Bruins Fire Cassidy

TFP

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Look at what Avs, Flames, Oilers, Rangers, TBL are playing with and how. It's called skill. It's 2022.
You're crazy if you don't think those teams are extremely tough. They also employ very unskilled guys like Lucic, Kassian, Reaves, Maroon, etc, and a lot of their skilled guys, especially on defense, are very tough.

Toughness <> enforcers and fighting. It also doesn't come at the expense of skill. I too would like to see this team get tougher to play against both competitively and physically. Well, I would have liked it when they had a full squad worthy of playoff run. Next year I'm not sure it matters.
 

Haunted

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Yeah, I hate this. I wasn't the biggest Cassidy fan (as Myt1 notes, playing a mangled Tuukka who was battling what ended up being a career-ending injury was atrocious and indefensible), however Ty is right in his article - of all the myriad problems with this team, Bruce Cassidy was not one of them.

I have zero faith that Sweeney and Cam will do the right thing here.
 

jk333

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Yeah, I hate this. I wasn't the biggest Cassidy fan (as Myt1 notes, playing a mangled Tuukka who was battling what ended up being a career-ending injury was atrocious and indefensible), however Ty is right in his article - of all the myriad problems with this team, Bruce Cassidy was not one of them.

I have zero faith that Sweeney and Cam will do the right thing here.
But there are no good options and the right thing may be unloading everyone they signed last offseason? So to that end, maybe this is most straightforward. Either next season they are mediocre but worse with a new coach (most likely) and those signings are the problem or they win and it really was the system that needed a tweak.

As dummyhoy notes in the other thread, maybe a new coach can add to their playing styles to use more of the roster effectively. The bottom lines have been horrible. It appears to be the players but maybe a new style will help.
 

Zososoxfan

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There are now six vacancies (BOS, DAL, DET, LV, PHI, WIN), two interim coaches (FLA, CHI) and a team with a expiring coach (EDM).

The lead coaching candidate is Barry Trotz, who is a Winnipeg native and has already interviewed for the job. Other experienced candidates include Mike Babcock, Peter DeBoer, Claude Julien, Paul Maurice, Dave Tippett, Rick Tocchet, John Tortorella and Alain Vigneault.

I believe Sweeney will need to look for an offensively-minded coach, who can get more out of the team in 5v5.
I vote Clod, mostly because I loved Blacken's avatar featuring the KFC bucket. I chuckle every time I think about it.

I would first pay attenton to what Dummy Hoy says here - I doubt Neely is calling for a return to 1980s style dump and chase.
To win in hockey, a team needs to possess the puck in the offensive zone. The offsides rule means a team can't pass it in, so the only choices are either to carry it in or dump it in and go get it. Better to carry it in since possession is maintained. But, knowing the blue line is an obstacle, the defending team will try to have its guys guard the blue line and deny entry. A lot of the various "trapping" types of hockey defenses involve having 3 guys up on the blue line trying to deny entry. Dumping and chase is another option. If the D is focused on the blue line, and the offensive team is attacking with speed, then they can just dump the puck in and maybe win the race to the puck (the defensive players are closer to the puck but facing the wrong way and moving more slowly). On the other hand, if the offense has just been stood up on the blue line and they aren't moving with speed, the defensive team is virtually certain to recover.

I think that in the modern game, the only value to dump and chase is as a way to loosen up the defense of they are overcommitting to the blue line and if the offensive team does it right.

But there used to be an old joke that was somthing like: Q:"How can you tell that the player on a breakaway is a Bruin?" A: "He'll throw it into the corner and muck for it."
Probably for another thread, but what was the Bruins' defensive philosophy? I'm not well-versed in hockey Xs and Os but it's a huge part of why I love sports generally. As you point out, hockey has moved into the modern era with analytics and there's not too much creativity (it seems to me anyway, happy to be proven wrong) about what you can do on O. It's basically finding the right balance of dumping to open up the carry-ins from what I can tell. There does seem to be more variety in how aggressive to have D pinch, but I digress.

