Felger and Mazz - Creating False Naratives one day at a time

HomeBrew1901

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I'm with erb here, I think Felger and Mazz are a way off base with much of what they say, but a lot of you guys are getting to be as bad as F&M. If the Sox sign Cliff Lee & Crawford or had they signed Teixeira, you'd hear less bitching about the players and payroll. I agree that they would find something else to bitch about, but that's kind of their job. I don't blame them for bitching about Martinez considering the deal he got from Detroit which is the biggest problem Mazz has with signing Crawford to a long deal for big money.

The idea that Gonzalez isn't worth the money because english is his second language was just about the dumbest thing I have heard come from Felger and the first time I think I have heard him say something he can't truly believe.
 

erb

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I'm not washing anyones jock here, I am explaining how it is possible to not agree with the moves the Red Sox have been making lately.  Josh Beckett has the worst opposing ERA of any pitcher against the Yankees since 1955. His 2007 was epic, however it was not the norm. For his Red Sox career his ERA is well over 4. Without looking it up specifically its at least 4.2. Unless he throws a CG every single time out that means he gives up more than 5 runs every single time he toes the rubber. His ERA against the Yankees is over 6.. He even has a losing record against just the AL East in general. He is hurt every single year too which obviously makes matters worse. "But he is an awesome Playoff pitcher" right? Well, what does recent history suggest? Out of 06, 07, 08, 09, 10 he's had that good 07 and nothing else since in the playoffs.

Lackey: His ERA and WHIP have both gone up every single year for the past 3 seasons so 4 more years of him probably means those numbers get even worse by the end of it.

You see when Theo Epstein gets a question from an interviewer regarding Cliff Lee and he explains that our rotation is really good as it is it makes people like me upset. It makes Mazz and Felger upset too I suppose. What is really good about a rotation that you have no idea what you're going to get out of 3 of your starting pitchers? 
 

URI

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Without looking it up specifically its at least 4.2.
I suggest that if you use it as evidence, you do look it up...you know, if you want people to think you're more than a reactionary clown.

Also, Beckett's 09 was almost as good as his 07.
 

judyb

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I'm not washing anyones jock here, I am explaining how it is possible to not agree with the moves the Red Sox have been making lately.  Josh Beckett has the worst opposing ERA of any pitcher against the Yankees since 1955. His 2007 was epic, however it was not the norm. For his Red Sox career his ERA is well over 4. Without looking it up specifically its at least 4.2. Unless he throws a CG every single time out that means he gives up more than 5 runs every single time he toes the rubber. His ERA against the Yankees is over 6.. He even has a losing record against just the AL East in general. He is hurt every single year too which obviously makes matters worse. "But he is an awesome Playoff pitcher" right? Well, what does recent history suggest? Out of 06, 07, 08, 09, 10 he's had that good 07 and nothing else since in the playoffs.

Lackey: His ERA and WHIP have both gone up every single year for the past 3 seasons so 4 more years of him probably means those numbers get even worse by the end of it.

You see when Theo Epstein gets a question from an interviewer regarding Cliff Lee and he explains that our rotation is really good as it is it makes people like me upset. It makes Mazz and Felger upset too I suppose. What is really good about a rotation that you have no idea what you're going to get out of 3 of your starting pitchers? 
You know what would be a lot better than what Felger and Mazz do when they're talking Red Sox? If they said things like what you just wrote.
 

erb

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Nov 11, 2007
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I suggest that if you use it as evidence, you do look it up...you know, if you want people to think you're more than a reactionary clown.
06 5.01
07 3.27
08 4.03
09 3.86
10 5.78








INN 204.2 ER 114
200.2 73
174.1 78
212.1 91
127.2 82

917.8 innings 438 earned runs.

4.30 ERA.. I told you its at least 4.2 because I knew for a fact that it was at least that. No clowns here.


 

Hendu for Kutch

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4.30 ERA.. I told you its at least 4.2 because I knew for a fact that it was at least that. No clowns here.
Of course you're using ERA from 2010 in proving that they should have known not to sign him before 2010.

The three years prior to signing the deal, his ERA was 3.71. Horrors, they should have known!

This looks even more ridiculous when you see that Lackey's ERA over the last 3 years before signing was 3.48. What you're doing is basically hindsight at its finest.
 

erb

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Nov 11, 2007
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Of course you're using ERA from 2010 in proving that they should have known not to sign him before 2010.

