Aaron Hernandez: Had Advanced CTE - NEP Sued

lexrageorge

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2007
18,101
I'm not convinced that the Pats will be forced to pay out the withheld bonuses. First, I'm not sure a conviction is absolutely necessary. Second, it's the NFL, so Goodell rules. And as much as the Jets fans in the league office would love to screw over the Pats, the last thing Goodell wants is to give the NFLPA any sort of satisfaction.

The pension may be harder to withhold, as it may now be considered "earned", as Hernandez did indeed play in the league for a few years.
 

staz

Intangible
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 2, 2004
20,671
The cradle of the game.
What an utter and complete waste. At least with this, his stain can erode a little more from all that is good about my Gators and Pats.

But isn't suicide itself a (ironic) felony? Wonder if the medical examiner pronouncement constitutes an automatic conviction, and if that plays into the remaining assets of the estate?
 

drbretto

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 10, 2009
12,080
Concord, NH
You know what, maybe it wasn't his lawyer who tipped him off. Maybe Hernandez just watched Louis CK's latest special on netflix!
 

Rusty13

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 3, 2007
5,351
I'm not a lawyer, but the firearm conviction may stand because he hadn't filed an appeal yet.
It actually looks like you are right. I spoke to a very experienced appellate attorney that I know, and she confirmed that unless a notice of appeal was filed prior to his death, the conviction CANNOT be vacated under the abatement precedent. He may end up going to his grave a convicted felon after all.
 

Dan Murfman

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 21, 2001
4,187
Pawcatuck
It actually looks like you are right. I spoke to a very experienced appellate attorney that I know, and she confirmed that unless a notice of appeal was filed prior to his death, the conviction CANNOT be vacated under the abatement precedent. He may end up going to his grave a convicted felon after all.
K
 

AB in DC

OG Football Writing
SoSH Member
Jul 10, 2002
13,633
Springfield, VA
Yes, since the conviction, by law, is vacated, then it cannot be used as prima facie evidence in a subsequent related civil lawsuit, as can regularly be done with underlying convictions. Having said that, I believe the preponderance of evidence standard for any wrongful death lawsuit with respect to the Lloyd case will not be hard to meet. And transcripts of the murder trial can be utilized in some ways at the civil trial depending on how any evidence comes in through witnesses etc.
So if Odin Lloyd's family filed a civil suit, they would have to start from scratch to show Hernandez's culpability?
 

joe dokes

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
30,247
It actually looks like you are right. I spoke to a very experienced appellate attorney that I know, and she confirmed that unless a notice of appeal was filed prior to his death, the conviction CANNOT be vacated under the abatement precedent. He may end up going to his grave a convicted felon after all.
I stand corrected.
 

gryoung

Member
SoSH Member
And wouldn't it be interesting if AH did this because he knew his conviction would be vacated by committing suicide thus giving his girlfriend and his child a chance at whatever might be left in his estate currently, or through future recovery litigation against the Patriots or media proceeds from his life story.
Similiar to the situation when Tom visited the prison housing the former associate of the Corleone family who was going to be the government witness ........
 

SumnerH

Malt Liquor Picker
Dope
SoSH Member
Jul 18, 2005
31,900
Alexandria, VA
But isn't suicide itself a (ironic) felony?
I don't believe that's the case in any state these days; most (all?) of the laws criminalizing suicide were phased out by the late 1980s-ish (with a few stragglers a bit later).

There are still laws on the books for assisting suicide, suicide while pregnant, suicide with intent to skew various contracts/insurance/etc, but I don't think there are any states left were suicide per se is illegal.
 

Sprowl

mikey lowell of the sandbox
Dope
SoSH Member
Jun 27, 2006
34,452
Haiku
Similiar to the situation when Tom visited the prison housing the former associate of the Corleone family who was going to be the government witness ........
Tom Brady is always crucial to the plot line.
 

sheamonu

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 11, 2004
1,342
Dublin, Ireland
I understand all of the legal nuances involved but find it hard to believe that they played in to Hernandez' planning. If he were going to kill himself to void the conviction why wait until now? He could have done it anytime prior to the completion of the latest trial with the same effect - why risk the chance of having to appeal a possible double conviction? And people are forgetting that the recent acquittal gave him a better (though by no means a good) chance of overturning the prior conviction. Remember - that conviction was at least partially obtained on the theory that AH killed Odin to cover up the fact that he killed the two nightclub patrons. Now that theory cannot be advanced at all - Hernandez has been acquitted of that charge. Any grounds for a new trial - improper venue, a juror who comes forward and alleges something, incompetent counsel (all long shots, I concede) - but any one of them that sticks - he's back in with a second bite at the apple and a much better chance of getting off. So why - knowing that - does he kill himself now? There are really only two logical conclusions - one, he was so depressed at having "won" only to face staring at the same four walls for the rest of his life that he decided that that would be only a short time if he had any say in the matter - and, two, he was killed by someone on the inside. I think option 1 is more likely - but, knowing how hard it is to kill yourself in prison (it ain't easy) and how things can sometimes be "arranged" - I think there is a 40% chance this was an "assisted" suicide.
 