However, it does seem like D strategy is what dictates 5v5 gameplay. Just writing this all out, I'd also venture to guess that more of the interesting stuff happens in the NZ. The same may be true for O. But if anyone can or wants to take the time to break down the Bruins' broad philosophies from the past season, I'd certainly love to learn about it.
 

Zososoxfan

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From that sportshub article:

Six months before promoting Cassidy, the Bruins threw a $30 million bag at David Backes. That was a year after throwing a bag at Matt Beleskey, and trading (highly affordable) top-six right wing Reilly Smith with his value at its absolute lowest. And during Cassidy’s tenure, the Bruins dropped a combined $84 million on a free agent group that included John Moore, Brett Ritchie, Craig Smith, Mike Reilly, Derek Forbort, Tomas Nosek, Linus Ullmark, Erik Haula, and Nick Foligno.

The Bruins also willingly began almost every season with a bevy of holes on their roster, and relied on Cassidy to find magic formulas in house and with a shallow prospect pool. They willingly walked away from 40 minutes of top-four left-side defensive play in 2020 by letting Torey Krug and Zdeno Chara walk and landed on Forbort and Reilly as the answers after Matt Grzelcyk and Jeremy Lauzon struggled. They went half a season without a third-line center before bringing in Charlie Coyle in 2019. They routinely rotated expired deli meat and Blockbuster rewards card on David Krejci’s wings.

I mean, when Cassidy’s team was on the ropes in the 2019 Stanley Cup Final, Karson Kuhlman was deemed the best available bullet in his chamber. The 2019 Kuhlman Experiment was sandwiched around concussion-derailed and costly runs with Rick Nash and Ondrej Kase. The 2022 postseason saw Chris Wagner and Josh Brown utilized as momentum shifters, and the move back to Trent Frederic late in that first-round series felt a bit like playing violin with half the Titanic in the Atlantic.
Egads
 

RIFan

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If they are making moves with the market in mind the obvious choice would be to resign. I think it would be tough to unify the fanbase on anything as much as we are right now on Sweeney and Neely not being the answer. The "market" wants to wins first and foremost and accountability secondly. You'll always have the segment of fans who bemoan the lack of fighting and big hits, but if they iced a team of Lady Bing contenders that rolled to a cup the fans would completely embrace the team. Winning is all that matters in this market. Style points are nice, but trophies matter more.
 

MiracleOfO2704

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So Fluto is pouring cold water on my theory:

The Bruins are not interested in the old guard — Mike Babcock, Peter DeBoer, Paul Maurice, John Tortorella, as examples — replacing Bruce Cassidy. As hard as they worked, it’s unlikely that assistants Joe Sacco, Kevin Dean or Chris Kelly will be front-line candidates.
If that’s the case, as much as they say they’ll cast a wide net, they’re likely targeting guys that have some kind of ties to the region (Fluto’s top 5 were all either Providence assistants or coached University teams in New England).
 

burstnbloom

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Probably for another thread, but what was the Bruins' defensive philosophy? I'm not well-versed in hockey Xs and Os but it's a huge part of why I love sports generally. As you point out, hockey has moved into the modern era with analytics and there's not too much creativity (it seems to me anyway, happy to be proven wrong) about what you can do on O. It's basically finding the right balance of dumping to open up the carry-ins from what I can tell. There does seem to be more variety in how aggressive to have D pinch, but I digress.

However, it does seem like D strategy is what dictates 5v5 gameplay. Just writing this all out, I'd also venture to guess that more of the interesting stuff happens in the NZ. The same may be true for O. But if anyone can or wants to take the time to break down the Bruins' broad philosophies from the past season, I'd certainly love to learn about it.
Their general system is a hybrid zone/man system which funnels the rush to the walls and grinds on the end boards to flush the puck out the other way. The Center has a lot of responsibility below the hash marks to support the D so they are never out numbered by the forwards. It severely minimizes the opponents ability to get inside and get dangerous chances. It's also why its so hard to play center in this system.
 

burstnbloom

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They're stuck in that 1990 mentality. My God.

