Anthony Davis: No Loyalty
- Thread starter HomeRunBaker
- Start date
Even then I’m guessing Demps is only going to use this as leverage for a starting position in the summer. He’s playing poker with all the chips while Magic is trying to get even at 5pm while having to make it home for dinner.
Is there a path for the Lakers to trade for Wall, then immediately turn around and acquire Davis?
My gut says the cap math on that simply can’t work. But if it does, it makes sense for all concerned. The Zards might give up an unprotected #1 in 2019 or 2020 to get out of Wall’s supermax — which would (I think) give them room to sign a max FA next summer to pair with Beal and Porter, who are under contract through 2020-21. The Pelicans aren’t going to get a better deal for AD than a lottery pick and two of Ball/Ingram/Kuzma. And the Lakers will gladly pay the luxury tax on that exorbitant payroll as the price of assembling their superteam.
It could work if Caldwell-Pope agrees to be traded. Rondo/Ball to one team and Caldwell-Pope/Ingram to the other, plus Kuzma and Zubac to NO.
The complaint in the article is that LA can’t afford to add Hart & Zubac due to too many players going out, but the Pelicans do have small expiring that they can include to make the numbers work and restock the cruft end of the LA roster...
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ydeykujx
KCP and Beasley work as Wall fodder, the question is whether or not the picks they get from DC are enough of a sweetener. Outlined as a three way deal ESPN says that this works, the LA super team isn’t terribly super, but if the Wiz are kicking in a couple of picks to the fold and the Pelicans are getting their four #1s...
The TradeID link isn’t working for me on mobile, so, in short...
To Washington: KCP and Beasley
To LA: Wall, Davis, and Hill
To New Orleans: Rondo, Stephenson, Ball, Ingram, Kuzma, Ingram, Hart, and Zubac
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So, in this deal, NO is passing on multiple 1st round picks in exchange for unloading Hill? The offers that we've heard so far have all of those players + 2 1sts, and apparently NO wants more than 2 1sts. Also not sure why LA does this--taking Wall is a high price for keeping your 1st rounders.
I think Nighthob was just matching salaries. Yes, there would have to be multiple 1st round picks to NO.
Interesting you bring up Wall because as you mentioned, LAL might be the only team left in the NBA that is willing to trade for his contract.
However, for some reason, 'Zards owner has been extremely vocal about not breaking up the "big 3". And yes, we all know that means the Wiz aren't going to be contending for a championship any time in the near future. I wonder if it has anything to do with finances because Leonsis seems perfectly fine for his team to be a borderline playoff team rather than the possibility of bottoming out.
I've said a couple of times before but it must suck to be a fan of a team that isn't trying to win a championship.
Chris Haynes is reporting that AD is healthy and available to play but management elected to sit him last night vs. Indiana.
Woj: Pels are waiting on Lakers to overwhelm them w/ an historic haul of picks. To Nola, that means Lakers offering 4 first-round and second-round picks as part of a Davis package. Pels want to be compensated - perhaps even overcompensated - to even consider a deal with LA now.
Romona Shelburne: Allow me to capitalize the key wording in
@wojespn latest update: “Pels want to be compensated - perhaps even overcompensated - TO EVEN CONSIDER- a deal with LA now.”
ESPN trade machine doesn’t have first round picks, we were discussing a scenario in which Washington was paying two first round picks to get rid of Wall’s contract so that LA had four picks to send to the Pelicans. I was simply listing the player salaries involved since ESPN’s trade machine wasn’t displaying the deal on my phone.
I think the Lakers will go all in and meet the picks demand. They essentially need to try even if its mortgaging the future. They have to be all in on maximizing Lebron's time there.
This works on Trade Machine
NO gets Rondo, Beasley, Stevenson, Ball, Ingram, Kuzma, Wiz unprotected 1, Wiz 2, two Lakers unprotected 1s.
Lakers get AD, Wall and Bryant from the Wiz, and some guys named Jackson and Williams from NO to clear roster spots.
Wiz get KCP and Hill and a Lakers 1st from like seven years from now
Do the Wizards want to divorce Wall that badly? Do they think Durant wants to play in his home area? Does Lakers GM LeBron James want to play with Wall, and preclude bringing in another top FA until he's 38?
NO gets Rondo, Beasley, Stevenson, Ball, Ingram, Kuzma, Wiz unprotected 1, Wiz 2, two Lakers unprotected 1s.
