2024 Jets: Out of the Darkness - Take 2

Tony C · Nov 23, 2024

MikeM said:
....
So yeah overall I generally find this idea Rodgers wouldn't upgrade more then a few of those QB rooms, in a much improved and equal opportunity setting, as being kinda silly imho. Now whether a said team can make that upgrade fit work with all the baggage that comes with it is another matter. Starting with the final Brady years dillemma where there is really no compromise to the fact he needs to be behind a line that consistently gives him time to work.

Maybe/maybe not.
If maybe: name the teams. It's notable in your posts I don't see any specific destinations.

I'll grant you that, say, Tennessee would be improved by him at QB, but seriously doubt they feel they're in a position to pick up a 40 year head case. Better than Levis? Sure. But even if not with Levis, the Titans and other teams want to find the future, not get a marginal improvement for a year or 2 max.

When I go through teams...I see few to no feasible options.

MikeM said:
I mean the progressive decline you state there was starting at the player age of 39. In NFL football.

The stupidly shallow expectation evaluations that have surrounded all this from the start aren't an L that falls on him imo.

If you don't think that pompous piece of arrogant crap didn't have something to with raising expectations, I'll just quote the dark legend himself: "Our biggest struggle is going to be handling success."

johnmd20 · Nov 23, 2024

Rodgers was a lot to take and always led teams that underperformed when he was one of the most skilled QBs in NFL history. Because he's a woeful leader.

Now he's terrible and utterly diminished and also a psychopath and an asshole. I would be surprised if any team took him on at this point. What would be the point? He's a bad person and this isn't Deshuan Watson at 25 years old.(which was a historically bad move) This is a guy who is going to be 41 in a week and has broken down in most of his body parts. He's not Tom Brady. 41 is fucking OLD.

Justthetippett · Nov 23, 2024

@

MikeM said:
So if Rodgers is indeed out for 2025 then the most important decision this franchise will make this offseason, by far imo, will end up shifting over to who Rex Ryan picks as his OC.

Because it's going to be Rex at HC for the "vibes" lol

I actually won't immediately reject the concept idea of Rex more or less working out (the bar is pretty low here) *IF* we match him with the right OC hire.

Are you talking yourself into Rex Ryan? Man this latest abuse on Jets fans is worse than I thought. If ever there was a team that needed to not pull from it's past, it's the Jets. Look no further than the Dolan Knicks. It is possible to overcome a clown owner with competent management. You need to find your Leon Rose, not go back to the well of despair. Douglas and Saleh actually demonstrated competence. Mistakes were made at QB that torpedoed everything.

koufax32 · Nov 23, 2024

johnmd20 said:
41 is fucking OLD.

Dude…

It’s actually impressive that AR’s incompetence and GM’ing hasn’t cost the Jets at all when it comes to being able to draft a QB with a top 5 pick. Competent incompetence, I guess?

nattysez · Nov 23, 2024

Justthetippett said:
@

Are you talking yourself into Rex Ryan? Man this latest abuse on Jets fans is worse than I thought. If ever there was a team that needed to not pull from it's past, it's the Jets. Look no further than the Dolan Knicks. It is possible to overcome a clown owner with competent management. You need to find your Leon Rose, not go back to the well of despair. Douglas and Saleh actually demonstrated competence. Mistakes were made at QB that torpedoed everything.

You think that's bad? In her article, Russini suggests that the Jets consider bringing the Mangenius back.

Cellar-Door · Nov 23, 2024

I was trying to find it, but can't now, but one suggestion I saw was that Woody getting an amassadorship would be good for the Jets because word is that people are a lot happier working for Christopher.

luckiestman · Nov 24, 2024

nattysez said:
You think that's bad? In her article, Russini suggests that the Jets consider bringing the Mangenius back.

Eric the Rat, as you guys call him, was a good coach that never should have been fired.

I don’t see it, though.

Tony C · Dec 3, 2024

It's Tuesday and I'm procrastinating work and so I thought I'd check out ESPN and the Athletic to see the reaction to AR's latest flop. (Anyone who says it's not about AR flopping is wrong -- he was terrible.) And what's great is there's very little. Pre-season and early season those sites were all AR all the time. Now...he's irrelevant.

I love that.

Saints Rest · Dec 3, 2024

What is the Jets' pathway out of darkness?

