Best Celtics Place in NBA History

[Pablo's TB Lover]

I am 100% on your team here. I think the greats love him because he was maniacal about perfecting the little things of the craft (footwork etc.) and was also known as an incredibly hard worker.
But that also conveniently forgets the selfishness, the pouting during games, just outright quitting during some important playoff games and how destructive he was as a locker room presence for most of his career. The player that Kobe imparted the most of his wisdom/ideas on being a leader and how to act in locker rooms is Kyrie Irving. Just think about that and I think you get a pretty clear idea of how warped Kobe’s ideas were on personal/professional relationships

Kobe worshipped at the alter of Jordan. He combined the desire for hard work with rehearsing every bit of his public persona for the purpose of selling shoes and filling in the vacant spot Jordan had occupied in the zeitgeist. He also took it to heart that "Republicans buy shoes too" statement and played everything down the middle with the media, although based on the Colorado case Kobe had some serious demons. Everything he did was to craft that façade and make people overlook his destructive antics on the court and locker room by blowing off the other side as "soft" and saying Kobe just wants it more than they do. He's Allen Iverson with a better publicist. (Tangent: In a win or go home game, I'd rather have Iverson on my side TBH. Kobe needed serious supporting casts to get his championships, while Iverson dragged some misfit toys to the Finals. Even the "names" on Iverson's team were a washed Toni Kukoc and Dikembe Mutombo years past his prime.)

 

[Eddie Jurak]

Celtic Rushmore: Russell, Havlicek, Bird, Pierce, Tatum (if he stays in Boston long term). That's 5 but the Celtics franchise is great enough to merit that.

That's the best Celtic player in every era where the Celtics didn't suck.

 

[jmcc5400]

An aside: think about those 76ers teams of the early 80s.

Lost to LA in the NBA finals.
Lost to Boston in the EC finals (after holding a 3-1 lead).
Lost to LA in the NBA finals.
Won NBA finals.
Lost in first round.
Lost to Boston in EC finals.

Tough sledding for Dr J, who, as great as he was, wasn’t in the Bird/Magic class, nor did he have quite the same level of supporting cast. Moses was an all time great and Barkley arrived at the end but as great as those teams were, they just didn’t quite have enough to get past Boston and LA.

You actually have to go back a few more years - lost in finals in 1977, conference finals in 1978 and second round in 1979,

 

[lexrageorge]

Thinking about how good those Lakers, Celitcs, Sixers, and Pistons teams were, it makes me wonder about the Jordan Bulls.

They were obviously a historically great team, and there was a ton of talent in that Era, but the talent wasn't that concentrated. Who were their greatest rivals? The one star Knicks? The two star and not much else JAzz?

It's a shame they never met the Rockets in the finals. The Rockets weren't even close to as good as the Bulls, but 94-95 Hakeem would have been a huge problem for those Bulls teams.

That's always been one "criticism" of those Bulls teams, but part of that is a misperception. They did have to beat some very good to excellent teams to win those titles; just that there were few consistently excellent teams from year to year that could be perceived as the Bulls chief rival a-la Celtics-Sixers.

Their first title was impressive, sweeping the defending champion Pistons and then beating a 58-win Lakers team that still had an excellent Magic and James Worthy and a legit 3rd banana in Byron Scott. But that Pistons team was starting to show its age, and nobody would confuse that Lakers team with the great teams of the 1980's. Still, the Pistons up to that time had the Bulls number. The ECF was mostly drek the subsequent 2 seasons. Even that 60-win Knicks team in 1992 was shallow. But the Blazers (Drexler) and Suns (Charles) were really good teams coming off of excellent seasons.

The Rockets had faded by 1996, and agree that showdown between the Bulls and Rockets would have been epic viewing at that time. But that Bulls team did have to get through Shaq/Penny and the 60-win Magic, a team that beat them convincingly the prior season even though Jordan had returned. The ECF was non-competitive in 1997, but the Pacers were a tough out in 1998. And those Jazz teams the Bulls beat in the Finals were also really good.

Then Jordan retires and you have the rise of the Duncan Spurs and the Lakers w/ Kobe, Shaq, and the Refs.

