Elite 8 Game Thread

Ale Xander

Hamilton
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The Truths will set you free

Bye bye dookies
Have fun in The G league Grayson

Epic game though
 

BigSoxFan

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Up 3 with 30 secs to go.

Awful steal attempt by Duval.

3 for KU.

No timeout by Coach K leading to forced Allen shot that nearly goes in but clearly wasn’t good look.

Bad turning point charge call that fouled Carter out.

Wide open 3 misses to tie the game after Bagley foregoes being assertive for the 56th time of the night.

That’s gonna sting.
 

lars10

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have no idea how Bagley didn't get the ball at all on the last possession before OT.

Allen going iso after having a very mediocre game.. just another awful decision.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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It would be interesting to look at all Duke buzzer beater scenario situations in the tournament and see what they did. I don’t really like Duke but they are kind of like the Patriots in that they have a really big post season body of work that makes for interesting stats.

If you define a buzzer beater possession as having the ball with the shot clock off with a chance to win the game, so down 1, 2, or tied, I can think of several. Laettner against Connecticut, Laettner against Kentucky, he converted. I think also against UNLV kind of. He got a rebound with the shot clock off and was fouled. Then Langdon against Connecticut did not get a shot off. Redick against Connecticut a few years later got stripped. I think Henderson scored very late against Belmont. Allen today missed.

There must be a few others.
 
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Greg29fan

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It would be interesting to look at all Duke buzzer beater scenario situations in the tournament and see what they did. I don’t really like Duke but they are kind of like the Patriots in that they have a really big post season body of work that makes for interesting stats.

If you define a buzzer beater possession as having the ball with the shot clock off with a chance to win the game, so down 1, 2, or tied, I can think of several. Laettner against Connecticut, Laettner against Kentucky, he converted. I think also against UNLV kind of. He got a rebound with the shot clock off and was fouled. Then Langdon against Connecticut did not get a shot off. Redick against Connecticut a few years later got stripped. I think Henderson scored very late against Belmont. Allen today missed.

There must be a few others.
There was also Duke-Kentucky II in 1998 where Will Avery missed a running 30 footer at the horn that sealed Kentucky's 86-84 win and the 02 Regional Final against Indiana where Jason Williams missed the free throw of a potential 4-point play that would have tied the game w/four seconds or so left and Carlos Boozer missed the tip-in on the rebound.
 
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Average Reds

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It would be interesting to look at all Duke buzzer beater scenario situations in the tournament and see what they did. I don’t really like Duke but they are kind of like the Patriots in that they have a really big post season body of work that makes for interesting stats.

If you define a buzzer beater possession as having the ball with the shot clock off with a chance to win the game, so down 1, 2, or tied, I can think of several. Laettner against Connecticut, Laettner against Kentucky, he converted. I think also against UNLV kind of. He got a rebound with the shot clock off and was fouled. Then Langdon against Connecticut did not get a shot off. Redick against Connecticut a few years later got stripped. I think Henderson scored very late against Belmont. Allen today missed.

There must be a few others.
Most of the examples you are citing are truly last-second issues, where the team has to take a rushed shot or draw up a play for a few seconds.

The play last night was a difference in kind, in the sense that there was ample time left and Allen made a conscious decision to take the shot himself. Honestly, I can't kill him for that, as he came damn close to making it.

They got beat. Should be enough for those who look forward to DED.
 
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Dan Murfman

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‘99 down 1 with 5 seconds to go Langdon tried to beat Ricky Moore and never got a shot off and traveled.

And in 2004 down Final Four against UConn down 1 with 10 seconds to go Reddick drove in and got blocked by the entire UConn team. But Duhon did hit a three at the buzzer to get the backdoor cover.
 
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tims4wins

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Congrats to KU. They deserved to win. Duke wasn't good enough shooting the 3, defending the 3, or rebounding to earn the win. Experience won out.
 

Humphrey

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Congrats to KU. They deserved to win. Duke wasn't good enough shooting the 3, defending the 3, or rebounding to earn the win. Experience won out.
Especially the latter two which on a given night there is no reason for not doing well...and some of the blame for both of them was coach K's zone/matchup zone/sagging man-to-man....Whatever the hell it was there were (a) open shots available and (b) left Duke in terrible rebounding position.
 

tims4wins

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Especially the latter two which on a given night there is no reason for not doing well...and some of the blame for both of them was coach K's zone/matchup zone/sagging man-to-man....Whatever the hell it was there were (a) open shots available and (b) left Duke in terrible rebounding position.
Both had been mostly a strength for Duke all year. Picked a bad time to not defend the 3 well.
 

dcmissle

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I can’t wait till he tries his crap in the NBA among grown up men.
 

Ale Xander

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He seems to be regarded as a borderline #1 pick currently, I saw him at #25 and #32 in two different listings. I was surprised too.
Kwame Brown and Anthony Bennett were regarded as first overall picks . . .

Hopefully Pagliuca isn't choosing the draft picks, although I can't fault him for the Tatum pick whatsoever.
 

Humphrey

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Kwame Brown and Anthony Bennett were regarded as first overall picks . . .

Hopefully Pagliuca isn't choosing the draft picks, although I can't fault him for the Tatum pick whatsoever.
So was the aforementioned William Avery (14th overall)...now there's a guy whose pro career ended before it started- in the NCAA Finals vs UConn.
 

BaseballJones

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Not that many here care but the UConn women last night beat the defending national champs, who have the best player in the country, by 29 and it wasn't even that close.
 

Cuzittt

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11 straight final fours. Eleven. Straight. Say what you will about Women's college basketball (the final four, after all, is all #1 seeds), but going to 11 consecutive final 4s in a 64 team tournament Era is still awe inspiring.