I love this team but I hate this team. They'll resist modern hockey even if it kills them. Don wouldn't take a guy like Johnny Gaudreau on this team because he's small. Idiots.
I just watched the video of this exchange and I think Ty was being a little unfair posting this. Don compared MacDeirmid and Reaves. One is not being played in the playoffs and the other is taking a shift. He feels like team toughness is essential and they want to be a more difficult team to play against but he doesn't want to sacrifice speed and skill for toughness. I'd argue that you're doing that with Reavo, but hey. I agree with him, for what its worth. Give me a team of Marcus Foligno's and I'll be happy and we will win a lot. But I'm all set with adding scrappers just to add them.
 

RedOctober3829

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I just watched the video of this exchange and I think Ty was being a little unfair posting this. Don compared MacDeirmid and Reaves. One is not being played in the playoffs and the other is taking a shift. He feels like team toughness is essential and they want to be a more difficult team to play against but he doesn't want to sacrifice speed and skill for toughness. I'd argue that you're doing that with Reavo, but hey. I agree with him, for what its worth. Give me a team of Marcus Foligno's and I'll be happy and we will win a lot. But I'm all set with adding scrappers just to add them.
Reaves was part of a couple additions the Rangers made this offseason to add toughness to an already talent-laden roster. Don adds these types when they need more talent.
 

burstnbloom

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Reaves was part of a couple additions the Rangers made this offseason to add toughness to an already talent-laden roster. Don adds these types when they need more talent.
Ya, I thought that was a bit misguided by Drury and the additions to that purpose (Reaves, Goodrow, Blais) were largely disastrous. Blais got almost immediately hurt and Buchnevich had an outstanding season in St. Louis. Reaves had 3 fights, and was one of the worst possession players in hockey and Goodrow was deployed as a defensive specialist and got absolutely caved in to a 44% xG. he did have some good GF fortune with a 1.042 PDO and a 10% on ice shooting percentage that made it look better than it was, but it was bad. What a weird hockey team. Lots of words to say they added those "tough" players and they really haven't done anything good.
 

veritas

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I think Cassidy is a good coach and given the information I have, I would have kept him. Six years is an eternity for an NHL coaching job though, and I can certainly see reasons they might have wanted to move in another direction. Reading between the lines, he might not be the easiest guy to work with. Not just players either, the head coach interacts with a lot of people in the organization. It's tough to tell how much he actually gives a shit about analytics. He didn't seem to see eye to eye with the front office, whether he's right or wrong, that's not a good situation for anyone.

Assuming they don't mess up the next hire, I really don't think it matters much either way. How many points do people think the best head coach in the league is worth? And Cassidy? I don't think there's a coach worth 10 points in the standings above a replacement level coach. And I think Cassidy is probably worth 3-4 points. Given the status of the organization, they should expect to be able to hire another above average coach. This is not letting a star player go and not replacing them. It's going to be fine.

I also don't agree that this hasn't been a very talented team. They have been very talented and very successful. Sucks they haven't won a cup, it's really hard to do. A team can not win the cup in 6 years and it doesn't have to be anyone's fault. 31 other teams fail every year too. Most of them fail a lot harder than the Bruins have.
 

burstnbloom

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I think Cassidy is a good coach and given the information I have, I would have kept him. Six years is an eternity for an NHL coaching job though, and I can certainly see reasons they might have wanted to move in another direction. Reading between the lines, he might not be the easiest guy to work with. Not just players either, the head coach interacts with a lot of people in the organization. It's tough to tell how much he actually gives a shit about analytics. He didn't seem to see eye to eye with the front office, whether he's right or wrong, that's not a good situation for anyone.

Assuming they don't mess up the next hire, I really don't think it matters much either way. How many points do people think the best head coach in the league is worth? And Cassidy? I don't think there's a coach worth 10 points in the standings above a replacement level coach. And I think Cassidy is probably worth 3-4 points. Given the status of the organization, they should expect to be able to hire another above average coach. This is not letting a star player go and not replacing them. It's going to be fine.

