Felger and Mazz - Creating False Naratives one day at a time

[Phenom]

Felger's take is that the Patriots didn't play poorly last night, and the offense's ineptness was situational. On defense, with Chandler Jones and Aqib Talib out, the Patriots reverted to being an average pass defense.

I know this has been rehashed many times before in this thread, but Felger is far from Ron Borges. He's a contrarian, but doesn't say things purely for shock value. I know Bruce Allen and others characterize him as such, but it's not true.

 

[Darnell's Son]

This thread is 90 pages long and they dominate in ratings. Plenty of people care.

Stop being so defensive. I meant "No one cares", because, you know, the Patriots just lost and no one cares what anyone thinks is going to happen next year.

 

[pedro1918]

SoSH getting some run on the show right now. 
 
Re: Tito's book: "Hiring some guy from a messageboard..."

 

[SoxScout]

Talked about it at the end of the show yesterday, but Tony was more interested in making fun of Voros McCracken's name.

 

[HomeBrew1901]

For the love of fuck, not Teixeira again.

Edit: Phew. That was short lived.

 

[Phenom]

Come on Felger ... he really hasn't picked up the book yet?
 
Interested to hear the Francona interview on Friday.  Let's hope Felger reads the book by then so we don't have a Tom Verducci repeat.

 

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

Talked about it at the end of the show yesterday, but Tony was more interested in making fun of Voros McCracken's name.

Tony's aware that "Voros" is something of a nom de plume for him, right?

 

[Harry Hooper]

Come on Felger ... he really hasn't picked up the book yet?
 
Interested to hear the Francona interview on Friday.  Let's hope Felger reads the book by then so we don't have a Tom Verducci repeat.

Felger already pledged yesterday that he won't have read the book by Friday.

 

[ForKeeps]

So how do they reconcile "why are they hiring guys from message boards with funny names!", which is totally a baseball ops-new wave-Ivy League-GM thing, with their narrative that the Sox lost their way because ownership was more concerned with ratings than letting baseball ops do their thing? I'm pretty sure Tom Werner wasn't the one arguing that Crawford was worth the money because of his defensive metrics.

 

[mabrowndog]

Tito's on at 5 pm.
 
Meanwhile, they're doing a nice job of needling the Celtics on the pumped-in fake crowd noise. The producers are peppering the show with canned laughter, cheers and boos at perfect moments, and the hosts plus Beetle can't stop cracking up.

 

[the1andonly3003]

looks like they sent F&M to NOLA for the Super Bowl?  is TSH the only station to send anyone down to Radio Row?

 

[soxfan121]

"Hey Cam [Neely], when you see Dave Gaucher punch him in the balls for me." - Tony Mazz

 

[SoxScout]

Mike Westhoff should be a weekly interview, that was pretty damn good.

 

[Phenom]

No calls today because they've sucked all week ... love it.  

 

[the1andonly3003]

No calls today because they've sucked all week ... love it.  

what do you mean?

 

[BannedbyNYYFans.com]

Mazz showing JJ Watt how he does shoulder shrugs at the gym.  
 

 

[Phenom]

what do you mean?

 
The callers were terrible, so they stopped taking calls instead of torturing us for the afternoon.  A nice change of pace.  
 
The way Felger treats callers is one of his best traits as a host.  The celebrity callers have gotten a little out of hand, but on the whole, he transitions in-and-out of calls WAAAY better than Ordway does.  Listening to hosts yell at bad callers just isn't entertaining radio.

 

[NortheasternPJ]

Anyone notice that Beetle has taken a more prominent role in the show since the Adam Jones announcement? he seems to be involved more in the show, he's now mentioned in promos etc. Last week it was "Felger, Mazz & Beetle are in New Orleans this week" and it's slowly becoming more apparent. I'm guessing part of the Adam Jones deal was that Beetle becomes a real employee and not just a glorified Flash Boy. Or maybe I'm just reading into to it.

 

[Vandalman]

Anyone notice that Beetle has taken a more prominent role in the show since the Adam Jones announcement? he seems to be involved more in the show, he's now mentioned in promos etc. Last week it was "Felger, Mazz & Beetle are in New Orleans this week" and it's slowly becoming more apparent. I'm guessing part of the Adam Jones deal was that Beetle becomes a real employee and not just a glorified Flash Boy. Or maybe I'm just reading into to it.

Felger and Beetle has a nice ring to it,

Sorry, Tony.

 

[soxfan121]

Felger's the front man - he whines about callers and sets the agenda. 
Mazz is the comic relief - he mocks the callers and agrees with everything while providing one hot sports take per show. 
Beetle is the smart one - he settles any fact based arguments and brings knowledge to the table. 
 
They might not have renamed the show but it's a three man operation, not two hosts and a news guy. Congrats to Beetle, who makes it worth listening most days. 

