Julian Edelman Watch: BurgerTyme Closed for Business

Kenny F'ing Powers

posts way less than 18% useful shit
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Nov 17, 2010
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This has been true since Welker? But before wasn't this more Faulk or an RB? If anything can be said about a BB offense is that he's always looking for good players that other teams aren't and using them better than any other team would.. this is why I think burkhead and Gilleslie aren't here by accident and they're both going to be a huge part of the offense
I dunno, man. People keep saying "Gronk's the key to the offense", but the numbers have never really bore that out. I mean, this offense is still going to be really good. Top 3? Number 1? Who knows. But losing Brady's binky is going to be an issue methinks.

Brady career numbers: 63.76 completion %, 97.2 QB Rate, 7.49 Y/A
Brady w/o Gronk: 63.3 completion %, 92.0 QB Rate, 7.46 Y/A
Brady w/o Edelman: 59.4 completion %, 90.4 QB Rate, 6.79 Y/A
 

Stitch01

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Jul 15, 2005
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I'm clearly in the minority here, but this injury really worries me. The slot receiver is what has always made this engine go in New England. I remember those 7 games without Jules in 2015, and it was obvious how much the offense, and Brady, missed him. The team went 3-4 in those games, lost home field advantage, Brady's numbers suffered, they had real problems on third down...it wasn't good. It felt pretty similar to when Welker blew out his knee in a meaningless Houston game, then watching the offense sputter and implode against the Ravens in the playoffs.

This offense is elite when the slot wr is elite. Amendola isn't that level talent, Carr is young and unproven, and while I know it's early, Brandin Cooks has me a little concerned. Hogan actually may be the best fit there, but he's certainly not Edelman.

This offense will be good, but when we need those big 3rd down conversions, I can't help but shake the feeling that were really going to miss Jules.
This is a fair point, but I'm not going to be in this bucket until they lose another player or two. The problem in 2015 was that Edelman got hit and they were starting fifth string linemen. The problem in 2009 was that, beyond Moss and Welker, the personnel was pretty bad. Edelman was a major contributor, but wasn't as effective or important to the offense last year as he was in '14 and '15 (catch rate lower last year, pretty sure his after the catch and return numbers were weaker as well, lost a little bit of PT in two WR sets later in the year)

If guys start getting hurt this changes but with Gronk/Allen, the addition of more balanced running backs, Cooks downfield ability, etc I think they still go into the year as the odds on favorite to have the league's best offense. Just less room before they hit a breaking point on offense with injuries

Also, and I know its not your suggestion so not saying this directly to you, but really don't understand why Butler being worse with Gilmore here is the default assumption or why we would trade him for like a fifth pass catcher. Butler should get more favorable matchups for his skill sets if anything.
 

InstaFace

The Ultimate One
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Sep 27, 2016
21,769
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Turf monster claims another victim.


"Just fucked Edelman, no lie!"

That's what I was insinuating earlier in the thread. Could this be a career-ender? At least with the Pats? Would be such a shame, he's such a great person and player.
Last seen in game action: Catching a 15-yard pass on 2nd and 13, in overtime, to put us 25 yards from glory.

Actually, that's just ball handling. Last game action was throwing a vicious block against a LB to give James White juuuuuuust enough room to squeeze in for the championship-winning score.
 
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axx

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Jul 16, 2005
8,126
Huh, apparently on the twitters since Edelman was put on IR before the roster was initially set (?) the IR-DTR rule doesn't apply. So he's def out for the year if you were hoping he could return for say like the SB.
 

SeoulSoxFan

I Want to Hit the World with Rocket Punch
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Jun 27, 2006
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Reiss reports that NE worked out BBtL's old pre-draft binkie WR Daniel Braverman who got cut by Chicago:
The Patriots continue to work out various free agents to keep their emergency lists fresh. On Wednesday, the workouts included WR Daniel Braverman (Western Michigan), QB Mitch Leidner (Minnesota), WR Tevaun Smith (Iowa), WR Jahad Thomas (Temple) and WR Bryan Walters (Cornell). Of the group, Walters has the most NFL experience, having played 42 career games for San Diego (2011), Seattle (2013-2014) and Jacksonville (2015-2016).
Braverman was linked to the Pats by Kiper before getting picked by the Bear's last pick in the 2016 draft:
Braverman has been compared to Wes Welker, Danny Amendola and Julian Edelman by draft analysts, such as ESPN's Mel Kiper Jr. A 5-foot-10 slot receiver, Braverman put up phenomenal numbers for Western Michigan in 2015: 108 catches for 1,371 yards and 13 touchdowns. That is serious production for someone at the collegiate level. And against elite combination, Braverman had 23 combined receptions for 231 yards versus Michigan State and Ohio State. Ryan Pace is a genius if Braverman becomes Welker or Edelman 2.0.
...and got high praise by PFF here:
One possible fit for the New England Patriots in the NFL Draft, according to Steve Palazzolo of Pro Football Focus, is Western Michigan receiver Daniel Braverman.

