NaVorro Bowman released by 49ers. Sign him, Bill!
- Thread starter RedOctober3829
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I mean, they could restructure the contract but no idea if Bowman would be open to doing so.
Right, that's why I said if he wanted to come here. It doesnt take money out of his pocket to convert this year's salary to a signing bonus. So no one really has to go back.
I dont think the Pats are taking another big salary though. Pats cap situation for next year is OK but not great even before any potential Jimmy G shenanigans
I dont think the Pats are taking another big salary though. Pats cap situation for next year is OK but not great even before any potential Jimmy G shenanigans
Wouldn't his signing bonus be paid by the 49ers? According to Spotrac, he has $680,000/year for the next four years in signing bonus money. That was all paid out by the 49ers, so that would be accelerated when he's traded. That makes the cap hits a little better.
His signing bonus was paid by the 49ers in 2016, but the Pats would be on the hook for the bonus money that is still owed on the contract. For this year, the $2,6 million option bonus and per game bonuses up to this point have been paid by the 49ers. The Pats would be on the hook for the rest of his base salary plus the rest of the per game bonuses. He still has a $3.45 million option bonus owed in March of 2018 plus his $8.7 million base and $750,000 in per game bonuses. That's $12.9 million in cash next year.
Per Miguel, cutting or trading Branch saves $3 million in cap space and cutting/trading Harris saves only $625k.
The player that *could* go back to SF that creates the most cap space and is a FA at the end of the year is Nate Solder. If coaches are sour on him, then a Bowman-for-Solder swap could make sense with Waddle moving into a starting spot.
Link? I dont think the Patscap page accounts for the guaranteed salaries.
Miguel writing an article for Bostonsportsjournal on this subject per twitter
Looks like for Branch they'd save 412,500 from his workout bonus and $1.17MM in salary, but the salary would eventually count against the cap. Dont know if they could spread it to next year, but the ultimate savings from doing a cut in season vs after should be that $412,500
Harris they'd save the 344k in roster bonuses and the 750K in incentive bonuses (he's not gonna get to the 750 in playing time bonuses, but its LTBE so its on this years cap, not sure cutting him changes it). He has $687k in remaining salary which ultimately will find its way onto the cap. So the ultimate benefit of cutting Harris in season should be that 344K.
Harris has 625K of signing bonus left to amortize, Branch has $1MM.
So the ultimate savings from cutting Branch and Harris now vs. this offseason are pretty small, just the roster bonuses. Not sure if they can defer cap costs until next year by cutting these players or if it would end up reducing cap space because the signing bonuses go onto this years cap. Even if the Pats are allowed to spread out the dead money cap hits from the remaining base salary over two years, its doesnt look like much savings given they have to account for the remaining signing bonus as well.
Maybe they could find a trade partner for Branch or Allen? That would free up a little more space.
Its hard to find real cap relief. Trade Butler? Release Burkhead (if he's not a "vested veteran")? Extend Solder?
Miguel writing an article for Bostonsportsjournal on this subject per twitter
Looks like for Branch they'd save 412,500 from his workout bonus and $1.17MM in salary, but the salary would eventually count against the cap. Dont know if they could spread it to next year, but the ultimate savings from doing a cut in season vs after should be that $412,500
Harris they'd save the 344k in roster bonuses and the 750K in incentive bonuses (he's not gonna get to the 750 in playing time bonuses, but its LTBE so its on this years cap, not sure cutting him changes it). He has $687k in remaining salary which ultimately will find its way onto the cap. So the ultimate benefit of cutting Harris in season should be that 344K.
Harris has 625K of signing bonus left to amortize, Branch has $1MM.
So the ultimate savings from cutting Branch and Harris now vs. this offseason are pretty small, just the roster bonuses. Not sure if they can defer cap costs until next year by cutting these players or if it would end up reducing cap space because the signing bonuses go onto this years cap. Even if the Pats are allowed to spread out the dead money cap hits from the remaining base salary over two years, its doesnt look like much savings given they have to account for the remaining signing bonus as well.
Maybe they could find a trade partner for Branch or Allen? That would free up a little more space.