The three years prior to signing the deal, his ERA was 3.71.  Horrors, they should have known!

This looks even more ridiculous when you see that Lackey's ERA over the last 3 years before signing was 3.48.  What you're doing is basically hindsight at its finest.
His Red Sox career ERA before 2010 was 4.05.. 

Lackeys ERA and WHIP have gone UP every single year over those 3 years.. Every single year he's pitched worse than the year prior.
Felger and Mazz are down on the Sox, however have you noticed a theme? Everyone is down on the Sox. They were in first place on July 2nd and their ratings were really low by their standards.

Without really going back and forth forever about Lackey and Beckett you gotta acknowledge that the interest in the team is waining for whatever reason. Felger/Mazz and I'm sure a bunch of other people atribute this fact to the players this team keeps signing.

Maybe it is wrong, maybe it is right. What we know for a fact is that NESN ratings are no where near what they use to be and there is a reason for that.

 

YouDownWithOBP?

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Felger is way off right now, claiming he would rather have Jeter on the Sox next year instead of Rivera, citing Jeter's batting average (but ignoring just how empty it really is).
 

AquaNarc

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Choice Mazz Moment: Guy calls up and talks about not needing Jeter because of Nunez (I know), but Mazz responds, "Are you talking about Boston or NY? Cause if you mean Boston I think you're talking about Iglesias."

Remember when Tony briefly pretended to be an expert on the Yankees farm system last year so he could find yet another angle to denigrate the Red Sox (The Yankees are catching up!)? Yet amazingly he's never even heard of a guy who actually played in the majors last year and is seen as a possible Jeter successor.
 

PBDWake

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His Red Sox career ERA before 2010 was 4.05..

Lackeys ERA and WHIP have gone UP every single year over those 3 years.. Every single year he's pitched worse than the year prior.
Felger and Mazz are down on the Sox, however have you noticed a theme? Everyone is down on the Sox. They were in first place on July 2nd and their ratings were really low by their standards.

Without really going back and forth forever about Lackey and Beckett you gotta acknowledge that the interest in the team is waining for whatever reason. Felger/Mazz and I'm sure a bunch of other people atribute this fact to the players this team keeps signing.

Maybe it is wrong, maybe it is right. What we know for a fact is that NESN ratings are no where near what they use to be and there is a reason for that.
The reason for that is a team devoid of almost anyone they recognized, struggling to stay in contention. Except they were in contention. Mostly on the backs of Theo Epstein's signings.

Let me itemize my issues point by point:

1) John Lackey- It's the first year of his contract. He got off to a lousy start, and his numbers for the year don't look that great. But let's break down how he finished the year.
June- 3.86 ERA, with a 3.58 BABIP
July- 3.67 ERA with a 2.86 BABIP
August- 5.75 ERA with a .376 BABIP
September/October- 3.46 with a .286 BABIP

Was he an ace? Of course not. But let's not act like he was Gil Meche here. He was a solid #3 starter, which is about what most of us expected out of him. Did we pay more than he was probably worth? Yes, but that's almost always going to be the Big Market Tax. The Yankees deal with it, we deal with it, the Mets deal with it. My point? It's year 1 of his contract. Give him at least one more year. He had a horrible start, but bounced back just fine.

2) Josh Beckett- I'm not going to go into this, other than to see that he was coming off 3 straight 5 f-WAR seasons, heading into a market that was (projected) to be basically him and Cliff Lee as the only two ace pitchers on the market. They made a pre-emptive strike and signed a contract that would have looked like a steal had he kept up his prior production.

3) Theo's signings in general, and the ratings- This year, they lost a 6 f-WAR player (Youkilis), a 5 f-WAR player (Pedroia) a 2.7 -fWAR player (Ellsbury), a 4.4 f-WAR player (Mike Cameron) for the season, with a 4 f-WAR player (Victor Martinez) missing about a month. That's quite likely to be the reason the ratings went down. In all seriousness, you could look at the starting field and see precisely ONE regular starter who was here last year, and that's everyone's favorite whipping boy, JD Drew. Starting pitchers who aren't Pedro aren't usually a draw, and even if they are, they're a draw once in every 5 games. And despite ALL of that, the Red Sox were still in the playoff hunt deep into the playoffs, in a division with the 2 best regular season teams in baseball, and still finished just shy of 90 wins. There are maybe 4 or 5 GMs who had a better season than Epstein this season, and that's counting your World Series winner, who had a massive string of misfirings simply not come and bite him in the ass, and the simple luck of being in the NL West allowing him to race back to grab that playoff spot. I am quite honestly struggling to find a team that's had a better 7 year run than the Red Sox, and since 2007, outside of the 3 world series winners and Tampa, another team with even a better 3 year window.

