2018 TB Off-Season Thread

RedOctober3829

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There's no chance TB12 hangs it up by the way, for 2 reasons:
1) TB12 method loses cred
2) He goes out on a really sour note in terms of how the fans would perceive him, saying he would play until mid-40s, watching the team trade away Jimmy, then calling it quits. Instead of being completely bulletproof for the rest of eternity in NE there would be mixed emotions from the fans
1) TB12 Method won't lose credibility. It's what has made Brady what he's been for the last few years. Other players are doing it even in other sports(Hanley Ramirez) and it's working.
2) He's bulletproof no matter what he does. Fans will forget how he left real quick.
 

Three10toLeft

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There's no chance TB12 hangs it up by the way, for 2 reasons:
1) TB12 method loses cred
2) He goes out on a really sour note in terms of how the fans would perceive him, saying he would play until mid-40s, watching the team trade away Jimmy, then calling it quits. Instead of being completely bulletproof for the rest of eternity in NE there would be mixed emotions from the fans

Tom's given this franchise at least 5 of the greatest sports moments of our lives.

He owes us nothing.

Fuck any other fan who feels/would feel otherwise if he decided to hang it up tomorrow.
 

steveluck7

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Can’t a chunk of this be seen as publicity for Tom vs time season 2? Create all this intrigue now and then when he decides to play we are treated to the behind the scenes drama that led to his “decision”
 

bankshot1

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If Brady retires I'd be disappointed and give him a standing ovation.

He's given me (us) more than it would ever be reasonable to expect.

And the bad vibes coming out from Foxboro from every corner seems about impossible to ignore.

Gisele > Yoko
 

TheoShmeo

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Of course Tom Brady owes us nothing. He's given us as many sportsgams as any Boston/NE athlete ever, and he's been nothing but a joy to watch.

But even if you just want to focus on him, very few people like to leave on a bad note or do something that feels wrong.

Whatever bad blood exists between him and BB over AG, and whatever else that might have contributed to it, the fact remains that the Pats had on their roster a potential star at QB and traded him because they reasoned, based on Tom's inputs, that Brady was planning to stay for 2-4 more years.

So yeah, it's a free country, and everyone can change their mind. But to walk out now would be to leave the Patriots in a horrible position. And a position that they would not have been in had Tom told him he was going to retire or was even thinking about it. Let me be clear, I am not suggesting that Tom forced out Jimmy, though I guess that's possible. But his information played a role in the decision, and given that, I just don't see him leaving Bob Kraft, his teammates, his coaches, Josh, the fans (the least of it but not irrelevant either) and even Bill in this position. I can't see him allowing that last game, and this mini drama, to be the finale.

I guess you can throw all that out the window if Tom just can't stomach another season with Bill and Bill wont trade him. But it being that far gone strikes me as highly unlikely.

I do think it's entirely possible that 2018 is the last year.

Last: if Bob, Bill and Tom can't fix this crap and get on the same page, and do it fast, shame on all of them. I get it, things sometimes break down. It's been a long time. But these differences strike me as things that adults can and should bridge. They all have too much to lose.
 

bankshot1

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I understand AG is the other man, but I thought Gisele has been pushing for TB12 to hang them up for awhile.

in any case IMO under any circumstance,

Gisele> Yoko
 

Captaincoop

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I really doubt TB is even considering retiring right now. He's either being salty and letting BB twist in the wind as part of an ongoing pissing contest, or as noted above, he's manufacturing some drama for his own promotional purposes.

But if he did retire at this point, after forcing the team's hand on Jimmy G six months ago, wow, that would be a kick in the balls.
 

tims4wins

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Tom's given this franchise at least 5 of the greatest sports moments of our lives.

He owes us nothing.

Fuck any other fan who feels/would feel otherwise if he decided to hang it up tomorrow.
I'm not saying this is how I would feel. I am saying I think there is a non-insignificant portion of the fan base that would hold it against him for holding up the franchise and seeing them trade away Jimmy and then Brady immediately retiring. I'm not one of those people.

