Fister? Hope? I don't understand the question?If that's true, how do you explain Fister still wearing a Sox uni?
Fister? Hope? I don't understand the question?If that's true, how do you explain Fister still wearing a Sox uni?
Reading between the lines, this is the move but they haven't spoken to Devers yet. I can't believe DDom doesn't know what he would do before making the trade. In the end it might be for the better for Devers, although not for the 2017 team. The atmosphere on this team does not sound like a situation for a 20yo to break into. Very poor example being set by the veteran leadership.Pete AbrahamVerified account @PeteAbe 12m12 minutes ago
Asked Dombrowski where Devers’ spot stands with Nunez coming in. Said they need to discuss it. So apparently it’s possible he goes back.
I will stop watching games closely if this happens.
I wonder how much of that is just lack of reps.He suuuuuuuuuuucks in the outfield, FYI. Like, Hanley bad.
You're post is so disengeuous. It would have been "magical" to bring in strong veteran leadership at 3rd and first base? People were posting about this void last offseason. This is a miserable ball club and ultimately that falls on DD despite his money constraints.What does this even mean? What specific actions on Dombrowski's part have manifested the "overlooking" of which you speak? Are you saying he should have somehow prevented Ortiz from retiring? Or are you saying that he should have magically conjured another player with the same personality and the same veteran-superstar clubhouse aura to take his place? What golden opportunity to hit a team-chemistry home run did he whiff on?
Okay, Uncle Shaughnessy.You're post is so disengeuous. It would have been "magical" to bring in strong veteran leadership at 3rd and first base? People were posting about this void last offseason. This is a miserable ball club and ultimately that falls on DD despite his money constraints.
This post is all kinds of wrong, and dredges up old discussions for no worthwhile reason. They had Pablo's "strong veteran leadership" and $19M salary already at 3rd. They brought in Moreland's "strong veteran leadership" to play first. And they were operating under the management decision to stay under the LT cap, so Encarnacion wasn't walking through that door. All of this has been discussed already.You're post is so disengeuous. It would have been "magical" to bring in strong veteran leadership at 3rd and first base? People were posting about this void last offseason. This is a miserable ball club and ultimately that falls on DD despite his money constraints.
Whenever the guys over at Soxprospects don't give a shit about the prospects traded, then you know they didn't give up a lot. Your descriptions of the prospects, while accurate as stand alone statements, do not even come close to painting an actual picture of who they are as prospects. There is plenty to bitch about... the prospects in this trade isn't one of them.Let's see. We had a 3rd-round draft pick from last year who was striking out about 7.5 per 9 and an 17-year-old in the DSL with an 0.90 ERA and 82.1% ground ball rate this year. So, we trade him for another utility player, who doesn't field especially well and has no power. Apparently Holt, Marrero, and Lin aren't enough. And we can always trade for another Fister.
Frankly, I think this team is dysfunctional and I mean from the very top on down. Look at some of the front office people, GMs, managers, coaches who once worked for the current ownership. There are a number of them on clubs who are doing well.
Dave Cameron blasted Nunez's defense, especially at SS. But that's the move I'd really like to see. Xander has been terrible since his hand injury and it would be great to see him rest it up and come back ready for the stretch run. Plus this move gives Devers an extended look at 3B and his service time wouldn't be a complete and absolute waste like I'm fearing.From a defensive standpoint is it too dangerous to put him at SS and DL Bogaerts?
I'm fairly meh on this deal, but comparing Nunez to Holt, Marrero and Lin actually makes him look pretty good--he's a much better hitter than Marrero, much more experienced than Lin, and has more power than Holt (career .126 ISO and 11 HR per 600 PA, compared to Holt's .098 and 5).Let's see. We had a 3rd-round draft pick from last year who was striking out about 7.5 per 9 and an 17-year-old in the DSL with an 0.90 ERA and 82.1% ground ball rate this year. So, we trade him for another utility player, who doesn't field especially well and has no power. Apparently Holt, Marrero, and Lin aren't enough. And we can always trade for another Fister.
Not really. Their ISO is a lot higher than Nunez.He's outslugging Beni and Moreland so we have that going for us.
I will be disappointed if they don't use Nunez at SS and DL Bogaerts. The latter has looked bad at the plate and in the field ever since he was hit in the hand. I'd hate for them to start the clock on Devers and then send him right back down. Why couldn't they get the Nunez deal done one day earlier if that was the plan?
If Nunez is leading off with his inability to walk with his lifetime 0.317 OBA, JF should be fired on the spot.I like this deal. Nunez can bat lead-off, and can run. If The Jaw could figure this out, it could move Mookie out of the 1-hole to someplace he could drive in runs, and lengthen our lineup so the 6 and 7 spots aren't death.
