Alpha Wolf: Eliot Wolf named de facto GM

Cellar-Door

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I thought Vrabel's interview with Tom Curran had an interesting Wolf tidbit, that might back up some of the "Wolf wasn't exactly able to do what he'd prefer, had some strong buffers/restraints"....
Which was he said "Eliot wasn't able to invest in personnel the way he wanted"
 

BringBackMo

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How much input *should* an NFL head coach have on drafts and free agent acquisitions? I honestly have zero idea and would like to hear what others think. I get why Vrabel would want to have a lot of say in personnel decisions, but outside of the most proven and experienced head coaches, just how much control over this area should a team give a coach?
 

naclone

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I thought Vrabel's interview with Tom Curran had an interesting Wolf tidbit, that might back up some of the "Wolf wasn't exactly able to do what he'd prefer, had some strong buffers/restraints"....
Which was he said "Eliot wasn't able to invest in personnel the way he wanted"
Interesting. It's also possible this just means that there were a lot of guys they went after in 2024 and they couldn't convert any of the offers. And this year with Drake established and an experienced HC in the fold they anticipate this year being able to invest in personnel the way they wanted to last year. (ie more guys say "yes"). If Wolf opened up the books to Vrabel and was like, "we offered this much to this guy and this much to that guy and they all turned us down" I can see Vrabel being aligned with the overall approach to the extent he's comfortable with Wolf's strategy and is focused on how to close more deals this offseason. I'm hoping its that anyway.
 

joe dokes

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How much input *should* an NFL head coach have on drafts and free agent acquisitions? I honestly have zero idea and would like to hear what others think. I get why Vrabel would want to have a lot of say in personnel decisions, but outside of the most proven and experienced head coaches, just how much control over this area should a team give a coach?
Generically speaking, coaches have schemes that require a fullback or no fullback or 4 tight ends or nose tackles or somesuch. At a minimum I'd expect that the HC has at least that much control.
 

Mystic Merlin

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I don’t think he’s talking about spending power on FA/trade candidates. For one thing, he’s gonna relate to the media that Kraft was cheap last year? Doubtful. Second, I got the impression that Wolf had a shitload to do in terms of trying to pivot football ops/personnel toward his preferred model, and filling out the coaching staff, that a personnel lead normally wouldn’t have on their plate in one offseason. With Vrabel here running the show, I think Wolf can adopt a more normal workload/focus more on typical personnel duties with the benefit of months of work in the can as part of their post-BB shift in player evaluation and structure.
 

BaseballJones

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I'd think a HC needs to be able to implement his system. That means different types of players. So if he plays a 3-4, he needs a nose tackle. That's different than a 4-3 defensive tackle. So he tells the GM what kinds of players he needs, maybe even offering some preferences (maybe some strong preferences), and giving his reasons why, but at the end of the day, the GM is the one who makes the call. Obviously there'll be friction if the GM gets players he (the GM) likes, but that don't fit what the HC wants to do.

The GM knows about the salary structure, does the negotiations, manages the cap, and could tell the HC, hey, we wanted to get one of these three guys you like that fit your system, but we couldn't get A or B (maybe they asked for too much $$, maybe there were character concerns, etc.) but we got C. And then it's the HC's job to make C work.
 

Cellar-Door

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How much input *should* an NFL head coach have on drafts and free agent acquisitions? I honestly have zero idea and would like to hear what others think. I get why Vrabel would want to have a lot of say in personnel decisions, but outside of the most proven and experienced head coaches, just how much control over this area should a team give a coach?
I think the SF model is fine... they discuss what Shanahan looks for in positions/scheme fits (so say what size/type edge, is he gonna want to play mostly zone or Man, zone or duo blocking, fullback?) like all staffs in the league they help final scouting/workouts and give opinions. then Lynch has control of the 90. He makes the picks, he signs the players and hands Shanahan the best 90 he can. Shanahan gets to make final cuts. Lynch manages stuff like PS- trades. signings, with input from Shanahan on what the team needs, injuries, etc .
 