Probably looking at a new HC and new GM. WFAN yesterday were talking about Rexy or Brian Flores as possibly "ass-kicking" HC's who could come in and lay down the law with a new culture, ideally to turn around a woefully under-performing D.

Looking at around $32M in cap space (before any moves) which is 21st most as of today (and that covers 43 players under contract for 2025). Rodgers and Adams are roughly 25% of the 2025 cap with dead cap hits of $49M and $8M respectively.

Currently sitting at pick #6 in the draft. Do they draft QB3 with #6 (assuming top two go early) or do they get some much-needed OLine help and take a mid-round flier on a QB to learn under AR? Talkathon mock draft has them taking another CB in Will Johnson -- nice bookend to Sauce.

Van Everyman · Dec 3, 2024

Tony C said:
It's Tuesday and I'm procrastinating work and so I thought I'd check out ESPN and the Athletic to see the reaction to AR's latest flop. (Anyone who says it's not about AR flopping is wrong -- he was terrible.) And what's great is there's very little. Pre-season and early season those sites were all AR all the time. Now...he's irrelevant.

I love that.

I like the idea of Rodgers' irrelevance as well but saw a bunch of stuff on my YT feed about Rodgers' latest flop. Rich Eisen. The crew with Bart Scott (which has been entertainingly negative this season when I've heard them). Colin Cowherd, who said there isn't a starting quarterback in football right now he'd take Rodgers over and absolutely killed for having no work ethic. I won't lie: the 15 or so minutes I consumed of all this was all super enjoyable.

The big thing every I saw was that after this latest flop was Rodgers saying, "There's 11 guys out there, sometimes it's my fault." Which is just totally him.

I will never underestimate how desperate football teams can be, but it would be great if every team with quarterback needs told Rodgers that they weren't interested after this season.

Gash Prex · Dec 3, 2024

Saints Rest said:
What is the Jets' pathway out of darkness?

Probably looking at a new HC and new GM. WFAN yesterday were talking about Rexy or Brian Flores as possibly "ass-kicking" HC's who could come in and lay down the law with a new culture, ideally to turn around a woefully under-performing D.

Looking at around $32M in cap space (before any moves) which is 21st most as of today (and that covers 43 players under contract for 2025). Rodgers and Adams are roughly 25% of the 2025 cap with dead cap hits of $49M and $8M respectively.

Currently sitting at pick #6 in the draft. Do they draft QB3 with #6 (assuming top two go early) or do they get some much-needed OLine help and take a mid-round flier on a QB to learn under AR? Talkathon mock draft has them taking another CB in Will Johnson -- nice bookend to Sauce.

I don't know but there is a batshit crazy looking documentary on Rodgers that's about his "journey" and "darkness" so I guess that's something. Shoutout to the "metamorphosis" happening for him

Devizier · Dec 3, 2024

P'tucket rhymes with... · Dec 3, 2024

MikeM said:
Honestly the fact Rodgers is at least now making comments in line of "i'm open to whatever changes if they decide to keep me around in 2025" has me a lot closer to 50/50 in whether i can see a total picture scenario playing out this offseason where it probably makes more overall reality sense to keep him at QB for that last paid-for season.

But I also say that as somebody who is 100% out on any suggestive logic that this offseason's answer at QB should be to draft a guy. If we bring in a GM this winter that buys into that bad team savior BS line of thinking that we need a "franchise QB" in the building to fix the core problem then I'm gonna probably end up the same half a foot out fan I've been with the Sox for a couple years now (and which likely continues when when don't sign Soto or at least one of the frontline starters this winter).

Cimini's article on ESPN said that if they keep him around for 2025, the cap hit for the following year goes to $63 million. Hard to see an incoming GM eager about the possiblity of keeping a badly-aging narcissist around for a year, and then deal with a nasty cap hit during the middle of a rebuild. IANAGM, but I'd take my medicine and try to land a Jameis-level FA to manage affairs for a couple years.

Who's being talked about for GM, by the way? Any names yet?

luckiestman · Dec 3, 2024

P'tucket rhymes with... said:
Who's being talked about for GM, by the way? Any names yet?

Nah. There are names but it’s pretty run of the mill cast of characters that everyone is looking at.

Devizier · Dec 3, 2024

Gash Prex said:
I don't know but there is a batshit crazy looking documentary on Rodgers that's about his "journey" and "darkness" so I guess that's something. Shoutout to the "metamorphosis" happening for him.

