Celtics vs. Warriors, NBA Finals

Who you got?

  • Celtics in 4

    Votes: 6 1.5%
  • Celtics in 5

    Votes: 18 4.6%
  • Celtics in 6

    Votes: 146 37.2%
  • Celtics in 7

    Votes: 127 32.4%
  • Warriors in 4

    Votes: 1 0.3%
  • Warriors in 5

    Votes: 23 5.9%
  • Warriors in 6

    Votes: 56 14.3%
  • Warriors in 7

    Votes: 15 3.8%

  • Total voters
    392
  • Poll closed .

chilidawg

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Tatum moved well without the ball on a couple possessions. The thing with Smart is if he gets the ball out of a double he needs to try to attack the basket and try to get a layup/create contact/create for others. Chucking up 3’s is not the answer especially if he’s not shooting it well.
He was 3-7 from 3 before the last couple of minutes. And how many times do you see a guy miss a shot, get it right back on an offensive rebound then nail it? Those 3's were great looks for late game offense.
 

Beale13

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What this team could really use is White figuring out how to shoot threes again, but I'm not holding my breath for that to happen in the course of the next few weeks.
7-15 over his last two games though. 0-2 from three the game before that but 6-6 on two-point shots. Obviously a stupidly small sample size but reason for some hope that he could be getting a little bit hot.
 

SteveF

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Golden State can't really pressure the ball/passing lanes as well as Miami, nor can they wall off the paint as well as Milwaukee. I think they've been notably worse on defense than they were in the regular season primarily because playoff basketball is more matchup oriented and they have players that can be attacked on the defensive end.

GSW compensated for this by being elite on offense. They've made more concerted efforts to get out in transition/secondary transition even after made baskets and getting out in transition will be pretty key to them scoring points. I don't really anticipate Golden State being able to light the Celtics up in the half-court, but I am very concerned about the Celtics transition defense in this series.

Tatum is going to need to play better and faster. He needs to get the matchup he wants and attack it immediately. He was slow to make decisions in that Miami series. Had he gotten the ball and attacked immediately he might have been able to beat the double teams instead of inviting them and passing as often as he was. If GSW wants to double, force an immediate hard double above the 3 point line if GSW wants to sell out and make an immediate pass. Otherwise, get the ball and fucking go.
 
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coremiller

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Golden State can't really pressure the ball/passing lanes as well as Miami, nor can they wall off the paint as well as Milwaukee. I think they've been notably worse on defense than they were in the regular season primarily because playoff basketball is more matchup oriented and they have players that can be attacked on the defensive end.

GSW compensated for this by being elite on offense. They've made more concerted efforts to get out in transition/secondary transition even after made baskets and getting out in transition will be pretty key to them scoring points. I don't really anticipate Golden State being able to light the Celtics up in the half-court, but I am very concerned about the Celtics transition defense in this series.

Tatum is going to need to play better and faster. He needs to get the matchup he wants and attack it immediately. He was slow to make decisions in that Miami series. Had he gotten the ball and attacked immediately he might have been able to beat the double teams instead of inviting them and passing as often as he was. If GSW wants to double, force an immediate hard double above the 3 point line if GSW wants to sell out and make an immediate pass. Otherwise, get the ball and fucking go.
Re GSW in transition, whether Gary Payton II can play could have an effect here, because he led the whole league in Steals/36 mins.
 

lars10

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I love Smart, but he can’t be taking the most shots on the team in the 4th quarter of these games like he was the last two. Tatum is almost too willing to pass it out of the double teams. There’s got to be something done schematically to get him away from doubles. If he has to pass it, where’s JB to come get it instead of Smart?
I think Smart should be more willing to set screens.. as it is I think he’s trying to get open at the three point line (or is already open) to get a pass back so he can shoot. I think he drastically overvalues his shooting ability. Tatum passes to a fault when he faces a double team.. Ime and by extension Smart need to figure out how to get him open.
 

Double Down Trent

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Timelord got his bone bruise game 3 against Milwaukee on May 7th. June 2nd will be nearly a month. He missed the next 4 games and then came back game 1 against Miami and has been questionable every game since.

Does anyone have any insight on whether it's the kind of injury that needs significant time off to heel? It seemed like he was progressing in the right direction until game 7, where it looked like the injury took a step back.
 

Spelunker

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Timelord got his bone bruise game 3 against Milwaukee on May 7th. June 2nd will be nearly a month. He missed the next 4 games and then came back game 1 against Miami and has been questionable every game since.

Does anyone have any insight on whether it's the kind of injury that needs significant time off to heel? It seemed like he was progressing in the right direction until game 7, where it looked like the injury took a step back.
That timeline is why I'm worried this is more the knee / meniscus than the bone bruise.
 