If Nunez is getting his defense at SS blasted, and he has bad numbers there why do you want him there? His defense probably is more the reason than his hitting the Yankees gave up on him and went and got Gregorious for SS, Jeter's injury in the middle of all that. They struck gold with Didi who is hitting far better with them than he did with the D-Backs.Dave Cameron blasted Nunez's defense, especially at SS. But that's the move I'd really like to see. Xander has been terrible since his hand injury and it would be great to see him rest it up and come back ready for the stretch run. Plus this move gives Devers an extended look at 3B and his service time wouldn't be a complete and absolute waste like I'm fearing.
But, again, Nunez's defense at SS is so concerning. In 600 innings at SS in 2013, he compiled a -28 DRS. YIKES. In 2015 with a 450 inning sample.. -4.
This year alone at short in 90 innings.. -4.
If by "strong veteran leadership," you mean "guys who can hit," then we agree.You're post is so disengeuous. It would have been "magical" to bring in strong veteran leadership at 3rd and first base? People were posting about this void last offseason. This is a miserable ball club and ultimately that falls on DD despite his money constraints.
Holt is leading off today. Ready to blast him into the sun?If Nunez is leading off with his inability to walk with his lifetime 0.317 OBA, JF should be fired on the spot.
Also stupid but prior to getting sick this year at least Holt has shown some ability to take a pitch and take a walk.Holt is leading off today. Ready to blast him into the sun?
The Red Sox problem isn't taking pitches and walks. They're 6th in the MLB in walks, 7th in OBP but are 12 in runs.Also stupid but prior to getting sick this year at least Holt has shown some ability to take a pitch and take a walk.
I want him here to play third. He's below average there, but not egregiously so. Right now our 3B production has a 53 wRC+. Nunes is sporting a 101 wRC+. If he keeps that up he drags us from 29th in the MLB to 15th, which is sadly an enormous upgrade.If Nunez is getting his defense at SS blasted, and he has bad numbers there why do you want him there? His defense probably is more the reason than his hitting the Yankees gave up on him and went and got Gregorious for SS, Jeter's injury in the middle of all that. They struck gold with Didi who is hitting far better with them than he did with the D-Backs.
Nunez used to be more of a pull hitter than he showed with the Giants. May be ballpark related. I hope he goes back to pulling more and plays pepper with the wall. As for spelling X at SS, put Deven M. there because he doesn't suck at fielding.
Calling up Devers for two days and then, essentially, choosing Marrero over him for the next few weeks/month would be idiotic. Keep Devers and have him share the position with Nunez while also letting him DH some games with Hanley at 1st. Send Marrero and his noodle bat down.
I wonder if Devers was really just a leverage play against the Giants. They may have been asking for something unreasonable and DD told them we don't need him we'll just bring up the rookie and he did.
so getting a guy with ZERO power who also does NOT walk helps in what way?Also stupid but prior to getting sick this year at least Holt has shown some ability to take a pitch and take a walk.
This, coupled with what DD said earlier, is what is frustrating (And incredibly myopic from the Sox management perspective). I think Nunez is fine as an acquisition, but they literally just called Devers up. Since this deal – or a deal for another 3B was presumably in the works before they announced they were calling up Devers – why even bother to call him up now? A game or two agains the Mariners doesn't give the club any real chance to evaluate anything.
Right, they're 27th in HR and 29th in ISO. They need more power. Nunez brings none of that, but he does improve their SB prowess. They are currently 8th in the majors.The Red Sox problem isn't taking pitches and walks. They're 6th in the MLB in walks, 7th in OBP but are 12 in runs.
It almost makes me wonder if the whole point of calling up Devers this week was gamesmanship in the Nunez trade negotiations ("hey, if you really think you're getting one of our top 10 prospects, cool beans, we'll just go with our rookie"). But Nunez is an awfully small fish to use such fancy tackle to land.This, coupled with what DD said earlier, is what is frustrating (And incredibly myopic from the Sox management perspective). I think Nunez is fine as an acquisition, but they literally just called Devers up. Since this deal – or a deal for another 3B was presumably in the works before they announced they were calling up Devers – why even bother to call him up now? A game or two agains the Mariners doesn't give the club any real chance to evaluate anything.
Right. And, you don't force him on the 40 man or risk the development on a prospect with his pedigree for a player like Nunez – if at all. Recent struggles exacerbate the frustrations, but the whole thing is just an awful set of decisions and public statements by the FO and JF.It almost makes me wonder if the whole point of calling up Devers this week was gamesmanship in the Nunez trade negotiations ("hey, if you really think you're getting one of our top 10 prospects, cool beans, we'll just go with our rookie"). But Nunez is an awfully small fish to use such fancy tackle to land.
Marrero? Try .304 .340 .609 .949 vs. LHP this year. Only 50 PA but he certainly fields better.I'm fairly meh on this deal, but comparing Nunez to Holt, Marrero and Lin actually makes him look pretty good--he's a much better hitter than Marrero, much more experienced than Lin, and has more power than Holt (career .126 ISO and 11 HR per 600 PA, compared to Holt's .098 and 5).
Let's see. We had a 3rd-round draft pick from last year who was striking out about 7.5 per 9 and an 17-year-old in the DSL with an 0.90 ERA and 82.1% ground ball rate this year. So, we trade him for another utility player, who doesn't field especially well and has no power. Apparently Holt, Marrero, and Lin aren't enough. And we can always trade for another Fister.
