2022 World Cup In Qatar: 1,000 Workers Already Dead

Infield Infidel

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http://www.espnfc.us/fifa-world-cup/story/1868185/report-qatar-paid-$17-million-for-asian-votes
 
 

 
FIFA's decision to award the 2022 World Cup to Qatar came under further scrutiny as The Sunday Times published new allegations that Mohamed Bin Hammam used his wealth and top level contacts to buy support for the oil-rich country's successful bid.
The newspaper, which last week claimed that the former FIFA Executive Committee member made payments totaling $5 million to senior football officials to seal support for Qatar, also accused Bin Hammam of using $1.7 million to secure key Asian votes.
It alleged that Bin Hammam arranged government level talks for Thailand's FIFA executive Worawi Makudi to discuss a gas sale "potentially worth tens of millions of dollars to Thailand'' and that he was invited to visit Vladimir Putin before Russia and Qatar's victories in the votes for the 2018 and 2022 World Cups.

 
 
 
And the sponsors are not happy
 
On Sunday, four of FIFA's top-tier sponsors - among six who will pay a collective $700 million over four years toward this World Cup - spoke out about persistent corruption allegations.
"The negative tenor of the public debate around FIFA at the moment is neither good for football nor for FIFA and its partners," said Adidas, the World Cup ball provider since 1970.
Visa called on FIFA to "maintain strong ethical standards and operate with transparency."
 
"Anything that detracts from the mission and ideals of the FIFA World Cup is a concern to us," Coca-Cola said in a statement, "but we are confident that FIFA is taking these allegations very seriously and is investigating them thoroughly."
A fourth, Sony, called for all claims to be "investigated appropriately."
FIFA's marketing director Thierry Weil said it had constant contact with commercial partners.
"Our sponsors have not requested anything that is not covered by the ongoing investigation by the ethics committee," Weil said in a FIFA statement.
 

Chemistry Schmemistry

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Looks like Blatter is doubling down with the race card.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27762435

It would be interesting to have another Cup here. I'd try to go to a match, just to experience it. I regret not taking advantage of the opportunity back in '94.

Weather-wise I don't see how they run it in the summer in Qatar. There's 90 and humid, and then there's an average daily high of 100 from early May until the end of September (105 in June-July). The high in Doha should reach 118 on Thursday, when the Cup begins. That's not realistic from a "we'd like to see top-notch soccer" perspective.

Humidity makes a difference. At 90, you run into dangerous conditions when the humidity exceeds 80 percent. We all know those days - it feels like being inside a swamp when you're outside. But when it's 110, you get that danger at 20 percent humidity. Qatar well over that line most of the summer.

I don't think there's any question they have to play the Cup after October if they're going to stay in Qatar, which will affect leagues that generate insane amounts of money.

Blatter may blame racism for the accusations of bribery, but how else, other than corruption, do you explain a process where this weather concern is completely ignored?
 

bosox4283

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JayMags71 said:
Jesus Christ.

Now *THIS* is how you devalue accusations of true racism. Good job, Sepp.
 
Yup. One train wreck after another. And it's horrifying, to me at least, because there is nothing that can stop this monster. 
 
Edit: Maybe the only way is to pressure the sponsors to the extent that they pull out...but then someone else would surely take that open spot.
 

DLew On Roids

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I don't think Blatter's comments are defensible, but it's worth recalling that there's a reason this kind of nonsense works with representatives from CAF and AFC.  Stanley Rous's leadership of FIFA, which included a vigorous defense of keeping South Africa in the organization back in the 1960s, is always in the back of the minds of those countries when criticism comes from the UK or England specifically.  There are large swathes of world soccer that think that the Home Nations view the rest of the world as colonial outposts, and any comment originating there is discounted as the product of racism.  Blatter's comments might be odious and inaccurate, but he's preaching to the choir.
 

jose melendez

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Does anyone really think there's any way in hell they're going to move it on account of the corruption?
 
The onyl way this gets moved is if it makes money dissapear (rather than making money appear like corruption does).  And the only way that happens is if sponsors get so mad they start pulling money.  That won't happen over corruption but it (maybe) could over the worker deaths.
 

jose melendez

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Interestingly, the lead story on BBC's Focus on Africa this morning was about CAF  ( the African Federation) attacking the British Media, for being defamatory.  Blatter's version will play well in the sticks.
 

Chemistry Schmemistry

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I don't know how soccer contracts work, but is there any chance that once we get closer to 2022, clubs will start asking for contract clauses paying players not to participate in the Cup?
 