Cellar-Door

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I don’t think he’s talking about spending power on FA/trade candidates. For one thing, he’s gonna relate to the media that Kraft was cheap last year? Doubtful. Second, I got the impression that Wolf had a shitload to do in terms of trying to pivot football ops/personnel toward his preferred model, and filling out the coaching staff, that a personnel lead normally wouldn’t have on their plate in one offseason. With Vrabel here running the show, I think Wolf can adopt a more normal workload/focus more on typical personnel duties with the benefit of months of work in the can as part of their post-BB shift in player evaluation and structure.
My general takeaway was... Wolf over the last few years has pushed to modernize the personnel department and BB wasn't interested, when Wolf took over, it was too late to do it before the FA/draft period. Add in that a bunch of FA and trade targets didn't want to take his money, and perhaps some disagreement internally on where/how to spend, he had to sit out FA more than maybe he would like. Overall not sure I took it as about 1 specific thing as a general "I don't think last offseason or the previous few seasons under Bill are representative of what Eliot would like to do moving forward, and Eliot and I are generally on the same page about what we'd like to do"
 

Justthetippett

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My general takeaway was... Wolf over the last few years has pushed to modernize the personnel department and BB wasn't interested, when Wolf took over, it was too late to do it before the FA/draft period. Add in that a bunch of FA and trade targets didn't want to take his money, and perhaps some disagreement internally on where/how to spend, he had to sit out FA more than maybe he would like. Overall not sure I took it as about 1 specific thing as a general "I don't think last offseason or the previous few seasons under Bill are representative of what Eliot would like to do moving forward, and Eliot and I are generally on the same page about what we'd like to do"
There is probably some truth to this, but how much did it affect who they picked in R2-R7, resigned and targeted in FA? Honestly, how hard is this? It's fun for Wolf and others to say they want to modernize the FO, but all the info collection and analysis eventually comes down to a decision...and they were not so stellar at that last year. Maybe it will change. They seem optimistic, which is why he is getting another crack at it.
 

Cellar-Door

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There is probably some truth to this, but how much did it affect who they picked in R2-R7, resigned and targeted in FA? Honestly, how hard is this? It's fun for Wolf and others to say they want to modernize the FO, but all the info collection and analysis eventually comes down to a decision...and they were not so stellar at that last year. Maybe it will change. They seem optimistic, which is why he is getting another crack at it.
I would guess re-signing is probably where coaches have the most sway. But also... people really wildly overrate how bad last offseason was in terms of decisions. Yeah looks like the 2nd round pick was a whiff, the rest... meh? 4-7 round picks as rookies aren't expected to do much and the 3rd rounder was hurt much of the year. In free agency they had basically no big misses, they might have small overpays for re-signings of top guys, and some cheap punt misses, but mostly... they just didn't spend at all once their targets (top WR, top OT) said no thanks we don't want your money, they tried to spend it on an extension to the best WR availble for trade and he said no thanks too.

THe offseason was bad, but less because they made a bunch of bad decisions and more that they sat it out and said "next year" which is a strategic choice (and one that either came from or was approved by ownership). This offseason should tell us much more about Wolf and his future here.
 

sezwho

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There is probably some truth to this, but how much did it affect who they picked in R2-R7, resigned and targeted in FA? Honestly, how hard is this? It's fun for Wolf and others to say they want to modernize the FO, but all the info collection and analysis eventually comes down to a decision...and they were not so stellar at that last year. Maybe it will change. They seem optimistic, which is why he is getting another crack at it.
Yeah, buying basically none of the Eliot media full court press. Now you sucked at your job of drafting AND signing players because you were so busy also sucking at getting coaches? Congratulations on having a famous dad.

He’s coming across like a snake, but Vrabel is a fing mongoose. I worry zero about Eliot the Moosh now.
 

Justthetippett

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I would guess re-signing is probably where coaches have the most sway. But also... people really wildly overrate how bad last offseason was in terms of decisions. Yeah looks like the 2nd round pick was a whiff, the rest... meh? 4-7 round picks as rookies aren't expected to do much and the 3rd rounder was hurt much of the year. In free agency they had basically no big misses, they might have small overpays for re-signings of top guys, and some cheap punt misses, but mostly... they just didn't spend at all once their targets (top WR, top OT) said no thanks we don't want your money, they tried to spend it on an extension to the best WR availble for trade and he said no thanks too.

