That would be awful unless the Pats won.I am kind of rooting for both Bell and Brown to end up on the Niners. That team could be a ton of fun to watch, especially not being in the AFC. Imagine a Jimmy-Brady Super Bowl next year.
Not a chance on the Seahawks. They have too many needs and too few draft picks as it is; they'd never give up the best package that it would take. If they got him for a 4th rounder or something stupid cheap, maybe. They have Lockett and Baldwin, he'd be a nice piece to add, but I also think they learned from the Harvin fiasco.Seahawks, Niners, Maybe Packers or Saints are my top 4 guesses.
Ed: based on that Steelers are more likely to send him to the NFC,and a GFIN type team with a secure QB is more likely to take him on.
Aren't we at the point that just about any trade benefits the Steelers?The Steelers GM came out and said they are not going to tag Le'Veon Bell so he will be a free agent. He also said there is no discount on an AB trade and that they will not make a trade that doesn't benefit the Steelers.
Dell Demps would be proud with this kind of posturing.Aren't we at the point that just about any trade benefits the Steelers?
Maybe not if Brown decides to sit out like Bell and doesn't report?Aren't we at the point that just about any trade benefits the Steelers?
Not really. If he was he would have taken the Lakers shitty offer.Dell Demps would be proud with this kind of posturing.
He would sit out after getting trade he asked for?Maybe not if Brown decides to sit out like Bell and doesn't report?
He clearly didn’t have the authority to do anything in that situation. He was a puppet GM.Not really. If he was he would have taken the Lakers shitty offer.
I know.He clearly didn’t have the authority to do anything in that situation. He was a puppet GM.
Absolutely. In full agreement there, which is why Steelers are posturing. They’ll take whatever they can get and move on. If they don’t, they’re a bigger mess than we could have ever imagined.I know.
Anyway, my Steelers point was more that he costs $22 million to be on roster and cause problems. Or they could get something/anything for him and let him cause problems elsewhere and "save" $1 million.
I took away from his comments that they won't just give him away. They'll probably still be asking for a first round pick for him.Aren't we at the point that just about any trade benefits the Steelers?
No, I meant if he refuses to report to the Steelers, he's not getting paid.He would sit out after getting trade he asked for?
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/02/20/steelers-g-m-is-ok-with-big-ben-calling-out-teammates-on-radio/During this soap opera-like offseason for the Steelers, a consistent theme has been that some players don’t appreciate the way Ben Roethlisberger will use his radio show to call teammates out publicly. But the Steelers’ front office won’t ask Roethlisberger to change.
Instead, Steelers General Manager Kevin Colbert strongly backed Roethlisberger as a leader today, and told other players they ought to listen when he says what they need to do better, whether that’s on the practice field or the radio.
“Ben’s the elder statesman. If the players were smart, they’d listen to him. He’s been there,” Colbert said, via Jeremy Fowler of ESPN.
This is fantastic. Talk about inmates running the asylum. I for one am thoroughly enjoying the mighty Steelers franchise descending into mediocrity, or worse. They are a farce.Steelers G.M. is OK with Big Ben calling out teammates on radio
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/02/20/steelers-g-m-is-ok-with-big-ben-calling-out-teammates-on-radio/
They were okay with him raping two women. Fuck the Steelers and the Rooney’s and all the praise for them.Steelers G.M. is OK with Big Ben calling out teammates on radio
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/02/20/steelers-g-m-is-ok-with-big-ben-calling-out-teammates-on-radio/
This is not limited to the AFC East or even the AFC and more accurately applies to all teams in the NFL.They're cracking under the pressure of trying to stay within sight of the Patriots.
I disagree. They traded Brown for pick 66 and a fifth. If they turn 66 into a Hall of Famer or a total bust, that doesn't change the trade. If you trade me $10 for $5 and then win $1000 on a $5 scratch ticket you buy with the fiver, that doesn't make trading a $10 for a $5 a good deal.I know the sentiment is already out there that the Steelers "lost' on this deal, but I don't think that can be fully ascertained until one sees who the Steelers pick up with the draft picks from the Raiders and how those two players pan out. Clearly, this AB situation had become more than a typical distraction, so we might just have an "addition by subtraction" scenario here.
I initially thought this was dumb, too, but I've been convinced that the last structuring (last offseason) did not actually make any difference. Brown got no new money, so it really just pushed money from the 2018 cap into 2019-2021 (and thus, this year's after the trade). Without that restructure, Brown's 2018 cap hit would have been ~$17.7 MM and trading him now would leave ~$11.3 MM in dead money. Instead, his 2018 cap hit was a little less than $8 MM and the dead money now is ~$21 MM. Either way, you're paying him ~$29 MM across 2018 and 2019, and with the ability to roll over unused cap space (of which Pitt had a bunch because of the Bell situation) it really doesn't make any difference.* And don't get me started on the last Brown restructuring done in order to make Bell's salary fit. What a shitshow.
Good point. Of course the way it worked out still added an additional $10 MM in dead money ($21 MM vs $11 MM) so it's still meaninful.I initially thought this was dumb, too, but I've been convinced that the last structuring (last offseason) did not actually make any difference. Brown got no new money, so it really just pushed money from the 2018 cap into 2019-2021 (and thus, this year's after the trade). Without that restructure, Brown's 2018 cap hit would have been ~$17.7 MM and trading him now would leave ~$11.3 MM in dead money. Instead, his 2018 cap hit was a little less than $8 MM and the dead money now is ~$21 MM. Either way, you're paying him ~$29 MM across 2018 and 2019, and with the ability to roll over unused cap space (of which Pitt had a bunch because of the Bell situation) it really doesn't make any difference.