NomarsFool

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One of the things that concerns me a bit is that the players have such lousy seats sitting on the bench. I don't even have a meniscus tear, nor am I 6' 8" but if I was sitting next to TimeLord during a basketball game I think I'd have knee soreness by the end of it. Now you add in the cross country travel, and not to go all Roger Clemens on you - but carrying your luggage and stuff - and part of me would like to see TL take the first two games of the series off and just stay in Boston.

I mean, none of us are having conversations with him or the trainers to know what's going on with him, of course, but as others have said - maybe we steal a game in SF, and then have a "healthy" TL back for the next 5 games.
 

Red Averages

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It’s possible the medical team for the Celtics might be operating with better medical expertise and player specific information than us speculating, so why not trust that they are taking the right steps instead of guessing on him flying/not flying to maybe or maybe not get better in 3 more days? Seems to me if he can’t fly across the country he’d need more rest than 3 days, but I’m not a doctor….
 

chilidawg

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It’s possible the medical team for the Celtics might be operating with better medical expertise and player specific information than us speculating, so why not trust that they are taking the right steps instead of guessing on him flying/not flying to maybe or maybe not get better in 3 more days? Seems to me if he can’t fly across the country he’d need more rest than 3 days, but I’m not a doctor….
Cuz it's teh interwebz and it's what we do?
 

lexrageorge

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It’s possible the medical team for the Celtics might be operating with better medical expertise and player specific information than us speculating, so why not trust that they are taking the right steps instead of guessing on him flying/not flying to maybe or maybe not get better in 3 more days? Seems to me if he can’t fly across the country he’d need more rest than 3 days, but I’m not a doctor….
Uninformed bashing of the Celtics medical staff is sometimes used here to fill the time between games.
 

Gash Prex

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Oh I remember Steph’s bullshit from a few years ago against the Cs - I’ve disliked him ever since (despite the general love for Steph in the NBA).
 

TripleOT

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The Celtics need to knock Curry around. When he drives, put the wood to him and put him on the deck. Attack him when on offense, and run him into picks. If he’s covering Smart, spread the floor and take him into the paint.
 

Ale Xander

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Oh I remember Steph’s bullshit from a few years ago against the Cs - I’ve disliked him ever since (despite the general love for Steph in the NBA).
Not sure if everyone knows but Steph had his bachelor party at Fenway Park (and is a huge Red Sox fan)
 

InstaFace

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Not sure if everyone knows but Steph had his bachelor party at Fenway Park (and is a huge Red Sox fan)
Well, he can at least catch them in Oakland this upcoming Friday and Saturday nights. The only chance he'll have to see them in Fenway is before Game 6 (on the 16th), as the Sox play the As at home on Tues the 14th and Weds the 15th.

Who wouldn't enjoy the reaction to him showing up at an Athletics-Red Sox game, in the middle of a Celtics-Warriors NBA Finals, while wearing a Red Sox hat? All the right heads would explode.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Oh I remember Steph’s bullshit from a few years ago against the Cs - I’ve disliked him ever since (despite the general love for Steph in the NBA).
Jaylen was the rookie who was running his mouth to Curry and Steph shut him up with that shot. I don’t know why Jaylen would be upset and Steph as it was the other way around at the time.
 

Eddie Jurak

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Will the Celtics need to play smaller against the Warriors? (i.e., can their 2 big lineups be exploited)? If so, will that test their depth? They only have 5 backhander/wings in the regular rotation, one of whom is not part of their best defensive team. Or will it play the other way - will the Warriors be unable to exploit the Celtics bigger frontourts?
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Thought this was a fun read: Tatum's Celtics can give Steph's Warriors fits LeBron's Cavs couldn't.

Singular superstars no longer faze a Warriors team that took three out of four Finals from LeBron James, perhaps the greatest postseason test-prep tool of them all. A squad that survives the tactical brilliance and physical onslaught of James can confidently face off with anyone and say, "We've seen worse."
Through those five consecutive trips to the Finals from 2015 to 2019, the Warriors core went toe to toe with the best the league had to offer—in all shapes and sizes. They derailed a potential dynasty in Oklahoma City, turned Grit and Grind to dust in Memphis, prevented Harden from one-man-showing his way to a ring in Houston and denied James the extra titles that would have put the GOAT debate to bed.
What could these Celtics possibly offer that Golden State hasn't seen (and solved) before?
 

