Cade to Black: 2021 NBA Draft Thread
- Thread starter Kliq
- Start date
Tacko or Waters is gone and their 2nd is going on a 2way most likely.
About trading Jaylen, I think setting the clock back several years will not go over well with Tatum.
I'd think Yam is taking up one of those 2 ways but maybe not. He was trying to get out of his contract last I heard.
Pistons getting #1 is a feel-good outcome, they have been in the wilderness a while. As opposed to the Houston insta-tank or Cavs getting ANOTHER horseshoe up their ass.
Because they mortgaged their draft future for a lottery protected Wizards' #1 and the right to pay John Wall the GNP of Bolivia. If they'd landed #1 there's no way they make the deal, but as their draft future otherwise relies on the mediocre '22 draft they might give real consideration to swapping Jalen Green for Jalen Brown.
Its a 2023-4 problem if their pick even pans out. Think about anything from two years ago...its a lifetime.
In hopes of what? Competing for a spot in the play in game for a couple of years before Brown shoots his way out of town?
At the same time, I really can't see why the Celtics would break up a team that is a legitimate finals contender next year if they get the depth signings right, and dealing their second best player for a guy who Might be as good as Brown in 4 seasons (and as all draft picks has a complete bust downside), and yes I know this opens cap space
Because after '23 their draft belongs to OKC. So putting together a competitive team today helps the franchise long term. Not everyone is looking to process the shit out of their rebuild. For a team like Houston it's not even a real option as the '22 draft isn't very good. Morey made some bad decisions at the end, but about one thing he was right, the toughest part of building an NBA team is finding the first star.
Yeah, Jaylen is on a good contract and has value either as a 2nd or 3rd fiddle to Tatum or in trade for a current star. You only trade him for a draft pick if you’re committing to a rebuild and/or to pissing off Tatum.
Man, I thought so too for much of the year......then he went like a month and a half when he looks as uncomfortable and hesitant shooting the ball as Ben Simmons. I’m talking uncontested 3’s in the flow on secondary breaks. I’m not saying he’s a Ben or Markelle but he absolutely showed signs of the yips if you were paying attention to him (and I was).
Why would they be exclusive? Their pick this year had nothing to do with the Harden trade. I guess maybe they lost a few more games, but that's parsing it way too much for something as luck based as the lottery.
It’s lottery luck but they would not have been bad enough to land in the top five if they took those other players. They would have been mediocre. Maybe I’m giving the GM too much credit but it seems like the goal was to be as bad possible to keep their pick this year.
I doubt the difference between having a partial season of Allen and a more partial season of Levert (remember he missed a bunch of time with the pacers) and the partial seasons of Oladipo and then Olynyk they got would have been the 5 extra wins they needed to not end up with a top 2 pick.
Way back when I made the joke that Houston’s best use of Simmons would be to move him to OKC to get their drafts back (plus some of OKC’s prospects since the Thunder would mistakenly view themselves as competitive and that the trade would have required Horford coming to Houston). And Houston just might have been better off with Tyrese Maxey and Lou Dort as running mates for Jalen Green.
On a more serious note, as much as I love Green, I might be looking to let Orlando have him for #5, #8, whatever else you can get (I’d settle for swapping John Wall for Gary Harris and Terrence Ross) and use those picks on Scottie Barnes and one of the Johnsons (Jalen or Keon).
Don’t we want the highest ceiling talent we can get? That’s Green, for me. We can suck again next year and land another high pick. Trading down doesn’t seem like the right strategy.
Let’s see what we can get for Wood. Will the Warriors give up Wiseman for him? Maybe we throw in another first round pick or two. The Warriors have a timeline.
Wiseman + Green + another high ceiling wing next year. That’s the best route for being a title-challenging team IMO.
Let’s see what we can get for Wood. Will the Warriors give up Wiseman for him? Maybe we throw in another first round pick or two. The Warriors have a timeline.
Wiseman + Green + another high ceiling wing next year. That’s the best route for being a title-challenging team IMO.
I completely agree with you on Green, he’s #2 on my board. But Barnes is #3 on my board, and I might swap out Green for Barnes with the right mix of extras because I think there’s a non-zero chance that he ends up being the best player from this pool (even though Cade almost certainly wears that crown).
Wiseman straight up for Wood is more than a fair deal for GSW, if you so desire.
With the Warriors timeline, they should be adding another asset (like Poole)
Last edited:
I hear you but that is a bit too cute for me---you just don't know how the team will perform. If you wanted to tank you could trade for Simmons (for all his warts still the best single asset they had available) and sat him a bunch.
Whether they made the right choice will be a function of Simmons development with a new team/in a new situation and how those picks turn out
When you are moving down to 18 if you miss the top 4, and the top of the draft is really good, you need to get a bit cute and a bit lucky.
2-way/Red Claw choices for 2021-22:
1. Quentin Grimes 2nd round / #45
2. Charles Bassey undrafted rookie FA
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbtjFH8bB2o
CB is a good FT shooter, started launching 3s this past season, 7'3" wingspan, good defender, athletic, 20.5
http://www.tankathon.com/players/charles-bassey
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Bassey
1. Quentin Grimes 2nd round / #45
2. Charles Bassey undrafted rookie FA
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbtjFH8bB2o
CB is a good FT shooter, started launching 3s this past season, 7'3" wingspan, good defender, athletic, 20.5
http://www.tankathon.com/players/charles-bassey
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Bassey
I use the Tankathon mock site since they have adv #s, video, its short/compact and it doesn't have tons of ads.
