ALDS: Indians vs Red Sox

JimD

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The Pedroia and Ortiz comments are ominous. That late-season swoon seemingly took away the positives from the winning streak and division title. They didn't even get to properly celebrate the title win thanks to Kimbrel's ill-timed meltdown. They entered the ALDS in a funk, while the Indians clearly heard everyone who wrote them off and are on a mission. I really don't have a good feeling about Sunday's game, especially if the Indians strike first.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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They've not looked good, but as long as Clay doesn't shit the bed they should pound Tomlin and then they have Bauer on short rest. Farrell needs a short hook Sunday and take your chances to get through. I'll take my chances in game five.
 

Tyrone Biggums

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This is absurd. This team went from worst to first and has a solid young core to build around. Neither Farrell nor DD will be judged on this series alone, nor should they.
I'm the furthest thing from a Farrell fan. However, there is no way he's getting canned for getting a team that has finished last in 2014 and 2015 back to the playoffs.
 

DeadlySplitter

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Fangraphs and 538 projections to win the ALDS:

Red Sox: 19%, 17%
Blue Jays: 90%, 92%

The Blue Jays are now AL favorites on both sites.

538 gave us a 58% chance on the road in game 1, while Cleveland had the edge at 55% in game 2.

538 has us at 59/58% for each home game, expecting Bauer on short rest and ERod for game 4. (60-40 is about as heavily favored as it gets in a single playoff game.) Porcello-Kluber is the projected game 5 and has us again as 45-55% dogs.

Of course, these projections probably aren't taking into account the very real possibility that X, JBJ and Mookie are cooked / overwhelmed by the playoffs right now. Let's hope the day off does some wonders, but we've said that a lot of September....
 
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mauidano

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Day off? They just had three days off plus they pretty much coasted the last few games of the season. They have lost seven out of the last eight games played. They surely picked the wrong time to have slumps all the way around. The Jays on the other hand played like their lives depended on it and it did. Now they have momentum (yes, it is a real thing) running hot for them. They can run the table.
 

aminahyaquin

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Just worry about Sunday, Clay has pitched well his last few starts. Do it one more time Clay.
Amen to that. AND, each time we have had to pass Cleveland for a post season championship, we have done so by coming back from a deficit. No team "picks" a slump...they are part of the absolutely arduous grueling and gutsy legacy of baseball.
Does this team have the HEART in service of the FOCUSED BRAINS and BODS to pull this off?
I believe we have the depth and the capacity, these fellas just do not all have the experience, but then we have two games under the belt, this is decisive moment.
SECRETARIAT many years ago was voted best athlete of the century in a sports poll and was featured on TIME magazine as sportsman of the century. There is a parallel. In no other sport but the Triple Crown of horse racing, does an athlete (in baseball a mixed bag of athletes) have to have such a combination of heart in service of brain and body tested under grueling arduous and often dissonant conditions. In horse racing the Triple Crown champion has to compete against the equivalent of best sprinters, the best marathon runners and the best mid range runners...within a 6 week period and in a "Game" in which the jockeys and owners collaborate to keep a good horse down.

In baseball it is a daily rally of cooperative and individual heroics over a season stretch that each year lately has posed new possibilities for extinction and with so many personnel involved , challenges both licit and illicit to charge through to the run for the roses of this extraordinary game.

We have done an awesome job just getting here. Will we be the Kentucky Derby winner? (ALDS) Can we add the Preakness (Pennant) and make it another Triple Crown (World Series 2016)? If we can raise the focus of the team and they keep their heart alive and keep practicing the basics that got them here, along with a little luck our way ... we got this. if not, we need to stop the bashing of the fighters on our team , who are doing their best to cope with the inescapable slumps that are as much a part of baseball as the bat, and celebrate that charge they are making wherever it ends , is their epitome of accomplishment as a great if not a storied team.
Honestly I think we got this, Clay is a ballbuster.
 

ricopetro6

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Offense is sputtering because the young guys have been swinging at pitches out of the strike zone. Add in the fact that they were slumping down the stretch and the end result has been a disaster.
 

