PawSox now looking at sites in Pawtucket

[GaryPeters71]

Boston Globe Sports ‏@BGlobeSports  26m26 minutes ago
Mayor says Pawtucket Red Sox plans do not include Pawtucket, RI.
 
By Associated Press and staff reports  FEBRUARY 23, 2015
 
PAWTUCKET, R.I. — Pawtucket Mayor Donald Grebien said his city’s Triple A baseball club, the Pawtucket Red Sox, has been sold and is leaving the city.
 
The mayor told radio station WPRO that he was briefed by the team Sunday. He did not disclose the new owners or where they will move the team. The Globe reported Sunday that the Red Sox are among the new owners along with a local group.
 
Grebien said that until Sunday there was hope the team would remain in Pawtucket. However, he said he was presented with a plan that doesn’t include Pawtucket.
 
He said the move is ‘‘devastating.’’
 
Grebien said the new owners told him it didn’t make sense to spend money on the stadium and they are instead looking at establishing a destination stadium.
 
The team’s principal owner is Madelaine Mondor, widow of longtime owner Ben Mondor, who owned the team from 1977 until his death in 2010.

 

[Minneapolis Millers]

This makes me a bit sad.  I was there when Barrett scored the winning run in the 33rd inning.  I always liked how accessible Pawtucket was to Sox fans.  Wish they could have simply renovated McCoy.
 
And a "destination" stadium?  That sounds like a plan for $40 tickets to me.  Blech.

 

[Yaz4Ever]

I was there as well.

 

[BigJimEd]

At least one report stating team is moving to Providence.

I'm not nearly familiar enough with Providence to know where there is room and a good fit.

 

[PeaceSignMoose]

If the reports are true and a move to Providence is imminent, I'm having trouble understanding why they would move 10 minutes down the road.  
 
Weren't there rumors several months ago of a move to Hartford to try to wrestle CT away from the MFY?

 

[theapportioner]

If the reports are true and a move to Providence is imminent, I'm having trouble understanding why they would move 10 minutes down the road.  

 
I'm assuming they'd also like to develop an entire neighborhood with shopping, restaurants, bars, etc. surrounding the stadium.

 

[flymrfreakjar]

Man, this is a pretty huge bummer for me. The Pawsox have been a part of my life since I was a baby. My mom painted all those portraits when players would graduate to MLB to help pay for RISD when she was a student. She also made Ben's memorial statue for the stadium after he passed. To think that the place is being vacated so suddenly is pretty awful. That's a long standing relationship and tradition, and Ben was one of the finest human beings on the planet. I hope they at least preserve some of that magic wherever they move, but I doubt it. 

 

[Puffy]

This makes me a bit sad.  I was there when Barrett scored the winning run in the 33rd inning.  I always liked how accessible Pawtucket was to Sox fans.  Wish they could have simply renovated McCoy.
 
And a "destination" stadium?  That sounds like a plan for $40 tickets to me.  Blech.

 
This is my big fear. For better or worse, McCoy has always had an old school working class vibe just by the very nature of the neighborhoods that surround it. Just super accessible for families. I have fond memories of going there with my dad and, recently, of bringing my girls there. Maybe it's overly sentimental of me, but last time I was there I was really struck with how wonderfully anachronistic it felt - it was all about getting into the stadium and watching the baseball on the field. McCoy was all about the baseball and I can't imagine whatever boondoggle these folks cook up will be more baseball than business.

 

[TomRicardo]

If the reports are true and a move to Providence is imminent, I'm having trouble understanding why they would move 10 minutes down the road.  
 
Weren't there rumors several months ago of a move to Hartford to try to wrestle CT away from the MFY?

 
 
If you could buy land on the cheap and develop the surrounding area you would make much money than playing in McCoy

 

[Spelunker]

 
I'm assuming they'd also like to develop an entire neighborhood with shopping, restaurants, bars, etc. surrounding the stadium.

 
As a non-car owner in Boston, I never go to PawSox games. Depending on where a stadium would be located in Providence- were that to happen- taking the commuter rail down there for a game would start to be appealing.

 

[GaryPeters71]

Brian MacPherson ‏@brianmacp  4m4 minutes ago
New PawSox owners are six weeks and $200,000 into studies determining feasibility of 10,000-seat stadium on I-195 land.