Lakers get AD, Wall and Bryant from the Wiz, and some guys named Jackson and Williams from NO to clear roster spots.
Wiz get KCP and Hill and a Lakers 1st from like seven years from now
Do the Wizards want to divorce Wall that badly? Do they think Durant wants to play in his home area? Does Lakers GM LeBron James want to play with Wall, and preclude bringing in another top FA until he's 38?
Lakers picks are going to be relatively worthless if Davis goes there. If the Celtics can't get Davis, maybe Ainge can find a way to fleece teams looking for some of their assets.
What value are the Lakers' first round picks to the Pels if they send AD to LA?
Also, you have to put a year in between them under the Stepien Rule, so they could get 2019, 2021, 2023 and 2025. 2019 and 2021 would probably be in the 20s. If AD is still in LA post-LeBron, they'll get some one else, so those 2023 and 2025 picks could be garbage too.
Also, you have to put a year in between them under the Stepien Rule, so they could get 2019, 2021, 2023 and 2025. 2019 and 2021 would probably be in the 20s. If AD is still in LA post-LeBron, they'll get some one else, so those 2023 and 2025 picks could be garbage too.
It would be great if LA went and made all these trades, taking on bad contracts in the process for these picks, and the Pelicans were like, "eh, we changed our minds - not trading him until the summer".
Or, even better, would be them telling Magic to get the SAC/MEM picks from Ainge
Is there a PHO, LAL, NOP deal that could work?
LAL - AD + Ryan Anderson
PHO - Ball + Solomon Hill + Beasley
NOP - Kuzma, Ingram, Zubac, Josh Jackson, KCP, picks
PHO throws in a pick (2 picks?) to upgrade from Jackson to Ball while shedding a bunch of money in Anderson.
LAL rolls out Rondo, Hart, James, Anderson, AD. Ugh?
LAL - AD + Ryan Anderson
PHO - Ball + Solomon Hill + Beasley
NOP - Kuzma, Ingram, Zubac, Josh Jackson, KCP, picks
PHO throws in a pick (2 picks?) to upgrade from Jackson to Ball while shedding a bunch of money in Anderson.
LAL rolls out Rondo, Hart, James, Anderson, AD. Ugh?
Honestly I would really like to see the Wall scenario come to pass and the SuperLakers be around to be second fiddle to the Warriors.It would be great if LA went and made all these trades, taking on bad contracts in the process for these picks, and the Pelicans were like, "eh, we changed our minds - not trading him until the summer".
Or, even better, would be them telling Magic to get the SAC/MEM picks from Ainge
Probably not since it takes away the Pelicans' ability to cash Ball in for further first round picks.
Serious question: do people really think that Lonzo is an upgrade from Josh Jackson either currently or ceiling-wise? I haven't seen any PHO games this year but JJ seems have improved numbers from last year.
As mentioned above, there are no indications that WAS wants to trade Wall. There was a rumour in December that LAL were offering package around Ball for Wall (LAL would include other pieces, such as Kuzma or Ingram) but no one thought that would go anywhere. Why would WAS all of a sudden decide to jettison Wall for nothing plus have to throw in draft picks?
This reminds me that my big worry if the C's were to swing a deal for AD is for him to do a Kawhi-style protest and sit all year to protect his asset for when he hits free agency.
I keep seeing Toronto and Milwaukee as threats to get AD, I don't see any way either team could build a package for him.
Toronto has OG as a guy you can dream on as a secondary asset in a deal, Van Vleet is a good young role player but doesn't seem like a rebuild piece. Siakam is a good player, but he turns 25 in two months and he's probably close to his ceiling now. He doesn't feel like the lead asset in a superstar deal to me. Toronto has no extra firsts coming in from other teams and can't deal their own until 2021 since they owe this years to the Spurs.
Milwaukee is an even longer shot. They have no young players with upside unless you believe in Thon Maker. Bledsoe and Middleton are expiring deals since Middleton has an opt out. They have no extra firsts coming in and since the pick they owe Phoenix this year won't convey, they can't trade a 1st round pick until 2024 at the earliest since they owe another in between to Cleveland.
Think you can cease worrying AD ends up in Milwaukee. Toronto doesn't seem likely either unless Demps just loves Siakam.
That is unlikely to happen, since he has a contract to honor and it would lead to very substantial litigation. However, AD is of course under no obligation to resign and that is obviously the major risk in the deal. One and done as a return for substantial assets would blow up 5 years of getting the Celtics to their current favorable position.