It took me a bit, but I realized what this reminded me of:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvEyZ5Isop0

Tony C · Dec 3, 2024

Gash Prex said:
I don't know but there is a batshit crazy looking documentary on Rodgers that's about his "journey" and "darkness" so I guess that's something. Shoutout to the "metamorphosis" happening for him

Guess I spoke to soon about him fading into irrelevance. I love the opening bit of that bat shit looking documentary -- the extrovert on the field and the introvert off.

An attention seeking egotistical whore who has documentary cameras following him into doctors' offices and ayahuasca men's groups is...an introvert?

Um, no. Wish he'd go away. But further self-humiliation in an endless quest for self-validation is what we'll get instead.

joe dokes · Dec 3, 2024

Devizier said:
It took me a bit, but I realized what this reminded me of:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvEyZ5Isop0

Over Guapo Grande · Dec 3, 2024

Saints Rest said:
Currently sitting at pick #6 in the draft. Do they draft QB3 with #6 (assuming top two go early) or do they get some much-needed OLine help and take a mid-round flier on a QB to learn under AR? Talkathon mock draft has them taking another CB in Will Johnson -- nice bookend to Sauce.

Pats will trade down, so a CB needy team picks at 5 to grab Johnson. A Broderick Jones redux.

luckiestman · Dec 3, 2024

Over Guapo Grande said:
Pats will trade down, so a CB needy team picks at 5 to grab Johnson. A Broderick Jones redux.

Weapon of Mass Destruction is better than BJ

Over Guapo Grande · Dec 3, 2024

luckiestman said:
Weapon of Mass Destruction is better than BJ

I always prefer BJ... but that's just me.

luckiestman · Dec 4, 2024

Cimini states on his pod that Vrabel has told friends just because Belichick shit talks the Jets it doesn’t mean Vrabel would not be interested in the job. Vrabel has told friends it depends who the GM will be.

joe dokes · Dec 4, 2024

luckiestman said:
Cimini states on his pod that Vrabel has told friends just because Belichick shit talks the Jets it doesn’t mean Vrabel would not be interested in the job. Vrabel has told friends it depends who the GM will be.

The premise of the point seems stupid. There are actually functioning humans who think Vrabel would turn down an NFL HC job with a team because Belichick shit talks the team?
Does Mikey call Billy to ask for permission to eat at a restaurant?

cshea · Dec 4, 2024

joe dokes said:
The premise of the point seems stupid. There are actually functioning humans who think Vrabel would turn down an NFL HC job with a team because Belichick shit talks the team?
Does Mikey call Billy to ask for permission to eat at a restaurant?

I don't look at it like that. Vrabel is going to be a sought after candidate this hiring cylce. He may have his choice of openings. He's going to talk to his contacts about the various openings and Bill is probably included. Media Bill has spent a large part of this year hammering Woody Johnson ("ready, fire, aim"). Bill won't give Woody and the Jets an endorsement. Doesn't mean Vrabel won't take the call but if he does have multiple options, Bill's recommendation might weigh into Vrabel's decision.

Also, I'm not sure Vrabel is that good of a coach or a good fit for the Jets. His offense was terrible except when he had Arthur Smith as his OC. The guy Vrabel promoted to replace Smith, Todd Downing, is the guy currently calling the plays for the Jets as a matter of fact. Vrabel's defenses were middling. Vrabel's game management carries a lot of his reputation.

luckiestman · Dec 4, 2024

cshea said:
I don't look at it like that. Vrabel is going to be a sought after candidate this hiring cylce. He may have his choice of openings. He's going to talk to his contacts about the various openings and Bill is probably included. Media Bill has spent a large part of this year hammering Woody Johnson ("ready, fire, aim"). Bill won't give Woody and the Jets an endorsement. Doesn't mean Vrabel won't take the call but if he does have multiple options, Bill's recommendation might weigh into Vrabel's decision.

Also, I'm not sure Vrabel is that good of a coach or a good fit for the Jets. His offense was terrible except when he had Arthur Smith as his OC. The guy Vrabel promoted to replace Smith, Todd Downing, is the guy currently calling the plays for the Jets as a matter of fact. Vrabel's defenses were middling. Vrabel's game management carries a lot of his reputation.

I agree with your first paragraph. Vrabel had LaFleur hired away. I think he is a type the Jets need unless they can get lucky with an offensive wiz. I think that this got to Cimini as a newsworthy item “friends said” means Vrabel kind of wants it out there. That’s interesting to me.

