2019-20 Offseason News, Rumors, Trades

jon abbey

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Boras' unofficial spokesman speaks:

"Jon Heyman

@JonHeyman


Yankees GM Brian Cashman is indeed coming with the offer for Cole today. Angels seem highly motivated but will need to convince Cole they can win with very top heavy roster. Dodgers also seen as threat (though they could go the Rendon route instead)"

I guessed 8/264 coming into this, I will guess 8/288 now. I don't think it will go over $300M.
 

sean1562

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Honestly if y’all spend that much on him I wouldn’t even be upset. Cole is only about 6 months younger than Sale. I dont think Sale is gong to completely fall of he face of the Earth over the next 5 years and that three year stretch before last year is a better stretch than anything Cole has ever done. So if that is what it takes to get Cole the Sale deal starts looking a lot better even with the risk. Sure, maybe Cole is Max Scherzer 2.0 but for that contract to be worth it you are basically betting on him being a sure time HoF by the time he ends his career.
 

edoug

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That's what I was saying, they have so many holes. Sign Bumgarner and Ryu for less combined than Cole, you could even probably sign Keuchel too for that money.
Yesterday that might have worked. After Strasburg's contract, pitching has gotten more expensive.
 

Wingack

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Cole is coming off a dominant season. Sale is coming off a visit to Dr Andrews. I’d take 8 year of Cole over 5 of Sale in a cocaine heartbeat.

Yeah, I was coming to post this. Not only that, it feels like for his entire career people have been waiting for Sale's arm to fall clean off his body, we may be at that point.

Cole kinda strikes me as a player that will pitch well into his later years, kind of like a Curt Schilling.
 

jon abbey

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Yesterday that might have worked. After Strasburg's contract, pitching has gotten more expensive.
I don’t know about that, Keuchel isn’t going to get 5/75 because Strasburg got a bit more than expected. Cole’s price maybe went up some but even there I think it was down to the Yankees and Angels already.
 

sean1562

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Ehh agree to disagree on the value of Sale compared to Cole when cole may get something like 280 million dollars. David Price was coming off a dominant season when he signed with us, Cole being an elite pitcher well into his 30s is not guaranteed. Sale got noticeably screwed by the juiced ball last season, his HR/FB rate spiked. Sale at a little under 30 mil a year for 5 years seems like a safer bet than Cole at 35 mil for 8 years. But I guess I am just a little more bullish on Sale than others. I highly doubt that the sox just wouldn't have him get TJ surgery if Andrews thought it was necessary.

But fully understand that reasonable minds can disagree on this. That figure seems like an insane amount of cash to throw at any pitcher. If Clayton Kershaw hit the FA market when he was 29 he would have probably seen a similar contract, and even a guy like him probably wouldnt be worth it over the long run.
 

edoug

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I don’t know about that, Keuchel isn’t going to get 5/75 because Strasburg got a bit more than expected. Cole’s price maybe went up some but even there I think it was down to the Yankees and Angels already.
Maybe but I was thinking more about Ryu than Kuechel.
 

sean1562

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honestly the nats are my NL team so i am pretty familiar with their farm system. I cannot imagine them having the trade capital to make that deal. If you took their top three prospects and gave them all to the Cubs Im still not sure that would be enough. Would make more sense just to sign Donaldson or move Kieboom to 3b. Any Bryant trade is gonna require they give up Kieboom. Im sure other teams would jump in and try to get Bryant and those teams have much better options than the Nats do. The Dodgers would probably be the favorites
 

jon abbey

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Didi to the Phillies and the Angels moved Cozart’s salary to the Giants.
 

jon abbey

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1/14 for Didi from the Phillies, good signing for them, I'm sure having Girardi there helped.
 

chawson

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Wow, that is about as pure a salary dump as it gets, the Angels took Will Wilson 15th overall.

I know them getting Cole barely helps the Sox as it adds another surefire contender to the Wild Card hunt, but it seems very interesting to those of us who don’t want to see him on the Yanks.
 

jon abbey

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Of course Cozart plays the same position as Rendon, who Arte Moreno was reported as 'loving' this afternoon.
 

chawson

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Of course Cozart plays the same position as Rendon, who Arte Moreno was reported as 'loving' this afternoon.
True, and I’m prepared to eat my hat if/when Cole accepts Cashman’s offer, but the Angels also had a pretty nice thing going with David Fletcher putting up a 3.5 win season at third base last year.
 

jon abbey

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paying the Giants your most recent first round pick to dump Cozart is an interesting use of resources.
Especially since Cole is looking to join a winner, and that cuts into their talent.