THe offseason was bad, but less because they made a bunch of bad decisions and more that they sat it out and said "next year" which is a strategic choice (and one that either came from or was approved by ownership). This offseason should tell us much more about Wolf and his future here.
Maybe. I do think he gets judged more on this off-season. Right now a lot of people seem happy to move the goalposts on assessing him (not saying you are doing that). But now he, and his system, really has to show something.

If they said "next year" I'd be pretty pissed if I was Mayo. Lends some credibility to the theory they just wanted to avoid paying his option, and that they did not put him in position to succeed. Not a reason to keep him for all the other reasons he seemed unfit, but an odd overall strategy for which he really would not be responsible.
 

Cellar-Door

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Maybe. I do think he gets judged more on this off-season. Right now a lot of people seem happy to move the goalposts on assessing him (not saying you are doing that). But now he, and his system, really has to show something.

If they said "next year" I'd be pretty pissed if I was Mayo. Lends some credibility to the theory they just wanted to avoid paying his option, and that they did not put him in position to succeed. Not a reason to keep him for all the other reasons he seemed unfit, but an odd overall strategy for which he really would not be responsible.
I kind of feel like everybody involved got screwed...
Mayo wasn't HC ready, and they did not really build out the roster.
Wolf got dangled, was asked to do a bunch of the coach work in filling out the staff, and appeared to have a murky coalition type offseason with only 1 of his guys added, and again... they didn't spend which I doubt was solely his decision.
The coordinators were both 1st time and set up a scapegoats for an eventual failure, plus AVP in particular spent a bunch of time doing radio hits and press interviews to clean up HC mistakes.

It was just a terrible year where nobody was in position to succeed because the Krafts didn't really plan for Bill departing in 2023. Then rushed through a bridge year of internal promotions rather than a full search/analysis
 

cshea

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Maybe. I do think he gets judged more on this off-season. Right now a lot of people seem happy to move the goalposts on assessing him (not saying you are doing that). But now he, and his system, really has to show something.

If they said "next year" I'd be pretty pissed if I was Mayo. Lends some credibility to the theory they just wanted to avoid paying his option, and that they did not put him in position to succeed. Not a reason to keep him for all the other reasons he seemed unfit, but an odd overall strategy for which he really would not be responsible.
I'm sure Mayo is pissed but I'm not sure what the alternative was. They tried to spend some money but the high end free agents and trade targets turned them down. I think keeping the powder dry for the next offseason is the right approach. Spending extra on mid or low tier free agents just to spend seems like it would do more harm than good. If they did that, we'd probably be killing them for some of the contracts hampering their ability to spend this offseason.
 

sezwho

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I kind of feel like everybody involved got screwed...
Mayo wasn't HC ready, and they did not really build out the roster.
Wolf got dangled, was asked to do a bunch of the coach work in filling out the staff, and appeared to have a murky coalition type offseason with only 1 of his guys added, and again... they didn't spend which I doubt was solely his decision.
The coordinators were both 1st time and set up a scapegoats for an eventual failure, plus AVP in particular spent a bunch of time doing radio hits and press interviews to clean up HC mistakes.

It was just a terrible year where nobody was in position to succeed because the Krafts didn't really plan for Bill departing in 2023. Then rushed through a bridge year of internal promotions rather than a full search/analysis
I spite of Eliot receiving the brunt of my current frustration I believe all of this.
 

Justthetippett

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I'm sure Mayo is pissed but I'm not sure what the alternative was. They tried to spend some money but the high end free agents and trade targets turned them down. I think keeping the powder dry for the next offseason is the right approach. Spending extra on mid or low tier free agents just to spend seems like it would do more harm than good. If they did that, we'd probably be killing them for some of the contracts hampering their ability to spend this offseason.
This is fair. I'd rather have $120 million and cap space heading into the offseason than $90 and Calvin Ridley. But... eventually you are going to need to spend. This year is a good time.
 

Justthetippett

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I kind of feel like everybody involved got screwed...
Mayo wasn't HC ready, and they did not really build out the roster.
Wolf got dangled, was asked to do a bunch of the coach work in filling out the staff, and appeared to have a murky coalition type offseason with only 1 of his guys added, and again... they didn't spend which I doubt was solely his decision.
The coordinators were both 1st time and set up a scapegoats for an eventual failure, plus AVP in particular spent a bunch of time doing radio hits and press interviews to clean up HC mistakes.

