Seems that a lot of Rams players found their talent this year.It didn’t hurt that Gurley found his talent again this year. He was a total mess last year.
Seems that a lot of Rams players found their talent this year.It didn’t hurt that Gurley found his talent again this year. He was a total mess last year.
Jeff Garcia was on pardon my take a month back, and he talked about being on Jeff fishers staff with the rams. He was an offensive assistant and he said Fisher doesn't give his quarterbacks an opportunity to succeed. He specifically mentioned going to work with the qb once and Fisher kicked him out/told him that wasn't his job. Garcia isn't a hall of famer, but he had a good career. The idea that you wouldn't want him working with your qb while he's on your staff is... Odd.Not sure I'd trade Garoppolo for Goff. Everybody talks about the great move up in head coaching talent from Fisher to McVay, but should it make that much difference in QB play? I want to see another good year from Goff.
This is not close to what people are saying.The idea that Garoppolo might be a 1-year wonder is being given way more credence than it deserves. All quarterbacks who are getting their first chance to start aren’t the same.
The argument that trading Jimmy was the right move doesn’t rest on the possibility that Jimmy will bust, anyway.
Brady was not great on deep passes early in his career and while he was particularly good early in this season, his performance on them deteriorated as the year went along.* The point is not to dissect Tom but rather to note that even the GOAT took time to become a great deep ball thrower and still managed to win SBs before he was that. And yes, I know that Tom threw some spectacular deep balls early on in his career (the OT pass in Miami, the deep balls in the second Steelers AFC Champ game both come to mind, among others).Lombardi used to go on and on about how beautiful a deep ball Jimmy threw compared to Brady. Since he has gone to the 49ers he has been trash on passes over 20 yards. I know he doesn’t have the best weapons but he has been super bad.
Jimmy is money on the short and intermediate stuff. Hopefully he gets better on the deep stuff.
The idea that Garoppolo might be a 1-year wonder is being given way more credence than it deserves.
Ummm...This is not close to what people are saying.
A statement like this is exactly what I would call "giving the idea that Garoppolo might be a 1-year wonder way more credence than it deserves."He may very well be an elite QB. Or, he may be Matt Flynn/Scott Mitchell/(insert one season wonder here.)
I always thought Garoppolo was better than Brady on lofted touch passes. He seemed, from the outset, to have a real knack for dropping the ball in right where it needed to be, where Brady did not have the same knack. That's a very small part of the game, though. At least it has been a very small part of Brady's game over his 17-year GOAT career.Lombardi used to go on and on about how beautiful a deep ball Jimmy threw compared to Brady. Since he has gone to the 49ers he has been trash on passes over 20 yards. I know he doesn’t have the best weapons but he has been super bad.
Jimmy is money on the short and intermediate stuff. Hopefully he gets better on the deep stuff.
This has been my point. There's a lot known about Jimmy beyond the fact that he has 7 starts and 7 wins, some of which you note here. By contrast, Matt Flynn (since his name keeps coming up) was in his 6th year, on his 3rd team, and widely deemed an NFL journeyman backup before he got his 3rd NFL start. The only thing Flynn and Garoppolo have in common is that they have both started 7 NFL games.But I continue to think that there is good reason to think that JG has that potential. From his impressive early record, to the ball he throws, to his similarity to both Tom and Rodgers in some important respects, to his athleticism and to his confidence level, I think he has as good a chance as any young QB I have seen in recent years to become elite. And if not elite, good enough to allow his team to compete for the title.
That's not really true. He wasn't a journeyman backup. He spent his first four years as the backup to Aaron Rodgers in Green Bay. Like Jimmy G. who got 1.5 starts while waiting behind Brady, Flynn got one start behind Rodgers in his first four years, and he set the single game Packer record for yards and touchdowns in that game.This has been my point. There's a lot known about Jimmy beyond the fact that he has 7 starts and 7 wins, some of which you note here. By contrast, Matt Flynn (since his name keeps coming up) was in his 6th year, on his 3rd team, and widely deemed an NFL journeyman backup before he got his 3rd NFL start. The only thing Flynn and Garoppolo have in common is that they have both started 7 NFL games.