Cellar-Door

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Chemistry Schmemistry said:
I don't know how soccer contracts work, but is there any chance that once we get closer to 2022, clubs will start asking for contract clauses paying players not to participate in the Cup?
No because the teams are bound by league rules, which are bound by national federation rules, which are bound by regional federation rules, which are controlled by.........
you guessed it FIFA.
 
For example, Chelsea can't make that contract because FIFA would not allow it, which binds UEFA which binds the English FA, which binds the Premier league (actually you can skip the league probably clubs are direct members of the FA.)
 

Vinho Tinto

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Chemistry Schmemistry said:
I don't know how soccer contracts work, but is there any chance that once we get closer to 2022, clubs will start asking for contract clauses paying players not to participate in the Cup?
 
I believe the authority that FIFA has with all of the regional bodies (Which govern the individual FAs) would preclude that from happening. Not a perfect analogy, but it would be like trying to create a city/town labor law that ignores state and federal guidelines.  
 

fletcherpost

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Serious question cos i find this so fuckin depressing. What would it take to clean up FIFA? Does football need FIFA? Football needs a world cup every four years, with a fair qualification system - i dunno if the current qualification system is fair...and i don't know the true inner workings of FIFA, but i remember years ago thinking Ballter was more of a comedy villain but now it seems he and his organisation have become so much more heinous, troublesome and damaging.
 
I mean everyone without a vested interest with a mere passing knowledge of football knows Quatar should never have even been considered for the world Cup. And it's not cos they are not a 'footballing nation'. The World Cup in the USA was a great success, I'd be more than happy for them to get it again, same with Australia, they deserve a crack at it sometime soon. But Quatar...
 
Can the footballing Federations and Bodies of the world do anything about this? I am gonna have to do some digging but is say an organisation like UEFA, a powerful footballing body to be sure, are they subserviant to FIFA, or are they a sort of subsidiary of FIFA...how does it work? How does one go about cleaning out FIFA.
 
Reading and seeing footbage of non Quatari  workers, having their passports withheld, working like dogs, dropping like flies - it's fuckin heartbreaking. And if it were to get the collumn inches it trulyy deserves would really cast a dim light on the sport, which let's not forget is by far and away the most popular sport on this planet. So much information, so little power, so fuckin depressing.
 

DLew On Roids

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I used to think that UEFA might change FIFA by its clubs threatening to break away, but even if they did, FIFA would still exist, just as corrupt, just a lot smaller.  
 

SoxFanInCali

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I would love it if the US and Mexico told the rest of CONCACAF to pound sand.  Jack Warner may be gone, but the federation is still being run primarily to line the pockets of Caribbean officials.
 
And yes, Chuck Blazer needs to go as well.
 

soxfan121

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DLew On Roids said:
I used to think that UEFA might change FIFA by its clubs threatening to break away, but even if they did, FIFA would still exist, just as corrupt, just a lot smaller.  
 
I know, right? Somehow, Platini & UEFA are making Blatter & FIFA look good in comparison.
 

Spacemans Bong

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DLew On Roids said:
I don't think Blatter's comments are defensible, but it's worth recalling that there's a reason this kind of nonsense works with representatives from CAF and AFC.  Stanley Rous's leadership of FIFA, which included a vigorous defense of keeping South Africa in the organization back in the 1960s, is always in the back of the minds of those countries when criticism comes from the UK or England specifically.  There are large swathes of world soccer that think that the Home Nations view the rest of the world as colonial outposts, and any comment originating there is discounted as the product of racism.  Blatter's comments might be odious and inaccurate, but he's preaching to the choir.
 
Even more relevant is that England and its media is criticizing Qatar in part because it's sick of the corruption, yes, but also because they want to host the 2022 Finals themselves. England is right, but it's being self-serving in doing so.
 

blueguitar322

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Spacemans Bong said:
 
Even more relevant is that England and its media is criticizing Qatar in part because it's sick of the corruption, yes, but also because they want to host the 2022 Finals themselves. England is right, but it's being self-serving in doing so.
 
My understanding was that if Russia hosts 2018, no European nation is eligible to host for another two cycles, e.g. Germany --> South Africa --> Brazil and then Europe again, this time Russia.
 

Cellar-Door

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blueguitar322 said:
 
My understanding was that if Russia hosts 2018, no European nation is eligible to host for another two cycles, e.g. Germany --> South Africa --> Brazil and then Europe again, this time Russia.
Correct. It would likely go to one of:
US, Korea, Australia.
 
