Bill Simmons: Good Luck With Your Life.

joe dokes

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John Marzano Olympic Hero said:
 
He used to complain about Felger all the time during his DC days. He said that Felger was a complete suck-up to the Herald sports editor at the time (getting him coffee, laughing at his jokes) and that's how Felger went from covering high school sports to the Bruins beat. He was really, really bitter about that. Not sure about Mazz, but man, did Simmons have a thing for Felger back in the late 90s.
 
Since Simmons has been on Felger's show a few times, I believe that they've buried the hatchet.
 
IIRC, Simmons didn't even want to be a beat writer.  He thought he was too good for that. (in addition to being too good to get someone a cup of coffee; in Greenwich, they got coffee for HIM).
 

DJnVa

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"I'm part historian, part know-it-all
 
 
I hope he didn't hurt himself with his pats on the back.
 
3) The end of the Heat-Spurs game six last June made him miserable.
"I had bad bronchitis, and I was messed up on medication. As soon as it became clear San Antonio had clinched the series, I was like, This is great. I was excited to go home and see my family, just lie in bed for two days. Then it flipped. And we were like, We've gotta go on TV and talk about that? I took that one hard." Also: He kinda hates the Heat.
 
 
Awww.
 
7) He helped poach Nate Silver from the New York Times – and it wasn't difficult.
"I did a podcast with Nate, and he was asking questions about Grantland. I could tell he wasn't asking only out of curiosity. That day, I sent a long email to John Skipper and a few other people, recapping everything. We were underdogs to get him, but I thought we had a chance, because the Times was being arrogant. I don't want to betray Nate, but some of the things he was saying to me—they were treating him like he was just another one of their writers. 'We're the New York Times, we'll be fine.' After the credibility he gave them, and the attention—there's no way you let that guy go. You've got to be idiots. I've got no problem saying that. I think they really fucked up."
 
 
Nate Silver gave the NY Times credibility?
 
 
 
 
 
14) ESPN is his other spouse.
"I had a weird epiphany about ESPN last Christmas. Sometimes my wife gets mad because I watch football all day—which is funny, since me watching sports pays for everything.
 
She should know her place.
 

NatetheGreat

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Nate Silver gave the NY Times credibility?
 
He was definitely their biggest traffic-driver during election season. Having the guy who is seen as the definitive oracle on calling presidential races is a pretty big deal...
 
Although I'm not at all clear on how much value Silver brings in non-election years. His site so far hasn't blown me away, thats for sure. I'll still read his stuff in 2016, but I've seen little reason to check in prior to then, which may be a problem for the ESPN site.
 

NatetheGreat

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CreightonGubanich said:
I thought Simmons came off horribly in that article. Thin-skinned, arrogant, all the criticisms that have been levied against him in the past. Except now, he's a "media mogul" or something, and seems to think he's infallible. Even the acknowledgment that he's playing a character on TV is telling, as he used to skewer "talking heads" like that in the past. 
 
Its strange. Simmons hired PIerce, who repeatedly took him to the woodshed as only Pierce can, and he's tried to hire some of the deadspin folks who shit on him constantly as well. That suggests he either doesn't really hold grudges, or that he's capable of setting them aside when he recognizes someone's talent.
 
But then you read pieces like this, and I agree, he really does come across as very thin-skinned and fixated on past things people have said to him.
 
So I'm not quite sure what to make of him. Its almost like I have to separate two figures in my head, "Executive Simmons", who hired a largely outstanding (and, as he sort of childishly points out, pretty diverse) team for Grantland and turned it into a big success, who dreamed up 30 for 30 and sold ESPN on it, who consistently gets really interesting guests for his podcasts, and who throughout his career has always understood how to parlay whatever his gig at the time was into something bigger. I think Executive Simmons is a pretty good weapon in the ESPN arsenal. But then there's "Writer/"personality" Simmons", who is a basically mediocre columnist with too many gimmicks, a thin-skinned, self-satisfied, frequently repellent personality, whose only saving grace is that he's legitimately obsessed with the NBA enough to occasionally provide useful insight about it. Executive Simmons is arguably one of the most important figures in the modern sports media landscape. Writer Simmons is someone you should only pay attention to if you love the NBA way more than most people, or if you happen to think Teen Wolf is a masterpiece (in which case, seek help).
 

kenneycb

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joe dokes said:
 
IIRC, Simmons didn't even want to be a beat writer.  He thought he was too good for that. (in addition to being too good to get someone a cup of coffee; in Greenwich, they got coffee for HIM).
Have you ever met a 24 year old that hasn't thought that about their job?
 

joe dokes

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kenneycb said:
Have you ever met a 24 year old that hasn't thought that about their job?
 