Flores would work for me also. I’ll hope for the best with anyone but some will take more delusions than others.

mwonow · Dec 6, 2024

MikeM said:
I say this all the time about Dan Campbell and it gets people triggered as if i say it in a troll, but with all surrounding aspects being equal I 100% believe that Lions team doesn't look much different right now with Robert Saleh as it's head coach. It might even be a touch better.

Vrabel to me is just getting overly caught up in the romantized outcome narratives lots of fans/media enjoy writing into post-outcome game explanations, and would basically be the reality equililent of re-hiring Saleh and running it back. The Jets need somebody that can fix coaching and X&Os of the offense more then they need better intangible value or a "culture" change (that can never truely happen in a meaningful way unless Woody sells anyway). It won't matter who the HC is if that apsect gets lost or back seat prioritized in the this reboot process. Fix the offense in an offensive league, stop fielding historically bad offenses that stuggle to score points, and win more games. That should be *this* team's current culture change formula approach.

Campbell, Vrabel, Saleh, Bellechik, and Flores are all essentially the same dead man walking guys *here* if we don't make a Ben Johnson success level hire under them. So since it's not gonna be Ben johnson (who I'd still somewhat worry about wilting under the darkness that comes with being "the guy" here even if it was) it really really needs to be an offensive HC to better our flailing chances.

Seems kind of unfair to lump BB in with the others. If you remove him from the mix, total # of Lombardis as HC drops from 6 to 0.

ManicCompression · Dec 6, 2024

MikeM said:
I say this all the time about Dan Campbell and it gets people triggered as if i say it in a troll, but with all surrounding aspects being equal I 100% believe that Lions team doesn't look much different right now with Robert Saleh as it's head coach. It might even be a touch better.

Vrabel to me is just getting overly caught up in the romantized outcome narratives lots of fans/media enjoy writing into post-outcome game explanations, and would basically be the reality equililent of re-hiring Saleh and running it back. The Jets need somebody that can fix coaching and X&Os of the offense more then they need better intangible value or a "culture" change (that can never truely happen in a meaningful way unless Woody sells anyway). It won't matter who the HC is if that apsect gets lost or back seat prioritized in the this reboot process. Fix the offense in an offensive league, stop fielding historically bad offenses that stuggle to score points, and win more games. That should be *this* team's current culture change formula approach.

Campbell, Vrabel, Saleh, Bellechik, and Flores are all essentially the same dead man walking guys *here* if we don't make a Ben Johnson success level hire under them. So since it's not gonna be Ben johnson (who I'd still somewhat worry about wilting under the darkness that comes with being "the guy" here even if it was) it really really needs to be an offensive HC to better our flailing chances.

I think you're overlooking the fact that Dan Campbell is a guy who coaches want to work for and players want to play for. He got Ben Johnson to stay when we can confidently say he got interest from a lot of other teams this past offseason. Also, it seems like Campbell has some influence in the organization and knows how to work in concert with other people. That has a lot of value, and I don't get the sense that any of those other names - including BB - check all of those boxes. He has other faults, but you're shortchanging the culture aspect of it.

ManicCompression · Dec 6, 2024

MikeM said:
If all of that is true then I would also expect that the downfall slope of this run shouldn't end up being one of the ugliest of the bunch I listed when their time to be fired came up.

Like last night showed (imo) there can be a very thin line between hero and "wtf is he doing" after takes. I expect Campbell's last year in Detroit to have some of the loudest this guy is an idiot who has to go talk we've ever seen.

Time will tell.

Not sure what you're looking for in the next coach, then. Plenty of Ben Johnson's (hot young O coordinators) have been hired as HC's and then turned out to suck - look at Adam Gase with the Jets, or Josh McDaniels... anywhere. Any archetype of coach is going to look stupid on the downside. Even the greatest coach of all time didn't go out on top. There are pluses and minuses to everyone, it really just matters how much those strengths outweigh the weaknesses. Kyle Shanahan has had just as much of a talent advantage over the rest of the league as Campbell - maybe even more - and I'm sure he'll be viewed as a moron when that runs out despite defining the modern offense for most of this decade.

E5 Yaz · Dec 6, 2024

ESPN: Running back Breece Hall and cornerback Sauce Gardner are not expected to play Sunday, and five-time Pro Bowl linebacker C.J. Mosley is done for the season after being placed on injured reserve Friday. For Mosley, 32, who has a herniated disk in his neck, it likely signals the end of his Jets career.
The Jets (3-9) are preparing to face the Miami Dolphins (5-7) at Hard Rock Stadium without Hall (knee) and Gardner (hamstring), two of their best players. Both are listed as doubtful for the game.