I didn’t start watching the 49ers this year until Jimmy became the starter, but Beathard was having a bad year in terms of all QB stats, and W/L. Why wouldn’t they try out the shiny new toy when he had learned the system enough?That's not really true. He wasn't a journeyman backup. He spent his first four years as the backup to Aaron Rodgers in Green Bay. Like Jimmy G. who got 1.5 starts while waiting behind Brady, Flynn got one start behind Rodgers in his first four years, and he set the single game Packer record for yards and touchdowns in that game.
Instead of waiting for him to become a free agent, the Pats traded Jimmy G. If Beathard didn't get hurt, would San Francisco even have given Jimmy G. the reigns this year? All signs seem to say no. Thus, the only real difference between Jimmy G. and Flynn, at this point in their respective careers, is that Jimmy only spent 3.5 seasons in NE, as opposed to Flynn's 4 in Green Bay, and Jimmy G. was fortunate enough that after he got traded, the guy in front of him got hurt and he ended up with a late season 5 game audition that Flynn didn't get.
When Flynn became a free agent, he got a starting QB contract from Seattle, but they drafted a guy named Russell Wilson during the same offseason, so he never had a chance to play there either. They traded him to Oakland after one season when it became clear Wilson was the real deal.
He then loses the job to Terrell Pryor in the pre-season, starts in Week 4 when Pryor gets hurt, and plays ok, and then Dennis Allen basically demotes him to third string and then releases him, he then goes to Buffalo for a few weeks to serve as an emergency backup, and gets released, and then finishes the season back in Green Bay where he gets a few starts after Rodgers gets hurt, and plays pretty damn well. Well enough that he should have gotten a look as a starter somewhere after that. The whole thing was very strange and if anybody in NFL history has a gripe with how shitty their luck was, it might be Matt Flynn. The guy was clearly good enough to get a solid look somewhere, but he spent his first five seasons behind two hall of fame QB's in two cities, and then when he did go somewhere that he should have got a chance, it ended up being a completely dysfunctional Oakland organization that probably never realized what they had.
I have a question: Do you think it's more likely that Jimmy G. has a decent, average NFL career, or he has a career like Tom Brady's? You're jumping on people for "comparing" him to Matt Flynn, and then making claims that Jimmy G. (who has played 7 games) is already better at certain types of passes than Tom Brady (who has won almost as many Super Bowls as games Jimmy G. has played), so I have to believe you think it's the latter, no?
Beathard acquitted himself well for a rookie (who wasn’t even expected to play).I didn’t start watching the 49ers this year until Jimmy became the starter, but Beathard was having a bad year in terms of all QB stats, and W/L. Why wouldn’t they try out the shiny new toy when he had learned the system enough?
By contrast, Matt Flynn (since his name keeps coming up) was in his 6th year, on his 3rd team, and widely deemed an NFL journeyman backup before he got his 3rd NFL start. The only thing Flynn and Garoppolo have in common is that they have both started 7 NFL games.
I think you misread my post, or I was too vague. At the time that Matt Flynn signed his $20 million contract (with $9 million bonus) with Seattle, he was what you describe. A hot commodity on the free agent market, hot enough at least to command that kind of coin as a free agent despite only 2 starts (he had a decent start against the Patriots the year before his big 400+ year, 6 TD start on his way to free agency).That's not really true. He wasn't a journeyman backup. He spent his first four years as the backup to Aaron Rodgers in Green Bay. Like Jimmy G. who got 1.5 starts while waiting behind Brady, Flynn got one start behind Rodgers in his first four years, and he set the single game Packer record for yards and touchdowns in that game.
This is where I disagree. Flynn was a 7th round pick, Jimmy a 2nd. Flynn signed for $9 million guaranteed, Jimmy (I think) would have gotten more had he played out out the string and left, even after adjusting for rising salaries. Jimmy was traded for what was expected to be a high second round pick, Flynn after not playing in Seattle was dealt for a 3rd. After his deal, Flynn played with 3 different teams where he was able to beat out exactly 1 of a long string of nobodies, and the decent numbers he put up in the last 5 games of the year didn't really impress anyone enough to want to give him another shot.Instead of waiting for him to become a free agent, the Pats traded Jimmy G. If Beathard didn't get hurt, would San Francisco even have given Jimmy G. the reigns this year? All signs seem to say no. Thus, the only real difference between Jimmy G. and Flynn, at this point in their respective careers, is that Jimmy only spent 3.5 seasons in NE, as opposed to Flynn's 4 in Green Bay, and Jimmy G. was fortunate enough that after he got traded, the guy in front of him got hurt and he ended up with a late season 5 game audition that Flynn didn't get.