 

[Auger34]

Kobe worshipped at the alter of Jordan. He combined the desire for hard work with rehearsing every bit of his public persona for the purpose of selling shoes and filling in the vacant spot Jordan had occupied in the zeitgeist. He also took it to heart that "Republicans buy shoes too" statement and played everything down the middle with the media, although based on the Colorado case Kobe had some serious demons. Everything he did was to craft that façade and make people overlook his destructive antics on the court and locker room by blowing off the other side as "soft" and saying Kobe just wants it more than they do. He's Allen Iverson with a better publicist. (Tangent: In a win or go home game, I'd rather have Iverson on my side TBH. Kobe needed serious supporting casts to get his championships, while Iverson dragged some misfit toys to the Finals. Even the "names" on Iverson's team were a washed Toni Kukoc and Dikembe Mutombo years past his prime.)

Kobe is store brand knock off Jordan. Everything about his personality just felt phony and trying to do an MJ impersonation (including his attempt at doing the MJ tongue out celebration by doing that weird bottom jaw jut out thing).

You’re exactly right about the “soft” thing too. What’s hilarious about that is I can’t think of anything more “soft” than throwing a tantrum during a playoff game and deciding you’re not going to shoot because your feelings were hurt

 

[Euclis20]

Thinking about how good those Lakers, Celitcs, Sixers, and Pistons teams were, it makes me wonder about the Jordan Bulls.

They were obviously a historically great team, and there was a ton of talent in that Era, but the talent wasn't that concentrated. Who were their greatest rivals? The one star Knicks? The two star and not much else JAzz?

It's a shame they never met the Rockets in the finals. The Rockets weren't even close to as good as the Bulls, but 94-95 Hakeem would have been a huge problem for those Bulls teams.

Honestly, it makes me with that the Lebron Heat and the Durant Warriors had overlapped. Those series would've rivaled the Celtics/Lakers of the 80s (at least in terms of starpower) in a way that nothing else has.

 

[snowmanny]

I think Magic vs Bird is razor close and people speaking on it with such certainty are lying to themselves or just being homers. It's a pretty easy argument of would you rather have Bird at a higher peak, but for a shorter period of time, or Magic at a slightly lower peak, but for a longer period of time. Magic also has his career cut short due to HIV, which I think people view as more tragic than Bird's career being cut short due to injury (even though the former is probably more preventable than the latter) in part because we never really saw Magic struggle on the court, with Bird it was obvious he wasn't the same player and needed to retire.

I don't really understand the Kareem argument against Magic. Sure, Kareem was a Top 5 player himself and certainly early on during their run he was the best player on the Lakers. But at the end of the day, both of these guys played on absolutely loaded teams with great supporting casts. At some point, the Parrish/McHale combo becomes superior to Kareem. Lakers had Worthy, Celtics had DJ, Lakers had Norm Nixon, Celtics had Tiny, etc. Both of these teams were star studded lineups, so it's weird to argue that one of these guys had more help in winning than the other. Put Magic on the Celtics and Bird on the Lakers and the teams probably mimic the same success the franchises actually had.

Kareem matters most in this argument for the 1979-80 season if you're counting titles. Magic was obviously great in the finals, but Bird joined a 29 win team and Magic joined a 47 win team and Kareem was the MVP Magic's rookie year. Pretty sure Bird would have won that title if he was on the Lakers instead of Magic. But, yeah, your post otherwise is pretty spot on.

 

[The Social Chair]

Thinking about how good those Lakers, Celitcs, Sixers, and Pistons teams were, it makes me wonder about the Jordan Bulls.

They were obviously a historically great team, and there was a ton of talent in that Era, but the talent wasn't that concentrated. Who were their greatest rivals? The one star Knicks? The two star and not much else JAzz?

It's a shame they never met the Rockets in the finals. The Rockets weren't even close to as good as the Bulls, but 94-95 Hakeem would have been a huge problem for those Bulls teams.

1996 - 99 was the NBA at its lowest point aesthetically and from a talent standpoint. It was also the most popular the league ever was because of Jordan.

Jordan's last game with the Bulls is unwatchable save for the last 2 minutes. 131 shot attempts combined!

 

[Reverend]

There was also a monkey. It apparently had escaped from a circus and lived in the rafters until the place was torn down.

monkey!!!!