 

[Yaz4Ever]

Man, this is a pretty huge bummer for me. The Pawsox have been a part of my life since I was a baby. My mom painted all those portraits when players would graduate to MLB to help pay for RISD when she was a student. She also made Ben's memorial statue for the stadium after he passed. To think that the place is being vacated so suddenly is pretty awful. That's a long standing relationship and tradition, and Ben was one of the finest human beings on the planet. I hope they at least preserve some of that magic wherever they move, but I doubt it. 

Loved those portraits as a kid. Thank your mom for me. Can't count the number of games I attended - all exhibition games against Boston, longest game, Righetti/Fidrych, countless others. Easy drive from North Providence and beyond affordable. Ben Mondor was a great owner, new ownership has huge shoes to fill. Hope they find a perfect location that allows so many regulars to continue to attend games.

 

[GaryPeters71]

NM

 

[smastroyin]

I-195 land is the empty stuff in the center of this map, for those interested.
 
https://goo.gl/maps/VBdCJ
 
There is really only one parcel that is even close to ballpark worthy.  
 
As I said in the other thread, I imagine that these guys are in bed with the 195 commission and therefore it's another shitty public boondoggle.  Maybe they will finance the construction themselves, but they will probably end up getting the land for a huge discount.  
 
Team musical chairs and the money that owners get when they play that game is moving up toward the top of my list of reasons to be less interested in sports.  

 

[theapportioner]

A riverside park could be nice.

 

[Red(s)HawksFan]

Get ready for it...Fenway Providence.

 

[Toe Nash]

 
This is my big fear. For better or worse, McCoy has always had an old school working class vibe just by the very nature of the neighborhoods that surround it. Just super accessible for families.

Fenway used to be cheap, too. When the team wasn't spending $60m+ on a 19-year-old.
 
I don't feel a lot of sadness about this. There's still Lowell and Portland and an upgrade could be really cool. If it's walking distance from commuter rail, I'd go way more often than I go to Pawtucket. And if there were things to do around the stadium, I'd even get there early as opposed to getting in and out of Pawtucket as fast as humanly possible.
 
And I'm not a RI taxpayer so public subsidies are a-ok with me

 

[JimD]

I can't imagine the new ownership will take the PR hit by pricing out families.  They can easily accommodate the current PawSox fanbase in an expanded new park while also chasing corporate customers and others with deeper pockets.

 

[Puffy]

I-195 land is the empty stuff in the center of this map, for those interested.
 
https://goo.gl/maps/VBdCJ
 
There is really only one parcel that is even close to ballpark worthy.  
 
As I said in the other thread, I imagine that these guys are in bed with the 195 commission and therefore it's another shitty public boondoggle.  Maybe they will finance the construction themselves, but they will probably end up getting the land for a huge discount.  
 
Team musical chairs and the money that owners get when they play that game is moving up toward the top of my list of reasons to be less interested in sports.  

 
For anyone interested, here's a better interactive view of the various 195 parcels:
 
http://www.195district.com/the-land/view-map/
 
No obvious candidates, but the proposed waterfront park and pedestrian bridge between the Jewelry District and the East Side might suggest some kind of assemblage of Lots 25, 22, and/or 42. I believe Lot 22 has some adjacent parking garage space which may be acquired, but the parcel is a mere 2.6 acres. So there must be a multi-lot purchase considered here, perhaps with other neighborhood parcels. It's not a surprise, since the Commission has had difficulty in attracting investor buyers to the land, that they turn to one big move like this. It's typical Rhode Island to swing desperately for the fences and try to solve all the problems at once. Hopefully this won't be a terrible boondoggle.

 

[moondog80]

The Lehigh Valley Iron Pigs play in a stadium that opened in 2008, tickets range from $7 for general admission to $15 for club level, which is only modestly ahead of the PawSox.  They won''t go much higher, that's just the market for minor league baseball.

 

[smastroyin]

Yeah, I'm thinking part of the boondoggle will be taking some of the park space. Maybe they will integrate the pedestrian bridge meant to go across the river (on the old 195 footings) and get that money too.