 

[ForKeeps]

Those labels are all in relative terms I hope.

 

[LoneWarrior1]

Anyone notice that Beetle has taken a more prominent role in the show since the Adam Jones announcement? he seems to be involved more in the show, he's now mentioned in promos etc. Last week it was "Felger, Mazz & Beetle are in New Orleans this week" and it's slowly becoming more apparent. I'm guessing part of the Adam Jones deal was that Beetle becomes a real employee and not just a glorified Flash Boy. Or maybe I'm just reading into to it.

 
FWIW: You're not.

 

[soxfan121]

Those labels are all in relative terms I hope.

 
Ringo's the untalented one.

 

[NortheasternPJ]

I'm loving the ripping on Felger for his sweater.

 

[SoxScout]

I have never laughed so hard as I did when Beetle and Mazz were reading tweets about Felger's sweater today.
 
The ones about nipples were amazing.
 

 

[Humphrey]

I assume he was flipping Mazz and Bertand the bird and not Rondo.

 

[NortheasternPJ]

It's pretty painful for Beetle to get Wiggy to have any meaningful conversations. It's like pulling teeth. Wiggy has about 20 minutes of hot takes in him and that's about it. Usually they're not even a hot take, but just a take. 
 
4 hours of Wiggy is about 3.5 hours too much. 

 

[mandro ramtinez]

I liked Wiggy's comparison of Kendrick Perkins to a lightpole.  I agree with Wiggy, a lightpole would be better on offense than Perk.

 

[HomeBrew1901]

4 hours of Wiggy is 4 hours too much.
 
I only heard Beetle and Beers for about 20 minutes last night but I liked how Beetle got the temporary flash guy involved in the conversation to give him some airtime.  I thought that was pretty cool.

 

[Dummy Hoy]

I'd rather listen to Wiggy than Mazz.

 

[Marbleheader]

Wiggins is just unlistenable, particularly on non-football topics.  If Pete Sheppard, Fred Smerlas and Larry Johnson spawned a radio personality, Wiggins is what you'd get.  Bring him in as a 3rd guy on Gresh and Zo once a week from Sep to Jan. He should never be on the afternoon drive show, let alone co-hosting it.

 

[mabrowndog]

I only heard Beetle and Beers for about 20 minutes last night but I liked how Beetle got the temporary flash guy involved in the conversation to give him some airtime.  I thought that was pretty cool.

 
While Wiggy's voice and viewpoints are indeed cringeworthy for anything beyond 15 seconds, Beers is one of the most droll on-air sports personalities in Boston. Nice guy and knows his shit, but he has zero voice projection and speaks at a slow pace and in a mundane monotone. So yeah, great move by Beetle to bring the flash temp into the mix, but I'd like to think it was more out of necessity than benevolence.

 

[NickEsasky]

Wiggy is terrible. He spent most of my drive home talking about trying to let Lee, and Terry, and Bass  play a lot of minutes to build up their trade value in the off-season like they are first or second year players. Uhh Wiggy, I am pretty sure everyone knows what these guys are by now. 

 

[Phenom]

Wiggins is just unlistenable, particularly on non-football topics.  If Pete Sheppard, Fred Smerlas and Larry Johnson spawned a radio personality, Wiggins is what you'd get.  Bring him in as a 3rd guy on Gresh and Zo once a week from Sep to Jan. He should never be on the afternoon drive show, let alone co-hosting it.

 
Spot-on description of Wiggy.  As everyone else has said, he's unbearable.  Not much more to be said. 
 
It's a minor and insignificant point, but the fill-ins they put on with Beetle are terrible.  I agree with mabrowndog on Beers: He's a good hockey analyst but his temperament isn't suited for talk radio.  He's a really boring co-host ... doesn't add anything to the conversation outside of hockey, and he isn't willing to go out on a limb when talking about the Bruins.  He's their announcer, so I understand that.  But still, it makes for uninteresting radio.  
 
The bench depth on 98.5 has thinned out a little bit.  Their best fill-in guy is Mike Flynn, but he was on for T&R this week.  
 
Again, it's a really minor point, but worth mentioning.  Beetle is great, but doesn't have a lot of talent to work with when he fills-in.  
 
On another note, though, he should be great with Felger these next two days.  I love the Felger and Beetle pairing.  

 

[NortheasternPJ]

I love Felger & Beetle. Felger has been beating his Green Teamer / Trader Danny shtick for the last 90 minutes and Beetle hasn't backed down. If Mazz was on it'd be 90 minutes of "you're right Mike!!!"

 

[SoxScout]

What is Beetle fighting him on? He said that this deadline didn't disprove "Trader Danny"... he said that has myth for 3 years now.
 
They both agreed that Ainge talked a good game but couldn't pull the trigger on not letting his team get old.