Boston.com: Closing the case on the Boston Garden monkey mystery
A (warning: slightly gross) final chapter to the monkey tale.
By Perry Eaton @PerryEaton
November 9, 2015

 

[BaseballJones]

I wonder what pair of teammates ranks the best in NBA history. Some contenders:

Using the admittedly subjective rankings here: https://www.lines.com/nba/the-50-greatest-nba-players-ever-ranked-180

Magic (6) and Kareem (5)
Shaq (10) and Kobe (9)
Robertson (12) and Kareem (5)
Durant (14) and Curry (13)
West (15) and Wilt (3)
Moses (18) and Dr J (16)
Pippen (21) and Jordan (1)
Barkley (22) and Dr J (16)
Baylor (23) and Wilt (3)
Baylor (23) and West (15)
Robinson (24) and Duncan (8)
Leonard (25) and Duncan (8)
Wade (27) and LeBron (2)
Stockton (30) and Malone (20)
Harden (31) and Durant (14)
Havlicek (36) and Russell (5)
Cousy (39) and Russell (5)
Pierce (47) and Garnett (19)
Drexler (48) and Olajuwon (11)
Barkley (22) and Olajuwon (11)
Rodman (49) and Jordan (1)

None of Bird's HOF teammates make the top 50 list, though obviously he's played with some great players - Tiny, Parish, McHale, DJ, Walton.

Magic and Kareem were probably my first guess, but I also thought of West and Wilt. Those rankings aren't anything official or objective or anything like that, and YMMV on them, but they're a little bit of a guide anyway.

So who do you guys think is the top duo of all time? Take into account how they were playing at the time they were together. So for Kareem and Magic, they had a few years there when they were both absolutely elite players. Durant and Curry also played together at their peaks. Wilt and West were in their 30s, but both still incredible when they played together in LA. Stockton and Malone obviously played together basically their entire careers, including their HOF peaks. Same with Pippen and Jordan - their best years were together.

 

[Kliq]

I think playing together in their primes is a big factor. Baylor and West come to mind because they played their entire primes together and were both Top 6 players for pretty much that entire span of time (depending on how you rank Russell/Wilt/Pettit/Oscar/Baylor/West each year). The longevity of that peak is really what stands out, only Pippen/Jordan can really rival it (and it depends on how high you rate Pippen). In recent years Curry/Durant and the first few years of LeBron/Wade in Miami were instances were I think two of the three best players were on the same team.

 

[snowmanny]

Probably should at least acknowledge Sam Jones and Bill Russell, who went 10 out of 12 together.

edit - obviously the record for titles by teammates, since they are 1&2 in titles.

 

[luckiestman]

Curry/Durant, Kareem/Magic have both had either player be the best guy on a championship team. I guess, LeBron/DWade. meet that criteria too but I think that Heat team (Shaq/DWade) win was kind of a weak year for the NBA.

I guess it’s Curry/Durant because that is really prime/prime

Would be Magic/Kareem if primes more aligned

Honorable mention LBJ/Wade

I didn’t see West/Baylor. The argument is solid but individually those guys don’t match up to the other three I’ve listed, imo.

 

[BaseballJones]

Using that list I made, if you're building a team today, which pair do you take to start a team? Jordan/Pippen would be amazing, even if a little light on three point shooting. They could both defend like hell, and would terrorize opponents. Steph/Durant obviously would be elite from a scoring perspective, but Curry's defense would struggle.

Wade and LeBron would obviously be phenomenal as well.

 

[TripleOT]

Using that list I made, if you're building a team today, which pair do you take to start a team? Jordan/Pippen would be amazing, even if a little light on three point shooting. They could both defend like hell, and would terrorize opponents. Steph/Durant obviously would be elite from a scoring perspective, but Curry's defense would struggle.

Wade and LeBron would obviously be phenomenal as well.

Durant and LeBron
MJ and Hakeem
MJ and LeBron would be pretty good.

 

[Devizier]

I would probably start with Jordan and Pippen. Both guys came together early in their careers and had a 10 year peak together (minus the baseball years). Said baseball years were also the proof of Pippen’s actual talent, which has been capped a little bit by Jordan’s presence. Hard to compare with the modern guys because of the rules changes but it’s pretty easy to see how their offense would have thrived in the modern era. Pippen in particular could have been a sniper.

 

[runnels3]

With my very darkened Polaroid green shades I'm going with these combos. Russ-Cooz, Russ-Sam, Russ-Hondo.
Not that they have to rate near the top, but each of the pairings represent a special period across the span of 11 rings.
Kind of like early, middle, and late William Felton Russell.