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AD wants to play now. It was the front office that decided to sit him. Seems complete opposite of the Kawhi situation .
This is amazing. I also highly recommend the commenters of Lakers' blogs like Silver Screen and Roll--they alternate between pissed that NO won't give them AD, and being ready to roll with the "amazing young core" of Lonzo and Ingram. Really good stuff.
Agree, and this is why I wouldn't be worried about trading for him.
His desire to play also explains why he (through his reps) is being such a massive tool right now with the media leaks. Getting traded to the Lakers (or a godfather offer from Toronto) is the only way he gets to play again this year. Pels have made that very clear.
LOL.
Damn those Warriors for drafting incredibly well and clearing cap for a future HOFer! Not fair!
Entitled Lakers fans are the worst. We suck so everyone needs to help us out!
Have they? If Davis is healthy, I think it would be a big disservice to their fans, and to AD to sit him for the rest of the year. That would be the sort of thing the league should intervene in. One could make the argument that they would be hurting AD's career and his future earning potential by not letting him play.
I agree there are those reasons not to do it, but the Pelicans have made it clear that this is their plan.
This is the large majority of NBA organizations though. We are really spoiled as Boston fans. I suppose the best local comp is the Bruins under Jacobs. With so much revenue coming in the only thing that you DON'T want to be in this league is a cellar dweller with your seats half empty and the ones filled half given away. For this reason I'd be a) the Wizard openly bottom out, b) shocked if the Wizards gave up an Unprotected #1 in a year they are bottoming out, and c) would not be mildly surprised if Silver blocked such a Stepien-like move.
One silver lining... no matter what happens, the Ball family will likely never be on a legit contender.
New Orleans NBC sports anchor/reporter Fletcher Mackel:
Many in Pelicans hierarchy really like Lonzo. I know many envision (d) he and Jrue as an excellent backcourt.
But I’m told LaVar has wrecked any chance of Lonzo being part of potential Lakers trade with NOLA.
Pelicans “want no part of the Ball circus.”
There were no realistic deals for Wall anyway. This is being discussed in Game Thread.
http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?threads/2018-nba-game-thread.25214/page-54
How do they plan on doing that? I’d have to think that he’d file a grievance over that, especially in the case of such a bald announcement.
Jackson still sucks at basketball. Ball has some useful skills.
Lonzo looks like he'll be a solid starter at worst with a slim chance of being something significantly better. Jackson at least now looks like the type that might not get a second contract. Given their ages I don't think either can be written off but as of today I think Jackson has significantly less value than Ball and Phoenix would have to chip in a protected pick to get him.
He tore his Achilles when falling at home? Maybe I’m being cynical, but does that happen?
Not sure filing a grievance would go so great for him. He's already been fined $50K (iirc) for making a public trade request. The NBA has a lot of latitude that they're not currently using to come down harder on him, Klutch, and LeBron. They're not using that ability right now for the reasons everyone knows, but that would change if Davis decided to get legalistic about this. He's treading on thin ice right now as it is.
Normally I'd be skeptical but he already had an existing injury and infection in the area.
What rights does Davis have here? He is under contract to the New Orleans Pelicans.This goes back to precedent and the PA has never filed a grievance on one of its players being shut down in the past. Nuthingburger here imho.
You may be right. I guess this is usually a coverup for an injury suffered while doing something that was in violation of the contract terms (I recall something about Jeff Kent racing dirt bikes), but I guess that’s not likely given his other injury.
Lakers are out says the LAT
https://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/la-sp-lakers-anthony-davis-trade-talks-20190205-story.html
He wasn't getting traded either way because of the trade kicker and the cap rules. As to putting asses in seats, they're 8th worst already, but still at over 85% despite how bad they are. Even the Suns are at 80%; the Cavs sell out and the Wolves are at 80%. There's no half full arenas in the NBA. The lowest attendance is Detroit at 75%. Their gate receipts are only 3% of their valuation at $31M. They could literally have no one show up and save money. That's not to say they should throw in an unprotected first, but they aren't going to let attendance numbers squash a deal based on economics, imo.
http://www.espn.com/nba/attendance/_/sort/homePct/order/false
https://www.forbes.com/sites/baileybrautigan/2016/03/21/where-all-that-money-comes-from-nba-team-valuations-visualized/#7b22fc1c444f