It was just a terrible year where nobody was in position to succeed because the Krafts didn't really plan for Bill departing in 2023. Then rushed through a bridge year of internal promotions rather than a full search/analysis
It is incompetence at the top. They could have had Vrabel last year and didn't do it. Kind of lucked into him this year because he could very well have been hired by another team last cycle. Cobbled together a pu pu platter for 2024 that unsurprisingly did not work out. Cut bait and went back to who Kraft "knew all along" he should hire. To be honest, not so different from the Parcells-Carroll-Bill sequence, although we've potentially hung into Grier and the tempo is faster.
 

Jimbodandy

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It is incompetence at the top. They could have had Vrabel last year and didn't do it. Kind of lucked into him this year because he could very well have been hired by another team last cycle. Cobbled together a pu pu platter for 2024 that unsurprisingly did not work out. Cut bait and went back to who Kraft "knew all along" he should hire. To be honest, not so different from the Parcells-Carroll-Bill sequence, although we've potentially hung into Grier and the tempo is faster.
The "hanging onto Grier" thing probably isn't fair. Not that Wolf isn't Grier, but it does seem like Vrabel likely can bigfoot him. Otherwise agreed.

If Grier had stayed and been beholden to BFB, he might not have been the chaotic force that he was in Pete's clubhouse.
 

Super Nomario

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How much input *should* an NFL head coach have on drafts and free agent acquisitions? I honestly have zero idea and would like to hear what others think. I get why Vrabel would want to have a lot of say in personnel decisions, but outside of the most proven and experienced head coaches, just how much control over this area should a team give a coach?
There are no games to be coached in March and April, so 32 head coaches (and their assistants) are involved in evaluating draft prospects. How much authority they have and how heavily their opinions are weighed varies.

I think the SF model is fine... they discuss what Shanahan looks for in positions/scheme fits (so say what size/type edge, is he gonna want to play mostly zone or Man, zone or duo blocking, fullback?) like all staffs in the league they help final scouting/workouts and give opinions. then Lynch has control of the 90. He makes the picks, he signs the players and hands Shanahan the best 90 he can. Shanahan gets to make final cuts. Lynch manages stuff like PS- trades. signings, with input from Shanahan on what the team needs, injuries, etc .
I think you're underselling Shanahan's authority a little. I remember when the 49ers drafted Joe Williams even though he wasn't on their board the day before, just because Shanahan stumped for him.

The "hanging onto Grier" thing probably isn't fair. Not that Wolf isn't Grier, but it does seem like Vrabel likely can bigfoot him. Otherwise agreed.

If Grier had stayed and been beholden to BFB, he might not have been the chaotic force that he was in Pete's clubhouse.
Grier stayed on with the Pats through Belichick's first draft! He was apparently the only exec to meet with Lloyd Carr about Tom Brady.
 

Cellar-Door

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I think you're underselling Shanahan's authority a little. I remember when the 49ers drafted Joe Williams even though he wasn't on their board the day before, just because Shanahan stumped for him.
Perhaps a case of Shanahan pushing and Lynch giving it to him, but Breer and others have reported that Lynch has final say over the 90 in his contract.
 

Super Nomario

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Perhaps a case of Shanahan pushing and Lynch giving it to him, but Breer and others have reported that Lynch has final say over the 90 in his contract.
I'm aware, but there's a power dynamic there. Shanahan was the guy SF wanted. They hired Lynch because Shanahan kept rejecting the other GM candidates and Lynch was willing to work with them, even though Lynch had essentially zero qualifications. If push comes to shove, I'm pretty sure Shanahan is getting his way regardless of what the contracts say.
 
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I'm sure Mayo is pissed but I'm not sure what the alternative was. They tried to spend some money but the high end free agents and trade targets turned them down. I think keeping the powder dry for the next offseason is the right approach. Spending extra on mid or low tier free agents just to spend seems like it would do more harm than good. If they did that, we'd probably be killing them for some of the contracts hampering their ability to spend this offseason.
Well if they had signed a few more mid tier free agents they’d probably be closer to a competitive window even if they had 30M less to work with

They’re not going to be able to sign 120M (or even 90M) of guys in one offseason barring some crazy turn of events.