They have Bassey out of the draft and #60 on their Big Board
http://www.tankathon.com/mock_draft
http://www.tankathon.com/big_board
The mocks are pretty inconsistent in regards to late 1sts/2nds (@nighthob is more attuned to this stuff than most of the professional sites). For example, all the mocks had Immanuel Quickley going in the 2nd round last season, and he jumped off the page to a lot of us. He turned out to be a good late 1st by the Knicks. It's the same with Quentin Grimes this season IMO.
also BIGs do have a tendency to be dropping in recent drafts with the plethora of fungible/experienced 5s signing cheap/short deals at the NBA level
yea you're right, ESPN has Bassey going in the late First Round to the Lakers
https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/31639869/2021-nba-mock-draft-projections-all-60-picks-lottery
Neither the Ringer (KOC) or CBS mock him in the First Round. Bleacher Report has him going very early in the 2nd round (but Queta at #57)
You're probably right to suspect Bassey is too talented, he should be drafted.
His advanced metrics are excellent. He's 2-time Conf. USA defensive POY, can shoot, with size/athleticism.
If he makes it to 45, he'd be a nice pick and sent to Maine for the first few months. Mostly I want the C's to use one of their 2-ways on a BIG since TL /Horford will need rest and want some cheap depth there.
Last edited:
I like Bassey and originally thought a development big would be a good add, but I think we've added Brown in that role, so I'd go with someone like Grimes.
I’m hoping that Duke slips to #45. I like Grimes, but he’s basically Nesmith Lite Ice. Duke has the quickness to defend 1s and the length/strength to be switchable (6’4” 205 with a +4/+5 wingspan). He handles the ball well enough to get the ball across mid court and hand it off to the JayCrew. He’s sort of an ideal 3&D combo guard for the modern game.
I agree. His people here in Providence think he might get drafted a lot higher than where he’s being mocked.
I'm intrigued by Herbert Jones. I feel like he fits the profile of a guy who contributes from a mid second round pick (a rarity). He has NBA size, athleticism and impressive wingspan, seems to project as a guy who can defend at the NBA level. His passing stats look very strong for a guy his size. He lasted to a senior despite the physical profile because his shot was terrible. Last year he looks to have fixed something, shot a respectable 35% from 3 on by far his highest volume, 71% from the line on career high volume as well. I like guys who have the athleticism and appear to be NBA ready on one side of the ball, those are usually the guys who make it in the 2nd. If he can defend and be a plus passer on the wing, he just needs to shoot 35%+ from 3 to be a contributor.
Yup I’m in this boat too. I see him long long gone by 45. Grimes does nothing for me as he’s redundant with Pritchard and his upside can be acquired via FA with a cheap vet who is ready to step in right away.
View: https://twitter.com/chadfordinsider/status/1409564352689053696
Not a lot in there for non-subscribers.
Not a lot in there for non-subscribers.
Yup, I like Jones too. I think he can be a a little bit like Josh Jackson, if JJ had better basketball character. I think he'll defend and be versatile on that end of the court. Like you said, he can handle the ball and create for others. Looks like he can make an open 3, even if mechanically it's not the prettiest shot. But as an energy wing who plays hard, defends, and has some skill--you can do a lot worse in the mid 2nd round.
damn
Quentin Grimes #1 on Combine winners
Grimes was considered a potential lottery pick coming out of high school. But a rough freshman year at Kansas followed by a transfer to Houston dropped his stock significantly. He’s been slowly climbing up boards all year with elite shooting, tough defense and an unselfish approach to the game.
His strong showing at the combine should give his draft stock another bounce onto the bubble of the first round. He scored a combine-high 27 points in his second game after posting 12 points, 6 rebounds and 3 assists in the first game. Grimes ended up shooting 9-for-14 from 3-point land in those two games and showed off the playmaking that teams saw in high school but didn’t see much in college.
NBA teams are looking for guards who can play and defend both backcourt positions and shoot the rock. Grimes was likely to be a late second-round pick before the combine. Did he do enough to crack the first round at the combine? Based on his background, excellent stats this past season at Houston (one of the best teams in the country) and performance on the court, I’d say yes.
Grimes will be a + defender. He's much bigger/stronger than Pritchard, will be over a year younger when drafted and cheaper. But doubt Grimes is there at 45
My problem with Jones is that jumpers that bad rarely work against the increased speed of the NBA game. If he committed himself to being Drew Hanlen’s adopted son and completely rebuilding the jumper (right now he looks like he shotputs the basketball in the direction of the hoop) he could be an actual rotational player (read Semi replacement+).
I know he shot .351 from three last year, but it was on so few shots to likely be nothing more than statistical noise.
I have to take a closer look at Scottie Lewis, his measurements are weird, he’s 6’4” with an absurd +8 wingspan, but only an 8’6” standing reach. Which doesn’t seem a lot. But he’s my next deep dive on film.