Well, if I had a pitcher who had a 60% GB rate as a 16-year-old and 80+% as a 17-year-old, I think I'd like to see what he does when he gets a little more experience rather than just use him as fodder for a trade for a suspect utility man....Your descriptions of the prospects, while accurate as stand alone statements, do not even come close to painting an actual picture of who they are as prospects...
That's not all that great a k rate. They have about 10 starters in the minors better than that. Scouts think his ceiling is back end starter, but think he'll realistically be in the pen.Let's see. We had a 3rd-round draft pick from last year who was striking out about 7.5 per 9 and an 17-year-old in the DSL with an 0.90 ERA and 82.1% ground ball rate this year. So, we trade him for another utility player, who doesn't field especially well and has no power. Apparently Holt, Marrero, and Lin aren't enough. And we can always trade for another Fister.
Anderson was pretty old to be posting merely okay numbers in high A. I've read that he lacks an out pitch. He's a fringe prospect, not someone to lose sleep over.Let's see. We had a 3rd-round draft pick from last year who was striking out about 7.5 per 9 and an 17-year-old in the DSL with an 0.90 ERA and 82.1% ground ball rate this year. So, we trade him for another utility player, who doesn't field especially well and has no power. Apparently Holt, Marrero, and Lin aren't enough. And we can always trade for another Fister.
Frankly, I think this team is dysfunctional and I mean from the very top on down. Look at some of the front office people, GMs, managers, coaches who once worked for the current ownership. There are a number of them on clubs who are doing well.
The first rule of the DSL is you don't talk about stats from the DSL
Nunez does lead the league in HLORP (helmets lost over replacement player)Right, they're 27th in HR and 29th in ISO. They need more power. Nunez brings none of that, but he does improve their SB prowess. They are currently 8th in the majors.
He's a mediocre defender at third (though his versatility is nice) with a league average overall bat. So he's Todd Frazier only, instead of bringing some much needed home run pop, he brings some steals which are nice to have but don't really address any of the flaws this team has.
I'm guessing he's being seen as two things:
1. A way to get Devers back down to Pawtucket where he can continue working on his defense and fine tuning his bat so that he can take over permanently next year.
2. Allows them to remove Holt from the roster in August if he doesn't start hitting again and Devers forces his way back up by annihilating the ball in AAA for the next 3-4 weeks.
I don't particularly like the idea of Nunez as the every day starter, but I can see the rationale behind wanting Devers focusing on his developing right now instead of the pennant race. And if their assessment of him is that he's not likely to give them much more than Nunez at the plate, then there is no reason to keep his clock running.
I like Nunez as an addition to the bench. This? I'm decidedly more "meh" on this.
Because the Giants rightly would have no reason to want Henry Owens.So it's the DSL and the kid is only 17 but his performance is intriguing enough to me to want to see how he develops. Why couldn't they have given them Henry Owens?
You're intrigued because you looked at his numbers. Stop looking at his numbers. DSL numbers are absolutely meaningless. You didn't even know this kid existed until he was traded. Go back to thinking that.So it's the DSL and the kid is only 17 but his performance is intriguing enough to me to want to see how he develops. Why couldn't they have given them Henry Owens?
What the hell is wrong with you?You're post is so disengeuous. It would have been "magical" to bring in strong veteran leadership at 3rd and first base? People were posting about this void last offseason. This is a miserable ball club and ultimately that falls on DD despite his money constraints.
Nah, they're miserable. That Devers kid is sloppy and soft!This team may not win a damn thing, but if you think it's miserable, you're the problem.
Henry Owens has massively higher potential to contribute to the Red Sox in the future if he can figure out just enough command to let him convert into being a reliever. Santos is far more likely to never see AA ball than he is to be a meaningful MLB contributor, that's just the reality of how prospects work.So it's the DSL and the kid is only 17 but his performance is intriguing enough to me to want to see how he develops. Why couldn't they have given them Henry Owens?
40 man logistics for Devers are meaningless at this point. They likely would have wanted him up as a September call-up at a minimum and the notion that a brief call up is a development hindrance is as valid as the counter argument: "rewarding" Devers hot start with a look at the real goal before sending him down to Pawtucket for a month.Right. And, you don't force him on the 40 man or risk the development on a prospect with his pedigree for a player like Nunez – if at all. Recent struggles exacerbate the frustrations, but the whole thing is just an awful set of decisions and public statements by the FO and JF.
He might -- but he has a long way to go before catching Hanley, whose helmet has its own Twitter account.Nunez does lead the league in HLORP (helmets lost over replacement player)
https://theringer.com/eduardo-nunez-boston-red-sox-trade-958d7ee77aa1
Did you play football?You're intrigued because you looked at his numbers. Stop looking at his numbers. DSL numbers are absolutely meaningless. You didn't even know this kid existed until he was traded. Go back to thinking that.