 
Any single one of us meet a really small sample of "new" workers, but in my experience, most recognize that they have some learning to do. And by the time that 24 year old is 40, he is likely to acknowledge that he did need to do some learning from those around him with more experience. Instead he's riding front row on the "I shoulda been a columnist from Day 1 but they made a mockery of my career" train.
 
He can't even bring himself to say something like, "thank God for the internet; I wasn't cut out for newspapers, with their pesky deadlines and space limitations."  There's no shame in admitting that *that* particular vein of sportswriting wasn't for him.  But he can't even bring himself to say that he didn't like Star Wars without turning into some sort of morality play.
 

kenneycb

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Your sample size is different from mine, I guess.
 
Here's something from Boston Sports Watch in 2005 that discusses his time at the Herald.  Gives more context than the Rolling Stone article.  Union stuff sounds whiny IMO but I can't speak to the validity of his larger point. http://shots.bostonsportsmedia.com/2005/09/the-boston-sports-guy-revisited-reinvented-and-revealed/
 

“I started working at the (Boston) Herald the following September, answering phones and doing shit work, organizing food runs, working on the Sunday football scores section,” he says. “What a miserable place. I thought it was just me, but I have gotten emails from people since who had similarly horrible experiences there.
 
“Some of the copy editors were the meanest, most unhappy people I have ever been around. . .I mean, it was unbelievable. I had never seen anything like it. That was the most discouraging environment imaginable for someone who dreamt of becoming a columnist some day. What I really hated was that, eventually, you turn into those people – you start slamming everyone else behind their backs. Man, I hated that place.
 
“After three years I knew I needed to get out, and I knew it would be years before I ever got a chance. Plus, I never clicked with the new sports editor (Mark Torpey) after Bob Sales was fired. In retrospect, I should have gone to JJ Foley’s on Thursday nights and laughed at his jokes like Mike Felger did, but I didn’t know to do that at the time.
 
......
 

“You forget,” the Guy implores. “I TRIED to do this conventionally. I spent three years at the Herald and even tried to make my mark at the Phoenix . The bottom line is that newspaper unions have killed this business – writers stay too long and never leave, and young writers who would kill to have their jobs never have a chance. Quick, how many Boston columnists have been hired in the past 10 years at one of the two papers? Here’s your answer – Howard Bryant and Jackie MacMullan. [Shots adds in Michael Holley, who did, despite some flip-flopping, have a column at the Globe.]
 
“So when someone like (Dan) Shaughnessy is bitching behind the scenes that I (or any other internet columnist) ‘never go in the clubhouse,’ well, you know what? I would have loved to have gotten a column that way. But all the dead weight was blocking my way.
 
“Clearly, I was good enough to do this for a living, but there was no way I was every getting a chance doing it conventionally. That’s what pisses me off. I never even had a real chance. I mean, this is the only industry where companies PAY PEOPLE TO LEAVE. Look at what just happened at the Herald [now at the Globe, too] – they had to spend four years worth of salaries to dump all their dead weight. This is a good system? If I suck for the next two years, you know what happens? ESPN doesn’t renew my contract and I’m unemployed. With newspapers, you could basically hand in scribble for 20 years and they have to keep paying you. It’s bad business. That’s why so many newspapers will be going under soon, if they aren’t already.
 

 
 
 

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kenneycb said:
 
Your sample size is different from mine, I guess.
 
Here's something from Boston Sports Watch in 2005 that discusses his time at the Herald.  Gives more context than the Rolling Stone article.  Union stuff sounds whiny IMO but I can't speak to the validity of his larger point. http://shots.bostonsportsmedia.com/2005/09/the-boston-sports-guy-revisited-reinvented-and-revealed/
 

 

 
 
That whole things absolutely reeks of entitlement.  What an asshole.
 

southshoresoxfan

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Guess im in the minority but i really enjoy Simmons esp when he's talking NBA.  I enjoy the guess the lines podcast with Cousin Sal, in fact I enjoy most of his podcasts.  Him and Jalen have a natural chemistry, I really enjoyed all their video podcasts on the NBA this year.  
 

