FLASH POLL: Who should start on Sunday--Maye or Brissett?
- Thread starter DJnVa
- Start date
I said Maye. It's a winnable series of games coming up on the slate (Texans aside) and eventually, this season is going to be measured by how much confidence we as fans can have in Maye as a long-term solution at QB.
He's not going to be in a great position to succeed, the offensive line sucks and the receivers are pretty weak. I totally see the argument of keeping Brisset, but I feel like given that strong improvement in those areas is unlikely throughout the season--the solution is either bench Maye for the entire season, or throw him into the game at some point.
He's not going to be in a great position to succeed, the offensive line sucks and the receivers are pretty weak. I totally see the argument of keeping Brisset, but I feel like given that strong improvement in those areas is unlikely throughout the season--the solution is either bench Maye for the entire season, or throw him into the game at some point.
Now is the time. The offensive line will line up the same 5 guys next week for the first time all season - at least there is some stability there. No point in waiting until London since that will be a weird week. As will the week after. In which case you're waiting until November 3. Too late.
Yeah, might as well see how it goes. I'm sure it won't go very well against the Texans, but if they can somehow score like 20+ points against Houston, that would be legit exciting, right?
(how far we've fallen........)
(how far we've fallen........)
I voted Brissett. One more week with Jacoby. The Texans battered Josh Allen this week. Nine QB hits, Allen was 9-30, and may have been concussed.
I'd like the option "whatever Wolf and Mayo think should happen." Because I'm guessing nobody wants to see Maye out on the field at this point more than Mayo and Wolf do, so if they don't play him they presumably have Reasons. They might be wrong, but they're the duo with the most information to work with right now.
Maye. Can't go much longer with a QB who can't get the ball to the WR because they need to develop too.
I guess ultimately I'm with @P'tucket rhymes with... , even though my personal opinion is closer to @ShaneTrot. Brady and Gronk both saying in public that rookie QBs shouldn't start right away only underscores my feelings -- but again, I have no idea how Maye looks on the practice field or in meeting rooms.
Frustrating as this is to admit, winning games is not my metric right now. With better QB play this might be a, what, 5-12 team? With current QB play it feels like a 3-14 team.
What matters to me is 1) what's best for Maye's development? and 2) what's best for the development of the rest of the players on the roster?
The danger remains that -- behind this dreadful O-line with these skill position players -- Maye will develop bad habits and/or get seriously injured in a way that impacts his preparation going into 2025.
I have no idea how likely either of those results are, but we've talked about them in many threads since April -- Darnold "seeing ghosts" against the Pats in 2019, Burrow getting his knee torn to shreds in 2020 (and yes, making the Super Bowl the next year), etc.
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Maye. Enough of the charade. Thanks for your service Jacoby. Now over to AVP and the staff to put him in a good position.
Maye. I think we need to start learning what we have (or don't have) at QB and with the receivers we drafted.
If Maye (over the next few weeks) can make a few plays here and there, and make some connection with any of the receivers that's good to know for next year. If he can't, then we need to think about another QB pick in 2025.
Right now we have no idea what we have for 2025.
If Maye (over the next few weeks) can make a few plays here and there, and make some connection with any of the receivers that's good to know for next year. If he can't, then we need to think about another QB pick in 2025.
Right now we have no idea what we have for 2025.
I voted Maye.
It's going to happen sometime soon and I'm not sure another week or two really adds much value developmentally for Maye.
It's going to happen sometime soon and I'm not sure another week or two really adds much value developmentally for Maye.
They aren't taking a QB in 2025. Maye will get at least next year to be the guy. You can't send him out there with this roster and expect success, you just look for improvement.
Now, if he looks like Jamarcus Russell next season, it's time to fire up the Arch Manning train for the 2026 draft.
Brissett. I see no reason to rush Maye into the starting lineup. He's super young, had a relatively small college experience, and this team isn't going anywhere. I'd much rather give him the full Mahomes/Love/Rodgers than rush him out to start for a bad team going nowhere just because...fans are impatient?
This is where I'm at, the Texans will batter the QB or they will have to run such a dumbed down gameplan that it won't be worth the risk to him. Once the Oline seems to be turning a corner pull the trigger. Don't want to David Carr him and have him seeing ghosts like Darnold.