*edit* Forgot my main point.

This year is an outlier. It's not in line with their prior history of product. They didn't suffer because a) players who projected very well had poor seasons, or b) projectable injuries occurred. It was an aberration. Let's see what happens next year.
 

bd11

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Choice Mazz Moment: Guy calls up and talks about not needing Jeter because of Nunez (I know), but Mazz responds, "Are you talking about Boston or NY? Cause if you mean Boston I think you're talking about Iglesias."

Remember when Tony briefly pretended to be an expert on the Yankees farm system last year so he could find yet another angle to denigrate the Red Sox (The Yankees are catching up!)? Yet amazingly he's never even heard of a guy who actually played in the majors last year and is seen as a possible Jeter successor.
Tony credited Duquette for signing Trot Nixon. If we know this stuff off the top of our heads, why doesn't he?
 

Ahriman

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The last 5 minutes are why I think this show is at its best when talking hockey/basketball. Mazz grows a pair when the subject moves to hockey. He slices through all of Felger's nebulous, intangible bullshit.

And I love the way Mazz hates on Lebron.
 

Gambler7

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Great surprise interview with Bill Cowher.

If anyone wants to know just how overblown "spygate" was listen to the interview with him when they put the podcast up. He lays it out pretty well.
 

Mystic Merlin

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He should let his former players - most prominently Joey Porter, Hines Ward, and Jerome Bettis - in on the secret. They're still convinced it's the reason they lost in '01 and '04. Not Kordell Stewart. Or a jumpy Roethlisberger 3 years later. No, no, no. It was the CAMERAS.
 
He should let his former players - most prominently Joey Porter, Hines Ward, and Jerome Bettis - in on the secret. They're still convinced it's the reason they lost in '01 and '04. Not Kordell Stewart. Or a jumpy Roethlisberger 3 years later. No, no, no. It was the CAMERAS.
I heard Bettis do an interview after Spygate in which he said (paraphrasing) "It seemed like their defense new our plays when I was there on the field. Now I realize they knew what we were calling the whole time!". Of course the host let him know it was the defensive signals that were in question, not the offensive calls which were delivered via microphone. Bettis seemed bewildered by that comment and repeated his first statement again - either ignoring or not understanding the interviewer.

Edit - Spelling
 

dcmissle

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For all the shit we give Mazz, he came right out and said he would stop being critical about the Sox being cheap if they were able to get the A-Gon deal done and sign either Werth or Crawford.
Come Monday, they won't know whether to shit or go blind. An important dynamic of sports talk radio and this show in particular is that the narratives shouldn't be allowed to get too positive. They've been ballwashing BB for weeks and justifiably so. Now this.
 
For all the shit we give Mazz, he came right out and said he would stop being critical about the Sox being cheap if they were able to get the A-Gon deal done and sign either Werth or Crawford.
Don't believe it. I bet within the first 15 minutes he'll say something along the lines of, "Well, if they just would have closed the Teixeira deal two years ago they would have had a premier first baseman and wouldn't have had to give up propects. After all, they're still gonna pay for a huge contract in the extension". There is no way he can resist.

I haven't listened in about a month or so but I'm tuning in on Monday just to hear how correct I am.
 

HomeBrew1901

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Don't believe it. I bet within the first 15 minutes he'll say something along the lines of, "Well, if they just would have closed the Teixeira deal two years ago they would have had a premier first baseman and wouldn't have had to give up propects. After all, they're still gonna pay for a huge contract in the extension". There is no way he can resist.

I haven't listened in about a month or so but I'm tuning in on Monday just to hear how correct I am.
I believe it, Mazz's issue with Teixeira was that the Sox were cheap and could have outbid the NYY for him, which I think most agree is bullshit, he was always going to the NYY at least IMO.

With Gonzalez and hopefully Crawford he won't be able to use that argument anymore because the Sox are going to pay him bigtime money to get him. He will find something else to bitch about but Teixiera and Gonzalez won't make that list. It will also stop all the Liverpool nonsense as well.

