leave Dike in. He’s going to overpower a tired defender in the 88th minute and score.
2021 Gold Cup: CONCACAF AF
- Thread starter DJnVa
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I don’t like how the only information we have so far on this double sub is that Roldan is part of it.
Yueill for Busio, Roldan for Acosta, and Hoppe for Zardes. The first of them makes me a little nervous, but the others make sense. Roldan looked excellent in a similar role vs. Martinique.
More generally, I like the idea of getting fresh legs into midfield given how badly the U.S. has been overrun there.
So it seems like Lletget will move to the center, Roldan and Hoppe will be higher and wider.
I would have liked to see Williamson because Busio has been such a defensive zero today and Yueill isn't likely to be too much better.
I would have liked to see Williamson because Busio has been such a defensive zero today and Yueill isn't likely to be too much better.
Yuell doesn’t help there no matter how fresh his legs are. Roldan might, but I dunno.
So we go down to 10 right? This won’t end well considering it’s been a blitzkrieg at even strength.
Didn't see an eye poke, seemed a flail elbow, but again for some reason my YTTV Fox feed looks like it is mid 1990s quality.
Hoppe hasn’t had enough chances because we made the midfield even softer, but he’s been a livewire when he gets the ball.
Some experiences are good to have, and others are good to have had. I think tonight was the latter for a lot of this young USMNT squad. Not a convincing game for Berhalter's in-game tactical adjustments, given the long struggles after the early part of the game.
Good work from Sands, Vines, and Robinson in particular. Hopefully everyone stays healthy. It would be great if Zimmerman can bounce back because we are really in a pickle if he's out since we'd have to start Pines or switch to a 4-3-3 with someone other than Sands as the 6.
Good work from Sands, Vines, and Robinson in particular. Hopefully everyone stays healthy. It would be great if Zimmerman can bounce back because we are really in a pickle if he's out since we'd have to start Pines or switch to a 4-3-3 with someone other than Sands as the 6.
Gotcha. Thx. My yttv was shit for some reason today. Moved to other tv for sox game as the yttv issue was only on main tv for some reason.
Hope it isnt serious for dike.
In other news i am really excited for this generation of players. This B team probably beats the team from 5 years ago.
Some of these guys will end up in Europe. Dike had a loan to Barnsley. I’d take him on the Toffees right now.
DVR’d the match.
Hoping for the best with the injuries. We definitely need Big Walker and probably need Dike if the US is going to win this Cup.
Love what Sands is doing with his opportunity and it’s clear Berhalter loves it, too. The kid is going to make WCQ camps and probably some squads.
But that hybrid CB/DM role is waaaaay to ambitious for a young national team where most guys are just learning each other’s names. Plus, it’s left the midfield a player short. Busio should have been the deep tempo setter with 2 mids in front of him (Acosta and Williamson preferably, but Roldan could slot in well for either).
I think the most effective set up is something that is a 5-3-2 if defense and a 3-1-3-3 in attack with the wingback providing width up high, Hoppe slipping in central behind Zardes/Dike, and the 2 mids working the channels. But that’s all moot if Zimmerman is hurt because they it’s 4ATB without any real wingers, so….
Hoping for the best with the injuries. We definitely need Big Walker and probably need Dike if the US is going to win this Cup.
Love what Sands is doing with his opportunity and it’s clear Berhalter loves it, too. The kid is going to make WCQ camps and probably some squads.
But that hybrid CB/DM role is waaaaay to ambitious for a young national team where most guys are just learning each other’s names. Plus, it’s left the midfield a player short. Busio should have been the deep tempo setter with 2 mids in front of him (Acosta and Williamson preferably, but Roldan could slot in well for either).
I think the most effective set up is something that is a 5-3-2 if defense and a 3-1-3-3 in attack with the wingback providing width up high, Hoppe slipping in central behind Zardes/Dike, and the 2 mids working the channels. But that’s all moot if Zimmerman is hurt because they it’s 4ATB without any real wingers, so….