Let's all remember that unless TB12 had announced he would be retiring, they could not have franchised Jimmy.
 

tims4wins

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1) TB12 Method won't lose credibility. It's what has made Brady what he's been for the last few years. Other players are doing it even in other sports(Hanley Ramirez) and it's working.
2) He's bulletproof no matter what he does. Fans will forget how he left real quick.
Maybe on #1. On #2, the Boston media won't ever let the fans forget, especially if Jimmy ends up a perennial Pro Bowler

Edit: like this from Giardi. I don't think this is sarcasm

 

JokersWildJIMED

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I'm not saying this is how I would feel. I am saying I think there is a non-insignificant portion of the fan base that would hold it against him for holding up the franchise and seeing them trade away Jimmy and then Brady immediately retiring. I'm not one of those people.

Let's all remember that unless TB12 had announced he would be retiring, they could not have franchised Jimmy.
The problem with this is that they would not be trading away Jimmy with Tom "immediately retiring"...there were things that happened in between
 

5dice

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He's either being salty and letting BB twist in the wind as part of an ongoing pissing contest
I don't know what winning the pissing contest is supposed to look like for TB. He makes BB look bad in public and that helps with exactly what? He, by extension of all this nonsense, hurts the Krafts and that helps with what?
What does he want? Unfettered access for all teammates to AG? Bill to suddenly change his style and run a Rex Ryan clubhouse? A different contract? I don't get it.
 

dcmissle

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Players in general don't owe their teams anything beyond what's agreed to contractually. This applies in spades to Brady. If Brady feels after a couple of months away from the game that he wants to spend more time with this family, or that he has had enough unreported concussions, he owes it to himself first and foremost to walk away.
You’re right, and I take the players’ side almost every time in a League run by 32 assholes.

But Tom’s career has been marked by great generosity and concern for everyone else in the organization. I don’t see the percentage in departing from that in your 18th year.

It’s very fact dependent and we don’t know who said what. I don’t think it’s a lot to expect a yes or no before the draft.

This is likely to be the most interesting draft in our lifetimes. Nothing should surprise anyone. Even the Rosen talk is less crazy in the current context.
 

PaulinMyrBch

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If he were to retire (doubtful), then the context of the time since Jimmy was traded mid season and the announcement would clear up tremendously. He would likely be very detailed as to why and what has changed this off-season to move the retirement bar south of 45. Any theory that he would do it to get back at the Pats or the League/Goodell is nonsense. The dude has been very open about playing, being the best option at QB this team has every week, and pushing himself to keep himself at that level. I'd be shocked if he's even considered it.

The clickbait stories we have to put up with in the media for the NFL offseason is really annoying. I know this is Shefter, but if you really listen to what he said this morning, its all old news just pieced together in one soundbite. Put that out the day after he isn't with the team for voluntary workouts, and bingo! You've got clicks and the lead story for every show that airs today.
 

dcmissle

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Maybe on #1. On #2, the Boston media won't ever let the fans forget, especially if Jimmy ends up a perennial Pro Bowler

Edit: like this from Giardi. I don't think this is sarcasm

I don’t think it is sarcasm, but I do think it’s too harsh. He seems to be assuming that TB had these reservations and stood idly by when they traded JG — or worse, agitated for the trade. I am not comfortable with that assumption based on the little we know.

If you assume there is genuine soul searching going on — and certainly if you assume this is a deliberate Hamlet act (and I am not assuming that) — this other tweet of Giardi hits what I was alluding to, and seems reasonable:

 

E5 Yaz

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Giardi's always been an ass when it comes to Brady, at least back to his asking about questions about changing QBs following the KC debacle.