Edit: Mazz isn't the prospect fucker, Felger is. Mazz said yesterday he is always in favor of giving up prospects for proven MLB talent.
 

PBDWake

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I haven't listened in about a month or so but I'm tuning in on Monday just to hear how correct I am.
It's been about 2 weeks for me, but I'm in the same boat. And if they're shitting on the Red Sox for this Monday (assuming the Sox ink his extension), then they've lost me for good. The dial will not be switched back to 98.5 ever again during the drive. It'd be definitive proof that there would be nothing the Sox could do that would satisfy them.
 

AquaNarc

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I believe it, Mazz's issue with Teixeira was that the Sox were cheap and could have outbid the NYY for him, which I think most agree is bullshit, he was always going to the NYY at least IMO.

With Gonzalez and hopefully Crawford he won't be able to use that argument anymore because the Sox are going to pay him bigtime money to get him. He will find something else to bitch about but Teixiera and Gonzalez won't make that list. It will also stop all the Liverpool nonsense as well.

Edit: Mazz isn't the prospect fucker, Felger is. Mazz said yesterday he is always in favor of giving up prospects for proven MLB talent.
They wont go back on anything they said, they'll simply conclude that the Red Sox changed their strategy because they learned the error of their ways. Zero chance either of them says "Maybe we were wrong all along."
 
Edit: Mazz isn't the prospect fucker, Felger is. Mazz said yesterday he is always in favor of giving up prospects for proven MLB talent.
You're right about this. Mazz wanted both Lester and Buchholz traded when they were young.

I think both will be happy about the deal, I'm just saying that Mazz won't be able to resist taking a shot at the Red Sox for saying that the Sox could have avoided all this and kept the prospects if they hadn't "blown it" with Tex back in '08. I'd bet my mortgage on it.
 

HomeBrew1901

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They wont go back on anything they said, they'll simply conclude that the Red Sox changed their strategy because they learned the error of their ways. Zero chance either of them says "Maybe we were wrong all along."
Seriously do you even listen to this show? One of the great things about Felger is that he is always ready to admit when he is wrong, I have never heard Mazz admit he was wrong though.

You're right about this. Mazz wanted both Lester and Buchholz traded when they were young.

I think both will be happy about the deal, I'm just saying that Mazz won't be able to resist taking a shot at the Red Sox for saying that the Sox could have avoided all this and kept the prospects if they hadn't "blown it" with Tex back in '08. I'd bet my mortgage on it.
Got it. Maybe, after hearing him on Friday I tend to disagree but you could be right. I do think this will get him off the Tex argument for good though.
 

shawnrbu

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Got it. Maybe, after hearing him on Friday I tend to disagree but you could be right. I do think this will get him off the Tex argument for good though.
Mazz won't let Teixeira go until the Red Sox win another ring. 2009 will be enough for him to continue to ride that pony.

As for Felger, I think he will be generally positive, but will get in his usual tweaks. Something about the "rift" between ownership and the baseball ops ("If ownership would have paid Victor Martinez $2 million more, Theo could have hung on to those prospects he loves!") and concern about Gonzalez being a "National League player."

I will say it's a very good sign for the show that we have multiple people speculating about what these two are going to say over 48 hours from airtime. When's the last time someone here wondered what Ordway would say on a topic?
 

H78

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Sometimes, it blows my mind that people get upset that we have sports media that's not afraid to be critical of the hometown teams.

Are people really seeking passive, ride-the-company-line type of coverage? I guess I'm alone in thinking that criticism - not all the time, but at least a regular dose - helps spawn change and keep ownership groups honest.
 

dcmissle

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Sometimes, it blows my mind that people get upset that we have sports media that's not afraid to be critical of the hometown teams.

Are people really seeking passive, ride-the-company-line type of coverage? I guess I'm alone in thinking that criticism - not all the time, but at least a regular dose - helps spawn change and keep ownership groups honest.
No, but for want of a better term, Tony has been a clueless c*** about this. At least make your criticisms reasonable.

This cuts the tail, finally, off the Tex nonsense. Or at least it does when A-Gon gets his mega-extension. Not even Mazz would argue that Henry was obligated to fish in those waters twice.

