1. They are talking about Lackey's refusal to acknowledge the crowd at Fenway because of how he was treated by the fans over the last three years. And they're right - John Lackey is a world-class asshole, he was deservedly shit on by fans for his performance (on and off the field) for the previous three seasons, and while he has the right to be aggrieved by the boos he endured, he also is solely responsible for those boos. Even if he throws a no-hitter tonight, John Lackey is still a world-class asshole. He gets cheered for performing well and he was booed for being utterly horrible for the first three years of his Boston tenure. How is that different from any number of John Lackey discussion threads on this site? (hint: it's not)
But not once did Lackey tip his cap when he left the mound at Fenway. As the crowd cheered, the righthander would stare straight ahead as he walked to the dugout, hat firmly on.
For Lackey, no cloying ovation could sweep clear the memories of his first three seasons with the Red Sox.
joe dokes said:Its funny, the people that seem to know him best dont think he's an asshole.
Corsi said:oh my god, the sox are on the eve of a possible world series and these two clowns are talking about how john lackey was an asshole last year and that we should be skeptical of the numbers ortiz is putting up. CAN WE ENJOY ANYTHING FOR EVEN TWO FREAKING MINUTES????
No problem from me. Obviously I only coment on what I read here, and that's a fair ground for taking shots. Ironically (I think), my lack of listening to them anymore, yet commenting on them anyway, isnt a whole lot diferent than calling Lackey an "asshole" or his actions "unprofessional." He was mediocre, then when he was probably hurt, he really sucked. And while dumping his wife may be enough to say "he's an asshole," that really is all we know about the guy (other than the fact that his teammates seem to like him). I guess I'm loathe to judge someone's person -- for good OR bad -- based on so little info. As for whether he's using "our" hate as motivation, that's a nice narrative.soxfan121 said:
Does his ex-wife count in your analysis?
I know I'm going to regret this but I think it's time that people who don't listen to the show shut the fuck up and stop posting in this thread. Nothing personal joe dokes, because today is the first time I've noticed your username. But shut the fuck up. It pains me that people who don't listen feel compelled to chime in on something they don't know anything about. If you didn't watch any Red Sox games, you wouldn't be posting in main board threads about the team and judging the intelligence of those who do.
Credit is due to John Lackey for working his ass off since the surgery and performing well this season. But that doesn't invalidate the previous three seasons where he earned the disdain and loathing of this board and this fanbase for his unprofessional and shitty performances. If he's using our hate as motivation, all the better. Because he's an asshole in our laundry.
No I bet he talks about Mark Teixeira instead.
Sorry--sometime my work gets in the way of my listening. And it only took him until the day of a possibly WS-clinching Game Six at home to admit it? Golly.HomeBrew1901 said:Considering he acknowledged that he was wrong yesterday?
I don't think you know what 'bitch' means, or perhaps my tone wasn't clear. My post was a tongue-in-cheek comment that has little relation to how happy I am with the improbably excellent season the Sox just concluded in the best possible way. I don't spend much time thinking about F&M, though I do think they are on the slow boat to suckitude aboard the good ship Complacency afloat the river of witless provocation.HomeBrew1901 said:Golly, the Red Sox just won their 3rd World Series Victory in 10 years, you know what I'm going to do? Run to the Felger and Mazz thread and bitch about how much they suck.
Buffalo Head said:Fair warning: Felger's whole post-game "hot take" was to shit on "second-place" teams (1967) and players (Ted Williams). Just a clumsy, DB way of trying to put the three recent titles in context. Expect more of the same tomorrow.
"I love pissing off the 67 crew."
Mike Felger, on the night the 2013 Red Sox win the World Series.
Milwaukee Mike is absolutely clueless at gauging the pulse of the region when it is a time to honor the local team's accomplishments.
joe dokes said:No problem from me. Obviously I only coment on what I read here, and that's a fair ground for taking shots. Ironically (I think), my lack of listening to them anymore, yet commenting on them anyway, isnt a whole lot diferent than calling Lackey an "asshole" or his actions "unprofessional." He was mediocre, then when he was probably hurt, he really sucked. And while dumping his wife may be enough to say "he's an asshole," that really is all we know about the guy (other than the fact that his teammates seem to like him). I guess I'm loathe to judge someone's person -- for good OR bad -- based on so little info. As for whether he's using "our" hate as motivation, that's a nice narrative.
More importantly for me to make clear though......I dont think I was judging the intelligence of those who listen. Well, I was, I guess, but not in the way you suggest...I think the vast majority of people who post here are intelligent. Those that aren't dont last long. So I wonder why intelligent people who, in the baseball context, look for information and insight would listen to programs that, for the most part provide neither, yet pretend that they do. Until they get called out, at which point they say, "Hey we're just entertainers." (which is why I stopped listening)
I wonder why people still watch the Weather Channel when they dont provide weather. I wonder why my intelligent teenaged children watch "dance moms."