I also don't agree that this hasn't been a very talented team
. They have been very talented and very successful. Sucks they haven't won a cup, it's really hard to do. A team can not win the cup in 6 years and it doesn't have to be anyone's fault. 31 other teams fail every year too. Most of them fail a lot harder than the Bruins have.
This is a good point. We all say this a lot but hte truth is, the bruins have a lot of way above average to elite players. The problem is they are paying a premium for a lot of other average to below average players and when we talk about it, we sometimes mush them together.
 

kenneycb

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They're stuck in that 1990 mentality. My God.

I love this team but I hate this team. They'll resist modern hockey even if it kills them. Don wouldn't take a guy like Johnny Gaudreau on this team because he's small. Idiots.
They just drafted Lysell in the 1st round and he's listed as 1 inch taller and 7 lbs heavier than Gaudreau per their HockeyDB profiles.
 

Haunted

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There’s literally no doubt in my mind that they’re going to trade him at the draft for a “package” of big stiffs that’s going to make the Seguin deal look good.
How very Bruins of them - trade a quarter for three nickels and insist that 3 > 1, therefore you won.
 

MiracleOfO2704

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As misguided as Sweeney may be, I’d like to think even he isn’t dumb enough to make that kind of trade and expect there not to be a fan riot on Causeway. My only misgiving is that Scott Bradley is still a voice in the room, and he can trace his roots to the Sinden days.
 

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I am already locked into next season's tickets with two payments made. Ticket rep said no opt out available either until next renewals. Fuck me.

I don't think they'd be so dumb as to move Pastrnak without talking to him, but what do I know. It's not clear what level of rot we're dealing with from this FO, but it's starting to stink.
 

MiracleOfO2704

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Also, I love me some Pete, but that tweet was pretty fucking irresponsible, considering Fluto later draws a line to Sweeney’s trade of Milan Lucic, a 27-year-old forward whose game promised to age like sun-kissed milk. The only thing that points to a trade is the one anonymous source.
 

FL4WL3SS

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From that sportshub article:



Egads
Ffs, when it's spelled out like that. Gross.

I've been really sour on the roster the last two summers and the writing was on the wall for me, but then Cassidy would work guys magic and I felt like eating crow. But then you look at that and realize that it really was a pile of dog shit.

This Cassidy firing sucks. Sweeney needs to go.
 

amfox1

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I don't think they'd be so dumb as to move Pastrnak without talking to him, but what do I know. It's not clear what level of rot we're dealing with from this FO, but it's starting to stink.
The assumption behind a Pastrnak trade is that he won't agree to re-sign with the Bruins, even at MacAvoy money. Pastrnak can essentially force the Bruins to trade him.

I could definitely see a trade of Pastrnak at the draft if Bergeron, as expected, retires. #2 overall pick and NJD prospect Alexander Holtz, for instance. Two high-ceiling prospects for a player who may leave as a FA after next season.
 

RedOctober3829

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Ya, I thought that was a bit misguided by Drury and the additions to that purpose (Reaves, Goodrow, Blais) were largely disastrous. Blais got almost immediately hurt and Buchnevich had an outstanding season in St. Louis. Reaves had 3 fights, and was one of the worst possession players in hockey and Goodrow was deployed as a defensive specialist and got absolutely caved in to a 44% xG. he did have some good GF fortune with a 1.042 PDO and a 10% on ice shooting percentage that made it look better than it was, but it was bad. What a weird hockey team. Lots of words to say they added those "tough" players and they really haven't done anything good.
I consume a lot of Rangers content given my in laws are fans and their commentators give a lot of credit to Goodrow for being a key locker room presence for a largely young team. Since being back off injury in the playoffs, it seems like their PK has been stabilized as well. Buchnevich was not going to be re-signed in NY due to the amount of young players needed to be taken care of. Reaves is what is he is. My overall point is two of these players are complimentary in Blais and Reaves for cheap. Goodrow is the Sweeney lookalike except Sweeney has made this mistake over and over and Goodrow is not the big splash counted on for a big offensive impact like Backes and Foligno. Thanks Donny.
 

burstnbloom

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The assumption behind a Pastrnak trade is that he won't agree to re-sign with the Bruins, even at MacAvoy money. Pastrnak can essentially force the Bruins to trade him.