So what's the argument now-- that they would have won the WS in "09 with Tex, rather than the Yanks? That they would have made the post-season, or better, with him, last year? Rank speculation.

And if he starts woofing about the prospects they have parted with today, it's just not going to mean a good goddamn unless and until one of the gets to the majors and performs at an all-star level consistently.

All of which means the Bruins are in major trouble on this show as the last men standing.
 

H78

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No, but for want of a better term, Tony has been a clueless c*** about this. At least make your criticisms reasonable.

This cuts the tail, finally, off the Tex nonsense. Or at least it does when A-Gon gets his mega-extension. Not even Mazz would argue that Henry was obligated to fish in those waters twice.

So what's the argument now-- that they would have won the WS in "09 with Tex, rather than the Yanks? That they would have made the post-season, or better, with him, last year? Rank speculation.

And if he starts woofing about the prospects they have parted with today, it's just not going to mean a good goddamn unless and until one of the gets to the majors and performs at an all-star level consistently.

All of which means the Bruins are in major trouble on this show as the last men standing.
I certainly agree with the context of what you're saying - Mazz overdoes it at times. I think your mention of Tex is a great example because just about everyone knows where Mazz stands on it. Actually, I think that drum has been beaten so badly that it's become inaudible at this point. But, overall, the way he challenges and questions ownership/Theo is something I appreciate; I wish we had a larger contingent of media that wasn't afraid to ask questions as opposed to just taking answers.

Mazz is a good personality for mainstream Red Sox coverage. I think he just needs to realize that people are listening to the broadcast and maybe after he makes a point a couple times he needs to leave it at that. Also, like Felger, when the Sox do something right, he should give a dose of genuine credit when it's due.
 

PBDWake

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Mazz is a good personality for mainstream Red Sox coverage. I think he just needs to realize that people are listening to the broadcast and maybe after he makes a point a couple times he needs to leave it at that. Also, like Felger, when the Sox do something right, he should give a dose of genuine credit when it's due.
The problem is he doesn't even follow baseball anymore. There are multiple week stretches where he has admittedly just not watched games. I think towards the end of the season, he said it'd been over a month since he'd watched a game. Furthermore, he throws out baseless statements about other players in the league without doing any leg work, and offers no logic or stats to his arguments, instead frequently offering just a blanket statement not supported by anything else (such as Jason Bay is a much better hitter than Jayson Werth) as the backbone of his point.

Look, there's a lot that you CAN be critical about with the Red Sox (Scutaro, Cameron, the bullpen, Ellsbury's handling, etc.) that are all legitimate gripes. There's room for healthy criticism there. Even Maz's points ARE points that are usually good enough points to bring up and debate. But frequently, his points are rooted in speculation, and they last infinitely longer on the air than they have any right to be, and his laziness is the big reason people hate him.
 

AquaNarc

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Sometimes, it blows my mind that people get upset that we have sports media that's not afraid to be critical of the hometown teams.

Are people really seeking passive, ride-the-company-line type of coverage? I guess I'm alone in thinking that criticism - not all the time, but at least a regular dose - helps spawn change and keep ownership groups honest.
No, I'm seeking objective, intelligent discussion. I realize talk radio is not the place to look, but it doesn't mean I can't hope. I've said it before, way back when he was on 890 Felger would have Keith Law on as a co-host once a week, and it was must listen radio. It allowed for a back and forth, but more importantly Law is a perfect example of someone who is informed AND opinionated . Unfortunately we only get the latter around here. And btw, you can be informed and funny and entertaining, all these things are not mutually exclusive. The homerism and jock-sniffing of EEI is just the other side to the Felger and Mazz coin.
 
Sometimes, it blows my mind that people get upset that we have sports media that's not afraid to be critical of the hometown teams.
PBDWake is correct. I don't think many posters (definitely not me) object to criticisms of the Red Sox. I actually enjoy it as long as they have a logical argument. In fact, I agreed with Felger and Mazz over a lot of things - disliking the Cameron move and how the team handled the Ellsbury injury for example. But over the past couple of months the two have said some crazy shit regarding baseball/Red Sox:

a. The Red Sox don't net a first round pick for losing VMart (Tony didn't know the compensation rules).
b. The Red Sox are trying to clear payroll and not commit to long term deals because ownership wants to sell the team.
c. Adrian Gonzalez won't be a big draw because he doesn't speak English as his first language.
d. The Red Sox are cheap.
e. It's a "travesty" that Felix won the Cy because pitching is about wins.
f. You can't blame injuries as even part of the reason for the Sox 3rd place finish. That's just an excuse.
g. The front office was secretly happy when Youk went down because they could write the season off at that point and didn't have to add payroll at the trade deadline.