I want to be excited by this because I think there is an opportunity, but I worry it will be a fuckup, and that they will get zoning concessions to make a giant sea of parking instead of integrating to downtown. We'll see. Better than just selling it all to JWU and their tax free status I suppose.

 

[yeahlunchbox]

Man, this is a pretty huge bummer for me. The Pawsox have been a part of my life since I was a baby. My mom painted all those portraits when players would graduate to MLB to help pay for RISD when she was a student. She also made Ben's memorial statue for the stadium after he passed. To think that the place is being vacated so suddenly is pretty awful. That's a long standing relationship and tradition, and Ben was one of the finest human beings on the planet. I hope they at least preserve some of that magic wherever they move, but I doubt it. 

 
Your mom's work brought so much happiness to me as a child, I loved those pictures.
 
This plan is trying to emulate what's happened in other AAA cities, but it shows a lack of understanding towards what made the PawSox work. If a fan in the Pawtucket area wanted to deal with a traffic headache in a larger city to go to a game, pay to park, pay extra for tickets and pay ridiculous amounts for concessions they would just go to Fenway. The PawSox weren't successful in spite of being small time, they were successful because they were small time.

 

[Billy Jo Robidoux]

I-195 land is the empty stuff in the center of this map, for those interested.
 
https://goo.gl/maps/VBdCJ
 
There is really only one parcel that is even close to ballpark worthy.  

 
What I'm seeing on that map is a potential riverside ballpark within a five-minute walk to Desires strip club.
 

 

[theapportioner]

 
What I'm seeing on that map is a potential riverside ballpark within a five-minute walk to Desires strip club.
 

Fun for the entire family!

 

[Darnell's Son]

 
What I'm seeing on that map is a potential riverside ballpark within a five-minute walk to Desires strip club.
 

Sounds like a Providence Bash to me!

 

[Dan to Theo to Ben]

 
Your mom's work brought so much happiness to me as a child, I loved those pictures.
 
This plan is trying to emulate what's happened in other AAA cities, but it shows a lack of understanding towards what made the PawSox work. If a fan in the Pawtucket area wanted to deal with a traffic headache in a larger city to go to a game, pay to park, pay extra for tickets and pay ridiculous amounts for concessions they would just go to Fenway. The PawSox weren't successful in spite of being small time, they were successful because they were small time.

There should be plenty of street parking with a 10-15 minute walk.

 

[Toe Nash]

 
Your mom's work brought so much happiness to me as a child, I loved those pictures.
 
This plan is trying to emulate what's happened in other AAA cities, but it shows a lack of understanding towards what made the PawSox work. If a fan in the Pawtucket area wanted to deal with a traffic headache in a larger city to go to a game, pay to park, pay extra for tickets and pay ridiculous amounts for concessions they would just go to Fenway. The PawSox weren't successful in spite of being small time, they were successful because they were small time.

I think you're way understating the money and time cost involved in going to Fenway from the Providence area.
 
It's 50 minutes to get from Providence to Fenway without traffic, and traffic is bad, so at best you're going to have to leave pretty much right after work and you're not getting home until 11-12 even if you leave the game early. To park, you're either going up to Boston way early and hoping for a metered spot, going to Riverside and T-ing in (both of which are taking hours extra on both sides of the game) or you're paying $20-30 to park near Fenway. Tickets at Fenway are $50+ compared to what, $20 in the new stadium?
 
Raising prices may or may not be desirable from your average fan's perspective, but I think there's plenty of room to have a nicer stadium experience and slightly raise prices without convincing people to go to Fenway instead. 

 

[yeahlunchbox]

I live in Northern RI and have had a 10th man plan pack since 2004. I've got a pretty solid grasp of getting to Fenway from the RI area. If people are going to spend $20 bucks on a ticket, they're going to spend that for a bleacher seat to see major leaguers in Boston, not minor leaguers in Providence. And I think you're overestimating how convenient this is to the average current PawSox fan. It works out great for you with the commuter rail option, but car traffic in the Providence area is a cluster and parking a 10-15 minute walk away from the stadium isn't really great for your car's safety with the neighborhood the park will be in. Unless you work in Providence or can take a commuter rail in to the game this plan is horrible and is bad news for people that currently enjoy going to PawSox games.