ManicCompression · Dec 6, 2024

MikeM said:
I know it starts with somebody I'm at least confident can *maybe* put us on a path to fixing what has been a historically bad offensive run for going on a decade now.

It's great and all you like what you see going on in that total Detroit picture, and want to credit DC to the extent you do. But chasing "culture change", *HERE* in NY, isn't going to solve the primary problem if/when any HC you bring in ultimately ends up being a Robert Saleh clone who gets booed out the the building when they can't fix the offense.

I mean in all seriousness do you really believe if you were to give Campbell this roster, and with this coaching staff/FO/ownership, things play out any prettier then they did for Saleh here? That shtick and his overly aggressive coaching spots more likely doesn't even make it out of year 1 here imo.

I don't know? It seems like Dan Campbell is pretty good at managing up - I could see him getting Woody to buy in to the vision and not being so meddlesome. It's not like ownership in Detroit is easy.

joe dokes · Dec 11, 2024

Rodgers says footbal IQ is going down.

View: https://youtu.be/pFBt8DDbBT4?feature=shared

Tony C · Dec 11, 2024

Everything about the guy bugs me, but that new age guru voice which he's developed is the cherry on top.

Two eternal questions:

What's worse than a gung ho football jock who thinks some success on the field makes him god's gift?
What's worse than a toooo cool for school new-ager who has all the answers that mainstream media and science have hidden from mere mortals?

Answer: someone who is both. Welcome Aaron Rodgers!

hoothehoo · Dec 11, 2024

Rodger’s planning to “call aliens”

https://www.profootballnetwork.com/nfl-fans-stunned-aaron-rodgers-aliens-ufo-theory-lifestyle/

Devizier · Dec 11, 2024

Petagine in a Bottle · Dec 14, 2024

Oh really?

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/42968588/source-bill-belichick-inquired-jets-coaching-vacancy

E5 Yaz · Dec 18, 2024

Highlights(?) from the three-hour docuseries on Rodgers
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/lists/aaron-rodgers-netflix-series-enigma/a-heros-journey-rodgers-confronts-aging-and-contemplates-football-vs-character-legacy/

Devizier · Dec 18, 2024

E5 Yaz said:
Highlights(?) from the three-hour docuseries on Rodgers
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/lists/aaron-rodgers-netflix-series-enigma/a-heros-journey-rodgers-confronts-aging-and-contemplates-football-vs-character-legacy/

Sounds far too hagiographic to be fun. Would love to see a King of Kong style documentary where Rodgers is featured as a Billy Mitchell type.

cornwalls@6 · Dec 18, 2024

Good grief, has this clown jumped the shark. I’m honestly starting to wonder about CTE, or negative after effects from all the psychedelics he enjoys…….. Mods, if anything in the article is too close to the V&N line, please delete or move. I wasn’t quite sure on this one.

https://sports.yahoo.com/aaron-rodgers-ryan-clark-rant-225717456.html

The Social Chair · Dec 18, 2024

"I’m not gonna need to find some sort of relevance to be on TV. "

But don't forget to check out my Netflix show.

Cornboy14 · Dec 18, 2024

"then say whatever the hell you want to say about me [because] I couldn't give two (expletive)s about it."

"and another thing: im not mad. please dont put in the newspaper that i got mad." - @dril

Van Everyman · Dec 18, 2024

Aaron Rodgers going to the New York Jets has played out almost exactly how I imagined it would. And surely I'm not alone.

luckiestman · Dec 18, 2024

Van Everyman said:
Aaron Rodgers going to the New York Jets has played out almost exactly how I imagined it would. And surely I'm not alone.

I didn’t have our defense absolutely sucking

2024 Jets: Out of the Darkness - Take 2

Moderator

mad dog

New Member

Member

He'll cry if he wants to...

Member

Member

Member

Son of the Harpy

Member

Moderator

Member

Well-Known Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Son of the Harpy

Member

Member

Moderator

Member

panty merchant

Son of the Harpy

panty merchant

Son of the Harpy

Member

Member

Son of the Harpy

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

Member

polka king

Member

Member

Moderator

Member

Member

Member

polka king

Member

Less observant than others

Member

Member

Member

Son of the Harpy