Its hard to find real cap relief. Trade Butler? Release Burkhead (if he's not a "vested veteran")? Extend Solder?
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Speculation on my part. Per Miguel, Solder creates $7 million in cap space if cut or traded post June 1 '17.
No brainer if he still has something in the tank. Marsh played a bit too much ILB for my liking last week and you'd have to think Bowman is a clear upgrade there. Get it done.
Why does anyone think he has anything more to offer than Harris? Dude was benched by the Niners. The 0-5 Niners.
He's played 94% of snaps this season and is four years younger than Harris. Niners run defense has been average. They're below average/bad at covering RBs but real good covering TEs per DVOA, not sure who Bowman has been covering.
He charts pretty well in coverag on PFF FWIW and his run stop stats arent bad.
Im not sure we're in the market for another older/expensive linebacker if there's any sort of pricey market for him, but I feel real confident he's better than David Harris. Niners might be 0-5, but Harris cant get on the field for what, to date, has been the worst unit on the worst defense in the league.
He charts pretty well in coverag on PFF FWIW and his run stop stats arent bad.
Im not sure we're in the market for another older/expensive linebacker if there's any sort of pricey market for him, but I feel real confident he's better than David Harris. Niners might be 0-5, but Harris cant get on the field for what, to date, has been the worst unit on the worst defense in the league.
He can still play but they wanted Foster to take over his role. He can't run sideline to sideline anymore, but he can still tackle well and can fill a role moreso than David Harris can. If this keeps Cassius Marsh from playing inside and KVN off the field in running downs I'll take him.
He's four years younger, two years removed from being named a first team All-Pro where he totaled 116 tackles, and has 22 more tackles this year to David Harris' 0.
Yeah, he would definitely improve our roster. Its mainly a question of cost.
There are a bunch of potential playoff teams with over $10M in cap space, a couple with far more. I have to think one of them offers Bowman substantially more than we can afford.
Rosenhaus sent a letter to every other team, and no one in the media got a whiff of it until now?
C'mon man. He's two years removed from a grisly knee injury and an Achilles tear.
Still looking for any one (PFF? heh) who says he can play in 2017.
The Niners coaches that played him 94% of the defensive snaps seem to think he had something to offer.
I also dont really fall into the PFF--heh category. I think plastering their numerical grade for a player up and saying 'well, he's good" or "well, he's bad" isn't a useful exercise. I think their insights and stats have enough merit to add to a message board evaluation of the usefulness of a player.
I also dont really fall into the PFF--heh category. I think plastering their numerical grade for a player up and saying 'well, he's good" or "well, he's bad" isn't a useful exercise. I think their insights and stats have enough merit to add to a message board evaluation of the usefulness of a player.
Ever heard the story about the two guys hiking who see a bear and the one starts putting on his running shoes and the other says "the fuck are you doing? you can't outrun a bear"--and the first guy says "don't have to outrun the bear"?
It's not whether he can play, it's whether he can play better than harris (and possibly better than Roberts). The bar is low.
EDIT: Miguel seems to think he can play at the vet minimum for the rest of the year so if it's not too disruptive to team chemistry I'd really think about it; it looks like Harris is going to give this team nothing this year and an ok ILB would free up Hightower quite a bit.
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The same coaches who benched him last week and released him today?
I suppose it is possible that John Lynch decided that appeasing Bowman with a release was best for team chemistry or Ruben Foster's development or what-have-you. Or, they looked at the roster and said "this guy isn't going to play because he's not good anymore" and released him.
I'd feel better about pursuing Bowman if there were reports saying he could still play.
Well, yes. But there's no chance that Bowman knows the playbook/scheme/roles better than Harris. That's a big factor. Perhaps Harris has some lingering injury that will resolve itself before the end of the season and didn't use IR-DTR on him because they needed it for Mitchell? (No reports on this, but it is possible, right?)
I think a tackling dummy is better than Roberts but the coaching staff seems invested in him (and Van Noy) so maybe playing (and making mistakes now) will pay off down the line?
I'm not really interested in Bowman unless he can still play and I can't find anyone who thinks he can. Doesn't mean he can't, just that we don't know. And the grass is not always greener...