Some of this I'm getting off this thread because I don't listen as often anymore. But when I have tuned in, they sound like Borges discussing the Pats. Many of their arguments are lazy and come as off trolling for the sake of ratings. Which is fine, but don't tell me that my problem with them is that I'm a "homer" and can't take criticism. That's not the problem.
 

Sparky Lyle

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PBDWake is correct. I don't think many posters (definitely not me) object to criticisms of the Red Sox. I actually enjoy it as long as they have a logical argument. In fact, I agreed with Felger and Mazz over a lot of things - disliking the Cameron move and how the team handled the Ellsbury injury for example. But over the past couple of months the two have said some crazy shit regarding baseball/Red Sox:

a. The Red Sox don't net a first round pick for losing VMart (Tony didn't know the compensation rules).
b. The Red Sox are trying to clear payroll and not commit to long term deals because ownership wants to sell the team.
c. Adrian Gonzalez won't be a big draw because he doesn't speak English as his first language.
d. The Red Sox are cheap.
e. It's a "travesty" that Felix won the Cy because pitching is about wins.
f. You can't blame injuries as even part of the reason for the Sox 3rd place finish. That's just an excuse.
g. The front office was secretly happy when Youk went down because they could write the season off at that point and didn't have to add payroll at the trade deadline.

Some of this I'm getting off this thread because I don't listen as often anymore. But when I have tuned in, they sound like Borges discussing the Pats. Many of their arguments are lazy and come as off trolling for the sake of ratings. Which is fine, but don't tell me that my problem with them is that I'm a "homer" and can't take criticism. That's not the problem.


OK, why did you change your avatar? Was the previous one Tito?
 
OK, why did you change your avatar? Was the previous one Tito?
The new avatar is small so it's hard to tell but it's a photoshopped Adrian Gonzalez in a Sox uni. It seemed appropriate today.

JINX

The old avatar (I'm sure I'll change back) is if the lead character in "Breaking Bad", an AMC show about a high school chemistry teacher who has terminal cancer and decides to become a meth dealer in order to leave his family money after his death. It's played by a shaved Bryan Cranston who was also Tim Whatley from "Seinfeld" and the dad on "Malcolm in the Middle".
 

Rocco Graziosa

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They're going to murder the Sox tomorrow. Wow. Maybe they were on to something about this organization being cheap if they didn't pony up to pay Gonzalez.
 

HomeBrew1901

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They're going to murder the Sox tomorrow. Wow. Maybe they were on to something about this organization being cheap if they didn't pony up to pay Gonzalez.
If this isn't some luxury tax ploy and another lost player over a couple million dollars, I'm going to be fucking pissed and possibly might be done with the Red Sox for awhile. This isn't like getting outbid by the Yankees for Teixeira or not wanting to pay a free agent like Jason Bay because they didn't think he was worth the money he wanted.

They knew what the contract was likely to be before entering negotiations, they barely had to give up anything to trade for him, they have been openly coveting him for 3 years now, and if they let him walk over an extra year or a couple million dollars they deserve to be called cheap and every bit of bile that is going to be sent their way.

More will come out soon and it might not be over yet, but I've got a sick pit in my stomach right now because I have a feeling everything Felger and Mazz have been saying for the last 18 months about the team is true, and this is going to fall through over money.
 

Salem's Lot

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They're going to murder the Sox tomorrow. Wow. Maybe they were on to something about this organization being cheap if they didn't pony up to pay Gonzalez.
Honestly, It's times like this that I'm glad this show exists. I'm so pissed off that this deal didn't happen that I could use 4 hours of venting. Sports Sunday at 7:30 should be a good appetizer for tomorrow's show. I wonder how much of the show will be Henry/Epstein bashing, and how much will be Pats-Jets talk. I'd say 80-20 Sox bashing.
 

Phenom

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More will come out soon and it might not be over yet, but I've got a sick pit in my stomach right now because I have a feeling everything Felger and Mazz have been saying for the last 18 months about the team is true, and this is going to fall through over money.
Felger was right about Randy Moss, and pretty much all of his football takes have been spot on this year. He was right about having questions in regards to Claude Julian (Bruins blowing the lead last year).