Clears Cleaver

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I worked with Simmons for a time at the Herald sports department. We overlapped as I spent three years there while finishing college. He joined in the months I was leaving. Everything he says about that miserable place is true. Torpey was a bad guy. Sales a bad guy. Most everyone was miserable and jealous. I lived next door to Felger at BU and worked with him and Mazz for a years or so. I think Simmons lack of respect was more pointed toward Mazz than Felger. Mazz was more of a kiss ass and less talented writer.
 

Orel Miraculous

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IHateDaveKerpen said:
 
That whole things absolutely reeks of entitlement.  What an asshole.
 
Sure, but he probably feels that way because he's well aware of the fact that he's the most influential sportswriter of his generation--easily (and he was already that good at that young of an age, as evidenced by what a phenomenon he became immediately after joining Page 2). His complaint is that the newspaper industry made effort to reward actual talent, based on what he did after leaving the industry, it's really, really hard to argue against that.
 

allstonite

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southshoresoxfan said:
Guess im in the minority but i really enjoy Simmons esp when he's talking NBA.  I enjoy the guess the lines podcast with Cousin Sal, in fact I enjoy most of his podcasts.  Him and Jalen have a natural chemistry, I really enjoyed all their video podcasts on the NBA this year.  
I really like him too and enjoy him for what he is at this point. Solid podcast who gets good guests, a few good NBA columns, and light Friday afternoon reading at work. Plus I love everything he does behind the scenes

But that Rolling Stone profile, to me at least, just confirmed pretty much everything his detractors say about him (thin skinned, entitled). I'll continue following him as I have been but I just lost a little bit of respect for him
 

ifmanis5

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I have no problem with Simmons seeing the writing (pun intended) on the wall at the Herald in the early 90's. It's a very rigid caste system and he would have needed to put in years, if not decades, to write even sidebars for Celtics or Red Sox coverage much less become a back page columnist. He did the math and bailed while bootstrapping himself to where he is today. Great for him. However, as a writer, he became exactly the sort of person that he once (and very justly) totally loathed. Other than his very good NBA content, it has become almost completely worthless to borderline embarrassing. That he hasn't noticed this turn of events, and furthermore is a total baby if anybody dares calls him out on it, is the really pathetic part.
 

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I think he's dead on in regards to the unions killing the sports section of the local papers.  Back in the Globe's golden Gammons-Ryan-McDonough era, the premier columnists had a passion for what they do and nobody to poach them, so it worked out well.
 
Now, if you actually write well and put in a real effort, you'll get poached by ESPN or SI's web sites (Reiss, Edes, Bedard, Smith, McMullen, McAdam, etc).  If you can speak semi-intelligently or know how to get people's attention you get to move on to a comfy radio gig (Felger, Mazz, Holley, Callahan, etc.).  
 
The guys who aren't good enough (Cafardo), don't work hard enough (Cafardo), or don't have enough to say (Cafardo) to draw internet/radio interest are left with the premier spots.  And it'll be a cold day in hell before someone like Cafardo gives up his cushy gig barfing up whatever the hell he feels like in probably the country's most storied sports column.
 

NatetheGreat

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His piece on Sterling today was actually sort of interesting. He goes pretty in-depth on an anecdote about sitting behind Sterling and V. Stiviano on a plane ride. its gossipy and full of irrelevant but fun details like the fact that Sterling made her sit in coach but kept calling her up to do shit for him. Fun read.
 
I thought the Sterling piece was great. The Sterling story in general is a gift from the writing gods to him:
 
*Basketball as opposed to other sports
*Gossiping about owners/stuff behind the scenes
*TMZ gossippiness
*The location in LA
*The racism aspect, which gives it this slight air of importance rather than just being about sports
 
He may have creamed his pants when he heard the Sterling tapes come out.
 

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NatetheGreat said:
His piece on Sterling today was actually sort of interesting. He goes pretty in-depth on an anecdote about sitting behind Sterling and V. Stiviano on a plane ride. its gossipy and full of irrelevant but fun details like the fact that Sterling made her sit in coach but kept calling her up to do shit for him. Fun read.
 
It was a fun read. And Simmons has mocked Sterling for years, so I guess he had some space to pound but, damn, that column just felt like a whole pallet of "piling on".
 

NatetheGreat

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johnmd20 said:
 
It was a fun read. And Simmons has mocked Sterling for years, so I guess he had some space to pound but, damn, that column just felt like a whole pallet of "piling on".
 