BaseballJones

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Offense is sputtering because the young guys have been swinging at pitches out of the strike zone. Add in the fact that they were slumping down the stretch and the end result has been a disaster.
We aren't allowed to use "they were slumping down the stretch" as a reason for their current offensive struggles.
 

bob burda

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The Indians, also very young, right now only know playoff baseball as being a blast: you play at home, the fans cheer wildly, you catch every break, the umps call a few for you based on the crowd's emotion, the other side's super talented young guys press and look lost - and all of this makes you think you've caused it, and that you are that much more awesome....your ace-in-the-hole manager steals you a game and the next game you come out and curb stomp the opponent.

If they get a nice lead (2-4 runs) early at Fenway, the fun will continue, and that probably will do it for this series....but if they don't, let's just see how fun it is with crap starting pitching, the bullpen needing to win again, and the "pressure" shoe on the other foot. Something like getting one hit by Clay Buchholz through six (as in: "WTF?...Buchholz?"), or the Sox scoring some runs early can very quickly accomplish that turnaround in the vibe....and if that happens, this Indians team has NO idea what a menacing and hostile Fenway playoff crowd right on top of you looks and feels like.....none.

Here's an old lesson from '04 - I think the board understood that ALCS G7 in the toilet required the Sox to get an early lead to pull that evil crowd out of the game....they did, and won the only way I, at least, thought they could - in a rout. But even so, in the top of the 8th Pedro comes in and starts to get lit up, the crowd comes back into it and if feels like doom again, animating what had been a moribund Yankee team. So yes, this series may be over quickly, and none of us signed up for that, but it is maybe more likely that there is a long way to go here.







We all remember 2004
 

lexrageorge

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I can't blame Farrel for a single decision in these two games, but if they lose in the ALDS he should be gone as should Dombrowski.
Flawless - not to speak for the poster above, and it's not realistic - but DD's resume for the season is 4 prospects including a very good one for a closer who couldn't throw strikes at year end, 217 million for someone who craps his pants in big games, and the # 1 pitching prospect for a guy who is pitching mop up middle innings in the playoffs. The trend is due entirely to players developed by the Epstein and Cherington admins. Obviously you don't hand the keys to a guy and dump him after one season in which the playoffs were made, but this guy's first season was Don Sweeney-esque.
The first post has to be one of the most ridiculous Mazz-level hot takez outside the game threads. The 2nd post deserves some response, however.

Without Price and Kimbrel, the Sox maybe make the wild card, although I tend to doubt they even do that. Price's 230 innings would have to be made up by the rest of the starting staff and bullpen, and I doubt the replacements would have notched 228 K's in those innings. Dombrowski did not let Lester walk, and Price was the one guy available. Kimbrel has had his control issues, but he also has had stretches of very effective relief, and he and Koji deserve credit for stabilizing the Sox bullpen roles during most of the stretch run. And Pomeranz was not pitching in a mop-up role the other other night; his role was to stop the bleeding and keep the game in control until the offense could come around and hand the game over the bullpen. Which he did. We're probably one great Perez stop of a wild pitch from a tie game in the 8th, and Pomeranz would have been one of the heroes. And that #1 pitching prospect hasn't exactly set the world on fire since the trade.

For all the angst here, Game 1 was actually quite close: both teams had 10 hits and 3 HR's; just the Indians were able to claw out 1 more run. And we expected more, deservedly so, out of Porcello and the lineup. Game 2 was admittedly awful But the Indians are not a bad team by any means; they look like one of those teams that played under the radar most of the year. Sometimes you just get beat by a team that is actually much closer in talent level than the hot-takez fan base wants to believe.

History lesson: the Sox were down 2-0 to Oakland in the opening round of the 2003 playoffs. And were down 3-1 to Cleveland in the 2007 ALCS. The series is not over yet.
 
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Hagios

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Lots of hand wringing in this thread but at the end of it all there are just two facts.

