NBA Offseason Thread 2016

jsinger121

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The Nets look absolutely garbage. Got to think they have every incentive to overpay Waiters and frankly anyone with a pulse who is still around.

It'll be interesting to see if the league steps in with them (clearly they won't). It truly does seem being absolutely incompetent is fine, deliberately exploiting a flawed system? Nope.
The Nets can start getting good in the fall of 2019 and not a minute earlier. They deserve this for maybe one of the dumbest trades in NBA history depending on the final outcome.
 

BigSoxFan

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What a quitter! Maybe the lottery curse is broken. Will definitely be different without Kobe and Duncan.
 

bowiac

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Wow. Pretty much regardless of what he got, that's going to be a bargain.
 

bowiac

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Sullinger should fire his agent if that's true. Raptors look to have extended their gap over the Celtics right now.
 

BigSoxFan

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<insert reference to Mozgov>

But, seriously, huge failure by Sullinger's agent. Bargain central for Raptors.
 

sox311

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That's what she said.
Sullinger should fire his agent if that's true. Raptors look to have extended their gap over the Celtics right now.
Seriously, someone should be fired over that. Are we all that big of homers thinking that he was decent of a player and can be of good value to some team out there, including he Raptors?

Six million? In this market Robert Swift could get signed again and get a 3/30 deal.

And did Danny not want him back that much that he wouldn't offer him that? I think that is a rhetorical yes.
 

Koufax

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Danny must not have liked his work ethic. About 25% the way through the season Danny said that Sully was the best player on the team at that point. He fell off precipitously.
 

Ed Hillel

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Eh, Sully ended the year poorly, so I can see him taking a bargain one year contract to hit an even bigget market next year. Good deal for the Raptors.
 

zenter

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Danny must not have liked his work ethic. About 25% the way through the season Danny said that Sully was the best player on the team at that point. He fell off precipitously.
Or DA simply didn't see the point of redundancy when the player definitely wanted to get/deserved more minutes than the Cs could offer.

Many things can be said of Danny Ainge, but he's almost always tried to do right by players. Only twice that I recall have players felt like he wasn't giving them a fair shake (Tayshaun Prince and Ray Allen). Renouncing Sullinger allows the player to find a better fit for himself. And the Raptors are a great org - good for Sully.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Or DA simply didn't see the point of redundancy when the player definitely wanted to get/deserved more minutes than the Cs could offer.

Many things can be said of Danny Ainge, but he's almost always tried to do right by players. Only twice that I recall have players felt like he wasn't giving them a fair shake (Tayshaun Prince and Ray Allen). Renouncing Sullinger allows the player to find a better fit for himself. And the Raptors are a great org - good for Sully.
I don't buy the loyalty angle when it comes to younger players who have yet to make their mark in the league. Certainly true with someone like Pierce who woudn't have wanted to end his career in another rebuilding situation but not with the Sully's, Delonte's, and Tony Allen's......the latter who he also "Sully'd" when he wouldn't go for a 3rd year prior to Memphis signing him to a 3/$10m. Stuff like this smells like some off the court issues just as Delonte and Allen had that Ainge didn't want around the organization.
 

Cellar-Door

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Looks like Sully is betting on himself. Since the RFA tag held him back through the big money dump he wants to take a shot at having a good year on a playoff team then hitting UFA next season when more teams have cap space.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Looks like Sully is betting on himself. Since the RFA tag held him back through the big money dump he wants to take a shot at having a good year on a playoff team then hitting UFA next season when more teams have cap space.
How much did the RFA tag hold him back though? To say he was betting on himself implies that he turned down a lucrative multi-year deal somewhere.....or even a larger one-year somewhere. It seems like there was simply no market for a low-upside backup big with weight problems and possibly other stuff going on.
 

Cellar-Door

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How much did the RFA tag hold him back though? To say he was betting on himself implies that he turned down a lucrative multi-year deal somewhere.....or even a larger one-year somewhere. It seems like there was simply no market for a low-upside backup big with weight problems and possibly other stuff going on.
Tough to say, but not many RFA offers (I counted 3, Barnes, Johnson, Crabbe two of which were strategic by the Nets) and a lot of reports that teams were holding off on RFA because they didn't want to tie up cap. We also saw a big splash on big men early, then a guy like Leonard going back for 4/41 which seemed low because other teams weren't making offer sheets. I can't imagine if Sully waited it out there wasn't a multi-year deal somewhere coming in at $6M+. I think he just decided to go the 1 year route to get back into the market when teams were flush, and wanted a playoff team for the showcase.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Maybe Ujiri promised that the Raptors would "feed him the ball" and Sully got as excited as when Kramer when he was offered unlimited coffee at Java World.