That's a very weird spin to put on my response to someone commenting about Garoppolo and deep balls. But, a more detailed answer: I don't know how well Garoppolo throws the deep ball, I haven't seen him throw enough of them to have an opinion. I don't think Brady is particularly great at the deep ball - the reasons for his extraordinary success as an NFL QB are many; throwing the deep ball wouldn't make my top 5 (in no particular order: arm strength, pinpint accuracy, ability to read defenses, judgment, durability, and mobility inside the pocket, most of which he does as well if not better than anyone else who has played the position). I wouldn't put Jimmy's seeming knack for one particular type of deep ball that doesn't happen to be a strength of Brady's up against the stuff Brady does well.I have a question: Do you think it's more likely that Jimmy G. has a decent, average NFL career, or he has a career like Tom Brady's? You're jumping on people for "comparing" him to Matt Flynn, and then making claims that Jimmy G. (who has played 7 games) is already better at certain types of passes than Tom Brady (who has won almost as many Super Bowls as games Jimmy G. has played), so I have to believe you think it's the latter, no?
Very good post. But I would call Jimmy a homeless man’s Brady at best.I think you misread my post, or I was too vague. At the time that Matt Flynn signed his $20 million contract (with $9 million bonus) with Seattle, he was what you describe. A hot commodity on the free agent market, hot enough at least to command that kind of coin as a free agent despite only 2 starts (he had a decent start against the Patriots the year before his big 400+ year, 6 TD start on his way to free agency).
But I would argue that by the time he got his third start, or at least his fourth, he was well-established as an NFL journeyman, which is what I meant in my post, and a lot of which you detail in your summary of his career. During that season he finished out as the GB starter, he was behind, at various times, Terrell Pryor who is now a WR, undrafted rookie Matt McGloin, EJ Manuel, Thad Lewis, undrafted rookie Jeff Tuel, and undrafted (but at least not a rookie) Scott Tolzien. That is an awful lot of forgettables and nobodies.
This is where I disagree. Flynn was a 7th round pick, Jimmy a 2nd. Flynn signed for $9 million guaranteed, Jimmy (I think) would have gotten more had he played out out the string and left, even after adjusting for rising salaries. Jimmy was traded for what was expected to be a high second round pick, Flynn after not playing in Seattle was dealt for a 3rd. After his deal, Flynn played with 3 different teams where he was able to beat out exactly 1 of a long string of nobodies, and the decent numbers he put up in the last 5 games of the year didn't really impress anyone enough to want to give him another shot.
After a 1-year stint as a backup in GB, Flynn then bounced around some more: signed by the Pats in the offseason prior to 2015, then cut in August, signed by the Jets, cut after starting the 4th preseaon game, then signed by the Saints.
I guess where you see a hard luck guy who deserved a better shot than he ever got, I see a guy who failed numerous times to win jobs against mediocre competition. If we are going to compare him to a former Patriots QB... I think he's far closer to Ryan Mallett than to Jimmy. He was fortunate to get a start on a powerhouse team and make the most of it, but that didn't lead GB to try to hang on to him or get value from him as the Pats did with Cassel.
In some of Flynn's stops, dealing with new offensive systems could have been an issue (his best play by far was in his original system in GB), but a couple of his moves happened in the offseason when there would have been time to learn. (Jimmy, by contrast, picked up SF's new (to him) system well enough in a few weeks after a midseason trade to lead that bad team to 5 straight wins. Pulling THAT off would probably have been a challenge for Brady.)
That's a very weird spin to put on my response to someone commenting about Garoppolo and deep balls. But, a more detailed answer: I don't know how well Garoppolo throws the deep ball, I haven't seen him throw enough of them to have an opinion. I don't think Brady is particularly great at the deep ball - the reasons for his extraordinary success as an NFL QB are many; throwing the deep ball wouldn't make my top 5 (in no particular order: arm strength, pinpint accuracy, ability to read defenses, judgment, durability, and mobility inside the pocket, most of which he does as well if not better than anyone else who has played the position). I wouldn't put Jimmy's seeming knack for one particular type of deep ball that doesn't happen to be a strength of Brady's up against the stuff Brady does well.