Sam Ray Not

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Not sure if everyone knows but Steph had his bachelor party at Fenway Park (and is a huge Red Sox fan)
And of course is just a stellar all-around dude. I get the annoyance with how he expresses joy on the court (shimmying etc.) but calling out another player the way he did there to Jaylen is pretty anomalous for him. I knew there had to be a backstory; HRB alludes to it above.
 

Caspir

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Oh I remember Steph’s bullshit from a few years ago against the Cs - I’ve disliked him ever since (despite the general love for Steph in the NBA).
Not shown was seven seconds earlier where Brown was literally slamming the ground with his hands like a maniac calling him out.

If that made you do some Curry then you never really liked him.
 

Auger34

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And of course is just a stellar all-around dude. I get the annoyance with how he expresses joy on the court (shimmying etc.) but calling out another player the way he did there to Jaylen is pretty anomalous for him. I knew there had to be a backstory; HRB alludes to it above.
Is that what happened? I honestly have no idea or recollection of that sequence or play. I’m a big Curry fan (and a big Jaylen fan obviously) and the whole thing seems out of character for both (Jaylen talking that much shit to provoke that reaction and Curry mocking a specific player like that)
 

DJnVa

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Jaylen was the rookie who was running his mouth to Curry and Steph shut him up with that shot. I don’t know why Jaylen would be upset and Steph as it was the other way around at the time.
Because young kids/players always get annoyed when they are shown up whether they deserved it or not.
 

lovegtm

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Will the Celtics need to play smaller against the Warriors? (i.e., can their 2 big lineups be exploited)? If so, will that test their depth? They only have 5 backhander/wings in the regular rotation, one of whom is not part of their best defensive team. Or will it play the other way - will the Warriors be unable to exploit the Celtics bigger frontourts?
You don't include Grant as a wing? He's played the wing effectively a decent amount in the playoffs.

In any case, Grant's versatility makes me less concerned on this front.

PP is interesting--if he can find a way to remain playable, that really opens up some things offensively. I'm cautiously optimistic, since the Warriors don't have the guys to back you down or just shoot over you in the midrange (except Klay).
 

Eddie Jurak

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You don't include Grant as a wing? He's played the wing effectively a decent amount in the playoffs.

In any case, Grant's versatility makes me less concerned on this front.
Grant at the wing implies the Celtics are playing their biggest lineup. (2 of Rob, Al, and Theis would have to be in). Will that work against the Warriors or be exploited by the Warriors?
 

Kliq

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We are playing in a series against Draymond Green; there is no need to turn Steph Curry into a villain here.
 

lovegtm

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Grant at the wing implies the Celtics are playing their biggest lineup. (2 of Rob, Al, and Theis would have to be in). Will that work against the Warriors or be exploited by the Warriors?
Wouldn't it just mean they're playing one of those guys at center?

I think I'm missing something, since I don't see how playing Grant at the wing some forces 2 bigs. You play Al at C for 35-40 mins, Grant at C for 8-13 mins, and Grant plays another ~25 mins on the wing. You don't even have to play Theis if you really don't want to.
 

Eddie Jurak

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Wouldn't it just mean they're playing one of those guys at center?

I think I'm missing something, since I don't see how playing Grant at the wing some forces 2 bigs. You play Al at C for 35-40 mins, Grant at C for 8-13 mins, and Grant plays another ~25 mins on the wing. You don't even have to play Theis if you really don't want to.
I think of wing as being the 2 and the 3. Like, I do not say "the Celtics regular starting lineup features Rob at C and Hoford on the wing (or vice versa)." If Grant is playig the 4 he's a big, to me, even if a small one.
 

lovegtm

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I think of wing as being the 2 and the 3. Like, I do not say "the Celtics regular starting lineup features Rob at C and Hoford on the wing (or vice versa)." If Grant is playig the 4 he's a big, to me, even if a small one.
Ah, ok, got it. In that case, I think they'll be fine, since there are 5 guys playing the 1-3, although Tatum will spend some time at the 4 too.

Obviously health is a concern, since they can't make that work if one more guys at the 1-3 goes down.
 

Gash Prex

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Jaylen was the rookie who was running his mouth to Curry and Steph shut him up with that shot. I don’t know why Jaylen would be upset and Steph as it was the other way around at the time.
Not shown was seven seconds earlier where Brown was literally slamming the ground with his hands like a maniac calling him out.

If that made you do some Curry then you never really liked him.
I have zero idea where you are both getting that from and I re-checked every source on the interwebs I could find to make sure I wasn't misremembering.