 

[Toe Nash]

 Unless you work in Providence or can take a commuter rail in to the game

Isn't this a pretty large number of people?
 
I'm sorry that it will not be as easy for you to get to games, but it seems like a better location to me and obviously to the new owners. I have zero desire to go to Pawtucket currently. Reasonable minds can differ I suppose and the details (and success) of the development will be key. If it's just a sea of parking around the stadium then it won't be any better.

 

[moondog80]

I live in Northern RI and have had a 10th man plan pack since 2004. I've got a pretty solid grasp of getting to Fenway from the RI area. If people are going to spend $20 bucks on a ticket, they're going to spend that for a bleacher seat to see major leaguers in Boston, not minor leaguers in Providence. And I think you're overestimating how convenient this is to the average current PawSox fan. It works out great for you with the commuter rail option, but car traffic in the Providence area is a cluster and parking a 10-15 minute walk away from the stadium isn't really great for your car's safety with the neighborhood the park will be in. Unless you work in Providence or can take a commuter rail in to the game this plan is horrible and is bad news for people that currently enjoy going to PawSox games.

 
 
Again, I don't know where the idea of $20 tickets came from.  That's just not what AAA tickets cost, general admission anyway:
 
 
http://www.milb.com/content/page.jsp?ymd=20130218&content_id=41756574&sid=t422&vkey=tickets
 
http://www.milb.com/content/page.jsp?ymd=20101110&content_id=16059770&sid=t1410&vkey=tickets

 

[DJnVa]

I can't imagine the new ownership will take the PR hit by pricing out families.  They can easily accommodate the current PawSox fanbase in an expanded new park while also chasing corporate customers and others with deeper pockets.

 
It's AAA baseball. Families won't be priced out.
 

 

[Dan to Theo to Ben]

You can currently get 4 Box seats for Opening Night for $58 for print at home or will call, or $60 for mail. FWIW. (total)
 
If I lived near I-95 at Norwood/Exit 11 or south, that would be a very attractive proposition, instead of Fenway. (Pawtucket)

 

[8slim]

Man, this is a pretty huge bummer for me. The Pawsox have been a part of my life since I was a baby. My mom painted all those portraits when players would graduate to MLB to help pay for RISD when she was a student. She also made Ben's memorial statue for the stadium after he passed. To think that the place is being vacated so suddenly is pretty awful. That's a long standing relationship and tradition, and Ben was one of the finest human beings on the planet. I hope they at least preserve some of that magic wherever they move, but I doubt it. 

 
Wow, your mom painted those murals?  Crazy.  I went to a TON of PawSox games as a kid growing up in SE Mass, and the walk up those spiral entrances passing the murals of great PawSox was one of my favorite parts of the experience.
 
I'm saddened by this news in a nostalgic sort of way, but since I haven't been to a game in Pawtucket in 20+ years I really don't have a right to be too upset.  A new ballpark in Providence might be very nice, putting aside the usual amount of waste and corruption that goes into municipal stadium projects.

 

[Bone Chips]

Would love to see them come to Hartford, but the city just signed a deal to bring the New Britain Rock Cats to Hartford. What a shame too. Hartford has a very rich baseball history. The Hartford Dark Blues were one of the original 8 charter teams of the National League. Mark Twain used to attend the games. Years later various minor league teams played in Hartford, including the Hartford Senators where Lou Gehrig began his career.

Another example of piss poor planning in Hartford...

 

[Darnell's Son]

Would love to see them come to Hartford, but I can't see it happening under the current political leadership. What a shame too. Hartford has a very rich baseball history. The Hartford Dark Blues were one of the original 8 charter teams of the National League. Mark Twain used to attend the games. Years later various minor league teams played in Hartford, including the Hartford Senators where Lou Gehrig began his career.

We need ex Governor John Rowland out of jail to make this happen.

Hey, hands off our team! They're moving to Providence and that's it!

 

[Bone Chips]

Sorry - see my edit. Hartford is off the table.

 

[Bone Chips]

To understand just how inept the political leaders in Hartford are, read this article. http://www.courant.com/sports/baseball/hc-pawtucket-red-sox-moving-0224-20150223-story.html

I just sent Thomas Deller an email imploring him to open negotiations with the PawSox. Screw the Rock Cats. Nobody wants to see the double-A team for the Colorado Rockies.