Bottom line, I think Jimmy is, already, a poor man's Brady. There is no other guy in the league I would want to drop in as NE's starter on short notice. That's not to say that Jimmy is the second-best QB in the league or anything - maybe he'll get to that level but realistically the odds are against it. I think "decent, average NFL career" is below his realistic floor, and "career like Tom Brady" is above his realistic ceiling.
Part of what I was getting at in my post is that I think the things the Patriots ask of Brady are quite difficult to do and would be beyond the abilities of most QBs, even some of those who are actually good. Jimmy, though, is good enough to step in and fake it for a few games at least, as we saw last year. I think that is where the very complementary remarks from Belichick at the time of the trade came from. It also speaks very well of Jimmy that, after a sudden change of teams and systems, he could play well enough to win 5 straight games with a team that was 1-10 before he started a game. Those are 2 significant things that aren't true of most young QBs first breaking into a lineup.In fact if Jimmy wasn’t a former backup of Brady, I really don’t think Jimmy would be compared to Brady at all.
That makes much more sense. I originally read the poor man’s Brady as level of skill.Part of what I was getting at in my post is that I think the things the Patriots ask of Brady are quite difficult to do and would be beyond the abilities of most QBs, even some of those who are actually good. Jimmy, though, is good enough to step in and fake it for a few games at least, as we saw last year. I think that is where the very complementary remarks from Belichick at the time of the trade came from. It also speaks very well of Jimmy that, after a sudden change of teams and systems, he could play well enough to win 5 straight games with a team that was 1-10 before he started a game. Those are 2 significant things that aren't true of most young QBs first breaking into a lineup.
While you are probably right that poor man's Brady is unfair, I put it that way because I think he can literally step into Tom Brady's offense, run it somewhat the way Brady would, and have some success. Part of that is because of Jimmy was a Patriot, but I don't think Brissett or Mallett were anywhere near that level during their time here.
I'll take on the rest of the post when I have some more time, but I think you're missing the timeline here. He went from hot commodity to journeyman in one season? All of those people you mention happened during the same season. It's not like he was spending a year here, a year there, etc. He spent 4 years in Green Bay behind Rodgers, went to Seattle in 2012, and immediately lost the job to Russell Wilson and sat behind him for a year. Then he was traded to Oakland, went to Buffalo and back to Green Bay all in the same season, 2013.I think you misread my post, or I was too vague. At the time that Matt Flynn signed his $20 million contract (with $9 million bonus) with Seattle, he was what you describe. A hot commodity on the free agent market, hot enough at least to command that kind of coin as a free agent despite only 2 starts (he had a decent start against the Patriots the year before his big 400+ year, 6 TD start on his way to free agency).
But I would argue that by the time he got his third start, or at least his fourth, he was well-established as an NFL journeyman, which is what I meant in my post, and a lot of which you detail in your summary of his career. During that season he finished out as the GB starter, he was behind, at various times, Terrell Pryor who is now a WR, undrafted rookie Matt McGloin, EJ Manuel, Thad Lewis, undrafted rookie Jeff Tuel, and undrafted (but at least not a rookie) Scott Tolzien. That is an awful lot of forgettables and nobodies.
.
I wasn't talking about the deep ball. I was talking about this post where you state that you think Jimmy has always been better than Brady at dropping in a touch pass:That's a very weird spin to put on my response to someone commenting about Garoppolo and deep balls. But, a more detailed answer: I don't know how well Garoppolo throws the deep ball, I haven't seen him throw enough of them to have an opinion. I don't think Brady is particularly great at the deep ball - the reasons for his extraordinary success as an NFL QB are many; throwing the deep ball wouldn't make my top 5 (in no particular order: arm strength, pinpint accuracy, ability to read defenses, judgment, durability, and mobility inside the pocket, most of which he does as well if not better than anyone else who has played the position). I wouldn't put Jimmy's seeming knack for one particular type of deep ball that doesn't happen to be a strength of Brady's up against the stuff Brady does well.