Oh, totally. But tbh I don't mind a bit of piling on when the stories are fun and the target is a complete asshole, and both are true in this case.
 
 
 
I thought the Sterling piece was great. The Sterling story in general is a gift from the writing gods to him:
 
*Basketball as opposed to other sports
*Gossiping about owners/stuff behind the scenes
*TMZ gossippiness
*The location in LA
*The racism aspect, which gives it this slight air of importance rather than just being about sports
 
He may have creamed his pants when he heard the Sterling tapes come out.
 
 
Not just a gift from the writing gods, a gift from the basketball gods as well. I'm sure Simmons was postively gleeful when he realizes this meant the Clips would have a new owner. (to be fair, I think many fans in similar situations would feel the same--as a Knicks fan on the NBA subreddit put it, "Why can't James Dolan be racist?")
 

Leather

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The problem that he ignores is that his style of writing would never, ever, work in a newspaper format.    There simply isn't enough room.  His columns are long, narrative in style, with countless diversions and self-references that would not only take up far too much print space, but would alienate casual readers who were just looking for information on their teams.   He was a square peg in a round hole, and it just seems odd to me that he blames the Herald for not doing something they could never do, anyway.
 
It's great for him that he left the Herald, but at the same time, (good) newspaper writing requires a level of tightness and discipline that he has never, ever, had or indicated any interest in having.  So it's disingenuous of him to say "Well, FUCK THEM!  THEIR LOSS!" when in fact there never was an option of him becoming BILL SIMMONS there, and that's not the fault of the Herald, it just is what it is.*
 
It would be like George Clooney getting angry at "E.R." in every interview because they wouldn't let him become a Big Movie Star on their show.   Well...it's a tv show.  What do you expect?
 
*And it has always been my contention that he would have benefited from some more classic journalism experience.  As fun and endearing his rambling style can be, it is often also his greatest weakness.  His big blind spot is being able to write a concise, pointed, piece without getting in his own way.  
 

kenneycb

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He somewhat addresses your points later on in that article I linked above.
 

“Ideally, the best possible situation for me would have been a joint website/newspaper deal at the Globe or Herald, followed by an eventual landing at ESPN. Now it’s too late – I would never work for a newspaper. People are leaving newspapers to write for Internet sites or host radio shows, not vice-versa.
 
“When my BSG site had some buzz in 2000 and 2001, they could have hired me dirt-cheap for Boston.com – which was in absolute shambles at the time – only they didn’t have the balls because they didn’t want to ruffle any feathers with the writers who allegedly didn’t like me over there. They finally contacted me in June, 2001 long after I had decided to move to ESPN. I did have extensive talks with the Herald and their website, and there was even a time when it looked like something might work out. But ESPN was the best move for me.”
 
 

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drleather is totally on the money.  His schtick flat-out wouldn't have fit in any newspaper.  The internet, yes.  A magazine, maybe.  But the RS article just drives home the point of how petulant he is about the whole thing.  You're the most successful sportswriter of your generation.  Let it go.
 
I'll echo the sentiments about the Sterling piece.  That was a pretty good read.
 

Leather

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kenneycb said:
 
He somewhat addresses your points later on in that article I linked above.
 

 

 
 
I guess, but he still sounds like the biggest asshole ever, and if his goal is to make the Globe sorry (For what? For trying to hire him, but not being able to complete with ESP fucking N?), I don't think he's succeeding.  They're probably thinking "Ok, so we would have hired this guy, he would have been a pain in the ass, and then shat all over us on his way out the door to ESPN or CNNSI after his first contract was up.  Dodged a bullet on that one!".  
 
For a guy who follows sports for a living, and knows all about the perception of players leaving teams, and how things get interpreted by fans, he seems to really not have learned anything at all about public relations or perception.  Moreover, all he's doing is alienating colleagues who one day he might A) get asked to work with or; B) want to hire to work with him.  What's the upside?  Why can't he just say "I was never meant for newspapers.  I had a tough time at the Herald, as I've spoken about, but in the end my experience there only showed me what I wanted to do, so I'm thankful."
 
To use a Simmons-esque reference, he sounds like Willie Beaman in "Any Given Sunday" before he has his big epiphany that it's more than about HIM.
 

NatetheGreat

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To use a Simmons-esque reference, he sounds like Willie Beaman in "Any Given Sunday" before he has his big epiphany that it's more than about HIM.
 