I think the key move was swapping Hoppe in for Zardes.
In addition to the obvious issue with losing Zimmerman for Pines, the forced sub was another problem because it used up one of the sub opportunities for the U.S. I wonder if that was partly why Berhalter was reluctant to make a move earlier.
CONCACAF - where you still beat the minnows but feel like you've been playing in a drive-thru car wash for 90 minutes
Credibility is obviously a huge priority for CONCACAF. Today — in the middle of the tournament — they announced that teams can make three injury swaps to their roster for the knockout stage.
View: https://twitter.com/GoldCup/status/1417152608284946436
O, Canada.
TFC announced that Akinola's injury is a blown ACL, too. Very tough.
View: https://twitter.com/CanadaSoccerEN/status/1417488276022337548
TFC announced that Akinola's injury is a blown ACL, too. Very tough.
View: https://twitter.com/CanadaSoccerEN/status/1417488276022337548
Watched the Canada game live but I thought I should watch it again. Some random thoughts:
1. Sands looks really, really good. Maybe our Adams backup? Even if nothing else goes right for the rest of the Gold Cup, it will be a success of sorts if we found our backup 6
2. The real Miles Robinson showed up.
3. The real Gianluca Busio unfortunately did not. I thought he was really poor and didn’t seem to give much effort. I wouldn’t blame Gregg for not playing him much for the rest of the GC, and I do love me some Busio
4. Vines looked about as good as he can at this point. Still not great, but much better. I still hope someone can pass him in the depth chart, but right now he’s probably the backup to Robinson at LB/LWB.
5. Yueill just doesn’t have USMNT quality.He’s better than many MLS players and will have a nice career there. He seems like a decent guy based on interviews I’ve seen and busts his ass every time he’s out there. But that doesn’t mean he is good enough for the USMNT.
6. I’m trying to give Gregg as much of a benefit as I can, but repeating issues have been showing up throughout the summer. There have been several very poor team performances, including games against Switzerland, Haiti, Honduras, and Canada. Individual players will have poor performances no matter what, but when the entire team is playing poorly, that’s on the coach. Roster selection, tactics, formations, starting lineups, substitutions- I have questions about them all. Credit where credit is due, the US has consistently started games well for the first 15 minutes. Beyond that though, it hasn’t been good.
7. Lletget and Acosta just aren’t good fits long term. Lletget had that 70/70 passing game (Haiti??) but I see that as a negative. He plays an advanced role for this team and is supposed to be creating things. He’s playing instead not to make mistakes. 70/70 passing is great for a CB who is playing simple passes. That’s not the 8/10s job. He needs to be taking risks when space is compressed. He just passed it back or square not putting pressure on the D at all. Yes, I know he got the assist against Canada, but what else did he do? Acosta was the same to me with the pass to Lletget to set up the goal, but then he went invisible for the rest of the game. Better than getting beat and giving up a Pk I guess. Now, both players have spot for qualifiers but I hope Gregg is open to phasing them out as other players force the issue, whether it’s later in WCQ or at WC2022. Seeing as though he keeps trotting Yueill out there, I won’t hold my breath.
8. Zardes and Dike together was not good. I’m shocked at how long it took to get Hoppe in there, especially given how good he looked.
9. We have serious issues if Zimmerman can’t go.
10. any reason we didn’t see Williamson?
1. Sands looks really, really good. Maybe our Adams backup? Even if nothing else goes right for the rest of the Gold Cup, it will be a success of sorts if we found our backup 6
2. The real Miles Robinson showed up.
3. The real Gianluca Busio unfortunately did not. I thought he was really poor and didn’t seem to give much effort. I wouldn’t blame Gregg for not playing him much for the rest of the GC, and I do love me some Busio
4. Vines looked about as good as he can at this point. Still not great, but much better. I still hope someone can pass him in the depth chart, but right now he’s probably the backup to Robinson at LB/LWB.