With the amount of cap space they have, I don’t think a couple of mid range or “low end but starter” types would impact their ability to do whatever they want this off-season.
 

Van Everyman

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I kind of feel like everybody involved got screwed...
Mayo wasn't HC ready, and they did not really build out the roster.
Wolf got dangled, was asked to do a bunch of the coach work in filling out the staff, and appeared to have a murky coalition type offseason with only 1 of his guys added, and again... they didn't spend which I doubt was solely his decision.
The coordinators were both 1st time and set up a scapegoats for an eventual failure, plus AVP in particular spent a bunch of time doing radio hits and press interviews to clean up HC mistakes.

It was just a terrible year where nobody was in position to succeed because the Krafts didn't really plan for Bill departing in 2023. Then rushed through a bridge year of internal promotions rather than a full search/analysis
I've ribbed you over the process stuff but I agree with most of this. The one thing I would just say: I give these guys some rope because I imagine moving on from two GOATs must be really, really hard. Some of the stuff we criticize Kraft for--"Wanting my team back," "The Coach was a pain the tush," etc.--seems lousy in a vacuum but kind of makes sense if you imagine it building slowly but surely over two decades.

And yeah, we also rip the whole "Patriot Way" thing but I also imagine some of last year's quasi-stasis/bridge year/internal promotions instead of a full search/analysis was also them trying to figure out how much of what made the team special was the culture they'd built up over the years versus two guys (Narrator: "It was mostly two guys").

So the results were really bad -- in some ways, not that dissimilar from the year after Tom left. I didn't lose my mind in 2020 because I assumed moving on from Brady would be really difficult in all likelihood and expose all sorts of things about the team that he had been holding together. Which it did. And the same thing happened in 2024 once Bill was finally gone.

The good news is that, regardless of the messy way they got here and what role Wolf does or doesn't play, the team now has 1) a QB for the future, 2) an experienced HC at the top of the pecking order, 3) a high draft pick and 4) a metric shit ton of cap space. None of which guarantees success, but hopefully sets them up for some.
 

Jimbodandy

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Well if they had signed a few more mid tier free agents they’d probably be closer to a competitive window even if they had 30M less to work with

They’re not going to be able to sign 120M (or even 90M) of guys in one offseason barring some crazy turn of events.

With the amount of cap space they have, I don’t think a couple of mid range or “low end but starter” types would impact their ability to do whatever they want this off-season.
We're gonna have a pretty good test of the "Kraft is a cheapo" theory this offseason. Looking forward to the results.
 

sezwho

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We're gonna have a pretty good test of the "Kraft is a cheapo" theory this offseason. Looking forward to the results.
If he is again sitting on the checkbook and the roster is again desolate then seeing the HoF in his lifetime will require a ticket.

I think he should be in, and ultimately will be, but the ‘cheap’ stuff is a runaway narrative he could correct.

Im saying he does green light.

Conspiracy theory here - I wonder if there was some holding back on money that Mayo agreed to with promise of security.
 
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I don't think Kraft is cheap. That idea is so overblown around New England. And I REALLY don't think the lack of spending last year is a good metric for whether or not he is. I didn't want them "burning through cash" in 2024. They were going to SUCK no matter what, so if that meant being careful with $$$ except for a case here or there, like backing up the Brinks for Calvin Ridley, then that was fine with me. In my view, it would have been a waste to spend big last year - not because of how it went, but because of how anyone with their eyes on the overall roster knew it was likely to go. Yes, it can be argued that a team needs to gradually build up a roster, and sign big-time FAs year by year, but wasn't it pretty much a no-brainer that they were going to be shitty/rebuilding regardless, so why not take a year off from going hog-wild and then really see where we are now?
 
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We're gonna have a pretty good test of the "Kraft is a cheapo" theory this offseason. Looking forward to the results.
You realize that the “Kraft is cheap” critiques are not aimed at salary cap space, yes?