Fact 1: All the small sample size stuff. Everyone wants to create a narrative for the playoffs (lack of character, tired young guys, lost their edge down the stretch etc.) but the only narrative is that even good teams lose two in a row all the time.

Fact 2: The curse of Larry Luchino. David Price is not a good postseason pitcher. I'm not sure why, but after 70 innings it doesn't seem like it's just luck anymore.
 

Toe Nash

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Yeah, a five-game series is the coinflip of all coinflips and one game was incredibly close. That's baseball.

But keys in losing both coinflips were:
-one of the best tactical managers in the league outmanaging a mediocre one, and
-a pitcher who has historically struggled in the most important games (and displayed IMO the entirely wrong attitude about it afterwards) struggling in an important game.

These were both potential weaknesses going into the series that have been magnified. The offense is another question.

Looking forward, you have to win three coinflips in a row, so no matter what the odds are against them. So it goes.
 

aminahyaquin

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The Indians, also very young, right now only know playoff baseball as being a blast: you play at home, the fans cheer wildly, you catch every break, the umps call a few for you based on the crowd's emotion, the other side's super talented young guys press and look lost - and all of this makes you think you've caused it, and that you are that much more awesome....your ace-in-the-hole manager steals you a game and the next game you come out and curb stomp the opponent.

If they get a nice lead (2-4 runs) early at Fenway, the fun will continue, and that probably will do it for this series....but if they don't, let's just see how fun it is with crap starting pitching, the bullpen needing to win again, and the "pressure" shoe on the other foot. Something like getting one hit by Clay Buchholz through six (as in: "WTF?...Buchholz?"), or the Sox scoring some runs early can very quickly accomplish that turnaround in the vibe....and if that happens, this Indians team has NO idea what a menacing and hostile Fenway playoff crowd right on top of you looks and feels like.....none.

Here's an old lesson from '04 - I think the board understood that ALCS G7 in the toilet required the Sox to get an early lead to pull that evil crowd out of the game....they did, and won the only way I, at least, thought they could - in a rout. But even so, in the top of the 8th Pedro comes in and starts to get lit up, the crowd comes back into it and if feels like doom again, animating what had been a moribund Yankee team. So yes, this series may be over quickly, and none of us signed up for that, but it is maybe more likely that there is a long way to go here.

We all remember 2004
From your lips to God's ears, Dude!! well said
 

lexrageorge

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Yeah, a five-game series is the coinflip of all coinflips and one game was incredibly close. That's baseball.

But keys in losing both coinflips were:
-one of the best tactical managers in the league outmanaging a mediocre one, and
-a pitcher who has historically struggled in the most important games (and displayed IMO the entirely wrong attitude about it afterwards) struggling in an important game.

These were both potential weaknesses going into the series that have been magnified. The offense is another question.

Looking forward, you have to win three coinflips in a row, so no matter what the odds are against them. So it goes.
When was Farrell outmanaged? So far, all of Farrell's moves have seemed quite sound.
 

TFisNEXT

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The Indians, also very young, right now only know playoff baseball as being a blast: you play at home, the fans cheer wildly, you catch every break, the umps call a few for you based on the crowd's emotion, the other side's super talented young guys press and look lost - and all of this makes you think you've caused it, and that you are that much more awesome....your ace-in-the-hole manager steals you a game and the next game you come out and curb stomp the opponent.

If they get a nice lead (2-4 runs) early at Fenway, the fun will continue, and that probably will do it for this series....but if they don't, let's just see how fun it is with crap starting pitching, the bullpen needing to win again, and the "pressure" shoe on the other foot. Something like getting one hit by Clay Buchholz through six (as in: "WTF?...Buchholz?"), or the Sox scoring some runs early can very quickly accomplish that turnaround in the vibe....and if that happens, this Indians team has NO idea what a menacing and hostile Fenway playoff crowd right on top of you looks and feels like.....none.