Honestly, if Simmons cut a "My name is Billy" music video, I'd have more respect for him.
 

joe dokes

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It would be like George Clooney getting angry at "E.R." in every interview because they wouldn't let him become a Big Movie Star on their show.   Well...it's a tv show.  What do you expect?
 
*And it has always been my contention that he would have benefited from some more classic journalism experience.  As fun and endearing his rambling style can be, it is often also his greatest weakness.  His big blind spot is being able to write a concise, pointed, piece without getting in his own way.  
 
Both of these are dead-on.
 
drleather2001 said:
 
I guess, but he still sounds like the biggest asshole ever, and if his goal is to make the Globe sorry (For what? For trying to hire him, but not being able to complete with ESP fucking N?), I don't think he's succeeding.  They're probably thinking "Ok, so we would have hired this guy, he would have been a pain in the ass, and then shat all over us on his way out the door to ESPN or CNNSI after his first contract was up.  Dodged a bullet on that one!".  
 
For a guy who follows sports for a living, and knows all about the perception of players leaving teams, and how things get interpreted by fans, he seems to really not have learned anything at all about public relations or perception.  Moreover, all he's doing is alienating colleagues who one day he might A) get asked to work with or; B) want to hire to work with him.  What's the upside?  Why can't he just say "I was never meant for newspapers.  I had a tough time at the Herald, as I've spoken about, but in the end my experience there only showed me what I wanted to do, so I'm thankful."
 
To use a Simmons-esque reference, he sounds like Willie Beaman in "Any Given Sunday" before he has his big epiphany that it's more than about HIM.
 
All he demonstrates is the obvious (in hindsight) fact that most large newspapers were slow to catch on to the internet. Bill Simmons has never and will never understand that most situations in which Bill Simmons is involved aren't actually about Bill Simmons. That doesn't mean he isn't talented or that people who like his stuff are illiterate.  I like some of his stuff (less than i used to, but more than none). But he seems tone-deaf to the idea that he is not the center of the universe.
 

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IMO the Sterling article was interesting/fun, but a rambling mess of an article. I loved Bill back at Digital Cities, and I'm really impressed with what he's accomplished. I also enjoy him very much on his NBA show with Rose and Collins. All of that said, his writing has gone to shit, or perhaps more accurately, it hasn't improved much in 10 years. Mostly, I'm guessing, because it hasn't had to given his podcast/TV/ESPN/Grantland success. He's crushing it now, no real reason to tighten up his writing.
 

JimBoSox9

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Yup.  There hasn't been nearly enough incentive for him to improve his writing.  His fundamental disconnect with the Herald is that he can be 1000% right about the atmosphere at the lower levels in print journalism but completely lack understanding that surviving that crucible is how better writers get built.  Many entrepreneurs who bypass the entry level retain some perspective that it was in part because they themselves had some shortcoming that made them not a good fit for that grind.  When Simmons looks at his time with the Herald, he only sees the externalities.  
 

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Maybe's it's just me, but when reading the Sterling article, I couldn't help thinking that this was a story he was saving for when the Clippers finally won a championship, with the ending being that the flight was a microcosm of Sterling's experience with the Clippers--everyone hated him throughout, but wound up loving him at the end.   But the recent events forced him to put the anecdote into a completely different context.  
 

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I thought the Phoenix reference was funny. Was he under the impression that was a union shop? They fired people at will all the time. I, for one, am shocked that the Phoenix didn't immediately realize his talent, fire an established and talented writer, and install Bill at the ripe age of 25 (or whatever) in a premiere slot at one of the premiere (at the time) journo jobs in Boston. 
 
Good for him for making the end around and being successful, but, yeah, if you don't want to have put in your time, that's what you have to do. He did it. Great. But don't act like the system is totally fucked. That IS the system, and it's great. Put in your time or start your own thing. Starting your own thing has a lot more risk involved. If you have appetite and desire for risk, that's the way to go. If you like a steady paycheck from writing, you start at the lower levels and wait for people to quit and die while you establish your bona fides and jump to a better job elsewhere if it opens up. 
 
He didn't have the patience for the latter and he did have the appetite for the former. Yay. Why he feels the need to shit on everyone who isn't like him, I'm not sure. 
 

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Why can't he just say "I was never meant for newspapers.  I had a tough time at the Herald, as I've spoken about, but in the end my experience there only showed me what I wanted to do, so I'm thankful."
 