He's just a troll playing hot-take-palooza and simply shouldn't be taken seriously by anyone with at least half a brain
 
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scotian1

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Regardless of how he feels towards BB, this would be a big slap in the face to Kraft if it was true. If reports are accurate that Kraft urged BB to trade Jimmy G under the assumption that Tom had several years left (or so he was indicating) then that is a insult not only to Kraft, the rest of his teammates and the fans. If he wants to screw the team because he is fed up with Bill, thanks to him and the 5 Super Bowls he was part of but don't let the door hit you on the way out.
 

E5 Yaz

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Regardless of how he feels towards BB, this would be a big slap in the face to Kraft if it was true. If reports are accurate that Kraft urged BB to trade Jimmy G under the assumption that Tom had several years left (or so he was indicating) then that is a insult not only to Kraft, the rest of his teammates and the fans. If he wants to screw the team because he is fed up with Bill, thanks to him and the 5 Super Bowls he was part of but don't let the door hit you on the way out.
Hopefully these ESPN stories are simply to draw clicks and views and are pure BS.
JFM, any more bases you want to touch to make sure you have all your asses covered?
 

lexrageorge

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Is Giardi really that credible? And does his opinion matter at all?

If Brady were to retire between now and training camp, there will be reasons behind it that probably have nothing to do with any animus towards Bill or Kraft.
 

NickEsasky

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Is Giardi really that credible? And does his opinion matter at all?

If Brady were to retire between now and training camp, there will be reasons behind it that probably have nothing to do with any animus towards Bill or Kraft.
Giardi is the guy who scremed to the high heavens the Pats needed to keep his binkie Jimmy G then when asked how it would be possible financially had no idea. He's a troll.
 

OnWisc

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More troubling is that this appears to run deeper than Brady. I've been looking around and I can't find evidence of ANY Patriots committing to play in 2018.
 

joe dokes

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More troubling is that this appears to run deeper than Brady. I've been looking around and I can't find evidence of ANY Patriots committing to play in 2018.
Or Ever. Maybe those other seasons didn't happen.
upload_2018-4-18_13-12-52.jpeg
 

SMU_Sox

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More troubling is that this appears to run deeper than Brady. I've been looking around and I can't find evidence of ANY Patriots committing to play in 2018.
The positives of the information age: you can scout your own players or break down your own film and post about it. If you want to do it yourself or follow others who break things down you can now! Hooray!

The negatives: this shit and other shit like this stupid shit.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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I'm not surprised if there's a bit of Super Bowl hangover and the media maybe is getting little pieces of it.

The deal when you play for the Patriots is that you put up with a more dictatorial type top down kind of model that is not particularly sympathetic, and you do it so that you can win. You run the extra hills because you know that it can pay off in February. And then you lose in excruciating fashion after being so close. And, if you're an offensive player, you're probably a bit frustrated that you did your part and you're kind of frustrated because you have some nagging wonder whether maybe the coaching staff that asks so much of you maybe didn't -- through team composition or personnel decisions -- put you in the best position.

I think this is the shit that happens when you lose the Super Bowl. Existential what's it all about and why am I doing this kind of thinking is probably only natural. I personally couldn't think about football for six weeks. Imagine what these guys feel about it all.

Also, 19 years in one situation is a long long time. Wanderlust is probably not that unexpected.

Once real football activities start this goes away.
 

InstaFace

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I'm not surprised if there's a bit of Super Bowl hangover and the media maybe is getting little pieces of it.

The deal when you play for the Patriots is that you put up with a more dictatorial type top down kind of model that is not particularly sympathetic, and you do it so that you can win. You run the extra hills because you know that it can pay off in February. And then you lose in excruciating fashion after being so close. And, if you're an offensive player, you're probably a bit frustrated that you did your part and you're kind of frustrated because you have some nagging wonder whether maybe the coaching staff that asks so much of you maybe didn't -- through team composition or personnel decisions -- put you in the best position.

I think this is the shit that happens when you lose the Super Bowl. Existential what's it all about and why am I doing this kind of thinking is probably only natural. I personally couldn't think about football for six weeks. Imagine what these guys feel about it all.

Also, 19 years in one situation is a long long time. Wanderlust is probably not that unexpected.