C'mon...Blatter's racism accusations were classic talk-out-of-both-sides-of-your-mouth politicking which truly cannot be taken at face value. My guess is that he's trying to make sure he stays in with the Third World federations even as he leaks information to the Sunday Times (through several layers of intermediaries who can't trace the leaks back to him). In his ideal scenario, this lets him get out of Qatar 2022 (pleasing the developed/rational world) while still keeping/gaining support in the less developed nations and greasing the skids for his re-election campaign. Let us not forget that in the wake of England's disastrous bid to host the 2018 World Cup, accusations of corruption were flung around at the time by various British newspapers - most of which smacked of so much sour grapes, without nearly as much hard evidence as the Times seems to have now. So where better to leak your information than an English paper if you want the evidence to be taken seriously by the West but easily disregarded in the developing world?
 
I think we all know FIFA is an utterly corrupt and shameless cesspit, but this feels to me like normal hardball politics being played by Blatter (and played rather well).
 

moly99

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Sadly Platini is at least as bad as Blatter. UEFA is only less corrupt than FIFA because they have less opportunities to put their hands in the cookie jar.

ConigliarosPotential said:
C'mon...Blatter's racism accusations were classic talk-out-of-both-sides-of-your-mouth politicking which truly cannot be taken at face value. My guess is that he's trying to make sure he stays in with the Third World federations even as he leaks information to the Sunday Times (through several layers of intermediaries who can't trace the leaks back to him). In his ideal scenario, this lets him get out of Qatar 2022 (pleasing the developed/rational world) while still keeping/gaining support in the less developed nations and greasing the skids for his re-election campaign.
Yup. What's amazing about FIFA politics is not how dirty it is, but how transparently dirty it is.
 

BigA27

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Chemistry Schmemistry said:
Looks like Blatter is doubling down with the race card.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27762435

It would be interesting to have another Cup here. I'd try to go to a match, just to experience it. I regret not taking advantage of the opportunity back in '94.

Weather-wise I don't see how they run it in the summer in Qatar. There's 90 and humid, and then there's an average daily high of 100 from early May until the end of September (105 in June-July). The high in Doha should reach 118 on Thursday, when the Cup begins. That's not realistic from a "we'd like to see top-notch soccer" perspective.

Humidity makes a difference. At 90, you run into dangerous conditions when the humidity exceeds 80 percent. We all know those days - it feels like being inside a swamp when you're outside. But when it's 110, you get that danger at 20 percent humidity. Qatar well over that line most of the summer.

I don't think there's any question they have to play the Cup after October if they're going to stay in Qatar, which will affect leagues that generate insane amounts of money.

Blatter may blame racism for the accusations of bribery, but how else, other than corruption, do you explain a process where this weather concern is completely ignored?
 
The gulf states are unbelievably humid during the summer. Despite being in a desert the moisture off the extremely warm Persian Gulf just envelopes the cities. Its roughly 70-80% humidity at times. I have not been to Doha but have spent time in August in Kuwait City, Bahrain, Dubai, and Abu Dhabi. All were oppressively hot (almost every day above 100 and most above 110 Fahrenheit) and incredibly humid. You couldn't move without dripping with clammy sweat. A humid desert is an unpleasant thing. 
 

DJnVa

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He follows with a statement from US Soccer saying that report is not accurate. 
 

soxfan121

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Internal report?! This man remains in charge. He laughs at your internal report. 
 

Jed Zeppelin

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This is just more sore English losership anyhow. Does the sun never set on British hubris? Nobody forced the FA to put forth a terrible bid.
 

Zososoxfan

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Jed Zeppelin said:
This is just more sore English losership anyhow. Does the sun never set on British hubris? Nobody forced the FA to put forth a terrible bid.
 
I don't agree with this. About 25 people were happy when the Qatari WC was announced, and they were all oil magnates or the beneficiaries of bribes. That WC would suck, and the best any real soccer fans can hope for is that this shit show gets so out of hand that FIFA is forced to move it. The best aspect of that scenario is that the US would be one of very few plausible alternatives, so I'm hoping twice as much that this shameful shit gets remedied and the US benefits from it.
 

Silverdude2167

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But seriously what happened to this:
 
 
Fifa's ethics committee is already in the process of investigating allegations of corruption surrounding the successful bid and is due to report back next month.
Former US prosecutor Michael Garcia, who is leading Fifa's internal investigation, will publish his report around a week after this year's World Cup final.
Did I miss it?
 
from this: http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news-and-comment/qatar-world-cup-2022-corruption-allegations-hyundai-becomes-latest-major-sponsor-to-turn-up-the-heat-on-fifa-over-newspaper-claims-9514439.html
 

Jeff Van GULLY

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Grant Wahl updated today about the report:

 
@GrantWahl  ·  2h

FIFA says Garcia Report investigating WC18 & WC22 bids has been submitted. Remains to be seen whether it will be made public.