Braverman, listed at 5’10 and 177 pounds, racked up 1,367 yards and 13 touchdowns during the 2015 season. On Quick Slants the podcast Palazzolo called Braverman “the perfect Patriot receiver.”

“With Braverman, he’s very similar as far as having a feel for coverage, being able to sit down in between zones, similar shifty route running, I think he’s got great vision with the ball in his hands,” Palazzolo said. “I never throw the Wes Welker [comparison] around, but with Braverman he’s probably the closest thing I’ve seen over the last few years.”
...and worked out by NE before the draft:
The New England Patriots have crossed paths with Daniel Braverman during the pre-draft process.

According to Mark Daniels of the Providence Journal, the Patriots held a private workout with the Western Michigan slot receiver this spring.

Braverman, a 5-foot-10, 177-pound route-runner whose suddenness in and out of breaks has been considered a fit for New England’s offense, is projected as a fourth- or fifth-round pick later this week.
Daniels also tweeted this yesterday:

@MarkDanielsPJ
Mel Kiper compared Braverman to Amendola and Edelman prior to the 2016 draft. He's a slot receiver/returner.
 
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SeoulSoxFan

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Jun 27, 2006
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Here I go with binkie-fever again. WEEI chimes in about Braverman:
Braverman is the most interesting as many connected him to the Patriots before the 2016 draft with comparisons to Julian Edelman and Danny Amendola being drawn. He's a slot receiver who can also return punts.

He was a seventh-round pick by the Bears last season, but played in only three games. He was cut at the end of training camp this summer. He starred in college at Western Michigan, finishing with 108 receptions for 1,367 yards and 13 touchdowns in 2015 before declaring for the draft.
 

BaseballJones

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Oct 1, 2015
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Whoa, that's crazy, undersized white slot receivers are never compared to Edelman and Amendola.
FWIW, Amendola is almost EXACTLY the average size for the prototype NFL wide receiver. And Edelman is actually BIGGER.

Prototype wide receiver: 5'11", 185 lbs
Amendola: 5'11", 183 lbs
Edelman: 6'0", 198 lbs

(Note: I get that this is prototype and not necessarily "average", and I also get that this is from several years ago so maybe the needle has moved. I just never got the sense that those guys were actually undersized compared to the average NFL wide receiver. I couldn't find actual "average" size data...)
 

Super Nomario

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Nov 5, 2000
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FWIW, Amendola is almost EXACTLY the average size for the prototype NFL wide receiver. And Edelman is actually BIGGER.

Prototype wide receiver: 5'11", 185 lbs
Amendola: 5'11", 183 lbs
Edelman: 6'0", 198 lbs

(Note: I get that this is prototype and not necessarily "average", and I also get that this is from several years ago so maybe the needle has moved. I just never got the sense that those guys were actually undersized compared to the average NFL wide receiver. I couldn't find actual "average" size data...)
As far as I can tell, those numbers are mostly pulled out of the butt of whoever put that page together. Mockdraftable has average size at about 6'1" 201. That's Combine invitees; to get a better metric, we ought to adjust and snap-weight by who is actually playing. Also, your measurements for Edelman and Amendola are team-reported (i.e., wrong). Edelman measured at 5'10" 3/8 at his Pro Day; Amendola at 5'10" 1/2.

If your point is that Braverman's even a little smaller (5'9" 7/8, 175 pounds at his Pro Day), fair enough.
 

lexrageorge

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Jul 31, 2007
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FWIW, Amendola is almost EXACTLY the average size for the prototype NFL wide receiver. And Edelman is actually BIGGER.

Prototype wide receiver: 5'11", 185 lbs
Amendola: 5'11", 183 lbs
Edelman: 6'0", 198 lbs

(Note: I get that this is prototype and not necessarily "average", and I also get that this is from several years ago so maybe the needle has moved. I just never got the sense that those guys were actually undersized compared to the average NFL wide receiver. I couldn't find actual "average" size data...)
I think the "Edelman is undersized" comes from the fact that he fit right into the Wes Welker role. Welker was 5'9". And Edelman looks short standing the huddle next to Gronk and Nate Solder.
 

Marciano490

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Nov 4, 2007
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As far as I can tell, those numbers are mostly pulled out of the butt of whoever put that page together. Mockdraftable has average size at about 6'1" 201. That's Combine invitees; to get a better metric, we ought to adjust and snap-weight by who is actually playing. Also, your measurements for Edelman and Amendola are team-reported (i.e., wrong). Edelman measured at 5'10" 3/8 at his Pro Day; Amendola at 5'10" 1/2.

If your point is that Braverman's even a little smaller (5'9" 7/8, 175 pounds at his Pro Day), fair enough.
Shocked that Edelman is the type of dude to claim 6' when he's barely 5'11. I bet his Bumble profile lists him as 6'1.