Here's an old lesson from '04 - I think the board understood that ALCS G7 in the toilet required the Sox to get an early lead to pull that evil crowd out of the game....they did, and won the only way I, at least, thought they could - in a rout. But even so, in the top of the 8th Pedro comes in and starts to get lit up, the crowd comes back into it and if feels like doom again, animating what had been a moribund Yankee team. So yes, this series may be over quickly, and none of us signed up for that, but it is maybe more likely that there is a long way to go here.







We all remember 2004
This is where I am at right now. Come back home and absolutely light Josh Tomlin up and see how much celebrating they are doing in the dugout in the 4th inning again. Get this series back to Cleveland after reminding these young players that the series doesn't always go like the first two games did and then let's see if they tighten up.

Kind of reminds me of 1999 if the Sox can turn it around. The Red Sox lost game 1 in a close extra inning game where Pedro had to leave early with the strained oblique muscle. Then we get routed in game 2 and it seems as if the Indians are completely invincible and they believe it too. But then the Red Sox fought back and absolutely curb stomped them in two games at Fenway with the offense scoring 32 runs in 2 games.

Then in game 5, Nomar Garciaparra hits a 2 run HR right off the bat in the top of the first to make the team believe (or at least us fans) that they can hit in Cleveland...then of course we get the epic Pedro relief appearance after the Red Sox were in danger of losing a slugfest.
 

capecodjr41

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Kind of reminds me of 1999 if the Sox can turn it around. The Red Sox lost game 1 in a close extra inning game where Pedro had to leave early with the strained oblique muscle. Then we get routed in game 2 and it seems as if the Indians are completely invincible and they believe it too. But then the Red Sox fought back and absolutely curb stomped them in two games at Fenway with the offense scoring 32 runs in 2 games.
Yes, was thinking the same thing, and that Indians team scored 1000 runs. Some of the offensive heroes for the Sox in that 3-win comeback were Brian Daubach, Troy O'leary, and John Valentin. If they can do it this lineup can certainly do it. The Sox lost game one of that series 3-2, then game two, 11-1 at the Jake. The next 3 games Boston scored 44 runs. Hopefully the Sox are watching DVDs of that series and perhaps others as we speak. Coupled with a patented "This is our fucking city" speech from Ortiz and they should be good to go for Sunday.
 

Tyrone Biggums

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When was Farrell outmanaged? So far, all of Farrell's moves have seemed quite sound.
I can't fault him at all this series. Certainly not a manager issue. Not his fault Porcello and Price crapped the bed. Just a really bad time for 2 bad starts. I still have all the faith in the world that this team will smack around Tomlin tomorrow afternoon.
 

Al Zarilla

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The Indians, also very young, right now only know playoff baseball as being a blast: you play at home, the fans cheer wildly, you catch every break, the umps call a few for you based on the crowd's emotion, the other side's super talented young guys press and look lost - and all of this makes you think you've caused it, and that you are that much more awesome....your ace-in-the-hole manager steals you a game and the next game you come out and curb stomp the opponent.
Maybe Tito does have a big edge over JF in the managing department in that he, with his personality, wit and loosely-goosey manner has his guys relaxed, enjoying themselves and therefore playing very well. Meanwhile, the young Red Sox are playing tighter than a drum, which kind of reflects their manager's personality. Who the hell knows, and this kind of thing can never be proven, but I'll take Tito over JF every single time.
 

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Maybe Tito does have a big edge over JF in the managing department in that he, with his personality, wit and loosely-goosey manner has his guys relaxed, enjoying themselves and therefore playing very well. Meanwhile, the young Red Sox are playing tighter than a drum, which kind of reflects their manager's personality. Who the hell knows, and this kind of thing can never be proven, but I'll take Tito over JF every single time.
I once heard Billy Beane talk about how people only reference a team's chemistry when teams are winning. That no one ever says, yeah, they suck, but they really get along. Similarly, how often do you hear references about teams staying relaxed while losing. It's a cause and effect thing, but you have it backwards. Let's see the Sox knock out Tomlin in the 2nd inning and then see who looks loose and relaxed.
 

54thMA

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Only because it's harder to win two games than to win just one.