I'm fine with either IF it's in line with the development plan they set up. If it's just a cover for a terrible start and Mayo getting criticism I'm worried.
Ideally... I would like them to wait at least 1 more week if it's close. HOU is a really tough assignment for any QB, but particularly a rookie.
Ideally... I would like them to wait at least 1 more week if it's close. HOU is a really tough assignment for any QB, but particularly a rookie.
I voted Maye — but it is mostly confirmation bias as I said at the beginning of the year I wanted to see him starting week 5 or 6 after a 1-4 or 1-5 type start. I think it is time to throw the young’n to the wolves and see what he can do.
Selfishly, I want Maye because I want to see the shiny new toy. But I don't think that's the rational way to make a decision.
I'm fine with trotting Brissett out there. This team isn't going anywhere. Maye will not make a material difference at this point.
Let him start next year with a new head coach and GM.
I'm fine with trotting Brissett out there. This team isn't going anywhere. Maye will not make a material difference at this point.
Let him start next year with a new head coach and GM.
I tend to agree. If Maye’s development in practice is making it more or less impossible to keep starting Brissett with a straight face based on who is the best option for the team now, and Maye is showing proficiency in some of the areas that Brissett was superior at (predominantly presnap, like blitz IDs/adjustments)/that the staff wanted to see progression in before throwing him out there as the starter, then he should play. By all press accounts (Breer, Reiss, Schefter, Perry) the team seems to think that time has come/is close, and if they’re comfortable then so am I. Certainly if Mayo orders it over the objections of the guys trusted with Maye’s development simply because he’s desperate for a win then that’s just bad process, but until there is evidence that occurred I don’t see much use in worrying about it.
My thoughts exactly. This season is toast, why risk having the kid develop bad habits or get hurt?
1. Maye
2. Milton
3. Local Tryout
The Brissett Era was a blast, but it's time to move on. No use in a vet game manager that cant throw the ball downfield for a rebuilding team. His floor is obviously higher than anyone we have, but what's the point in that? We need to see if any of the WR are good and what on this offense is useful moving forward. Having Jacoby dump the ball off and limit turnovers isn't serving any purpose.
The O-line is bad, but it's going to be bad all year and Maye should definitely not sit all year. Let him start now and see how it goes. The idea that there is some perfect incubation period for young QBs is silly. He will learn faster playing and if struggling is going to submarine is confidence forever he's screwed anyway.
2. Milton
3. Local Tryout
The Brissett Era was a blast, but it's time to move on. No use in a vet game manager that cant throw the ball downfield for a rebuilding team. His floor is obviously higher than anyone we have, but what's the point in that? We need to see if any of the WR are good and what on this offense is useful moving forward. Having Jacoby dump the ball off and limit turnovers isn't serving any purpose.
The O-line is bad, but it's going to be bad all year and Maye should definitely not sit all year. Let him start now and see how it goes. The idea that there is some perfect incubation period for young QBs is silly. He will learn faster playing and if struggling is going to submarine is confidence forever he's screwed anyway.
I said Brissett (and I'm kind of surprised he is at 37% here and not much lower).
I think they should develop a package of plays that may prepares to run Maye and then give him a series or two.
I think they should develop a package of plays that may prepares to run Maye and then give him a series or two.
I went with Maye to express my general sense that its time for the switch broadly but I think my optimal choice would be letting Brissett take the hits from the Texans and starting the kid the following game.
Great, let's join the perpetual retreads and go full Jets with it firing coaches and GMs after one year.
Seriously, have people paid no attention to how organizational turnover is a huge part of the problem for the Patriots (Bill lost a lot of assistants and unlike a team like SF, never kept up the pipeline of new talent to replace them)? The answer is not tearing out the few new foundations that we have just because people are pissed there wasn't a fully built house ready to slide on top. It's gonna take a second. If the team looks rudderless this time next year, then maybe you reassess whether you have the right people in place, but talking about changing GMs, coaches, or even starting QBs, is exactly how bottom dwellers stay bottom dwellers. A modicum of patience is needed.
Unless it is garbage time at the end, I don't know how practical this would be. It's hard to get the game script to go exactly how you want.