Also awe inspiring... UCONN has faced and beaten two of the three other finalists this year (Notre Dame and Louisville). The team they haven't faced is Mississippi State... who broke the winning streak last year in the final four.
 

HomeRunBaker

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He seems to be regarded as a borderline #1 pick currently, I saw him at #25 and #32 in two different listings. I was surprised too.
I'd say that is Allen's range although I'd probably go a bit lower simply because he doesn't have the athleticism to have a high ceiling. I'm thinking 28-34. He's an older skill player entering the league and is already a better talent than many of the end of bench guards right now getting regular rotation run in the league. If Patrick McCaw can get minutes on the Warriors even when their entire lineup isn't on the shelf there is a spot on someones second unit in the league for Grayson Allen and he'll be cheap for 4 years.
 

BaseballJones

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11 straight final fours. Eleven. Straight. Say what you will about Women's college basketball (the final four, after all, is all #1 seeds), but going to 11 consecutive final 4s in a 64 team tournament Era is still awe inspiring.

Also awe inspiring... UCONN has faced and beaten two of the three other finalists this year (Notre Dame and Louisville). The team they haven't faced is Mississippi State... who broke the winning streak last year in the final four.
Yep. Really there's just no room for error to make it to 11 straight. They've had no slip ups. It's amazing. He's the greatest coach in the world but he still has kids playing for him. And you'd think over that span of time - 44 tournament games (11 years, 4 wins to get to the final four = 44 wins) - many of them against really good teams, that they'd slip up once. They simply haven't. It's amazing.
 

Dan Murfman

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Their closet Elite 8 game in the 11 years is 10 points. And their average margin of victory is 25.8 points. In the Sweet 16 they actually had a 5 point victory. And their average margin of victory is 24.6. That number is a little skewed by winning in back to back years in Sweet 16 by 50 and then 60 points.
 

chilidawg

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I'd say that is Allen's range although I'd probably go a bit lower simply because he doesn't have the athleticism to have a high ceiling. I'm thinking 28-34. He's an older skill player entering the league and is already a better talent than many of the end of bench guards right now getting regular rotation run in the league. If Patrick McCaw can get minutes on the Warriors even when their entire lineup isn't on the shelf there is a spot on someones second unit in the league for Grayson Allen and he'll be cheap for 4 years.
He's an inefficient volume scorer as a senior at the college level, how do you think that projects on an NBA roster?
 

HomeRunBaker

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He's an inefficient volume scorer as a senior at the college level, how do you think that projects on an NBA roster?
For one, that wouldn't be his role in the NBA. I get how polarizing a figure he is but I am eliminating the emotion and focusing on his skillset. Allen was much more than just a volume scorer at Duke. He was second on the team in assists, led them in steals, often initiated their offense, and was their highest energy player on the floor. At the next level he isn't going to be a great defender but does have the size to matchup and should be a solid positional team defender, he'll bring energy to a second unit and be a catch-and-shoot spotup guy.

Like all role players entering the league, where he ends up will determine his fate. He'll play off great players much better than he will crappy players so the Nets, Hawks, Kings, etc would represent a death knell to him but those teams should be looking at higher upside guys anyway. I can see him in Portland or Golden St late 1st round or landing in Toronto or Philly early 2nd. Looking more specifically at the order he'd be a great fit in Philly with one of their picks in the late 30's if he's still around that late.
 

Deathofthebambino

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For one, that wouldn't be his role in the NBA. I get how polarizing a figure he is but I am eliminating the emotion and focusing on his skillset. Allen was much more than just a volume scorer at Duke. He was second on the team in assists, led them in steals, often initiated their offense, and was their highest energy player on the floor. At the next level he isn't going to be a great defender but does have the size to matchup and should be a solid positional team defender, he'll bring energy to a second unit and be a catch-and-shoot spotup guy.

Like all role players entering the league, where he ends up will determine his fate. He'll play off great players much better than he will crappy players so the Nets, Hawks, Kings, etc would represent a death knell to him but those teams should be looking at higher upside guys anyway. I can see him in Portland or Golden St late 1st round or landing in Toronto or Philly early 2nd. Looking more specifically at the order he'd be a great fit in Philly with one of their picks in the late 30's if he's still around that late.
This is absolutely right. If Shane Larkin and Abdel Nader can play regular minutes in the NBA for a good team, there are 3 minutes a night off the bench for Grayson Allen on some team somewhere.
 

thehitcat

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For one, that wouldn't be his role in the NBA. I get how polarizing a figure he is but I am eliminating the emotion and focusing on his skillset. Allen was much more than just a volume scorer at Duke. He was second on the team in assists, led them in steals, often initiated their offense, and was their highest energy player on the floor. At the next level he isn't going to be a great defender but does have the size to matchup and should be a solid positional team defender, he'll bring energy to a second unit and be a catch-and-shoot spotup guy.

Like all role players entering the league, where he ends up will determine his fate. He'll play off great players much better than he will crappy players so the Nets, Hawks, Kings, etc would represent a death knell to him but those teams should be looking at higher upside guys anyway. I can see him in Portland or Golden St late 1st round or landing in Toronto or Philly early 2nd. Looking more specifically at the order he'd be a great fit in Philly with one of their picks in the late 30's if he's still around that late.
You're a better man than I am HRB. I hope he gets kicked in the nuts in the Summer League if that isn't too much to ask. Also I'd like to ask Donovan Mitchell to take one night next season to re-enact slapping Allen in the face. Once those two things happen I'm OK with allowing him to settle into a 12 minute a night guy on a team I never have to watch (say Portland or the Clippers.)