“I was a bit surprised,” Brown told reporters after the game, per the Boston Herald. “I didn?t say a word to him. I promise I didn?t say a word to him. I was just out there playing D, doing my job. He looked at me and starting doing whatever. But, I mean, they needed that energy to get them going. I?m just glad we got the win tonight.”
https://www.celticslife.com/2017/03/why-was-steph-curry-chirping-and.html

https://www.mercurynews.com/2017/03/09/watch-why-did-stephen-curry-taunt-celtics-rookie-so-much/

https://nesn.com/2017/03/fired-up-steph-curry-taunted-jaylen-brown-before-being-held-scoreless-in-fourth/


Jaylen called the Warriors out for showboating in a Nov 2016 game at the garden in the media.
 

lovegtm

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I have zero idea where you are both getting that from and I re-checked every source on the interwebs I could find to make sure I wasn't misremembering.



https://www.celticslife.com/2017/03/why-was-steph-curry-chirping-and.html

https://www.mercurynews.com/2017/03/09/watch-why-did-stephen-curry-taunt-celtics-rookie-so-much/

https://nesn.com/2017/03/fired-up-steph-curry-taunted-jaylen-brown-before-being-held-scoreless-in-fourth/


Jaylen called the Warriors out for showboating in a Nov 2016 game at the garden in the media.
I watched the game; Jaylen was pounding the floor right before, as mentioned. It happened as the Warriors were crossing halfcourt, iirc.
 

TripleOT

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Thought this was a fun read: Tatum's Celtics can give Steph's Warriors fits LeBron's Cavs couldn't.

Singular superstars no longer faze a Warriors team that took three out of four Finals from LeBron James, perhaps the greatest postseason test-prep tool of them all. A squad that survives the tactical brilliance and physical onslaught of James can confidently face off with anyone and say, "We've seen worse."
Through those five consecutive trips to the Finals from 2015 to 2019, the Warriors core went toe to toe with the best the league had to offer—in all shapes and sizes. They derailed a potential dynasty in Oklahoma City, turned Grit and Grind to dust in Memphis, prevented Harden from one-man-showing his way to a ring in Houston and denied James the extra titles that would have put the GOAT debate to bed.
What could these Celtics possibly offer that Golden State hasn't seen (and solved) before?
The two times they solved the tactical brilliance of LeBron, he was playing either without, or with injured, second and third bananas. The one time he had them healthy, he beat the Warriors. They got past the Rockets sans a healthy CP3. Two of those title teams featured KD.

If the Celtics have to play without Jaylen Brown and Al Horford, I’m sure the Warriors could vanquish Tatum.

Now let’s discuss how the Warriors lost to Toronto after two of their four best players had a leg destroyed.
 

lovegtm

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The two times they solved the tactical brilliance of LeBron, he was playing either without, or with injured, second and third bananas. The one time he had them healthy, he beat the Warriors. They got past the Rockets sans a healthy CP3. Two of those title teams featured KD.

If the Celtics have to play without Jaylen Brown and Al Horford, I’m sure the Warriors could vanquish Tatum.

Now let’s discuss how the Warriors lost to Toronto after two of their four best players had a leg destroyed.
"I would simply have prime KD, Steph, Draymond and Klay on my team, and thus handle anything the opposition could throw at me. I think your favorite team should just do that if they want to be light-years ahead, like us"
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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The two times they solved the tactical brilliance of LeBron, he was playing either without, or with injured, second and third bananas. The one time he had them healthy, he beat the Warriors. They got past the Rockets sans a healthy CP3. Two of those title teams featured KD.

If the Celtics have to play without Jaylen Brown and Al Horford, I’m sure the Warriors could vanquish Tatum.

Now let’s discuss how the Warriors lost to Toronto after two of their four best players had a leg destroyed.
Thought it was more of a fun read rather than hard-hitting analysis. I think the main premise of the article - that the Cs present much different problems than what GSW has been facing thus far in the playoffs - is true.

However, the main reason I'm replying is that your bolded sentence brings up an interesting question I heard (credit where credit is due) on a GSW radio podcast I was listening just by chance:

Which team is better, the 2019 Raptors or the 2022 Cs?

Kawhi / Siakam / Lowry / FVV / Gasol / Ibaka / Green / Powell (10 mpg) versus
JT / JB / Marcus / Horford / TL / GW / White / Pritchard (less than 10 mpg).

Healthy, I think the Cs are have more talent but a healthy peak Kawhi probably means TOR was the better playoff basketball team. Unless, of course, JT finds another gear against a less physical GSW team.
 

lovegtm

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Thought it was more of a fun read rather than hard-hitting analysis. I think the main premise of the article - that the Cs present much different problems than what GSW has been facing thus far in the playoffs - is true.