It doesn't matter though. That additional $10 MM they would have paid in 2018. Instead they get to roll over an extra $10 MM from 2018 to 2019 but have to pay an extra $10 MM in dead money. It's even steven. If they hadn't renegotiated the deal they would have paid the exact same in the final analysis, because there was no new money.Good point. Of course the way it worked out still added an additional $10 MM in dead money ($21 MM vs $11 MM) so it's still meaninful.
If the Steelers were boxed in it was based on some bad assumptions that they took in their salary negotiation approaches with Brown and with Bell. Perhaps it's because most players kind of accept terms even under a player-unfriendly CBA, but nothing about the Steelers' approach seemed to suggest that they considered the possibility that Brown and Bell would act in what might be an economically irrational way.I'm far more pissed about the dead money* than the trade return. They were boxed in by a difficult player and were forced (or maybe forced themselves?) to make a bad trade rather than a release and have him show up on the roster of a contending AFC team. Without the dead money perhaps they sign Golden Tate and CJ Mosley and suddenly the "return" doesn't look that bad.
* And don't get me started on the last Brown restructuring done in order to make Bell's salary fit. What a shitshow.
I’m convinced half of Tomlin’s value to management is that he has no issue taking public bullets for them. A good number of issues his critics have with how he runs the locker room we’re just as prevalent under Cowher.I know Tomlin gets a lot of the blame for engendering this culture, but it also seems that the management doing things in specific ways such as franchise tagging Bell seems to have also created some resentment. (Interesting to see that the Patriots by contrast have moved away from the franchise tag approach.)
Yeah, with cap carryovers you really can't look at one particular hit taken with a cut or trade as a one-year phenomenon in isolation. The Steelers are getting hit with a high cap charge for the trade precisely because they took savings in prior years. And extra cap savings carries over.I initially thought this was dumb, too, but I've been convinced that the last structuring (last offseason) did not actually make any difference. Brown got no new money, so it really just pushed money from the 2018 cap into 2019-2021 (and thus, this year's after the trade). Without that restructure, Brown's 2018 cap hit would have been ~$17.7 MM and trading him now would leave ~$11.3 MM in dead money. Instead, his 2018 cap hit was a little less than $8 MM and the dead money now is ~$21 MM. Either way, you're paying him ~$29 MM across 2018 and 2019, and with the ability to roll over unused cap space (of which Pitt had a bunch because of the Bell situation) it really doesn't make any difference.
Given all the non-financial aspects of the AB drama-fest, I still believe the Steelers made a deal that will benefit the team/organization and its brand both now and far down the road. Holding out for a deal where they hopefully get another team's first-round pick would only have exacerbated what has become an untenable situation, especially if no deal ever came to fruition.I disagree. They traded Brown for pick 66 and a fifth. If they turn 66 into a Hall of Famer or a total bust, that doesn't change the trade. If you trade me $10 for $5 and then win $1000 on a $5 scratch ticket you buy with the fiver, that doesn't make trading a $10 for a $5 a good deal.
I don't have an opinion on this one way or the other, but it has nothing to do with my post that you quoted here.Given all the non-financial aspects of the AB drama-fest, I still believe the Steelers made a deal that will benefit the team/organization and its brand both now and far down the road. Holding out for a deal where they hopefully get another team's first-round pick would only have exacerbated what has become an untenable situation, especially if no deal ever came to fruition.
Agree with it or not, the organization decided to stick/side with Roethlisberger and Tomlin, both of whom were targets of AB's social media sideshow and it had become abundantly clear those riffs were not going to be repaired. Again, with this level of distraction, it is very difficult to envision a scenario where AB would have shown up for the 2019 season ready to produce as he had in the past; AB's histrionics forced the front office's hands, so in that regard, I guess the Steelers "lost". Still, as a lifelong Steelers fan, I am now looking forward to the draft and the 2019 season more than I had been prior to the AB and Bell crap, and I am certain I am not in the minority amongst Steelers fans when it comes to this mindset...to me, that's a win for the Steelers.
I know the sentiment is already out there that the Steelers "lost' on this deal, but I don't think that can be fully ascertained until one sees who the Steelers pick up with the draft picks from the Raiders and how those two players pan out. Clearly, this AB situation had become more than a typical distraction, so we might just have an "addition by subtraction" scenario here.
I was telling myself that same story for most of the day. Consider this an intervention: they lost. It doesn’t matter whether they draft two future HOFers or two guys who get cut in camp. The value for Brown (“AB” is dead to me) was much higher.I know the sentiment is already out there that the Steelers "lost' on this deal, but I don't think that can be fully ascertained until one sees who the Steelers pick up with the draft picks from the Raiders and how those two players pan out. Clearly, this AB situation had become more than a typical distraction, so we might just have an "addition by subtraction" scenario here.
You can’t see it, but I’m playing the world’s smallest violins for him. He didn’t sign the $68M extension under duress. He wasn’t backed into a corner and left without options. Maybe he should have insisted on more guaranteed money or not signed the extension.Antonio Brown is producing at a historic rate. If he had a serious injury, he could end up being released and playing on a one year deal with no guaranteed money somewhere else. I'm not excusing all of the pageantry on his way out of town, but the problems in Pittsburgh definitely extend well beyond him.
We’ll see. If things don’t change, nobody is minding the store.Does anyone really think a locker room with Mike Tomlin and Roethlisberger isn't going to be a mess just because Brown is gone?
This might be the time that philosophy is the wrong play.We’ll see. If things don’t change, nobody is minding the store.
Playing a Rooney for a second, I’d have been tempted to fire Tomlin and call Roethlisberger in to underscore that he works for me not vice versa. Be a good teammate and stay in your lane.
But firing people is not a solution unless you have somebody in the wings who would be better. And historically, the Steelers are loathe to churn HCs.