 

[Phenom]

What is Beetle fighting him on? He said that this deadline didn't disprove "Trader Danny"... he said that has myth for 3 years now.
 
They both agreed that Ainge talked a good game but couldn't pull the trigger on not letting his team get old.

 
Felger keeps saying "Danny hasn't done anything for years!"
 
Beetle is coming back with the point that over the past three years, they've made the Eastern Conference Finals twice and the NBA Finals once.  Until this year, it can be argued Danny didn't have to do anything drastic.  
 
It's been a lively show thus far.  I also loved Beetle shutting Felger up when he got on his high horse about Alfonzo Dennard, and how "the only people who should mouth off to cops are minorities who are unfairly targeted."  Beetle reminded Felger that Dennard, in fact, is a minority and could've been unfairly targeted.  Felger was speechless, good stuff.

 

[NortheasternPJ]

Felger keeps saying "Danny hasn't done anything for years!"
 
Beetle is coming back with the point that over the past three years, they've made the Eastern Conference Finals twice and the NBA Finals once.  Until this year, it can be argued Danny didn't have to do anything drastic.  
 
It's been a lively show thus far.  I also loved Beetle shutting Felger up when he got on his high horse about Alfonzo Dennard, and how "the only people who should mouth off to cops are minorities who are unfairly targeted."  Beetle reminded Felger that Dennard, in fact, is a minority and could've been unfairly targeted.  Felger was speechless, good stuff.

 
Watching that on CSNNE, Felger sat there for 5 seconds with his mouth open and had nothing to say it was great.
 
Beetle's been right, name 1 GM that when they make the NBA Finals or Conference Finals, they're going to completely blow it up. The number is 0.0. Also, he's made the point that he made the Perkins deal against everyone's desires, he made the Garnett trade when some here thought giving away Jefferson was a mistake. He tried to trade Allen last year when it was basically vetoed. He's being blamed for making deals Felger doesn't like and not making deals that he's come close to due to situations out of his control.
 
Trader Danny always could have done more, but its not 100% his fault if there's not good deals on the table.

 

[soxfan121]

It's been a lively show thus far.  I also loved Beetle shutting Felger up when he got on his high horse about Alfonzo Dennard, and how "the only people who should mouth off to cops are minorities who are unfairly targeted."  Beetle reminded Felger that Dennard, in fact, is a minority and could've been unfairly targeted.  Felger was speechless, good stuff.

 
It was one of the best moments Beetle has ever had on air - Felger was all lathered up about "people who talk back to cops should go to jail", meandered  into the "unfairly targeted" thing as described and then SMACKED by Beetle, resulting in a moment of silence and "I hadn't thought of that". 
 
As usual, Felger & Beetle is more entertaining than F&M. Bertrand doesn't allow Felger's bullshit freight train to run amok and it makes for great radio.

 

[steveluck7]

Felger just made a direct appeal to SOSH to help him with an argument. He contends that if the Sox projected starting staff pitches to their career averages, the Sox will be an 86 win team.  He said e-mailers and txts have told him to look at WAR and it backs him up but Tony and Beetle don't buy it

 

[Phenom]

Felger just made a direct appeal to SOSH to help him with an argument. He contends that if the Sox projected starting staff pitches to their career averages, the Sox will be an 86 win team.  He said e-mailers and txts have told him to look at WAR and it backs him up but Tony and Beetle don't buy it

 
It's in Felger's best interest to label the Red Sox a "playoff team."  It builds expectations, and if they flounder, he can rail against them all summer.  
 
Saying the Red Sox are a 79 win team does nothing for the show.  Who is going to get upset over a team that was supposed to be mediocre anyway?
 
Felger may truly believe the Red Sox are better than many people think they are, but he's grasping at straws in his attempts to explain why he thinks they're a playoff team.  He's come up with the thesis that the Red Sox are an 86 win team, and now he's trying to find the data to back up his thesis.  
 
(I'll give him credit for calling the Brady extension, though.  I didn't hear anybody else speculate that.  Good job there.) 

 

[SoxScout]

Yeah, he nailed the Brady extension a few days ago.
 
His "career averages" argument is looking at pitchers wins based on their 162-game averages on BB-REF.

 

[the1andonly3003]

Felger may have predicted the Brady extension, but I am waiting for him to start bashing this Brady contract as a bad contract. 
 
"How many QBs close to 40 get big money extensions?"
 
"Why commit so many years?"
 
"Brady is on the decline."
 
That will be Felger at some point.

 

[Phenom]

Felger may have predicted the Brady extension, but I am waiting for him to start bashing this Brady contract as a bad contract. 
 
"How many QBs close to 40 get big money extensions?"
 
"Why commit so many years?"
 
"Brady is on the decline."
 
That will be Felger at some point.

 
Nope, it won't be.  
 