Due to injuries, they will be facing two below average pitchers in game 3 and 4 if necessary. And they're at Fenway. They will be significantly favored to win game 3. Then if they win that one, they'll be significantly favored to win game 4. But I don't think they'd be favorites to win game 5 if it happens.
They're winning the next two games.

Game 5 will come down to how much Tito uses Miller/his bullpen in games 3 and 4.

I can't see Porcello pitching like he did in game 1, he's been too good this year.

This is what makes October baseball so special; some guys rise to the occasion, others wilt under the pressure.
 

Al Zarilla

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I once heard Billy Beane talk about how people only reference a team's chemistry when teams are winning. That no one ever says, yeah, they suck, but they really get along. Similarly, how often do you hear references about teams staying relaxed while losing. It's a cause and effect thing, but you have it backwards. Let's see the Sox knock out Tomlin in the 2nd inning and then see who looks loose and relaxed.
Yeah, and contrary to my theory, Farrell's Red Sox played just fine in 2013, regular and post season. So what the hell is going on out there? Red Sox were bad on all sides of the ball yesterday, right down to Pedey's error. I guess I have to look at it as this being just a collection of two frustrating games that are to be expected sometimes when a team like the Sox makes it to so many post seasons. The bad end of the results spectrum. You can't win them all.
They can still turn it around Sunday though.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Just throwing this out for discussion purposes...

Assuming Buchholz pitches well (i.e. the bullpen isn't overtaxed) and they win tomorrow night, should Farrell give any consideration to bringing Porcello back on short rest for Monday or just let it ride with Rodriguez?

Personally, I'd go with the regular rotation, but I've seen it suggested elsewhere that the short outing for Porcello leaves open the possibility of his coming back for Game 4, with Price able to start Game 5 on regular rest. If Price had looked strong and they'd lost a close one last night I might see it differently, but I actually have more confidence in ERod than Price at the moment and feel no urgency to give Price another chance in this series.

It isn't exactly a starting Schourek in Game 4 instead of Pedro scenario, but I can picture some columnist or radio doofus trying to turn it into one on Tuesday morning if they lose.
 

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Yeah, and contrary to my theory, Farrell's Red Sox played just fine in 2013, regular and post season. So what the hell is going on out there? Red Sox were bad on all sides of the ball yesterday, right down to Pedey's error. I guess I have to look at it as this being just a collection of two frustrating games that are to be expected sometimes when a team like the Sox makes it to so many post seasons. The bad end of the results spectrum. You can't win them all.
They can still turn it around Sunday though.
Yeah, it's easy to try to be an armchair psychiatrist--they're pressing because they want so badly to win for Papi, and no one is pressing more than him, is a theory--but we really have no idea what's going on, other than most of the team is young, and Porcello did something unexpected in Game 1. The Fenway crowd could be a huge boost tomorrow. A few clean innings from Clay wouldn't hurt either.
 

E5 Yaz

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Speaking of armchair psychiatry and Clay, if there's one manager who might know how to agitate the squirrel, it's Francona
 

Scott Cooper

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Obviously premature but if/when we get to Monday I'd definitely go Porcello with the Fenway splits and a Price in game 5
 

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I'm really torn, because if good Eddie shows up, I think he has a better chance of shutting down the Indians than anyone else. His stuff, when he's on, is so good. However, his first playoff start being an elimination game makes me concerned that Wild Eddie might show up instead. The safe play is Fenway Porcello, even on short rest. But I really don't know if that's the right move. Hopefully, it's a decision the team gets to make.
 

E5 Yaz

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I'm really torn, because if good Eddie shows up, I think he has a better chance of shutting down the Indians than anyone else. His stuff, when he's on, is so good. However, his first playoff start being an elimination game makes me concerned that Wild Eddie might show up instead. The safe play is Fenway Porcello, even on short rest. But I really don't know if that's the right move. Hopefully, it's a decision the team gets to make.
Galehouse over Kinder and Parnell
Lonborg (two days rest) over Santiago
Burton over (PH for) Willoughby
Sprowl over Lee
Hurst (three days rest) over Boyd
Schourek over Martinez

A mixed bag of results over the years
 

DeadlySplitter

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On the one hand, we should worry about game 5 if we get there and figure it out then.

