2017-18 NBA Regular Season Game/Observation Thread
- Thread starter DeJesus Built My Hotrod
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I had the same post typed up, he’s going to be an offensive beast. As solid as Brown has been for the C’s, there’s a reason that was considered a 2 player draft.
Was hoping he would jack another up from the corner on the last possession. No such luck.
Definitely need another ball handler/shooter out there given the Rondo defense teams throw at him.
And he still throws it away all the time despite that space.
Donovan Mitchell just destroyed Harden's ankles. But the Rockets are just dropping bombs over Salt Lake.
Ryan Anderson 8-9 fg, 5-6 3fg, 21 pts
Carmelo Anthony 5-20 fg, 0-4 fg, 11 pts
Dangit, too bad (for the Thunder, and the rest of the West) Morey wasn't able to make that swap like he wanted to.
Meanwhile, the James v. Harden MVP race is pretty fascinating right now. Though I kinda figure LeBron will take couple weeks off at some point with an "injury" and Harden will run away with it.
Carmelo Anthony 5-20 fg, 0-4 fg, 11 pts
Dangit, too bad (for the Thunder, and the rest of the West) Morey wasn't able to make that swap like he wanted to.
Meanwhile, the James v. Harden MVP race is pretty fascinating right now. Though I kinda figure LeBron will take couple weeks off at some point with an "injury" and Harden will run away with it.
Eighth straight road loss for OKC. They scored 37 points in the second half. About that pick for Cleveland...
I don’t know what Brett Brown was doing in that final play but you have to have a solid play ironed out for that situation. Redick or Covington have to at least get a look at the rim. Any decent coach would have been able to at least get the ball into the hands of one of two capable shooters on the court.
You didn't like the design that got Embiid the ball low on the block away from a double team? Or were you referring to the final 00:01 catch and shoot? If it's the latter getting them a look should be nearly impossible against a defense designed to deny that pass following a timeout with all 5 defenders literally positioned outside of the arc.
I think a good coach should have a play in that specific situation that can get the ball in the hands of one of your two very good shooters; or at the very least get something better than a Richaun Holmes fall-away from 30 feet.
Did you watch the play unfold though? You would need a complete defensive breakdown, immediately following a timeout, to allow either of them to catch a pass much less catch and shoot even in desperation. That isn't a reasonable expectation under those conditions where all 5 defenders are positioned on the perimeter denying the shooters.
Teams' get looks like that all the time with a second left on the clock. I would like to see a coach have a strong play he can go to in that situation given the talent at his disposal that results in a better chance at successfully making a basket.
Yes they do.....when they also have to defend a two-point shot at the end of quarters and at the end of games. This wasn't the case last night. The defense can dictate 100% where the ball goes in this spot when they are up 3 with 1 second on the clock unless their is a breakdown which the timeout created a much less chance of their being one.
If you are going to criticize Brett Brown it would be for losing two straight home games to the Suns and Lakers with two 2018 All-Stars (Simmons and Embid) and RPM darling Robert Covington.
BUT it's the regular season and they are young, Sixers will be prone to lulls. Still, think they make the playoffs.
Just be glad they didn't trade down and take Donovan Mitchell.
BUT it's the regular season and they are young, Sixers will be prone to lulls. Still, think they make the playoffs.
Just be glad they didn't trade down and take Donovan Mitchell.
NBA heads and people in this forum acknowledge how deep this draft class was and how many impact rookies there are, especially when counting Simmons. Its pretty remarkable. That said - and I hate to keep preaching on this - but Mitchell, above all, is a revelation.
I understand that he is a few years older than guys like Ball and Tatum and that what Simmons is doing is insane (and it is). However, aside from Simmons, who has at least had a season to absorb his team's sets and has more than a passing familiarity with his teammates, Mitchell has been asked to and is carry a load unlike any other first year player - and he has responded by looking like a ruthlessly efficient, seasoned-veteran. His array of moves to the basket are, I suspect, what people had in mind for Fultz with more experience. The thing is, Mitchell is beating legit NBA defenders with his moves now - I know that December defense isn't the same as it is in May and when teams really clamp down on him, he won't have the same looks. However his game suggests he will still beat them.
The other thing that stands out to me is that despite their acquisition of Ricky Rubio in the offseason, the Jazz are increasingly looking like their primary ball-handler is going to be Mitchell. Simply put, Quin Snyder, who is very highly regarded coach, is leaning towards a rookie versus a solid veteran to handle the ball in crunch time for what looks like a solid playoff team. I know Simmons is the leader for ROY by a large margin and Tatum, whom I love for all the reasons you guys do, will get some looks. But I won't be shocked if Mitchell somehow overtakes him, especially if the Jazz make the playoffs and the Sixers do not. He looks to be that good.