But manifestly, from early September on, at least, he behaved like a cunt. There is no more civilized fitting description.smastroyin said:To be fair to Mazz, his stance that they were not a good team has been dying the death of a thousand cuts all year.
I'm using quotes but these are paraphrases.
February: "I won't be surprised if this team is under .500"
Opening Day: "I think this is basically you know, 84 win team, probably 4th in a tough division, but luckily ahead of the Yankees and all their injuries."
End of April: "With the hot start, they have climbed up to like 88 wins probably."
Middle of May: "See, the hot streak is over, this team is showing true colors, we'll see if they can climb out of this."
ASB: "OK, well now let's see if they can keep it up in the second half, because these guys haven't had to do that."
Peavy trade: "they are still an ace short and this gut isn't good enough. Even if they get Buchholz back. They look like they will get to the playoffs now, but what happens then? They needed to do more"
early September: "well now you can't blow this division lead, I mean, talk about disappointment, and they could very easily do that. 2011!!!1!1!1!111!!!!"
Start of playoffs: "OK, before the season I said they were probably an 84 win team and they blew that right out of the water, but I'm still not sure they have what it takes to win a playoff series, nevermind the whole thing."
I think this kind of reflects the way a lot of people evolved through the season.
Why would I want to?
He pretty much had Felger convinced as well until Tony and Beetle both pretty much said "WTF are you high?"RedOctober3829 said:Some caller said that Jon Lester is a better pitcher than Pedro Martinez.
Think about that for a second....
Even his first World Series appearance with the Sox in 2004, he was slightly past his peak. He still threw 7 shutout innings essentially giving no chance for the Cardinals to get back in that series.Byrdbrain said:He pretty much had Felger convinced as well until Tony and Beetle both pretty much said "WTF are you high?"
The guy compared their WS numbers to make his case. Tony then pointed out that Pedro only pitched in one WS game with the Sox and the other two were when he was 37 YO throwing 85 mph for the Phillies.
So yeah not exactly an "apples to apples" comparison.
dcmissle said:But manifestly, from early September on, at least, he behaved like a cunt. There is no more civilized fitting description.
The defining characteristic of this team from start to finish was its determination to stamp out 2011 in every way imaginable. To group the two teams together, for any purpose, was ridiculous. If they fell short, it would only be because of their limitations or a string of terrible luck.
Once this club made the playoffs, accomplishing worst to first, everything was gravy. Anyone paying scant attention recognized this because, again, the team's limitations were manifest. You cannot reasonably whine in a rebuilding year.
This is truly the fellowship of the miserable. Francesa at least had the sense to take the day off.
It is more than recency bias. Unless you think everyone here is a moron -- and I mean, literally, everyone. Nobody had them pegged to do what they did. Nobody. Go to the offseason threads as this team was assembled and try to find one. One.ForKeeps said:
Try telling a Royals or Padres fan that this was a "rebuilding year." with a 150m dollar payroll or whatever it is. I don't disagree with the gravy sentiment, but come on, what "limitations"? They were, by objective measures, the best team in baseball. All year long. Because they have a lot of really good players. Just because the entire world is prone to recency bias and picked them for 4th or 5th place doesn't mean they were truly underdogs. That's a joke.
NortheasternPJ said:I wonder if the powers at be will stop F&M from ripping on the Celtics and rooting for them to tank. There was at least 20 minutes spent today telling them to dig deep against Utah and find it in themselves to lose. "You Play to Lose the Game" "Losing is a Choice" etc. etc.
Blacken said:Who's listening anyway?
Maybe not content, re: the teams, but they clearly got a smackdown from higher-ups at the station about a year ago about "Seidenberg in my pants," "Naughty Mazz," and "Wayne in Grafton" and other off-color elements of the show. Felger even announced that they would no longer be doing that stuff on the air and that they had gotten a wrist-slap about it.Rocco Graziosa said:I don't think Feger and Mazz take orders from anyone at that station about content.
They've been pretty hard on the Patriots and Bruins in some ways as well and they haven't been silenced to this point.NortheasternPJ said:Oh I loved it. I find it refreshing they aren't on the company line and letting it go
I'm just wondering how long until they get told to stop.
Buffalo Head said:Maybe not content, re: the teams, but they clearly got a smackdown from higher-ups at the station about a year ago about "Seidenberg in my pants," "Naughty Mazz," and "Wayne in Grafton" and other off-color elements of the show. Felger even announced that they would no longer be doing that stuff on the air and that they had gotten a wrist-slap about it.
Is he really talking openly about this? I mean, isn't Middlebrooks married? It's one thing to joke about this kind of shit, but to just throw it up on the air...Bogaerts said:Felger's new favorite topic recently is how fucking Jenny Dell is ruining Middlebrooks' career.