However, the main reason I'm replying is that your bolded sentence brings up an interesting question I heard (credit where credit is due) on a GSW radio podcast I was listening just by chance:

Which team is better, the 2019 Raptors or the 2022 Cs?

Kawhi / Siakam / Lowry / FVV / Gasol / Ibaka / Green / Powell (10 mpg) versus
JT / JB / Marcus / Horford / TL / GW / White / Pritchard (less than 10 mpg).

Healthy, I think the Cs are have more talent but a healthy peak Kawhi probably means TOR was the better playoff basketball team. Unless, of course, JT finds another gear against a less physical GSW team.
I don't think there's as big a gap between 2019 Kawhi and now Tatum as is commonly believed (Tatum is a much, much better passer), and that supporting cast for Toronto was really, really good as a supporting cast.

If healthy, I say Boston, but it's quite close, and mostly based on how the healthy 2022 Celtics have blown out everyone, and have had the top point differential in the playoffs even without health, and playing by far the toughest playoff schedule.
 

BaseballJones

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If the Celtics win it all, it will have to be considered one of the more impressive title runs.

Swept a team with two all time players in KD and KI.

Knocked off the defending NBA champs.

Eliminated the #1 seed, a team that got to the NBA finals two years ago.

And then if they can knock off Golden State too? Holy smokes that would be incredibly impressive. (It already has been)
 

teddykgb

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"I would simply have prime KD, Steph, Draymond and Klay on my team, and thus handle anything the opposition could throw at me. I think your favorite team should just do that if they want to be light-years ahead, like us"
Also didn’t like how they essentially “yadda yadda” the Morant injury. That was a series defining injury.
 

Auger34

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I watched the game; Jaylen was pounding the floor right before, as mentioned. It happened as the Warriors were crossing halfcourt, iirc.
So the only clip I can find shows Bradley guarding Steph before a switch puts Brown on him…Jaylen was pounding the floor guarding someone else?

Again, I have no recollection of that game (I didn’t even remember Curry talking trash) but if Brown was obviously pounding and slapping the floor wouldn’t one of these articles have mentioned it? I mean there’s both Celtics and Warriors coverage linked above and not a single mention of that.

EDIT: I also searched Reddit and no mention of that. Everyone seems to think it’s due to Brown saying after a previous game that they were “disrespectful” and that the Celtics would see them again
 
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Ale Xander

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Well, he can at least catch them in Oakland this upcoming Friday and Saturday nights. The only chance he'll have to see them in Fenway is before Game 6 (on the 16th), as the Sox play the As at home on Tues the 14th and Weds the 15th.

Who wouldn't enjoy the reaction to him showing up at an Athletics-Red Sox game, in the middle of a Celtics-Warriors NBA Finals, while wearing a Red Sox hat? All the right heads would explode.
and the 16th. Day game. Travel day for the A's
 

HomeRunBaker

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Because young kids/players always get annoyed when they are shown up whether they deserved it or not.
Huh? The jawing from Jaylen began well prior to this clip which is why Steph was giving him that mouthy thing with his hands.
 

HomeRunBaker

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I watched the game; Jaylen was pounding the floor right before, as mentioned. It happened as the Warriors were crossing halfcourt, iirc.
Yes and one would assume he was jawing along with that as they go hand in hand……unless you believe that Steph made a hand motions signifying that Brown was being yappy without having said a word which doesn’t pas the smell test. At the end of the day I’d give this exchange zero meaning toward this series as there will be plenty of intensity and jawing from both sides.
 

m0ckduck

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If the Celtics win it all, it will have to be considered one of the more impressive title runs.

Swept a team with two all time players in KD and KI.

Knocked off the defending NBA champs.

Eliminated the #1 seed, a team that got to the NBA finals two years ago.

And then if they can knock off Golden State too? Holy smokes that would be incredibly impressive. (It already has been)
This got me wondering about the toughest postseason slate a team has faced on the way to a title.

The 87 Celtics didn't win, but... jeez:
  • 3-0 sweep against Jordan and the Bulls
  • 7 games against the Bucks (50-32)
  • 7 games against the Pistons (52-30) with Laimbeer and Mahorn trying to injure guys
  • Then, the 65-17 Lakers in the finals
 

Salem's Lot

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This got me wondering about the toughest postseason slate a team has faced on the way to a title.

The 87 Celtics didn't win, but... jeez:
  • 3-0 sweep against Jordan and the Bulls
  • 7 games against the Bucks (50-32)
  • 7 games against the Pistons (52-30) with Laimbeer and Mahorn trying to injure guys
  • Then, the 65-17 Lakers in the finals
With Kevin McHale playing on a broken foot no less.