I could definitely see a trade of Pastrnak at the draft if Bergeron, as expected, retires. #2 overall pick and NJD prospect Alexander Holtz, for instance. Two high-ceiling prospects for a player who may leave as a FA after next season.
I mean…I would actually do that. Cooley is legit and Holtz could score 30 next year. It’s risky and I love Pasta, but I’d do this.
 

Salem's Lot

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The assumption behind a Pastrnak trade is that he won't agree to re-sign with the Bruins, even at MacAvoy money. Pastrnak can essentially force the Bruins to trade him.

I could definitely see a trade of Pastrnak at the draft if Bergeron, as expected, retires. #2 overall pick and NJD prospect Alexander Holtz, for instance. Two high-ceiling prospects for a player who may leave as a FA after next season.
Why does New Jersey make that trade without an extension? And why wouldn’t Pastrnak just go to UFA instead of playing in that shit hole?
 

burstnbloom

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I consume a lot of Rangers content given my in laws are fans and their commentators give a lot of credit to Goodrow for being a key locker room presence for a largely young team. Since being back off injury in the playoffs, it seems like their PK has been stabilized as well. Buchnevich was not going to be re-signed in NY due to the amount of young players needed to be taken care of. Reaves is what is he is. My overall point is two of these players are complimentary in Blais and Reaves for cheap. Goodrow is the Sweeney lookalike except Sweeney has made this mistake over and over and Goodrow is not the big splash counted on for a big offensive impact like Backes and Foligno. Thanks Donny.
same actually, and I usually just say “that’s a lot of money for intangibles.”
 

Dummy Hoy

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Fluto has reverted back to Eyeore this year…he’s really been enjoy writing the columns that freak everyone out.
 

Jordu

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Jacobs needs to take out his MontBlanc pen and start writing contract offers to Pastrnak. A good place to start would be 8/80.

A goal-scorer of his abilities and record is not replaceable. He’s a player you build a team around. They need to make sure he stays in Boston.
 

cshea

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I don’t have an Athletic sub but is it based on anything outside a source close to Pasta?
I think it’s mostly conjecture based on Pastrnak’s contract status and the state of the team. I adore Pasta, he is one of my favorite players of all time. 50-goal scored, great personality and ambassador for the sport, league and team. I’d love nothing more than to sign him to an 8-year, $88 million extension. But if they approach him and he’s hesitant to commit or tells them he wants to leave, they have to have trade conversations for him.
 

Myt1

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I don’t have an Athletic sub but is it based on anything outside a source close to Pasta?
I love The Athletic and really like Fluto.

It’s not a good article. Smells of manic content production, TBH.
 

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I think it’s mostly conjecture based on Pastrnak’s contract status and the state of the team. I adore Pasta, he is one of my favorite players of all time. 50-goal scored, great personality and ambassador for the sport, league and team. I’d love nothing more than to sign him to an 8-year, $88 million extension. But if they approach him and he’s hesitant to commit or tells them he wants to leave, they have to have trade conversations for him.
I would rather lose him in free agency then get whatever overpaid dreck that Sweeney/Neely would get in return in a trade.
 

kenneycb

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That's stupid asset management.

The dourness in this thread is painful to read and more reminiscent of a game thread when they go down 2-1 in a playoff series. Note, that is not an endorsement of Sweeney but I don't think he's turning them into the Harold Ballard era Maple Leafs that some are resigning the Bruins to.
 

Ale Xander

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I am already locked into next season's tickets with two payments made. Ticket rep said no opt out available either until next renewals. Fuck me.

I don't think they'd be so dumb as to move Pastrnak without talking to him, but what do I know. It's not clear what level of rot we're dealing with from this FO, but it's starting to stink.
if people are already locked then it’s like 95% there’s an ugly rebuild. They don’t have anything to lose now. Fans lose all the leverage after renewal date.