True, and I’m prepared to eat my hat if/when Cole accepts Cashman’s offer, but the Angels also had a pretty nice thing going with David Fletcher putting up a 3.5 win season at third base last year.
Good point, I didn't realize this. The LA paper says in their piece about this deal: "The Angels had no role for him, with David Fletcher, Tommy La Stella and Luís Rengifo available to play second and third."
 

EvilEmpire

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Good luck to Didi. I grew up around a lot of Philly fans in south Jersey and have a bit of a soft spot for all their teams except the Flyers. The Phillies will be easy to root for, especially with Girardi and Didi both in town.
 

sean1562

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who would they play at SS? weird after taking on that Grienke contract. Too bad they lost the WS!
 

nvalvo

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MadBum is gonna cash in. Twins in big on him (Heyman).

View: https://twitter.com/JonHeyman/status/1204604880272248832?s=20
If Bumgarner is worth over $100m, Price might well be worth his contract.

Bumgarner's last four seasons, 2016-19: 4.3, 1.6, 1.4, 3.2 fWAR
Price's last four seasons, 2016-19: 4.4, 1.5, 2.4, 2.3 fWAR

Now, presumably that's not a three year deal for Bumgarner, and Bumgarner is several years younger at 30. But both guys are LH ex-Aces with health concerns who are now figuring out how to succeed on guile and 91 mph fastballs.

They are comparable players.
 

sean1562

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welp that sucks. we cant be kings of the AL East forever, the 2010s were a great decade
 

sean1562

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Just remember that the Dodgers were an unbeatable superteam all season. anything can happen in the playoffs. But that yankees team is damn good now
 

jon abbey

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Just remember that the Dodgers were an unbeatable superteam all season. anything can happen in the playoffs. But that yankees team is damn good now
The Dodgers bullpen always sucked, Jansen was a mess all year, plus their division was pretty weak. Anything can happen in baseball but NY looks really loaded up and down the roster now, plus they still have all their prospect trade chips if needed.
 

sean1562

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The Dodgers bullpen always sucked, Jansen was a mess all year, plus their division was pretty weak. Anything can happen in baseball but NY looks really loaded up and down the roster now, plus they still have all their prospect trade chips if needed.
dont take my hope away. the yankees will lose to the WC team in the ALDS! the best team lost this year itll happen again!

but seriously, I dont think the red sox should roll over and die but i wouldnt be distraught if this alters how they think of next season. We would need Sale/Price/Eovaldi/ERod to pitch to their max potential and even then im not sure it is enough. Our offense is amazing but we would need a Cy Young season from Sale to even have a chance at getting close to yall.
 

jon abbey

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Verlander is 8 years older than Cole and still an ace, that is what NY is (obviously) hoping for. Scherzer also has held up quite well, he is six years older than Cole.
 

strek1

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Verlander is 8 years older than Cole and still an ace, that is what NY is (obviously) hoping for. Scherzer also has held up quite well, he is six years older than Cole.
It happens but the odds are very much against it. For every Scherzer or Schilling there are 10 other aces that flame out in a few years. The long term deal was an enticement to get him there. Win for the next couple of years and if he implodes after 5 years they'll gladly take the loss.
 

Average Reds

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Verlander is 8 years older than Cole and still an ace, that is what NY is (obviously) hoping for. Scherzer also has held up quite well, he is six years older than Cole.
Verlander is an interesting comp, in the sense that he went through a period (2014-2015) where his velocity fell off the table and he looked washed up. He credits a flexibility program he picked up from his wife with revitalizing his career.

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/24332092/astros-justin-verlander-says-kate-upton-saved-career
Everyone is different and for all I know, Cole will hold up just fine. I'm still shocked at the number of years.

Edit: linked to a different article, same info.
 

67YAZ

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The White Sox traded a real prospect for a corner outfield who has 4 more or less full seasons in MLB and never put up an OPS+ of 100?
Meh. Walker was 23 last season and put up an .811OPS in A/advanced A ball. The year before it was a .613 OPS in rookie ball. He raked at Oklahoma, so there's talent there. And it's a pretty awesome name, too.

The White Sox were desperate for an everyday RF and left-handed bat. The other Nomar fits that bill for better or worse. Personally think Calhoun would have been a better fit.