Bowman led the team in linebacker snaps last week. He wasnt really benched.
I mean, I dont think he's an all pro anymore or anything, but I think there's more evidence that he still deserves a roster spot in the NFL than evidence he doesnt deserve a roster spot.
Whether the Pats should pursue him, I dont know. Harris cant get on the field, so the bar is pretty low from that perspective.
I mean, I dont think he's an all pro anymore or anything, but I think there's more evidence that he still deserves a roster spot in the NFL than evidence he doesnt deserve a roster spot.
Whether the Pats should pursue him, I dont know. Harris cant get on the field, so the bar is pretty low from that perspective.
As others have said the is he better than David Harris bar is quite low. Trust me, I'm not making the case that he's still the All-Pro of 2015. In checking the snap count he played 82 and 84 snaps before getting 53 snaps last week. Maybe that's a dumb way to use a guy coming off of such serious injures and maybe in the Pats system playing the David Harris / Cassius Marsh role they could manage his snap count better and keep him fresher. Perhaps use him in an early down run stuffer role rotating with Van Noy. I think it's worth a shot.
Here are the three most attractive landing spots for Bowman in free agency.
NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS
The Patriots have struggled greatly on defense. The team is on pace to concede a franchise-worst amount of points over the course of its 16 games, so any and all reinforcements would be welcomed.
No, Bowman isn’t a pass rusher, which is what the Patriots are most sorely lacking, but he has more left in the tank than David Harris, who is the team’s backup at middle linebacker. This is the kind of move the Patriots would make, adding a former high-tier veteran in the middle of the season and allowing him to get up to speed just in time for the playoffs.
More importantly, the interest is there. The Patriots inquired about Bowman over the summer and were mentioned as being interested Friday afternoon when Adam Schefter reported the 49ers were shopping Bowman.
https://www.fanragsports.com/3-ideal-destinations-navorro-bowman/
NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS
The Patriots have struggled greatly on defense. The team is on pace to concede a franchise-worst amount of points over the course of its 16 games, so any and all reinforcements would be welcomed.
No, Bowman isn’t a pass rusher, which is what the Patriots are most sorely lacking, but he has more left in the tank than David Harris, who is the team’s backup at middle linebacker. This is the kind of move the Patriots would make, adding a former high-tier veteran in the middle of the season and allowing him to get up to speed just in time for the playoffs.
More importantly, the interest is there. The Patriots inquired about Bowman over the summer and were mentioned as being interested Friday afternoon when Adam Schefter reported the 49ers were shopping Bowman.
https://www.fanragsports.com/3-ideal-destinations-navorro-bowman/
Miguel broke down Branch in detail on bsj. Came up with up to 812k in savings in ‘17 if released (before the roster spot replacement and weight clause) 2 mill if traded.
Yes, you get to bring 2 back at your leisure. Signs on Mitchell aren’t promising, either.
Adam SchefterVerified account @AdamSchefter 15h15 hours ago
Former 49ers LB Navorro Bowman is visiting the Raiders in Monday and then is planning to visit the Cowboys, per source.
I doubt he makes it past two visits. Time to get used to the Cassius Marsh Experience.
Reiss had a short blurb on it, but that's all I could find.
http://www.espn.com/blog/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4806900/cassius-marsh-makes-subtle-statement-with-usa-flag-mouth-guard
Meanwhile, my sense is that receiver Malcolm Mitchell, who was placed on IR on Sept. 7 (knee), is not close to being a consideration to begin practicing at this point, if at all this year.
Adam SchefterVerified account @AdamSchefter 41s41 seconds ago
Former 49ers’ LB NaVorro Bowman is signing a one-year, $3 million deal with the Raiders, per sources.
Former 49ers’ LB NaVorro Bowman is signing a one-year, $3 million deal with the Raiders, per sources.
FWIW, Heath Evans of NFL Network told Dale & Holley (WEEI) today that he didn't think Bowman was a fit with the Patriots because "it takes him all week to get his knee prepared to play and while Bill has let key guys with lingering issues skip practices in the past, it would be hard to do that with a guy who has never played in anything resembling [the Pats] system."