5. Yueill just doesn’t have USMNT quality.He’s better than many MLS players and will have a nice career there. He seems like a decent guy based on interviews I’ve seen and busts his ass every time he’s out there. But that doesn’t mean he is good enough for the USMNT.
6. I’m trying to give Gregg as much of a benefit as I can, but repeating issues have been showing up throughout the summer. There have been several very poor team performances, including games against Switzerland, Haiti, Honduras, and Canada. Individual players will have poor performances no matter what, but when the entire team is playing poorly, that’s on the coach. Roster selection, tactics, formations, starting lineups, substitutions- I have questions about them all. Credit where credit is due, the US has consistently started games well for the first 15 minutes. Beyond that though, it hasn’t been good.
7. Lletget and Acosta just aren’t good fits long term. Lletget had that 70/70 passing game (Haiti??) but I see that as a negative. He plays an advanced role for this team and is supposed to be creating things. He’s playing instead not to make mistakes. 70/70 passing is great for a CB who is playing simple passes. That’s not the 8/10s job. He needs to be taking risks when space is compressed. He just passed it back or square not putting pressure on the D at all. Yes, I know he got the assist against Canada, but what else did he do? Acosta was the same to me with the pass to Lletget to set up the goal, but then he went invisible for the rest of the game. Better than getting beat and giving up a Pk I guess. Now, both players have spot for qualifiers but I hope Gregg is open to phasing them out as other players force the issue, whether it’s later in WCQ or at WC2022. Seeing as though he keeps trotting Yueill out there, I won’t hold my breath.
8. Zardes and Dike together was not good. I’m shocked at how long it took to get Hoppe in there, especially given how good he looked.
9. We have serious issues if Zimmerman can’t go.
10. any reason we didn’t see Williamson?
The concern with Williamson is that he's very loose with the ball, which isn't exactly what you want when you're already struggling for possession and worried about keeping shape and defending.
Agreed 100% on Lletget, and I'm surprised I haven't seen more people making the same criticism re his passing %ages.
The benefit of the doubt argument on Berhalter goes something like this: he wanted to protect Pines after Zimmerman went out, so basically gave up on possessing the ball in favor of defending and countering. The defending part worked great (we beat Canada in xG though that probably doesn't account for what might have been two or three penalties) but the countering part did not, mainly because we got nothing out of Zardes and Dike.
Agreed 100% on Lletget, and I'm surprised I haven't seen more people making the same criticism re his passing %ages.
The benefit of the doubt argument on Berhalter goes something like this: he wanted to protect Pines after Zimmerman went out, so basically gave up on possessing the ball in favor of defending and countering. The defending part worked great (we beat Canada in xG though that probably doesn't account for what might have been two or three penalties) but the countering part did not, mainly because we got nothing out of Zardes and Dike.
Haven't seen an injury update on Big Zim, so assuming he gets replaced it should be with Trusty or Kessler. I'm guessing CCV, EPB, and Che are all back to Europe, leaving just those 2 as CBs from the provisional roster.
If 3ATB is the formation for the rest of this tournament and Arriola is done, then I might call up both Trusty and Kessler to provide some cover.
The most fun replacement would be Caden Clark for Arriola, but that would require another change in formation...ah, what a mess.
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Che is still at Dallas I believe, but if you’re looking to stabilize a back line for tournament knockouts a 17 year old with fewer than 10 pro starts is not a low risk choice, even with the obvious talent.
CCV just played in a friendly for Spurs. That probably means he is not available, and he is very likely to be signing transfer paperwork any day now, so I don't think he is an option.
Che has also been starting at RB with Dallas, and hasn't been getting reps at CB.
I would have taken Trusty or Kessler over Pines from the outset.
USMNT viewership has been pretty solid for a C team Gold Cup.
View: https://twitter.com/thegoalkeeper/status/1417607819688353800
View: https://twitter.com/thegoalkeeper/status/1417607819688353800
If Zimmerman is out, another CB is a must. I'd assume Kessler is all but officially on the roster for the rest of the Gold Cup. Cowell is here if Arriola can't go, or maybe if Dike's shoulder is a problem.