NortheasternPJ

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 16, 2004
19,272
Apparently he had John 3:16 written on his head:


I'm not sure believing in Jesus is going to save you from multiple homicides then killing yourself, but good luck Aaron, hope it all worked out at the gates. Tell St. Peter I said hello.
 

uncannymanny

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 12, 2007
9,081
The Bible verse thing is odd. I'm not implying any conspiracy, but that's an odd/awkward place to write on yourself.
 

gingerbreadmann

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 11, 2008
750
The Bible verse thing is odd. I'm not implying any conspiracy, but that's an odd/awkward place to write on yourself.
There's a joke to be made here about Tebow getting through to him about 10 years too late. This whole thing is too weird and sad for my heart to be in it though.
 

Myt1

educated, civility-loving ass
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Mar 13, 2006
41,582
South Boston
I understand all of the legal nuances involved but find it hard to believe that they played in to Hernandez' planning. If he were going to kill himself to void the conviction why wait until now? He could have done it anytime prior to the completion of the latest trial with the same effect - why risk the chance of having to appeal a possible double conviction? And people are forgetting that the recent acquittal gave him a better (though by no means a good) chance of overturning the prior conviction. Remember - that conviction was at least partially obtained on the theory that AH killed Odin to cover up the fact that he killed the two nightclub patrons. Now that theory cannot be advanced at all - Hernandez has been acquitted of that charge.
Why? There's no res judicata effect of an acquittal on the ability to offer a motive as evidence.
 

I am an Idiot

"Duke"
SoSH Member
Nov 16, 2007
5,116
I understand all of the legal nuances involved but find it hard to believe that they played in to Hernandez' planning. If he were going to kill himself to void the conviction why wait until now? He could have done it anytime prior to the completion of the latest trial with the same effect - why risk the chance of having to appeal a possible double conviction? And people are forgetting that the recent acquittal gave him a better (though by no means a good) chance of overturning the prior conviction. Remember - that conviction was at least partially obtained on the theory that AH killed Odin to cover up the fact that he killed the two nightclub patrons. Now that theory cannot be advanced at all - Hernandez has been acquitted of that charge. Any grounds for a new trial - improper venue, a juror who comes forward and alleges something, incompetent counsel (all long shots, I concede) - but any one of them that sticks - he's back in with a second bite at the apple and a much better chance of getting off. So why - knowing that - does he kill himself now? There are really only two logical conclusions - one, he was so depressed at having "won" only to face staring at the same four walls for the rest of his life that he decided that that would be only a short time if he had any say in the matter - and, two, he was killed by someone on the inside. I think option 1 is more likely - but, knowing how hard it is to kill yourself in prison (it ain't easy) and how things can sometimes be "arranged" - I think there is a 40% chance this was an "assisted" suicide.

He was acquitted of what he murdered to cover up. He realized he was a dink and wouldn't be in jail if he hadn't continued murdering.
 

Rusty13

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 3, 2007
5,351
So if Odin Lloyd's family filed a civil suit, they would have to start from scratch to show Hernandez's culpability?
Pretty much. But like I said the transcripts from the criminal trial will help, discovery will now be easily obtainable and they effectively already have a road map in place for preparation. And given the lesser standard of proof, this should be very easily winnable case if it even goes to trial. They don't even have to show specific intent/premeditation or malice aforethought like with 1st degree murder. For wrongful death all they have to show is negligence causing death (or willful, reckless and wanton conduct or "gross" negligence to get punitive damages). His defense at the criminal trial pretty much conceded him calling up his Conn. boys to come up to Mass. and putting all 3 of them together with Lloyd at the scene of the murder but tried to argue he was an "unwilling participant". Good luck arguing that in the civil case!
 

Red(s)HawksFan

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 23, 2009
20,678
Maine
And he was possibly smoking Synthetic Weed (k2) last night:

Isn't that the stuff Chandler Jones smoked before his barefoot sojourn to the Foxboro police station a couple years ago?

If Hernandez smoked that last night, it makes the theory that he killed himself as part of a pre-meditated plan to benefit his estate a hell of a lot harder to swallow.
 

mauidano

Mai Tais for everyone!
SoSH Member
Aug 21, 2006
35,657
Maui
There is always more to the story and it's obviously slowly coming out now. Regardless the end result is the same. The drugs and depression seem an obvious tipping point. Still, fuck him, the horse he rode in on and go straight to Hell. Do not pass Go. He did everyone a favor, especially his wife and kid.
 

Rovin Romine

Johnny Rico
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 14, 2005
23,722
Miami (oh, Miami!)
Late to the party.

I think all the bases have been covered in the thread - though I don't believe people have mentioned the attorneys fees going to the defense. They'll be substantial. That said, 40 million is a lot to go through. There should be enough there for someone to take the Lloyd family on contingency and attempt a redo (if no settlement) of the Lloyd criminal trial. Frankly, bizarro scenarios aside, I didn't see how a criminal jury would outright acquit. Therefore I can't imagine a civil jury finding for Hernandez's estate under the lesser standard.