 

mauf

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I wonder if Sully couldn't pass a physical -- he didn't look right in the playoffs, and 1/6 is totally out of whack for a player with Sully's skills in the current market.
 

mauf

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You may have fired him up
If I did, it didn't last long -- midway through the second quarter tonight, he's minus-9 on 1-for-5 shooting.

Summer league is SSS, but I'm awfully glad that Danny passed on Hield and Dunn and instead rolled the dice on one of the 19-year olds. (Edit: I guess Dunn's numbers were pretty good; he didn't look great in the limited action I saw.)
 

HomeRunBaker

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zenter

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My life has been in shambles at times. Oh how I wish the result of that negligence was a 6 million dollar salary
Approximately 600 people make a single industry about a billion dollars annually (and possibly more). Sullinger's stat line probably is "worth" ~12M in this market.

Would you take a 50% haircut for doing well but "not being motivated enough"?
 

Grin&MartyBarret

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A minor signing, but one I really like: Maurice N'Dour, last year's summer league standout, who spent time with both Dallas and Real Madrid signed with the Knicks today.

I watched him a lot in college and he's a really unique athlete. 6'8, long enough to defend 4s, and quick enough to switch onto guards. If he can start making 3s consistently, I think he ends up having a nice career.
 

jmm57

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I did take 26 shots for him to get there, and he posted the largest - on his team (-8 in a game they lost by 1). Murray has scored 29 twice, the other game was on 25 shots. 2.4 apt to 2.8 turnovers and less than a steal per game.

Bender had 4 blocks last night, but outside of that his summer has looked like the Summer Leagues version of Anthony Bennett's rookie year. I expected a lot more.

Brown has shot awful, but has gotten to the line enough that he's actually been a more efficient scorer than Murray. 2.3 steals/gm is promising and he's been less of a turnover machine than I expected early.

Dunn looked very good in 2 games, but as a 22 year old he probably should have. Missed the rest with a concussion, but did what he should have when on the floor.

It's just a handful of summer games so it ultimately means very very little, but that's all we have to go on right now.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Murray started scoring when Mudiay stopped playing: i.e., when he had the ball in his hands. Being behind Mudiay, Harris, and Barton, it will be interesting to see what his role is on offense and he's not really equipped to play the 2 on defense methinks.

One thing I saw on Hield is that he played better than his shooting percentage shows.

Still, I'm happy with Brown. All he needs to do is to get a respectable outside shot and he will be something. I mean at this point, isn't he a more explosive Evan Turner?

edit: fixed typo.
 
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bowiac

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Turner's value was his ability to handle and distribute the ball in certain sets. Do we think that's something Brown can do?
 

mauf

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Turner's value was his ability to handle and distribute the ball in certain sets. Do we think that's something Brown can do?
Evan Turner must have looked like Magic Johnson in the games I didn't watch, because from what I saw, there was absolutely nothing praiseworthy about his decision making with the basketball.

On a totally unrelated point, Kobe Bryant is getting honored at the Nickelodeon Kids' Choice Sports Awards tonight. The girl who introduced him looked like she was a couple years younger than that girl he bent over (consensually or otherwise) in that Colorado hotel room. I guess his rehabilitation is complete.
 

Eddie Jurak

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Evan Turner must have looked like Magic Johnson in the games I didn't watch, because from what I saw, there was absolutely nothing praiseworthy about his decision making with the basketball.
The difference was, Turner could actually be the primary ball handler and distributor when Isaiah was on the bench, if not well, whereas others were worse. Less of a need this year, probably, with a step forward from Rozier.
 