 
 
 
 
and more importantly nothing will change:
 
@GrantWahl  ·  2h

Have been told for a while not to expect any smoking guns in Garcia Report that would cause Qatar or Russia to lose World Cup hosting rights

 
 
 

soxfan121

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Infield Infidel said:
Brazil world cup attendance 3,429,873
Qatar Population 2,155,446
 
Did you include the women? I don't know if you should count the women.
 

Silverdude2167

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It would be interesting to see the Qatar National Team. A team that suddenly has a lot of duel citizens from Brazil, Spain and Germany.
 

soxfan121

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The Allented Mr Ripley said:
How much for the women?
 
Maybe count a few trophy wives but the class structure in Qatar is pretty weird. 
 
So like, none?
 

Vinho Tinto

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If you have HBO, look in the On Demand or the 2Go app the Real Sports episode from July. They did a story on the Qatari World Cup that was shocking with regards to the working conditions for migrant workers. Al Jazeera America did a great story on third country nationals working on US military bases in the Middle East last year. I couldn't find a clip of that on youtube, but from my experience of working on Al Jaber AFB in 1999 both pieces were 100% accurate. 
 
 
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9f2WT830x8[/media]
 

soxfan121

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Vinho Tinto said:
If you have HBO, look in the On Demand or the 2Go app the Real Sports episode from July. They did a story on the Qatari World Cup that was shocking with regards to the working conditions for migrant workers. Al Jazeera America did a great story on third country nationals working on US military bases in the Middle East last year. I couldn't find a clip of that on youtube, but from my experience of working on Al Jaber AFB in 1999 both pieces were 100% accurate. 
 
 
[media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9f2WT830x8[/media]
 
I recall seeing that on HBO when it aired and it is fantastic. Thanks for posting it here - provides lots of useful context on the situation.
 

Dan Murfman

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I happened to see it last night. I don't care one bit of the bribery. But how anyone in FIFA could watch that piece and think it was okay for the World Cup to played there is just unbelievable to me.
 

Chemistry Schmemistry

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I wonder what they'll do if Israel qualifies. Israel had to be "adopted" by the European region, for obvious reasons. So their road to qualification has been difficult. But they've been competitive at times.
 

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Vinho Tinto said:
If you have HBO, look in the On Demand or the 2Go app the Real Sports episode from July. They did a story on the Qatari World Cup that was shocking with regards to the working conditions for migrant workers. Al Jazeera America did a great story on third country nationals working on US military bases in the Middle East last year. I couldn't find a clip of that on youtube, but from my experience of working on Al Jaber AFB in 1999 both pieces were 100% accurate.
Looks like this May be the Al Jazeera story you were talking about.

http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows/fault-lines/Episodes/2014/3/7/america-s-war-workers.html
 

Jed Zeppelin

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Report will not be made public (duh), the ethics committee has no actual power (again, duh) except for the magic of delaying tactics:
 
He said he would finish examining Garcia's report by the "end of October, beginning of November".
 
Eckert added: "I am now doing a statement on the report and then Mr Garcia will be working further. There will be some decisions, maybe in spring, and then we will go on."
 
German judge Eckert, the chair of the adjudicatory chamber of Fifa's ethics committee, says he will limit his verdicts to individuals, disappointing Fifa critics who want him to order re-votes into Russia 2018 and Qatar 2022 after allegations of corruption.
 
He added that such a decision would be for Fifa's ruling executive committee or its congress of 209 federations. "The judgement may be the base for a decision in sports politics, but we will not make any recommendations. That is not our job," he said.
 
Eckert insisted that no-one at Fifa had read the confidential reports from Garcia, the chair of the investigatory chamber of the ethics committee, and they will "never" be made public. He said only four people had seen the files — himself, Garcia, and their deputies, Australian judge Alan Sullivan and Swiss prosecutor Cornel Borbely.
 
 

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Qatar will not host 2022 World Cup, says FIFA's Zwanziger
 
Just one man's opinion and absolutely not anything official, but FWIW the guy is on FIFA's ExCo.
 
 
The 2022 World Cup will not be held in Qatar because of the scorching temperatures in the Middle East country, FIFA Executive Committee member Theo Zwanziger said on Monday.
 
"I personally think that in the end the 2022 World Cup will not take place in Qatar," the German told Sport Bild on Monday.