Also, the families of the two young men who were shot should be able to file a wrongful death action. That case might be fundamentally weaker though.

And Bradley may have a civil suit still pending.

I would be shocked if there wasn't a will. But, would it surprise anyone if the GF sued the estate?

I think the fallout of this has the potential to be very messy.

***
In terms of vacating a conviction-pending-appeal upon death, it might make more sense if you view it through the "presumption of innocence" lens along with the "fair trial" lens. I mean, clearly, if one is presumed innocent and dies before trial, there can't be a conviction. This is similar.

I've only had one criminal client die pre-trial. The prosecutor kept threatening to try the case because corrections couldn't produce a death certificate to her liking. To this day I have no idea what she was on about, but it may have been a slightly irrational response to pressure from the victim. But, I mean, what are you going to do, wheel the corpse out there and have a trial?
 

PaulinMyrBch

Don't touch his dog food
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 10, 2003
8,316
MYRTLE BEACH!!!!
Late to the party.

I think all the bases have been covered in the thread - though I don't believe people have mentioned the attorneys fees going to the defense. They'll be substantial. That said, 40 million is a lot to go through. There should be enough there for someone to take the Lloyd family on contingency and attempt a redo (if no settlement) of the Lloyd criminal trial. Frankly, bizarro scenarios aside, I didn't see how a criminal jury would outright acquit. Therefore I can't imagine a civil jury finding for Hernandez's estate under the lesser standard.

Also, the families of the two young men who were shot should be able to file a wrongful death action. That case might be fundamentally weaker though.

And Bradley may have a civil suit still pending.

I would be shocked if there wasn't a will. But, would it surprise anyone if the GF sued the estate?

I think the fallout of this has the potential to be very messy.

***
In terms of vacating a conviction-pending-appeal upon death, it might make more sense if you view it through the "presumption of innocence" lens along with the "fair trial" lens. I mean, clearly, if one is presumed innocent and dies before trial, there can't be a conviction. This is similar.

I've only had one criminal client die pre-trial. The prosecutor kept threatening to try the case because corrections couldn't produce a death certificate to her liking. To this day I have no idea what she was on about, but it may have been a slightly irrational response to pressure from the victim. But, I mean, what are you going to do, wheel the corpse out there and have a trial?
That's hilarious. I'm guessing her trial record was so bad, she was looking to try him in absentia for better odds.
 

Myt1

educated, civility-loving ass
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Mar 13, 2006
41,582
South Boston
Late to the party.

I think all the bases have been covered in the thread - though I don't believe people have mentioned the attorneys fees going to the defense. They'll be substantial. That said, 40 million is a lot to go through. There should be enough there for someone to take the Lloyd family on contingency and attempt a redo (if no settlement) of the Lloyd criminal trial. Frankly, bizarro scenarios aside, I didn't see how a criminal jury would outright acquit. Therefore I can't imagine a civil jury finding for Hernandez's estate under the lesser standard.
It's interesting. Under normal circumstances, anything held in a joint tenancy with a right of survivorship skips the estate and probate and becomes the sole property of the surviving joint tenant by operation of the death itself. Most joint bank accounts are JTROS by default. Lots of real property is by deed.

I have no idea if a pending or likely to be filed suit would thwart that, but AFAIK, there's no current civil judgment against him, so it's not like he has any judgment creditors that could complain of a fraudulent transfer.

Which brings me to:

The Bible verse thing is odd. I'm not implying any conspiracy, but that's an odd/awkward place to write on yourself.
Everyone always concentrates on the end of that verse (because it's more anthrocentric). In light of what I wrote above, the "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son . . . ." bit might be more interesting. Fucking humans making the direct object of the verse the important thing: if you believe in divine inspiration, it's God bragging about how awesome he is.

I'll defer to anyone who actually knows how the legality of a convicted murderer entering into a joint tenancy works, or if there's a limit on the amount that can be transferred that way.

To destroy any opacity, with the information I have right now, I think it's possible that Hernandez could have just ensured that his fiancée and daughter get everything. Certainly open to being shown the error of my ways, though.
 
Last edited:

DanoooME

above replacement level
SoSH Member
Mar 16, 2008
19,831
Henderson, NV
A friend showed me a tweet today that said something to the effect of:

INJURY UPDATE: Aaron Hernandez (neck) OUT indefinitely
 

Hank Scorpio

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 1, 2013
6,923
Salem, NH
LeGarrette Blount: In protest of the Trump presidency, I will not be attending the White House visit.
Chris Long: Me neither.
Alan Branch: Nor myself.
Dont’a Hightower: I will also not be going.
Martellus Bennett: Count me out.
Devin McCourty: I'm taking a stand.
Aaron Hernandez: Hold my beer.
 
LeGarrette Blount: In protest of the Trump presidency, I will not be attending the White House visit.
Chris Long: Me neither.
Alan Branch: Nor myself.
Dont’a Hightower: I will also not be going.
Martellus Bennett: Count me out.
Devin McCourty: I'm taking a stand.
Aaron Hernandez: Hold my beer.
This is the "Hold my beer" meme that's been circulating today.