2021 Hall of Fame

Pablo's TB Lover

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FYI, I organized the players based on the HOF monitor on Pro Football Reference into categories. The metric used is the average HOF monitor score of players at their position. However the football HOF selection is so archaic that ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Way below HOF avg
Jared Allen
Ronde Barber
Tony Boselli (does not even register due to short length of career)
Calvin Johnson
John Lynch
Clay Matthews Jr.
Sam Mills

Just below HOF avg
Leroy Butler
Torry Holt
Richard Seymour
Zach Thomas

Just above HOF avg
Reggie Wayne

Way above HOF avg
Alan Faneca
Peyton Manning
Charles Woodson

I am officially concerned over Wayne's chances seeing as Isaac Bruce(!) just got in with a below average HOF number. We shall see...
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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FYI, I organized the players based on the HOF monitor on Pro Football Reference into categories. The metric used is the average HOF monitor score of players at their position. However the football HOF selection is so archaic that ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Way below HOF avg
Jared Allen
Ronde Barber
Tony Boselli (does not even register due to short length of career)
Calvin Johnson
John Lynch
Clay Matthews Jr.
Sam Mills

Just below HOF avg
Leroy Butler
Torry Holt
Richard Seymour
Zach Thomas

Just above HOF avg
Reggie Wayne

Way above HOF avg
Alan Faneca
Peyton Manning
Charles Woodson

I am officially concerned over Wayne's chances seeing as Isaac Bruce(!) just got in with a below average HOF number. We shall see...
Faneca, Manning, and Woodson all were no-brainers, so it's good to see them where they are on the list.

I dont really get the Wayne, thing. Longer career than a guy like Holt, but if someone plays for over a decade (Holt played 11), it's not like his career was short.

And, to be fair, Wayne wasnt HoF status for all 14 seasons. Waynes first two seasons, he was targeted less than 80 times. His second to last season he only played 5 games. So, basically 11 seasons of high target volume career. Torry played 11 total seasons, but all 11 seasons he was a high volume 100+ target WR (97 his rookie season). Torry averaged more yards, TD's, better YPC, and receptions per season than Wayne.

I guess you could argue that Wayne was part of a very successful Indy team, so hes got that story behind him. But Holt was part of the greatest show on turf which was successful and a great story in their own right.

Holt also had a significantly higher peak. Two seasons with 1600+ yards (only Calvin Johnson, Julio Jones, and Marvin Harrison have 2 such seasons). Four other seasons with 1300+ yards. Wayne only crossed 1500 yards once and 1300 yards twice.

I just see no reason for Wayne to get in. Better peak player? Calvin Johnsons 135 games. Better long term, high volume receiver? Holts 153 games started. Wayne was lower peak than both, but started 2 more seasons of games than Holt. Again, if Holt had only played 7 or 8 seasons, fine. But dude played 11 seasons. If Wayne gets in over either, it's a joke.
 
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Pablo's TB Lover

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Faneca, Manning, and Woodson all were no-brainers, so it's good to see them where they are on the list.

I dont really get the Wayne, thing. Longer career than a guy like Holt, but if someone plays for over a decade (Holt played 11), it's not like his career was short.

And, to be fair, Wayne wasnt HoF status for all 14 seasons. Waynes first two seasons, he was targeted less than 80 times. His second to last season he only played 5 games. So, basically 11 seasons of high target volume career. Torry played 11 total seasons, but all 11 seasons he was a high volume 100+ target WR (97 his rookie season). Torry averaged more yards, TD's, better YPC, and receptions per season than Wayne.

I guess you could argue that Wayne was part of a very successful Indy team, so hes got that story behind him. But Holt was part of the greatest show on turf which was successful and a great story in their own right.

Holt also had a significantly higher peak. Two seasons with 1600+ yards (only Calvin Johnson, Julio Jones, and Marvin Harrison have 2 such seasons). Four other seasons with 1300+ yards. Wayne only crossed 1500 yards once and 1300 yards twice.

I just see no reason for Wayne to get in. Better peak player? Calvin Johnsons 135 games. Better long term, high volume receiver? Holts 153 games started. Wayne was lower peak than both, but started 2 more seasons of games than Holt. Again, if Holt had only played 7 or 8 seasons, fine. But dude played 11 seasons. If Wayne gets in over either, it's a joke.
Yes IMO Holt is AT LEAST even with Wayne and I'd put him in my HOF over Wayne. Wayne was kind of "next in line" and got more production as Harrison aged, and you know Peyton was going to make even an above average receiver put up superstar numbers. Where it felt like Holt was more supplanting Bruce (who was a HOF'er himself) and really took that superstar mantel from him. Maybe just my Colt hatred talking, but my gut is telling me Holt should get in first, Johnson second, and Wayne third if they all make it. However with an unusual amount of weight put on team performance unlike other sports' Halls, my guess is it will be some combination of Wayne and Holt, then Johnson will be third in line.
 