How was Pete Sheppard on afternoon drive today, Jason?  Ironic that he's now the man filling in for Glenn. 

 

[RedOctober3829]

Joe Haggerty
‏@HackswithHaggs
Bruins are 4th in the NHL in goals against & @felgerandmazz say there are only two B's defensemen they trust in the D-zone. Huh? Double Huh?

 

Joe Haggerty
‏@HackswithHaggs
Trading Brad Boyes for Dennis Wideman was a "bad loss" for Chiarelli? Wideman is top-4 D & he
turned into Horton/Campbell. Huh? Double Huh?

 

 
Is there a subject that Mazz can intelligently talk about?

 

[mcpickl]

Felger is a disaster today talking Bruins today too, which I think is unusual for him.
 
His complaint with Chiarelli now is that all of his deadline deals, he's added to the team using picks and prospects as bait instead of trading roster players away. Huh? Isn't that exactly what you want your GM to do?
 
He's going on and on that if Chiarelli wants to show him something, he should be willing to include grinders like Kelly and Peverly in a deal. Well, since the Bruins are buyers they'll be dealing with rebuilding teams. Why are those teams looking to deal for your solid, third line veterans? They're not. They want the picks and prospects that may help in the future, as opposed to vets to help now,  that Chiarelli has traded to make deals in the past.
 
Good grief. It feels like the awful basketball talk is now leaking into awful hockey talk. Their hockey takes are usually the strength of the show.

 

[Corsi]

Hell, we should be lauding Chia's ability to make these secondary deals.  Chad Finn actually touched upon this today:
 
 

Consider these smaller but essential trades -- just trades, excluding savvy signings such as Shawn Thornton -- that Chiarelli has pulled off through the years, helping the Bruins win one Cup and surely contend for a couple more. These are just players on the current roster:
 
February 10, 2007: Acquired Andrew Ference (and Chuck Kobasew) from Calgary for Brad Stuart and Wayne Primeau.
 
May 16, 2007: Acquired Adam McQuaid from Columbus for a fifth-round pick. 
 
June 24, 2008: Acquired Johnny Boychuk from Colorado for Matt Hendricks.
 
October 20, 2009: Acquired Daniel Paille from Buffalo for a 2010 third-round pick.
 
March 3, 2010: Acquired Dennis Seidenberg from Florida along with Matt Bartkowski for Byron Bitz, Craig Weller and Tampa Bay's 2010 second-round draft pick.
 
June 22, 2010: Acquired Nathan Horton and Gregory Campbell from Florida for Defensively Deficient Dennis Wideman and draft picks.
 
February 15, 2011: Acquired Chris Kelly from Ottawa for a second-round pick. (I seem to remember a lot of Bruins fans being peeved that they didn't get Mike Fisher instead.)
 
February 18, 2011: Acquired Rich Peverley (and Boris Valabik) from Atlanta for Blake Wheeler and Mark Stuart. (Wheeler's become a decent scorer but he was a puck-losing tease here.)
 
That's a pretty extraordinary knack for the secondary or supplemental deal. Ben Cherington should have such a deft touch with his remodeled Red Sox roster.

http://www.boston.com/sports/touching_all_the_bases/2013/02/does_peter_chiarelli_get_enoug.html
 
Who cares if he hasn't added an established top-liner?  He's knocked almost all of his other, complementary trades, out of the park. 

 

[timlinin8th]

Who cares if he hasn't added an established top-liner?  He's knocked almost all of his other, complementary trades, out of the park. 

Its not like Horton isn't a top line player either. Has he added an elite-level player via trade? No, but how often are they available to ANY team?

 

[Dummy Hoy]

It's the perfect formula- you draft and develop your top end talent, complement them with astute signings and deals like the ones Chad mentioned, and pick and choose the spot to break the bank on a truly impact FA. Anyone shitting on Chia right now is an idiot.
 
My biggest issue with him was probably the Dave Lewis hiring, and he was smart enough to know when to cut his losses and move on.
 
I stopped listening to the show a while ago if Mazz is on. It's been said a billion times, but Felger needs a foil, not a lazy sidekick.

 

[soxfan121]

I stopped listening to the show a while ago if Mazz is on. It's been said a billion times, but Felger needs a foil, not a lazy sidekick.

 
Yep. Claude is to Felger as Belichick is to Borges. Felger hates Claude Hockey aesthetically but he cannot rip Claude or the system because of the success. So he has to find ways around it.The Fribble Crew. The High Glass Line. The plus/minus ratings and the "yet they keep winning!" mini-rants. The constant questioning of whether they would trade one "those guys". 
 
Beetle as a legit third guy would have shut Felger down before he blundered into Chiarelli's track record...Mazz is just along for the ride and giggles, man. Who knew hidden inside Tiny Mazz lurked an unfunny class clown?