I think complaints about the amount of unused cap space last year are more directed at Wolf than Kraft and it’s not a matter of cheapness as much as either an obsession with value (not overpaying) or a philosophical issue (don’t pay external guys, draft and develop then spend your money on re-signing your own guys)
 

sezwho

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You realize that the “Kraft is cheap” critiques are not aimed at salary cap space, yes?

I think complaints about the amount of unused cap space last year are more directed at Wolf than Kraft and it’s not a matter of cheapness as much as either an obsession with value (not overpaying) or a philosophical issue (don’t pay external guys, draft and develop then spend your money on re-signing your own guys)
The critiques are leveled at Kraft both for being cheap on roster and for being cheap with the organizational infrastructure and coaching.

In theory both can be explained significantly by BB (he made choices for the former and covered up need for the latter) but things look a little threadbare both on the field and off.
 

lexrageorge

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You realize that the “Kraft is cheap” critiques are not aimed at salary cap space, yes?

I think complaints about the amount of unused cap space last year are more directed at Wolf than Kraft and it’s not a matter of cheapness as much as either an obsession with value (not overpaying) or a philosophical issue (don’t pay external guys, draft and develop then spend your money on re-signing your own guys)
Again, the Pats did court some big name free agents early on - they just chose to sign elsewhere. Maye hadn't been drafted yet, and nobody knew how Mayo was going turn out.

Wolf also made the conscious decision to not overpay for the second tier of free agents, few (if any) of whom ended up being difference makers for their teams anyway. It's already clear that the team will take a different approach this offseason.
 
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Again, the Pats did court some big name free agents early on - they just chose to sign elsewhere. Maye hadn't been drafted yet, and nobody knew how Mayo was going turn out.

Wolf also made the conscious decision to not overpay for the second tier of free agents, few (if any) of whom ended up being difference makers for their teams anyway. It's already clear that the team will take a different approach this offseason.
I’m confused as to what this has to do with Kraft or what is “clear” and “different” this year?

The first point you made, nobody wanted their money, isn’t part of their approach so I don’t know how you can say they (Wolf et al) can clearly operate differently at the top of the market

As for the second, being willing to overpay for non difference makers, I do believe they will do that as they’re going to have to spend some money and the vast majority of free agents at the key positions are not difference makers. So a haul of guys like Matt Peart, Demarcus Robinson, Morgan Fox, Dan Brunskill. Those types.

I’m not sure who you would consider second tier, non difference making guys where this new and different approach will be applied by Wolf. Perhaps you could suggest some names of guys who fit that criteria
 

lexrageorge

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I’m not sure who you would consider second tier, non difference making guys where this new and different approach will be applied by Wolf. Perhaps you could suggest some names of guys who fit that criteria
Others noted some key targets in the FA thread. Some of those players are indeed upgrades over their current roster, and so by definition become difference makers for this team.
 

8slim

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The one aspect of Kraft being cheap that I buy is his lack of attention to the physical infrastructure that helps players. While he was pouring money into Patriot Place, and renovating revenue-generating parts of Gillette, he let the weight room and various other player-centric facilities become completely outdated. That should have never happened.

I do wonder if that was also a mix of Tom working out on his own, and BB having a general mindset of "we don't need all that fancy shit".
 

cshea

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The one aspect of Kraft being cheap that I buy is his lack of attention to the physical infrastructure that helps players. While he was pouring money into Patriot Place, and renovating revenue-generating parts of Gillette, he let the weight room and various other player-centric facilities become completely outdated. That should have never happened.

I do wonder if that was also a mix of Tom working out on his own, and BB having a general mindset of "we don't need all that fancy shit".
Or "we're going to the AFC Title game every year and winning Super Bowls, does the weight room really matter?"
 

rodderick

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The one aspect of Kraft being cheap that I buy is his lack of attention to the physical infrastructure that helps players. While he was pouring money into Patriot Place, and renovating revenue-generating parts of Gillette, he let the weight room and various other player-centric facilities become completely outdated. That should have never happened.

I do wonder if that was also a mix of Tom working out on his own, and BB having a general mindset of "we don't need all that fancy shit".
BB was super over the top in his praise for the Raiders' facilities ("the Taj Mahal"), so I find it hard to believe he didn't care about the state the Patriots' were in.
 