Once real football activities start this goes away.
Really? To the extent that I understand the mentality of a hypercompetitive elite athlete, my first guess at the thinking would be,

"we were ONE FUCKING PLAY from winning it all and having beautiful memories of standing at the mountaintop after a year of hard work. One. Fucking. Play. We weren't a few players and some lucky bounces from maybe playing for a conference championship. The goddamn lombardi was right there at the other end of the field, we just had to go and get it, that's how close we were. If I redouble my efforts this offseason, and I can motivate my teammates to do the same, and we focus just a little bit more this year, we've got the best chance of anyone of crossing that last little bridge. I don't have to give 50% more, I just have to find that 5% more. I can do that."

vs,

"why am I doing this? I wanted to be a lumberjack!"

I just don't think you get to even playing in the NFL if the latter is the slightest bit of consideration. These peoples' lives are built on confidence piled on top of optimism and over-preparing.
 

reggiecleveland

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Tom's given this franchise at least 5 of the greatest sports moments of our lives.

He owes us nothing.

Fuck any other fan who feels/would feel otherwise if he decided to hang it up tomorrow.
It is not that simple. Fans are fans of the team. Tom has been vocal about wanting to be the future and Jimmy G does not get traded if he had only one year left this time last year, or even maybe if he had only two left. There has been nothing to dispute the fact Tom wanted the Pats to commit to him beyond 1 year. So if he did hang it up, there is rightful tarnishing of his image. I would be disappointed, and annoyed, and rightfully so.

Manny was fantastic, but how he left town made me think less of him. Schilling had maybe the best single game performance of any player on any team I ever cheered for, but what he did since then has sullied his image with me.

If Tom did force a trade of Jimmy G, fought with his coach about snake oil BS, then retired, it would be a shitty last few pages to his Pat's Epic novel. The fact the previous 2900 pages were awesome, does not mean the last shitty 15 pages don't diminish the book. And it also doesn't mean they didn't happen. Sure one day in our mind we will correctly rip out these pages, but in the moment it is shitty, if true.
 

E5 Yaz

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If Tom did force a trade of Jimmy G, fought with his coach about snake oil BS, then retired, it would be a shitty last few pages to his Pat's Epic novel.
This is the problem in a nutshell. Fans who have no idea if any of these stories are true will be convinced by the drumbeat of the media coverage and therefore accept it. We've already seen signs of it here today.

It's simple, really ... unless you have first-hand knowledge of the inner workings of the Patriots, there's no value in making these hypothetical leaps.

It's foolishness
 

Marbleheader

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The obvious problem right now is that the Pats aren't controlling the narrative or communicating at all to squash this nonsense. In the absence of one of the major players involved manning up, fans and media are left to speculate. I'm pretty pissed at everyone involved right now because the optics suck.
 

RedOctober3829

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Amid national and local stories calling into question Brady's commitment to returning for 2018, NFL Network Insider Ian Rapoport and NFL Network's Mike Garafolo reported Wednesday that the franchise quarterback is seeking a new contract before the upcoming season.

"It's not a pressing issue," Garafolo emphasized on Wednesday's edition of NFL Up to the Minute. "It's not anything that is contentious right now. But Brady would absolutely be interested in revisiting this contract."

That said, neither Rapoport nor Garafolo believes Wednesday's reports represent a ploy by Brady to expedite those talks. In fact, Brady's public statements on the matter have left no doubt that he intends to return for a 19th NFL season.

"Tom Brady is going to play in 2018," Rapoport explained. "He said it. Everyone close to him has said it. Everyone I've spoken to has said it. The Patriots are going forward with the very strict and stern belief that he will be playing for 2018. I don't get the sense that they considered any of these reports this morning about 'maybe he doesn't play.'

"I also know Brady is planning a little passing camp with some of his buddies before training camp. That does not sound like the kind of the thing you would do if you were not going to play in 2018."