View: https://twitter.com/USMNT/status/1417672566618066946
View: https://twitter.com/USMNT/status/1417672728446918660
View: https://twitter.com/USMNT/status/1417672566618066946
View: https://twitter.com/USMNT/status/1417672728446918660
So we should be seeing the other shoe to drop later today re: who comes off the roster for Cowell.
This was really well done and I agree with pretty much all of it. The most troubling thing about Berhalter’s continued dabbling with marginal talent possessing zero upside is that the clock is ticking. There are precious few opportunities to work in new candidates for the 6 or 8 before Qatar b/c he keeps giving all the minutes to proven mediocrities Like maybe thats OK when you have 2-3 years left in a cycle, but we’re running out of runway to ease in new candidates in a low consequence environment.
As more and more young Americans move to and and break through in Europe over the next 12 months, it will be fascinating to see whether GGG is able to integrate them into “the group”. Like, if Caden Clark is in the rotation at RBL next Spring, how do you keep him off the roster in favor of an Arriola, Lletget or Acosta?
This just isn’t the time for that complaint. You can justify a complaint in the last tournament but this Gold Cup roster is clearly prioritizing letting the European players do a normal pre season with their clubs. That’s the right move and cobbling together an MLS based roster with players you can count on makes sense. Unless there’s some huge talent MLS youngster who didnt make this squad it’s not much of a viable complaint
I agree with the bolded. My issue though is that some players were on both Nations League and Gold Cup rosters. The Nations League should have been 100% European based players for exactly this reason. That way we could maximize the number of players who would get a camp. Now, I know Lucas de la Torre turned down the invite and Caden Clark had an appendectomy. Still, there would have been some overlap of the rosters. Also I am no way defending de la Torre's decision to not play in the Gold Cup. He should have played, and I will not have much of an issue if GGG does not consider him worth a call up during qualifying. That being said, he should have been on the Nations League roster so he could get a camp with the USMNT then be back in Europe for preseason. If there was going to be overlap anyways, how come David Ochoa is left off the GC so we could have two veteran GK backing up Turner? He could've gotten a half against Martinique and been cap tied. Instead he's off making googly eyes with El Tri. This is not a normal qualifying cycle. With three games in a short time period, depth players will not just be subs, they'll likely have to start and play a lot of minutes.
I applaud Gregg for getting some of the new guys in there. I said it before, we learned that Busio in my opinion is not there yet. He's been must see TV for SKC this season, but it did not translate to the USMNT for now. The same could be said about Bello to a lesser extent. We learned the Sands and Zimmerman should be in the mix. Shaq Moore has been surprisingly good (randomly, I vaguely remember him as a LB when he was at Levante. I could've sworn he ended up defending Messi throughout that game- anyone can feel free to fact check me on that one). I like what I saw out of Williamson and would like to see more. How about Leon Floch though? He's having a great season in Philly but we won't know how he stacks up against CONCACAF opposition. He could be a nice Adams backup. Instead we get to trot Jackson Yueill out there. Again, and again, and again. Chris Mueller is another obvious omission to me as a winger. I would have liked to see Tesserman but he got his romantic Venice transfer.
There are also a lot of inconsistencies in the squad selection. Roldan gets the call because he's having a great MLS season, so Gregg wants to see if that improved play carries through to the USMNT? Ok, I get it (disagree, but I get it). But why the hell is Jonathon Lewis on the roster then? Is it because he's clearly so well rested since he rarely even starts for his MLS club? One player looks good in MLS and gets the call, the other looks bad in MLS and gets the call. Let's not get into the actual makeup of the squad- not enough winger depth for a 4-3-3 and not enough CB for a 3 ATB- pretty much the only two formations GGG actually uses.
My frustration is that there are some obvious locks in the top 25-30 players who the USMNT will lean on for qualifying and there are players on the fringe, and it feels like GGG is protecting "his guys" that are on the fringe from competition from other players. That's probably unfair, and you're probably right that now is not the time to complain about the roster, but this is what happens when we get like 10 days between matches.