j-man

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Dec 19, 2012
2,116
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FYI, I organized the players based on the HOF monitor on Pro Football Reference into categories. The metric used is the average HOF monitor score of players at their position. However the football HOF selection is so archaic that ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Way below HOF avg
Jared Allen
Ronde Barber
Tony Boselli (does not even register due to short length of career)
Calvin Johnson
John Lynch
Clay Matthews Jr.
Sam Mills

Just below HOF avg
Leroy Butler
Torry Holt
Richard Seymour
Zach Thomas

Just above HOF avg
Reggie Wayne

Way above HOF avg
Alan Faneca
Peyton Manning
Charles Woodson

I am officially concerned over Wayne's chances seeing as Isaac Bruce(!) just got in with a below average HOF number. We shall see...
manning woodson johnson seymour then faneca wayne or hoit
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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Sep 10, 2017
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FYI, I organized the players based on the HOF monitor on Pro Football Reference into categories. The metric used is the average HOF monitor score of players at their position. However the football HOF selection is so archaic that ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Way below HOF avg
Jared Allen
Ronde Barber
Tony Boselli (does not even register due to short length of career)
Calvin Johnson
John Lynch

Clay Matthews Jr.
Sam Mills

Just below HOF avg
Leroy Butler
Torry Holt
Richard Seymour
Zach Thomas

Just above HOF avg
Reggie Wayne

Way above HOF avg
Alan Faneca
Peyton Manning
Charles Woodson


I am officially concerned over Wayne's chances seeing as Isaac Bruce(!) just got in with a below average HOF number. We shall see...
Well, 2 from the "way below" category get in. At least all 3 of the most qualified players will get in.

But that's some bullshit if you are putting 5 players in the HOF and Seymour does not get in. Is Calvin Johnson at 35 yo the youngest to ever get into the HOF?
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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Gayle Sayers at 34 is the youngest inducted into the HOF.
Thanks, and c/o Sportscenter Jim Brown also was inducted to the HOF at 35 (he may have been elected at 34 yo if they did so around SB time, as his DOB is Feb 17th).
 

Ale Xander

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Oct 31, 2013
36,399
Well, 2 from the "way below" category get in. At least all 3 of the most qualified players will get in.

But that's some bullshit if you are putting 5 players in the HOF and Seymour does not get in. Is Calvin Johnson at 35 yo the youngest to ever get into the HOF?
The eye test would put in Megatron over Holt and Wayne.
 

Cellar-Door

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Aug 1, 2006
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Well, 2 from the "way below" category get in. At least all 3 of the most qualified players will get in.

But that's some bullshit if you are putting 5 players in the HOF and Seymour does not get in. Is Calvin Johnson at 35 yo the youngest to ever get into the HOF?
I think Seymour should get in, but any metric that rates Megatron as well below HOF level is dumb. He was the best WR in football for a good 3-5 years, and he's 2nd all time in receiving yards per game for his career. Nobody cares that he played "only" 9 seasons, he was so clearly one of the best if not the best players in the league at his position for basically all of them.
 

Kliq

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Mar 31, 2013
14,586
I think Seymour should get in, but any metric that rates Megatron as well below HOF level is dumb. He was the best WR in football for a good 3-5 years, and he's 2nd all time in receiving yards per game for his career. Nobody cares that he played "only" 9 seasons, he was so clearly one of the best if not the best players in the league at his position for basically all of them.
I don't have a problem with Johnson getting in, but looking back at his statistical profile, he seems a tad overrated. He really only has 4 truly elite years (maybe 5) and he had that two year stretch from 2010 to 2011 where he was definitely the best WR in football; but outside of that two year stretch, his career is good but not particularly outstanding. Plus, those two seasons were in a crazy offense that threw the ball a million times and often were playing from behind. His 2011 season, the one he had 1,963 yards in, his team finished 4-12 and he got a ton of stat padding yards in garbage time. Stafford had back-to-back 5,000 yard seasons in 2010/2011, but nobody is saying he should be in the hall of fame (he didn't even make the pro bowl those years) because we understand those numbers were inflated by garbage time accumulation. We often don't dock WRs for the same situation, accumulating worthless yards and receptions in garbage time, because we accept that they don't have the same amount of control over the end result as the QB, but we probably should consider that when it comes to things like Johnson almost cracking 2,000 yards for a 4-12 team.

It is the peak vs career argument and I'm fine with Johnson getting in; but it isn't crazy to think that he shouldn't be in. There are going to be plenty of WRs with much higher career totals that will not get in.