Bottom line, I think Jimmy is, already, a poor man's Brady. There is no other guy in the league I would want to drop in as NE's starter on short notice. That's not to say that Jimmy is the second-best QB in the league or anything - maybe he'll get to that level but realistically the odds are against it. I think "decent, average NFL career" is below his realistic floor, and "career like Tom Brady" is above his realistic ceiling.
I've seen you reference this multiple times, and I'm just not getting it. What did you expect Belichick to say? "He sucked, and we don't want him anymore?"I think that is where the very complementary remarks from Belichick at the time of the trade came from.
I think he literally did, in about 1.5 seasons. He signed with Seattle, lost the starting job to Russell Wilson. (OK, not a huge knock on him, given who Russell Wilson became, but, still. It's not unheard of in the NFL for a worse veteran to beat out a better rookie, simply due to experience.) Then he was traded in the next offseason, this time losing the staring job to Terrelle Pryor (I think we can agree a huge step down from Wilson). After one start, he loses the second string job to an undrafted rookie (McGloin) and is then cut. He goes to Buffalo, backs up another undrafted rookie (Tuel) and is then cut when EJ Manuel and Thad Lewis are healthy. So, yes, fast descent from commodity to literal journeyman.I'll take on the rest of the post when I have some more time, but I think you're missing the timeline here. He went from hot commodity to journeyman in one season?
This assumes there was interest around the league, which doesn't seem like a given.I think Flynn's biggest mistake was signing a one year deal with Green Bay after that, for the 2014 season. I'm sure he could have signed as a backup for a dozen other teams with QB's much worse than Rodgers and created a quarterback controversy that would never have existed in Green Bay, but he didn't, and at that point, his fate was sealed, but by the time he got his few starts at the end of the 2013 season, I very much disagree that was a journeyman backup.
I did, in the part of my post that you apparently chose to ignore.We've now established that Jimmy G. is better at lofted touch passes, and Brady isn't very good at deep balls. Go on.
I think that everyone in football operations without a legit NFL QB is telling his owner directly or indirectly that he was prepared to offer something better than pick 45 for Jimmy G but was shut down. I sure as shit would if I were them.Doesn't surprise me they couldn't get a conversation started given what we have read about the difficulties surrounding the Collins trade, but it would obviously be disappointing if the Pats didn't even listen to offers. That's just negligence, and hard to believe to be true.
That's a great pointI think that everyone in football operations without a legit NFL QB is telling his owner directly or indirectly that he was prepared to offer something better than pick 45 for Jimmy G but was shut down. I sure as shit would if I were them.
After the way that he finished out the year, it's fair to say that the national perception of him has changed a tad.
It's possible but there have been multiple reports going back to the beginning if the off-season that the Patriots didn't even listen. SF themselves said the Pats wouldn't listen previously and then the Pats called and the trade was done in 10 minutes.I think that everyone in football operations without a legit NFL QB is telling his owner directly or indirectly that he was prepared to offer something better than pick 45 for Jimmy G but was shut down. I sure as shit would if I were them.
After the way that he finished out the year, it's fair to say that the national perception of him has changed a tad.
According to this, the Browns were willing to swap the #4 pick in the draft + , for JG, but could not get a convo started with the Pats. Two days later JG was off to SF for what may be the 40th pick.
http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2018/01/how_cleveland_browns_were_froz.html#incart_2box_sports
On November 4, I wrote about how the Browns had last talked to the Patriots on October 28.
They couldn't even start a conversation. They were told Garoppolo wasn't available.
I know that Brown was willing to part with Houston's first-round pick and other goodies. He would have been willing to help Belichick shop around for a backup quarterback to help the trade work.
Keep him out of the conference (Jimmy G could have easily forced his way out of CLE to a place like NYJ or Denver).So what was the motive for taking the substantially lower offer from San Francisco?
Let’s just lay it down as simply as possible: Matt Cassel was a much, much more accomplished quarterback when he was traded than Jimmy Garoppolo was when he was traded. It’s not even remotely close.
We’ll eliminate Cassel’s first three seasons (39 total passes) and Garoppolo’s first two seasons (31 total passes) and look only at the two players’ tenures as starting quarterbacks for the New England Patriots.