 
Because he wants you to feel bad for him, or at the very least agree that he was correct.
 
The guys at the Herald were assholes, so I was right to leave.
The people at Boston.com were short-sighted, so I was right to go to ESPN.
 
Bill Simmons is a stereotypical only child. He can't be just correct, he needs everyone to tell him that he's correct and believes that he's correct in every move that he makes. It's not good enough that he's correct, everyone has to be wrong too. He's a good writer, but sometimes I think that he picked the wrong occupation to be in because he's so damn sensitive to criticism.
 

Dehere

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NatetheGreat said:
 
He was definitely their biggest traffic-driver during election season. Having the guy who is seen as the definitive oracle on calling presidential races is a pretty big deal...
 
Although I'm not at all clear on how much value Silver brings in non-election years. His site so far hasn't blown me away, thats for sure. I'll still read his stuff in 2016, but I've seen little reason to check in prior to then, which may be a problem for the ESPN site.
 
In March 538 averaged about 150 users at any given moment if you believe the comscore numbers.
 
No doubt the bigger numbers will come in '16 and even this year as we get closer to the midterms, but I think the value of landing Silver and the damage it did to the NYT has been exaggerated.
 

ifmanis5

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John Marzano Olympic Hero said:
He's a good writer, but sometimes I think that he picked the wrong occupation to be in because he's so damn sensitive to criticism.
Very on the nose for me.
 
Back at the Herald no doubt there were many grouchy dicks who were all too happy to tell Bill that his stuff stunk. Rather than taking that criticism and sticking it out to be a better writer he took his ball and went home. History has totally vindicated him- he choose the Internet instead of Newspapers, but at the time I doubt he saw the future at all. He just heard a lot of negativity he couldn't handle and fled.
 
All that said, I have few problems with his decisions back then. I'm more disappointed by how the writing has turned out now.
 

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Everybody says he's sensitive to criticism but do we have any idea how much criticism he gets. My guess is he gets ripped apart on a daily basis because of his views and the medium he works in. I realize he has had some public spats with guys, but I'm guessing we don't know he half of the shit he gets on a daily basis.
 

Blacken

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I've seen the mailboxes of folks not even a quarter as big as Simmons. I can pretty much guarantee he gets a lot of shit. There's a reason all these people respond in the way they do, and why it's always so similar: because it's huge and oppressive.
 

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We do A LOT of cloud email moves. Biggest mailbox I've ever come across was 118GB.

The dude was like 800 years old.
 

joe dokes

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Merkle's Boner said:
Everybody says he's sensitive to criticism but do we have any idea how much criticism he gets. My guess is he gets ripped apart on a daily basis because of his views and the medium he works in. I realize he has had some public spats with guys, but I'm guessing we don't know he half of the shit he gets on a daily basis.
 
This has some validity, but I seem to remember him not handling the criticism of 10 posters here very well  a few years ago when he tried to go somewhere with "batters who were feared" as some kind of metric-ish thing, IIRC.
 

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ifmanis5 said:
Very on the nose for me.
 
Back at the Herald no doubt there were many grouchy dicks who were all too happy to tell Bill that his stuff stunk. Rather than taking that criticism and sticking it out to be a better writer he took his ball and went home. History has totally vindicated him- he choose the Internet instead of Newspapers, but at the time I doubt he saw the future at all. He just heard a lot of negativity he couldn't handle and fled.
 
All that said, I have few problems with his decisions back then. I'm more disappointed by how the writing has turned out now.
 
Is there any evidence that people "[told] Bill that his stuff stunk"?  My understanding is that he wasn't treated poorly, it's just that he was treated like every other new guy and wasn't given tasks that he felt were worthy of him.   Basically, he got told to work on the NFL summaries, he said "I want a column" and they said "No" and he left.  I don't think he every got to the point where he earned an opportunity to have people tell him his writing "stunk", because he hadn't earned that opportunity yet.
 

Nick Kaufman

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Once again, I think a lot of the shit Simmons takes in this tread is out of proportion. The article linked above shows that he hired Charles Pierce who tore him a new one on his book, while being ready to hire a guy from Deadspin who from what I understand is on his case every other day. Moreover, while he's had had a ton of public grudge matches he seems to have mended fences with almost every guy he's publicly fought, like let's say Doc Rivers. To me that shows a very mature approach to dealing with spats in understanding their transient and small nature.
 