Now if this Gonzalez deal has indeed fallen through, these two may have been right on the Red Sox, too.

I, for one, will no longer call their baseball conversation "ridiculous." It was the most accurate in town in regards to how this Front Office has run things after 2007.
 

Razor Shines

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I, for one, will no longer call their baseball conversation "ridiculous."
But, you should. Just to reiterate a recent post above:

But over the past couple of months the two have said some crazy shit regarding baseball/Red Sox:

a. The Red Sox don't net a first round pick for losing VMart (Tony didn't know the compensation rules).
b. The Red Sox are trying to clear payroll and not commit to long term deals because ownership wants to sell the team.
c. Adrian Gonzalez won't be a big draw because he doesn't speak English as his first language.
d. The Red Sox are cheap.
e. It's a "travesty" that Felix won the Cy because pitching is about wins.
f. You can't blame injuries as even part of the reason for the Sox 3rd place finish. That's just an excuse.
g. The front office was secretly happy when Youk went down because they could write the season off at that point and didn't have to add payroll at the trade deadline.
Some of those points might be hyperbole just for the sake of boredom aversion, but a few of those things just highlight a misunderstanding of some of the more basic aspects of the game of baseball.

It's going to suck if the Gonzalez thing doesn't go through, but IMO it doesn't make F&M a credible baseball duo.

The fact that the recent news likely makes them both giddy infuriates me even more.
 

AquaNarc

New Member
Jan 21, 2010
146
Felger is roasting the front office. Calls it a PR disaster. Says ownership needs to make up its mind if they want to compete with the big dogs or not.
oh thank god he got this on the record before they ended up signing him anyway.
 

scottyno

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Dec 7, 2008
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start backtracking felgy if heyman is to be believed, Im sure he'll still find a way to rip the team for not getting a deal done a few hours earlier though

also, whos to say he wasn't talking about former red sox prospects in the above image :lol:
 

PBDWake

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May 1, 2008
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start backtracking felgy if heyman is to be believed, Im sure he'll still find a way to rip the team for not getting a deal done a few hours earlier though

also, whos to say he wasn't talking about former red sox prospects in the above image :lol:
The problem is that people ultimately believed Jon Heyman in the first place. Even as he was reporting the deal fell through in the first place, Ken Rosenthal was reporting that it was still ongoing. But we'll probably hear about how they tried to cheap out and walk away. This is a situation where I'd love to be wrong, though.
 

AquaNarc

New Member
Jan 21, 2010
146
"So it's more important to the Red Sox to save a few million on the luxury tax than to lock up their new franchise player as quickly as possible? What kind of message does that send to the fans who pay 100 dollars for a hot dog?!!"
 

Phenom

as if andy gresh and gary tanguay had a baby
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Jul 31, 2006
998
"So it's more important to the Red Sox to save a few million on the luxury tax than to lock up their new franchise player as quickly as possible? What kind of message does that send to the fans who pay 100 dollars for a hot dog?!!"
Yep...that's what we'll be hearing tomorrow. Ugh.

(Yes, I've taken back what I said earlier in the day. These two don't have a clue about baseball...the baseball conversation remains "ridiculous").
 

HomeBrew1901

Has Season 1 of "Manimal" on Blu Ray
SoSH Member
"So it's more important to the Red Sox to save a few million on the luxury tax than to lock up their new franchise player as quickly as possible? What kind of message does that send to the fans who pay 100 dollars for a hot dog?!!"
Apparently you have listened to the show before. I think this will probably be the rallying cry until April.
 

dcmissle

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Apparently you have listened to the show before. I think this will probably be the rallying cry until April.
It's going to be difficult -- even for them -- in light of stuff like this courtesy of 'EEI:


That being the case, it came as little surprise to the source that the deal got done after Gonzalez spent the weekend talking to Red Sox officials. The first baseman had heard rumors of other teams’ interest — including the Cubs and White Sox — but Boston ultimately always seemed like the most sensible fit. While an extension has not been worked out, all sides are seemingly comfortable that one will be, likely after Opening Day.

Then again, Felger expressed a really "bad feeling" about Tom Brady's contract situation, esp after Bob Kraft's mean spirited fighting words. So anything is possible out of these two.