Matt Cassel, 2008
15 starts, 10-5 record
327-for-516 (63.4%)
3,693 yards, 7.2 Y/A
21 TDs, 11 INTs
PFR Approximate Value: 17
Jimmy Garoppolo, 2016
2 starts, 2-0 record
43-for-63 (68.3%)
502 yards, 8.0 Y/A
4 TDs, 0 INTs
PFR Approximate Value: 2
Cassel also rushed 73 times for 270 yards and two touchdowns; Garoppolo rushed 10 times for six yards.
So, yes, in the sense that Cassel threw 453 more passes for roughly 3,200 more yards and 17 more touchdowns, the Cassel situation and Garoppolo situation is basically an apples-to-apples comparison.
(The win-loss numbers are a little skewed too; it should have Cassel at 11-5 and Garoppolo at 1-0. Or, maybe 1.5-0. Cassel played more than three quarters in the ’08 season opener but doesn’t get credit for the win, while Garoppolo played less two quarters in Week 2 of 2016 but gets credited with the win. Stats!)
And while we’re all living in the wake of the Jimmy G Phenomenon that was the end of the 2017 season, the fact is the kid threw six touchdowns and five interceptions in his five starts this year. We’ve seen better flashes from the likes of Nick Foles, Matt Flynn, Tim Tebow, Brock Osweiler, Robert Griffin, Derek Anderson and Cassel. None of them went on to have great careers. Most of them didn’t even have good careers. Most of them also got paid a lot of money, too.
According to Belichick himself, the Pats weren't interested in trading him in the offseason, so it doesn't matter if a hundred reports have offers of Fort Knox coming back in August.It's possible but there have been multiple reports going back to the beginning if the off-season that the Patriots didn't even listen. SF themselves said the Pats wouldn't listen previously and then the Pats called and the trade was done in 10 minutes.
I don't know what happened but I'm pretty confident the Pats didn't maximize their value in this instance.
It's worth 15 slots in the first round (or whatever it was projected to be at the time) to keep an unproven QB out of the conference? They can't possibly have thought this. I think "accepting less to trade a player out of the division" is a silly notion in most cases anyway, but this one in particular seems really absurd.Keep him out of the conference (Jimmy G could have easily forced his way out of CLE to a place like NYJ or Denver).
So what’s your theory?It's worth 15 slots in the first round (or whatever it was projected to be at the time) to keep an unproven QB out of the conference? They can't possibly have thought this. I think "accepting less to trade a player out of the division" is a silly notion in most cases anyway, but this one in particular seems really absurd.
Even if it was paramount to keep JG of of the AFC (which I think is BS-was BB really afraid of JG in 3 or 4 years?) they could have used the leverage of an auction and the Browns interest to boost the return from SF, an additional 3rd rounder, or next year's 2?So what was the motive for taking the substantially lower offer from San Francisco?
So you’re suggesting Robert Kraft flat out lied to Peter King and now Belichick is playing along by pretending it’s business as usual and he’ll be back next year?I can only guess what Machiavellan motives may have come into play in this Kraft-court powerplay.
No, BB knew that Kraft wouldn't approve, so he got a shitty deal to bring to Kraft, then if Kraft said no, he could go become the NYG coach, which is his dream. Plus he got to stick it to Brady to put Jimmy G in the gig that Brady has always wanted since he was a kid. Kraft shocked him when he let BB do the deal and stayed out of it. Totally backfired on BB.So you’re suggesting Robert Kraft flat out lied to Peter King and now Belichick is playing along by pretending it’s business as usual and he’ll be back next year?
Also, how does such a “power play” lead to Belichick taking less that optimal value? Kraft ordered him to trade Jimmy for less than market? Or Bill did it to sabotage his own team? You really think that happened?
right, but the question is why not even listen in the off-season and then turn around and trade him in 10 minutes att the deadline.According to Belichick himself, the Pats weren't interested in trading him in the offseason, so it doesn't matter if a hundred reports have offers of Fort Knox coming back in August.
When he decided to trade him, he had like 2 games experience and a handful of games left on his contract. Nobody knows whether BFB could have squeezed more out of someone else. But now there's a hell of a lot more game tape on him, and all of it good. So obviously, one wouldn't want to tell their boss that a first rounder was verboten.