Hartfordites - let your voice be heard!!! Send Tom Deller an email - tdeller@hartford.gov. Let's reverse what Kraft did to us in 1998.

 

[Brohamer of the Gods]

Save your time - Deller used to be head of planning for Providence. It's all an inside job.

 

[nvalvo]

I just hope there are no more pastiche-y Fenway architectural quotations. What makes Fenway great is its uniqueness: keep it that way. I love Hadlock, but it would be better without the "Maine Monster."
 
Design a ballpark that fits the location, not one laden with references to another ballpark, no matter how beloved. 

 

[Darnell's Son]

@PatrickAnderso_: Skeffington says ticket, parking prices will be kept at McCoy levels in new stadium. Why not raise prices, lower subsidy?
 
Patrick is a reporter at the Providence Journal.

 

[bradmahn]

I just hope there are no more pastiche-y Fenway architectural quotations. What makes Fenway great is its uniqueness: keep it that way. I love Hadlock, but it would be better without the "Maine Monster."
 
Design a ballpark that fits the location, not one laden with references to another ballpark, no matter how beloved. 

 
For most things, I'd agree, but there is an on-field benefit to re-creating the Monster in a Sox AAA affiliate

 

 

[Carmen Fanzone]

Another example of piss poor planning in Hartford...

You mean like building a 9,000 seat stadium when 10,000 is the accepted minimum for AAA teams?

"No thanks, we really see ourselves as a THIRD tier city."

 

[E5 Yaz]

You mean like building a 9,000 seat stadium when 10,000 is the accepted minimum for AAA teams?

 
They were told there'd be no math

 

[nvalvo]

 
For most things, I'd agree, but there is an on-field benefit to re-creating the Monster in a Sox AAA affiliate
 

 
My view is that this is what the park in Fort Myers is for. AAA teams should be given a little more dignity. 

 

[bradmahn]

 
My view is that this is what the park in Fort Myers is for. AAA teams should be given a little more dignity. 

 
That's fair. I like that a guy could conceivably go from having played the wall (or a great facsimile) the day before he debuts in LF at Fenway--lots can be lost between playing in the Fort in March and a call up in August.

 

[TomTerrific]

This makes me a bit sad.  I was there when Barrett scored the winning run in the 33rd inning.  I always liked how accessible Pawtucket was to Sox fans.  Wish they could have simply renovated McCoy.
 
And a "destination" stadium?  That sounds like a plan for $40 tickets to me.  Blech.

 
 

I was there as well.

Did either of you get the lifetime pass that I heard was awarded to the fans who stuck it out to the bitter end? Or were you just there for the finishing inning (which was played on a later date, right?)

 

[Yaz4Ever]

 
 
Did either of you get the lifetime pass that I heard was awarded to the fans who stuck it out to the bitter end? Or were you just there for the finishing inning (which was played on a later date, right?)

I recall hearing of the passes, but no I wasn't there that night. I was there for the conclusion which was played before the next home game against Cal Ripken's Rochester Redwings.

 

[Hank Scorpio]

For what it's worth, it's about a 15 minute walk from the Commuter Rail to the proposed new park site.
 
Current commuter rail resources and schedules don't really make it feasible for people to utilize it en masse to head down to RI to catch a ball game. I wonder if something could be worked out. Seems too complicated.

 

[SoxJox]

Where in the F**K are they going to put a park in Providence proper.

 

[SoxJox]

I-195 land is the empty stuff in the center of this map, for those interested.
 
https://goo.gl/maps/VBdCJ
 
There is really only one parcel that is even close to ballpark worthy.  
 
As I said in the other thread, I imagine that these guys are in bed with the 195 commission and therefore it's another shitty public boondoggle.  Maybe they will finance the construction themselves, but they will probably end up getting the land for a huge discount.  
 
Team musical chairs and the money that owners get when they play that game is moving up toward the top of my list of reasons to be less interested in sports.  

There is really no way - given RI politics - that a park can be dropped in that location in the next...10 years.
 
Or stated another way: RI politics will ensure that a park will most definitely be wedged into that crevice in the next 3 months.