I think the inclusions of Yueill and Lewis were clearly shown to be a mistake, given that both played themselves down the depth chart within the first half of the first game of the Gold Cup. As discussed, this ruins the depth chart for both the 4-3-3 and 3-man backline formations.
Whenever you assemble a roster that is close to a "2nd 23", there's going to be a lot of quibbling at the back end of the roster because there isn't necessarily a ton that separates players at this point in the depth chart. I am largely okay with how Berhalter handled the two squads outside of the two aforementioned players, though I also have my quibbles at the back of the roster (e.g. Pines was a dicey choice at best).
The Nations League was all about giving the A team a simulation of WCQ. It's not the time for experiments, or to look at players for the future. The Gold Cup is about filling a few holes in the WCQ travel roster that is mostly already set. Berhalter picked a roster that is one of the youngest squads in the last decade of Gold Cups (and may have been THE youngest if Araujo hadn't dropped out). I know there were some calls for what would have amounted to a U20 team, but I think there's a reasonable balance of very young players and somewhat more experienced players. The players who get the short end of the stick here are the Euros who are somewhere outside the Nations League roster (LDLT, CCV, et al), but them's the breaks.
I would have been fine with some younger players who people find more exciting like Pepi, Paredes, Flach, et al, but realistically none of them have a particularly good chance of moving into the WCQ team *right now*, which means they aren't the priority for the Gold Cup. It would help if the USSF wasn't so bankrupted by all their dumb legal troubles such that they no longer run ANY youth national teams, which would allow more of these youngsters to stay a bit more involved.
I do think it is important that the USSF change managers after the 2022 WC cycle no matter what happens. The pool is evolving quickly with a new wave of talent coming in. Incumbent players aren't going to phase themselves out by retiring or going into late-career decline. Some perfectly solid, reliable players will need to be placed aside in favor of better young talent. Given that second-term managers are notorious for sticking with guys they trust, I think it will be very important to have a fresh set of eyes.
Whenever you assemble a roster that is close to a "2nd 23", there's going to be a lot of quibbling at the back end of the roster because there isn't necessarily a ton that separates players at this point in the depth chart. I am largely okay with how Berhalter handled the two squads outside of the two aforementioned players, though I also have my quibbles at the back of the roster (e.g. Pines was a dicey choice at best).
The Nations League was all about giving the A team a simulation of WCQ. It's not the time for experiments, or to look at players for the future. The Gold Cup is about filling a few holes in the WCQ travel roster that is mostly already set. Berhalter picked a roster that is one of the youngest squads in the last decade of Gold Cups (and may have been THE youngest if Araujo hadn't dropped out). I know there were some calls for what would have amounted to a U20 team, but I think there's a reasonable balance of very young players and somewhat more experienced players. The players who get the short end of the stick here are the Euros who are somewhere outside the Nations League roster (LDLT, CCV, et al), but them's the breaks.
I would have been fine with some younger players who people find more exciting like Pepi, Paredes, Flach, et al, but realistically none of them have a particularly good chance of moving into the WCQ team *right now*, which means they aren't the priority for the Gold Cup. It would help if the USSF wasn't so bankrupted by all their dumb legal troubles such that they no longer run ANY youth national teams, which would allow more of these youngsters to stay a bit more involved.
I do think it is important that the USSF change managers after the 2022 WC cycle no matter what happens. The pool is evolving quickly with a new wave of talent coming in. Incumbent players aren't going to phase themselves out by retiring or going into late-career decline. Some perfectly solid, reliable players will need to be placed aside in favor of better young talent. Given that second-term managers are notorious for sticking with guys they trust, I think it will be very important to have a fresh set of eyes.
The answer is nobody, as it turns out. Kessler for Zimmerman is the only swap. Of the banged up players, Berhalter said that Dike is in better shape than Arriola.
View: https://twitter.com/USMNT/status/1419334125840896005