How do you know this?I just think it is strange that they didn't even entertain offers and then decide on the value
This sounds a lot like Polian’s “we had a first round grade on Brady.“ Funny how none of this leaked before Jimmy went on a tear. This seems a lot like their incompetent ownership trying to save face, especially as that first article says Jimmy wanted nothing to do with Cleveland. They’re giving up a top pick in the draft for a guy who would force his way out in a few months?
So what’s your theory?
The only thing that i thought that made sense was keeping both guys was not a workable solution.So you’re suggesting Robert Kraft flat out lied to Peter King and now Belichick is playing along by pretending it’s business as usual and he’ll be back next year?
Also, how does such a “power play” lead to Belichick taking less that optimal value? Kraft ordered him to trade Jimmy for less than market? Or Bill did it to sabotage his own team? You really think that happened?
There are multiple reports. Lynch said they were shut down immediately in the off-season before getting to the offer stageHow do you know this?
Sure, but that doesn’t preclude them from having spoken with others before the deadline. I find the timing of the Cleveland piece suspect, so it’s entirely possible he spoke to other teams and didn’t get a better offer. This was a QB with 6 quarters of experience and half a year left on his deal. I don’t for a second buy Cleveland was giving up the farm.There are multiple reports. Lynch said they were shut down immediately in the off-season before getting to the offer stage
If anyone would be in a position to know that fort knox was not forthcoming, it would be BFB. And I trust him. 18 years of doing the right thing by the team is more predictive to me than some writers with unsourced opinion pieces, a name to make, and an apparent hard on for the organization. Bill probably didn't feel like wasting his time.right, but the question is why not even listen in the off-season and then turn around and trade him in 10 minutes att the deadline.
That to me is not maximizing value.
Or at least different perspective of value. Putting much more value on the security of Jimmy as a backup for half a season.
I just think it is strange that they didn't even entertain offers and then decide on the value.
What if someone was willing to offer Fort Knox?
Not to mention Jimmy’s a FA and could easily end up back in the conference by choice.It's worth 15 slots in the first round (or whatever it was projected to be at the time) to keep an unproven QB out of the conference? They can't possibly have thought this. I think "accepting less to trade a player out of the division" is a silly notion in most cases anyway, but this one in particular seems really absurd.
Yes, I was referring to the off-season in my post not before the trade deadline. Although at that point I think they probably valued Hoyer pretty highly.Sure, but that doesn’t preclude them from having spoken with others before the deadline. I find the timing of the Cleveland piece suspect, so it’s entirely possible he spoke to other teams and didn’t get a better offer. This was a QB with 6 quarters of experience and half a year left on his deal. I don’t for a second buy Cleveland was giving up the farm.
Not fielding offers in the offseason makes sense if BB gave significant value to letting the offseason and first 8 games play out before making the call on which QB to choose moving forward. Insurance has value, especially at such an important position.
Two other small points.If anyone would be in a position to know that fort knox was not forthcoming, it would be BFB. And I trust him. 18 years of doing the right thing by the team is more predictive to me than some writers with unsourced opinion pieces, a name to make, and an apparent hard on for the organization. Bill probably didn't feel like wasting his time.
Insurance is great, even if you don't make a claim.
BfB said that they hoped to make it work enough to keep both. Maybe he overvalued his own persuasive skills on selling a bridge contract to JG. Or maybe dealing with a few cap casualties became less tenable, once he had more film on those guys and saw who he would have to cut in order to keep both.
I'm starting to think that I'm pissing into the wind on this one. Maybe all of New England is so traumatized still from four decades of dysfunction junction that their brains will latch into this stuff. Or maybe I just dont have enough of an imagination.
Why would JimmyG think the Pats were going to draft him?Thinking back on this nonsense, there's one thing I want to know: why would Jimmy G ever think it was a good idea to hire Brady's agent?
By so doing, he guaranteed that he could not communicate in confidence with the Pats. Seems like a needless conflict of interest.
He hired him before he was drafted.Thinking back on this nonsense, there's one thing I want to know: why would Jimmy G ever think it was a good idea to hire Brady's agent?