Bigdogx

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Or "we're going to the AFC Title game every year and winning Super Bowls, does the weight room really matter?"
It seems to for the players of the league who created these rankings. Seems to have lit a bit of a fire under ownership who just announced building a new practice facility which is good. The place is now heading towards 3 decades old and let's face it, it wasn't the cats meow when it first opened either. Improvements need to be made to keep up, players today absolutely do mind if the stadium and the facilities they use are sub par compared to others.
 

cshea

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It seems to for the players of the league who created these rankings. Seems to have lit a bit of a fire under ownership who just announced building a new practice facility which is good. The place is now heading towards 3 decades old and let's face it, it wasn't the cats meow when it first opened either. Improvements need to be made to keep up, players today absolutely do mind if the stadium and the facilities they use are sub par compared to others.
I understand that but I think it's easy to overlook something like the quality of the weight room when you're at the top of the league every year and winning championships. It didn't become an issue until they started sucking. I certainly think he should've been more proactive in upgrading everything but I can see how it feel by the wayside over two decades.
 

Bigdogx

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Jul 21, 2020
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I understand that but I think it's easy to overlook something like the quality of the weight room when you're at the top of the league every year and winning championships. It didn't become an issue until they started sucking. I certainly think he should've been more proactive in upgrading everything but I can see how it feel by the wayside over two decades.
No not correct, it become an issue when they let the players release these rankings which have only been done for what, 2 or 3 seasons now? It just so happened to coincide with their downward decline!
 

Eric Fernsten's Disco Mustache

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So, funny story: I drive a car that is legally old enough to vote.

It runs fine, is easy to maintain, and gets me everyone I want to go. Yes, I'm slower than most other people getting up to speed when merging on the highway, but who's in all that big a rush anyway?

Once in a while I get into a car that's less than five years old and go "Holy cow-- look at all this stuff!" It's really incredible what they've done with cameras and technology and all.

I guess what I'm saying is I don't really hold it against Bob if the weight room got a little dated and he didn't notice or do much about it. Especially if Belichick wasn't saying it was a problem.

Then people started pointing it out, and lo and behold now he's doing something.

Come to think of it, it might be time for me to get a new car, too.
 

jsinger121

@jsinger121
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Jul 25, 2005
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BB was super over the top in his praise for the Raiders' facilities ("the Taj Mahal"), so I find it hard to believe he didn't care about the state the Patriots' were in.
He started to care the second Brady walked out the door and the team starting to suck.
 

sezwho

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Jul 20, 2005
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I understand that but I think it's easy to overlook something like the quality of the weight room when you're at the top of the league every year and winning championships. It didn't become an issue until they started sucking. I certainly think he should've been more proactive in upgrading everything but I can see how it feel by the wayside over two decades.
The thing that complicates this further is the guy who had earned Carte Blanche over a historical run was the one you trusted to keep the train on the tracks. What happens when he’s the problem?

Bill came to power when watching tape meant literal reel to reel. For all the $&&@“ he took, I think it was Patricia who convinced Bill to use technology as a way to be more efficient.

How many other pockets of ‘this is how we did it in 2000’ are there? Scouts? Analytics? Strength? Medical?

It’s not even about blaming at this point it’s about identifying and solving. Go Vrabel!
 

Jimbodandy

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Jan 31, 2006
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The thing that complicates this further is the guy who had earned Carte Blanche over a historical run was the one you trusted to keep the train on the tracks. What happens when he’s the problem?

Bill came to power when watching tape meant literal reel to reel. For all the $&&@“ he took, I think it was Patricia who convinced Bill to use technology as a way to be more efficient.

How many other pockets of ‘this is how we did it in 2000’ are there? Scouts? Analytics? Strength? Medical?

It’s not even about blaming at this point it’s about identifying and solving. Go Vrabel!
A guy that I worked for briefly had been a tech guy at Foxboro for a while. He loved Bill and said that he had a fantastic sense of humor. But Bill didn't really love him, because Bill hated technology so much that it was like the other end of the spectrum from his "Army-Notre Dame 1963 fake punt in the snow" talks. Hated it so much that he threw up in his mouth.