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000927188/article/tom-brady-eyes-new-contract-will-play-in-2018?campaign=tw-nf-sf187290343-sf187290343&sf187290343=1
 

joe dokes

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This is the problem in a nutshell. Fans who have no idea if any of these stories are true will be convinced by the drumbeat of the media coverage and therefore accept it. We've already seen signs of it here today.
It's simple, really ... unless you have first-hand knowledge of the inner workings of the Patriots, there's no value in making these hypothetical leaps.
It's foolishness
This a thousand times.


Amid national and local stories calling into question Brady's commitment to returning for 2018, NFL Network Insider Ian Rapoport and NFL Network's Mike Garafolo reported Wednesday that the franchise quarterback is seeking a new contract before the upcoming season.
"It's not a pressing issue," Garafolo emphasized on Wednesday's edition of NFL Up to the Minute. "It's not anything that is contentious right now. But Brady would absolutely be interested in revisiting this contract."
That said, neither Rapoport nor Garafolo believes Wednesday's reports represent a ploy by Brady to expedite those talks. In fact, Brady's public statements on the matter have left no doubt that he intends to return for a 19th NFL season.
"Tom Brady is going to play in 2018," Rapoport explained. "He said it. Everyone close to him has said it. Everyone I've spoken to has said it. The Patriots are going forward with the very strict and stern belief that he will be playing for 2018. I don't get the sense that they considered any of these reports this morning about 'maybe he doesn't play.'
"I also know Brady is planning a little passing camp with some of his buddies before training camp. That does not sound like the kind of the thing you would do if you were not going to play in 2018."
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000927188/article/tom-brady-eyes-new-contract-will-play-in-2018?campaign=tw-nf-sf187290343-sf187290343&sf187290343=1
for crissakes.
Calling into question his commitment?
There is no official way that a player, ANY player "lets the team know" that he's going to play. He plays. So The fact that Brady hasn't "let them know he's going to play" is a nothing. He hasn't told them that he doesn't have a brain tumor the size of an avocado, either. uh-oh!!!!!!!! Maybe he's having a passing camp because he will soon be passing....on? OHMYGOD Brady's gonna die!!! Yes, he is. "Brady Announces He Is Going to Die, But Wont Commit to 2018"

Would Brady "absolutely be interested" or is he "seeking a new contract." Those are different things. At least in English they are. I would "absolutely be interested" in a lot of stuff. "I am seeking" a whole lot less.

The obvious problem right now is that the Pats aren't controlling the narrative or communicating at all to squash this nonsense. In the absence of one of the major players involved manning up, fans and media are left to speculate. .
Its not the team's job to keep morons from moronning. In fact, I think they enjoy it. responding to this nonsense would be like responding to player on the other team before a big game. And if they do respond, even with proof that Brady is playing in 2018 (which can not by definition exist) the new "narrative" and "optics" will be that they're "panicking" in the face of "unprecedented scrutiny" or some other nonsense that otherwise intelligent people seem all too willing to eat up..
 

AB in DC

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This is the problem in a nutshell. Fans who have no idea if any of these stories are true will be convinced by the drumbeat of the media coverage and therefore accept it. We've already seen signs of it here today.
It's another example of ESPN completely inventing a story out of whole cloth just for clicks. And people fall for it time and time again. Pathetic.
 

OnWisc

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It's another example of ESPN completely inventing a story out of whole cloth just for clicks. And people fall for it time and time again. Pathetic.
Not half as pathetic as when the guys on Pardon the Interruption or whatever moniker SAS's insane ramblings are marketed under start debating whether "people" are reading too much into Tom Brady's "actions."

Or perhaps brilliant. I mean, some outlets manufacture breathless and baseless content for one round of clicks. ESPN doesn't settle for just that first round, their bullshit stories feed the network for a week. And to your point, it....just....keeps....happening.

It's like the Boy Who Cried Wolf, but the fucking villagers never stop coming. And also he has a partner in the newspaper business who sells tons of papers analyzing whether or not there was a wolf.