What a wealth of young talent the NBA has these days.
I understand that he is a few years older than guys like Ball and Tatum and that what Simmons is doing is insane (and it is). However, aside from Simmons, who has at least had a season to absorb his team's sets and has more than a passing familiarity with his teammates, Mitchell has been asked to and is carry a load unlike any other first year player - and he has responded by looking like a ruthlessly efficient, seasoned-veteran. His array of moves to the basket are, I suspect, what people had in mind for Fultz with more experience. The thing is, Mitchell is beating legit NBA defenders with his moves now - I know that December defense isn't the same as it is in May and when teams really clamp down on him, he won't have the same looks. However his game suggests he will still beat them.
The other thing that stands out to me is that despite their acquisition of Ricky Rubio in the offseason, the Jazz are increasingly looking like their primary ball-handler is going to be Mitchell. Simply put, Quin Snyder, who is very highly regarded coach, is leaning towards a rookie versus a solid veteran to handle the ball in crunch time for what looks like a solid playoff team. I know Simmons is the leader for ROY by a large margin and Tatum, whom I love for all the reasons you guys do, will get some looks. But I won't be shocked if Mitchell somehow overtakes him, especially if the Jazz make the playoffs and the Sixers do not. He looks to be that good.
What a wealth of young talent the NBA has these days.
Not sure it matters to your overall point (it strengthens it), but Mitchell is only 1 year older than Ball, and a year and a half older than Tatum. That's a bit different than a few years older. It's not even 2 years. He's not exactly Kyle Kuzma. If there was a redraft today, the only player I'd consider over Tatum right now is Mitchell. Out of everyone in this draft class, he is the most likely to become a top 10 player. I also wouldn't be shocked if he won ROY. He's been an absolute beast the last 7 games and is improving every game.
edit: I feel obligated to throw in John Collins name now, too since I mentioned Kuzma and Mitchell. There aren't really many players you'd be willing to write off from this draft atm. Almost all of the top picks have shown flashes, even guys like Isaac who haven't gotten any press. Granted he's been injured. Sorta reminds me of a less talented Myles Turner.
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Love Mitchell--I actually find myself noting when the Jazz are on so that I can watch him.
It's crazy that the Jazz utterly nailed #9, #13, and #27 picks, out of which the oldest player is 27, over a 7 year period, and are still stuck in purgatory for the forseeable future.
Actually I lied. I haven't really seen Zach Collins play but looking at his game log is uninspiring.
I watched a good amount of him at Louisville and I was bullish, hyping him early and often in the draft thread, but I didn't have any inkling he'd be this effective as a primary ball-handler and at creating his own shot. I thought he had a high floor as a uber-athletic 3 & D with a great mental make-up, but I thought maybe he'd grow into a lead guard in a couple of years, not a couple of months. I had pegged his upside as Avery Bradley with better length and athleticism- a helluva player, but not a guy you'd hand the keys over to- but he's shown he can be more than that. I loved watching him in college, so it's nice to see him tearing it up now.
I've watched 13 Jazz games this season. He's taken over Jokic and Khris Middleton as my favorite non Celtic and Middleton has improved a bit. Seems most teams are stuck in purgatory for the foreseeable future though, it's not exclusive to the Jazz. Imagine if they still had Hayward and ended up with Mitchell?
Yeah, with Hayward they'd have some outside shot at a championship once Mitchell developed.
I guess my point was that most of the teams in purgatory haven't hit that nearly hard on late lottery or non-lottery picks, whereas the Jazz did, but still haven't been able to make anything happen: the margin of error is incredibly thin.
Going into tonight games, Drummond over the last 6: 17.5 points, 15.3 rebounds, 5.7 assists/2.0 TO, 2.3 steals, 1.2 blocks in 34.7 minutes of play. Shooting .645 from the field and .658 from the line. That is absurd. I'm going to keep pushing this Drummond has improved his playmaking ability agenda until people take notice. He's averaging 4.0 apg this year. Going into the year, his career assist rate was 4.1%. It is currently at 18.3% and rising. His TO rate did jump from 10.9% to 19.9% but I think you have to take the trade off and lately, the TO are declining.
Not having that great a game tonight against GS atm but they are only down 57-53.
Not having that great a game tonight against GS atm but they are only down 57-53.