On the other hand, Price has reinforced every bad thing about him in the postseason. Rick may not have a track record either, but I would think he goes back to quality start Rick just by not overthrowing.

Farrell could do some crazy managing tomorrow that changes everything too - remember we had no elimination games in 2013. unless we're way ahead I'm expecting Kimbrel for as many outs as he can get
 

Zososoxfan

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Why couldn't they start EdRo and have a short leash? Good EdRo is a real possibility and why would you not even give him the chance to see if he can carry them? If you're willing to burn Porcello in G4 on short rest, then maybe EdRo gives you 3-4 good innings and Rick can get you the rest of the way. I have to think that Pom plays a huge part in this calculation too. In other words, if Farrell thinks EdRo-Pom can get them to the bullpen in decent shape in G4, then you save Rick for G5 and have Price out of the pen for one or both games.
 

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Maybe Tito does have a big edge over JF in the managing department in that he, with his personality, wit and loosely-goosey manner has his guys relaxed, enjoying themselves and therefore playing very well. Meanwhile, the young Red Sox are playing tighter than a drum, which kind of reflects their manager's personality. Who the hell knows, and this kind of thing can never be proven, but I'll take Tito over JF every single time.
Yep, those two kids - David Ortiz and Dustin Pedroia - each have one hit and are a combined 2 / 16...

Fucking Farrell.
 

54thMA

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Hurst (three days rest) over Boyd
It was a gamble to pitch Hurst on three days rest, but he held up for awhile; wasn't the managers fault that Boyd was so upset he did not get the start that he got shitfaced in the clubhouse.

Him being hammered is why they had no choice but to go to Schiraldi and he got lit up...................it boggles my mind an organization as snake bitten as this one was able to break an 86 year old curse, let alone win two more WS titles.

How any of us who lived through the years prior to 2004 survived to see it is beyond my comprehension.

This team killed both of my grandfathers and two of my uncles prior to 2004 regardless, must have been a Hell of a view from heaven though...............
 

Al Zarilla

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Why couldn't they start EdRo and have a short leash? Good EdRo is a real possibility and why would you not even give him the chance to see if he can carry them? If you're willing to burn Porcello in G4 on short rest, then maybe EdRo gives you 3-4 good innings and Rick can get you the rest of the way. I have to think that Pom plays a huge part in this calculation too. In other words, if Farrell thinks EdRo-Pom can get them to the bullpen in decent shape in G4, then you save Rick for G5 and have Price out of the pen for one or both games.
The thing is, what's a short leash? If he puts two guys on, is that what the leash allows and do you pull him? Probably not, the best pitcher in the world can put on two baserunners. So then he gives up a home run and it's 3-0. What now? I don't believe in short leashes. I'd rather just go with the guy I think is the best pitcher considering all the circumstances of who's been going well, rest and matchups. Maybe that will be Eddie anyway.
 

BaseballJones

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Through two games....

Red Sox: 65 ab, 4 r, 13 h, 5 2b, 0 3b, 3 hr, 4 rbi, 4 bb, 22 k, .200/.257/.415/.673

Starting rotation: 7.2 ip, 12 h, 10 r, 10 er, 2 bb, 9 k, 11.73 era, 1.83 whip, 10.6 k/9

Bullpen: 8.1 ip, 7 h, 1 r, 0 er, 2 bb, 11 k, 0.00 era, 1.08 whip, 11.9 k/9

The bullpen obviously has been excellent. The starting pitching has been awful, and the lineup has been abysmal.
 

Byrdbrain

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The first post has to be one of the most ridiculous Mazz-level hot takez outside the game threads. The 2nd post deserves some response, however.