Sprowl

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The difference was, Turner could actually be the primary ball handler and distributor when Isaiah was on the bench, if not well, whereas others were worse. Less of a need this year, probably, with a step forward from Rozier.
Rozier has a great handle on the dribble, and he can get his own shot in the lane whenever he wants it. It's not so clear to me yet that Rozier can be a distributor, much less a playmaker. The team will need Marcus Smart to make some forward strides to make up for what Turner brought to the floor as backup playmaker.
 

bowiac

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Evan Turner must have looked like Magic Johnson in the games I didn't watch, because from what I saw, there was absolutely nothing praiseworthy about his decision making with the basketball.
I was hardly trying to promote an idea that Turner has good decision making, or really, almost anything else good. I do reluctantly admit however that he was a useful player on the Celtics by year's end. Now I think that's mostly a fluke of roster construction, and really says more about the flaws in Bradley and Smart's games than anything else, but either way, he had value in this context.

Brown won't be asked to do that, so his value proposition will be pretty different.
 

mauf

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I was hardly trying to promote an idea that Turner has good decision making, or really, almost anything else good. I do reluctantly admit however that he was a useful player on the Celtics by year's end. Now I think that's mostly a fluke of roster construction, and really says more about the flaws in Bradley and Smart's games than anything else, but either way, he had value in this context.

Brown won't be asked to do that, so his value proposition will be pretty different.
I reacted because I'm still dumbfounded about that $70 million contract. You don't usually make that coin by being merely a serviceable 9th or 10th man, which is the highest praise I can muster for Turner. I look forward to the C's giving Turner's minutes to younger guys like Smart and Rozier; at least one of them is likely to be a better option.
 

luckiestman

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I reacted because I'm still dumbfounded about that $70 million contract. You don't usually make that coin by being merely a serviceable 9th or 10th man, which is the highest praise I can muster for Turner. I look forward to the C's giving Turner's minutes to younger guys like Smart and Rozier; at least one of them is likely to be a better option.

I read on another board that Turner told Cs he would take less to stay. Cs said: not enough less, go get that money; you earned it.
 

HomeRunBaker

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I reacted because I'm still dumbfounded about that $70 million contract. You don't usually make that coin by being merely a serviceable 9th or 10th man, which is the highest praise I can muster for Turner. I look forward to the C's giving Turner's minutes to younger guys like Smart and Rozier; at least one of them is likely to be a better option.
There were 3 FA contracts this summer that left my head spinning and two of them were in Portland where the Blazers paid a combined $145m for backup guards Allen Crabbe and Evan Turner. The other was Washington paying Ian Mahinmi $64m over 4 years to be Gortat's backup.
 

Eddie Jurak

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There were 3 FA contracts this summer that left my head spinning and two of them were in Portland where the Blazers paid a combined $145m for backup guards Allen Crabbe and Evan Turner. The other was Washington paying Ian Mahinmi $64m over 4 years to be Gortat's backup.
Mozgov didn't leave your head spinning, too?
 

Drocca

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Any concern that this draft is going to be a busted one (like the 00 and 01 drafts?).
I think it was always a two-person draft w/r/t likelihood of perennial all-stars. Even those two were pretty far from slam dunks. The draft was heavy on rotational talent (Brice Johnson at 25 to the Clippers, Furkan at 26, Beasley at 19, Yabusele at 16; Prince at 12, Sabonis at 11).
 

HomeRunBaker

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Any concern that this draft is going to be a busted one (like the 00 and 01 drafts?).
This isn't star studded like I felt 2015 was however this is a very solid draft both at the top and in the middle. I love the top 3 of Bender, Dunn, and Simmons while kids like Taurean Prince and Poeltl to be rock solid NBA players. The Zizic and Zubac's figure to make their mark as well. You have some intriguing guys later in the 1st and early 2nd as well so I feel the bust potential of the draft as a whole is low however it doesn't have all of the star firepower as last years.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Mozgov didn't leave your head spinning, too?
Not like the others who admittedly have signed crazy deals for limited bench roles. At least a healthy Mozgoz is your starting 5 but yes I understand your point and it's certainly w fair one.
 

Eddie Jurak

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This isn't star studded like I felt 2015 was however this is a very solid draft both at the top and in the middle. I love the top 3 of Bender, Dunn, and Simmons while kids like Taurean Prince and Poeltl to be rock solid NBA players. The Zizic and Zubac's figure to make their mark as well. You have some intriguing guys later in the 1st and early 2nd as well so I feel the bust potential of the draft as a whole is low however it doesn't have all of the star firepower as last years.
You left out future league MVP* Abdel Nader.













* Note I didn't say which league.