Oladipo has 15 points in the 3rd quarter with 3:18 left. He's keeping the Pacers in the game.... Only had 7 at the half.
make that 18.
make that 18.
Reggie Jackson, WTF? You have 15 seconds and the ball at the top of the key with a chance to tie or take the lead and instead of moving it around you take it into the teeth of the defense and lose it. Bad basketball. Poor Avery having to watch that...
For what it's worth, advanced stats don't love Mitchell. He is a positive as a rookie, so that's really good, but the numbers don't love him on either side of the ball, particularly on defense. His 0.5 BPM ranks 57th all time for rookies 21 and under. His RPM is consistent with his BPM at 0.81 (92nd in the league). He's ranked comparably to John Collins in BPM. To be clear, this is a really good result still.
It's also worth noting that only 31 rookies under 21 have ever had a usage over 25%. Of those, Mitchell ranks 13 and is in pretty impressive company, although many of the players are simply good high volume players instead of great players. Overall, though, the top BPM guys had better careers than the top usage guys.
For context, the players with the closest BPM to Simmons are Kawhi, Traylor, AK, Shaq, and Pierce. For Tatum, it is Cummings, Barkley, Marques Johnson, and Millsap. For Mitchell it is DeJuan Blair, Collins, Thad Young, Larry Hughes, Rondo, Adams, and Ray.
(The number of comps grows down the list as their is less separation.)
If you add a usage filter (over 25%), Mitchell instead compares to Bernard King, Brandon Jennings, Larry Hughes, and Melo.
Basically, Simmons looks like a guy whose on track to be in the hall of fame by rookie BPM. Tatum does to once you account for age. Mitchell looks more like a good to very good player who will score a lot.
As always, the above conclusions are based on limited samples and only a couple statistics so they are very far from conclusive of anything. Mitchell has started his career better than a lot of incredible players and what he is doing is really impressive, but it isn't impressive like what Tatum and Simmons are doing.
It's also worth noting that only 31 rookies under 21 have ever had a usage over 25%. Of those, Mitchell ranks 13 and is in pretty impressive company, although many of the players are simply good high volume players instead of great players. Overall, though, the top BPM guys had better careers than the top usage guys.
For context, the players with the closest BPM to Simmons are Kawhi, Traylor, AK, Shaq, and Pierce. For Tatum, it is Cummings, Barkley, Marques Johnson, and Millsap. For Mitchell it is DeJuan Blair, Collins, Thad Young, Larry Hughes, Rondo, Adams, and Ray.
(The number of comps grows down the list as their is less separation.)
If you add a usage filter (over 25%), Mitchell instead compares to Bernard King, Brandon Jennings, Larry Hughes, and Melo.
Basically, Simmons looks like a guy whose on track to be in the hall of fame by rookie BPM. Tatum does to once you account for age. Mitchell looks more like a good to very good player who will score a lot.
As always, the above conclusions are based on limited samples and only a couple statistics so they are very far from conclusive of anything. Mitchell has started his career better than a lot of incredible players and what he is doing is really impressive, but it isn't impressive like what Tatum and Simmons are doing.
Philly will have whichever of the Lakers ‘18/King ‘19 picks they don’t send the Celtics, and that will likely be their last lottery pick for a while.
Golden State with terrible three-point shooting last night, but still beat Pistons by four. I was combing the box score, looking for which category they excelled in last night ... trailed in rebounds, steals. But 15 blocks (6 by Green, 5 by Durant)! Warriors always find a way.
Warriors as a team now have 234 blocked shots. #2 in the NBA is the Spurs with 158. The rest of the league ranges from 81 to 141.
Durant with 36 pts / 10 reb / 7 ast / 5 blk last night.
Durant with 36 pts / 10 reb / 7 ast / 5 blk last night.
Clippers win at home 113-112 over the Wizards. Lou Williams hit a huge three with Beal in his face for the game winner.
This team is so damn frustrating. The injuries killed the season but they had the pieces there.
Then Beal hits what would have been the game winner just after the buzzer goes off. They go to replay and rule that the Clippers clock operator began the clock prior to the inbounds pass touching Beal's hand. They reset the clock to 1.1 seconds for a "do over" and win the game.......but the officials screwed up the clock on the reset as per league rules in that situation the clock should have been reset to 0.1 seconds.
I only wish the Wizards made the shot and see how the league reacts to what would have been the Clippers appeal. Good times in LA!
They're only 2.5 games out of a playoff spot in the West. As a Celtics fan, I'm still hoping they tread water through mid-January. If they can get within a few games of .500 before Blake comes back, then this roster still has the talent to make the playoffs.