If anything, the opposing criticism can be leveled against him. When he mends fences with someone like Isaiah Thomas whom he rightfully had lambasted in the past, it shows the problem with a ton of journalists. Once they gain access to the inner sanctum of celebrity or more prosaically, once they get access to info, they lose their independent streak and become obsequious servants of the rich and famous. Arguably there is some of that Simmons although the line between this and  the understandable feeling of being overcome by feeling of awe when you meet your childhood heroes is a pretty thin one.
 
Anyway, the thing he says about twitter is pretty spot IMO. It is a medium that allows unjustified nastiness to flourish. And so are comment sections of every other site. Why is it thin skinned for not wanting to deal with that sort of shit?
 

Ralphwiggum

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Of all of the stuff to get on Simmons' case for, I don't understand the focus on his time at the Herald. Many of us are in professions where you have to "pay your dues" by doing shit work at the bottom before you advance.  But there is shit work in a supportive environment where you are learning your craft and getting better at it, and there is shit work in a poisonous environment where you get dumped on because tradition says we all have to dump on the new guy, and his description of his time at the Herald sounds like the later.  I spent time in an atmosphere like that, and it sucks.  Sure, ultimately it made me better at my job but I don't look back fondly at those days, and I could have gotten better at my job without putting up with all of that bullshit.  So I don't blame him for looking around and deciding that he didn't want to be there.
 
He probably should be more diplomatic about it and just say something along the lines of "I realized it wasn't a place I wanted to be long term", but whatever.
 
To me the biggest thing I took away from the Rolling Stone article is that BS seems to have developed a massive ego.  As a guy who goes back to his Digital City days, I think Bill is a lot of things and many of the criticisms in this thread are warranted, but I guess I never took him for an egomaniac.  He's obviously accomplished a ton and it is probably hard not to develop a bit of an ego given his position at ESPN, but he no longer seems like a guy who I would want to sit and have a beer with and talk sports.
 

Hendu for Kutch

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Ralphwiggum said:
but he no longer seems like a guy who I would want to sit and have a beer with and talk sports.
 
Interesting way of putting it.  I think you're right. 
 
I'm willing to bet we've all had that conversation with someone who finds out you like sports and then tried to impress you the whole time with their deep insight of "sports as narrative".  The whole time you're just nodding along, praying they'll shut up because you know if you bother to rebut any of their points they'll act like you just spit in their face.  That's what I imagine a bar conversation with Simmons would be like nowadays, at least in terms of baseball or football.  Which would have seemed inconceivable 10-15 years ago.
 

Guapos Toenails

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I fully admit that i'm still butt-hurt that he didn't move back to Boston, but teasing his daughter (that became a Kings fan because she grew up in LA, not Boston) over a hockey game is pretty pathetic.  Paddling-upstream-in-a-douche-canoe type of pathetic.  I really dis-like that guy.
 

kenneycb

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Yes, I'm sure he did it in a mean spirited and malicious way that will prove irreparable damage to his daughter and will cost thousands in future therapy sessions.

My mom's a Yankee fan and did the same to me and my brother growing up. Hopefully you don't think she's a bitch or anything.
 

URI

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kenneycb said:
My mom's a Yankee fan and did the same to me and my brother growing up. Hopefully you don't think she's a bitch or anything.
 
Too...many...jokes...
 

Leather

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kenneycb said:
Yes, I'm sure he did it in a mean spirited and malicious way that will prove irreparable damage to his daughter and will cost thousands in future therapy sessions.

My mom's a Yankee fan and did the same to me and my brother growing up. Hopefully you don't think she's a bitch or anything.
I dunno. Did she point out her actions in a national publication for the purpose of impressing millions of strangers?
 

kenneycb

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Yeah, phrasing.

And sure, when you phrase it in your convoluted way it sounds awful because, well, that's your MO in this thread. It's an very mildly humorous anecdote about the give and take in his relationship with his daughter. Of which sports appears to play a large part. Oh noes.

And I thought the Sterling article sucked and was more or less an excuse to tell the plane story.
 

Guapos Toenails

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kenneycb said:
Yes, I'm sure he did it in a mean spirited and malicious way that will prove irreparable damage to his daughter and will cost thousands in future therapy sessions.

My mom's a Yankee fan and did the same to me and my brother growing up. Hopefully you don't think she's a bitch or anything.
 
Was this for real?  Holy shit I give an example of why I think he's a douche, I didn't say he was a child abuser.  Could you be more of a thin-skinned pussy?