Without Price and Kimbrel, the Sox maybe make the wild card, although I tend to doubt they even do that. Price's 230 innings would have to be made up by the rest of the starting staff and bullpen, and I doubt the replacements would have notched 228 K's in those innings. Dombrowski did not let Lester walk, and Price was the one guy available. Kimbrel has had his control issues, but he also has had stretches of very effective relief, and he and Koji deserve credit for stabilizing the Sox bullpen roles during most of the stretch run. And Pomeranz was not pitching in a mop-up role the other other night; his role was to stop the bleeding and keep the game in control until the offense could come around and hand the game over the bullpen. Which he did. We're probably one great Perez stop of a wild pitch from a tie game in the 8th, and Pomeranz would have been one of the heroes. And that #1 pitching prospect hasn't exactly set the world on fire since the trade.

For all the angst here, Game 1 was actually quite close: both teams had 10 hits and 3 HR's; just the Indians were able to claw out 1 more run. And we expected more, deservedly so, out of Porcello and the lineup. Game 2 was admittedly awful But the Indians are not a bad team by any means; they look like one of those teams that played under the radar most of the year. Sometimes you just get beat by a team that is actually much closer in talent level than the hot-takez fan base wants to believe.

History lesson: the Sox were down 2-0 to Oakland in the opening round of the 2003 playoffs. And were down 3-1 to Cleveland in the 2007 ALCS. The series is not over yet.
This is an excellent response and frankly much more than both of those silly posts you quoted deserved.
 

The Gray Eagle

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This talk of pounding Tomlin tomorrow doesn't add up to me. I would be stunned if Francona allowed him to give up more than three runs (unless they are winning a blowout.)
Their whole bullpen will be available tomorrow and Miller will be ready to go for two or three innings. Their starter will be yanked at the first sign of real trouble and isn't going to make much difference in the game unless he throws a gem.
 

ricopetro6

New Member
Oct 25, 2013
1,908
This talk of pounding Tomlin tomorrow doesn't add up to me. I would be stunned if Francona allowed him to give up more than three runs (unless they are winning a blowout.)
Their whole bullpen will be available tomorrow and Miller will be ready to go for two or three innings. Their starter will be yanked at the first sign of real trouble and isn't going to make much difference in the game unless he throws a gem.
agree...people are hopeful though lol
 

glasspusher

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SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2005
9,973
Oakland California
Game 1 was close, and if had gone the other way there'd be more optimism. The bats aren't great but they came out swinging in Game 1, and putting Holt in the 2 spot was great.
I could see Porcello on a short leash in game 4, but I wouldn't want Price to start a game 5, certainly not on the road. I'd take my chances with Edro in a game 4 and Porcello in Game 5, or how about starting Edro in a potential game 5 with Price out of the pen?
 

DeadlySplitter

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SoSH Member
Oct 20, 2015
33,250
This talk of pounding Tomlin tomorrow doesn't add up to me. I would be stunned if Francona allowed him to give up more than three runs (unless they are winning a blowout.)
Their whole bullpen will be available tomorrow and Miller will be ready to go for two or three innings. Their starter will be yanked at the first sign of real trouble and isn't going to make much difference in the game unless he throws a gem.
how much can Tito really push his bullpen? game 4 could leave him high & dry.

that said I do expect him to go for the jugular.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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Dec 4, 2005
19,615
Portsmouth, NH
This talk of pounding Tomlin tomorrow doesn't add up to me. I would be stunned if Francona allowed him to give up more than three runs (unless they are winning a blowout.)
Their whole bullpen will be available tomorrow and Miller will be ready to go for two or three innings. Their starter will be yanked at the first sign of real trouble and isn't going to make much difference in the game unless he throws a gem.
Others have already chimed in, but that's the position Tito is in. If Tomlin gives up 3 or 4 in the second, it doesn't make much sense to burn Miller or Allen to come put out the fire, because then you burn them for game 4. The key is if Clay has kept them in check at that point. If they can stake themselves a 4 run lead early, I think Tito is best served letting Tomlin take the abuse and save his bullets for game 4. If Clay spits the bit, it's a different ball game.