You could have it scripted up and then when it's Maye's turn, they are taking over inside their own 5 so the plays you have scripted aren't viable. Or a quick change where they are taking over at the red zone. It could be a 2:00 drill the next time you have the ball, he's not ready for that either. The only real controlled beginning of a possession where you can reasonably predict a starting point and build in plays is after receiving a kickoff, of which they are only guaranteed 1 per game. As unlikely as it may be, there's also the scenario where Brissett leads them to a 14-0 lead or something, are they going to pull the plug and potentially punt a win?
I don't know, just feels like the 1-2 series thing is more complicated than it appears on the surface and if you're willing to put him out there for 1-2 series, might as well just put him out there for the whole game.
Per @P'tucket rhymes with... we don't have enough information to say who *should* start - I don't think anyone in this forum or outside of the Pats facility does (even if the beat writers have a different narrative).
That said, if the question is, *whom do we want to start?* - and I think that's what the question is actually asking - the answer is Maye.
That said, if the question is, *whom do we want to start?* - and I think that's what the question is actually asking - the answer is Maye.
I need one more week. If the receivers are getting open and the line isn’t in shambles and we’re still ineffective then I might put him second half.
Watching the futility of Brissett and the team as this season unfolds is really starting to grind, but the next two weeks with an ascendant Houston then Jacksonville in London with the travel making it a shorter week of prep make it a bit hard to say let’s throw the kid out there. Jets at home 10/27 is the best first Maye start.
I want Maye to start more based on my thinking before the season that let's give the kid around a college season's worth of playing time (10-11 games) as the middle ground between starting out of the gate and taking a full redshirt year without knowing what we have. Seeing how bad the O Line actually is gives me a little pause but I believe the poor line play is exacerbated with Brissett's limitations in mobility, lack of downfield passing game, and frankly his general distaste in taking ANY risks.
Also at some point you want to raise morale and not lose the team. If the other 50 guys are seeing Maye do better in his 30% of reps in practice every week without getting a starting nod, that doesn't instill confidence in the team leadership. The average quarterback has a career length longer than the average NFL player generally (4.4 vs 3.3 years), so to throw away the better part of a year IF Maye is better now (which none of us outside the practices know) in the interest of either tanking or perceived protection of the "fragile QB" for a rank-and-file player is rough. But I am sympathetic to the scenario "what if Maye plays WORSE than Brissett?" then you are left with the decision of either let the kid take a beating or destroy his confidence further by putting him back on the bench.
Also at some point you want to raise morale and not lose the team. If the other 50 guys are seeing Maye do better in his 30% of reps in practice every week without getting a starting nod, that doesn't instill confidence in the team leadership. The average quarterback has a career length longer than the average NFL player generally (4.4 vs 3.3 years), so to throw away the better part of a year IF Maye is better now (which none of us outside the practices know) in the interest of either tanking or perceived protection of the "fragile QB" for a rank-and-file player is rough. But I am sympathetic to the scenario "what if Maye plays WORSE than Brissett?" then you are left with the decision of either let the kid take a beating or destroy his confidence further by putting him back on the bench.
Brissett. After all, if that poor guy keeps taking the beating he has been, it will be Maye soon enough.
What reason is there to think next season won’t be similarly “toast”?
They’re likely going to be bad for a while and the OL isn’t going to be rebuilt in one off-season - especially with Wolf’s approach to roster construction
At some point, Maye is going to have to play on a crappy team.
presumably less so since he will have had a full season of developing good habits in a controlled setting. Though I think the odds he sits the whole year are slim, he'll get some time no matter what, the question is when and how, and whether it is carefully planned or a kneejerk reaction
Next season has no bearing. Don’t know why people keep thinking the two are logically connected in some way.
Id'd rather roll Brissett out there one more time and have Maye start off on the right foot against Jacksonville's league worst pass defense.
Went with Maye.
We brought in Jacoby to get the rebuild underway, mentor Maye, and run a professional operation for the players and slate of new coaches. This has been an utter failure. Each week that passes brings us more ridicule, the rebuild has ground to a halt, Lazar uttered the word "mutiny" (though later retracted or was encouraged to retract).
In short, it's an effing mess. Time to sink or swim with Maye.
We brought in Jacoby to get the rebuild underway, mentor Maye, and run a professional operation for the players and slate of new coaches. This has been an utter failure. Each week that passes brings us more ridicule, the rebuild has ground to a halt, Lazar uttered the word "mutiny" (though later retracted or was encouraged to retract).
In short, it's an effing mess. Time to sink or swim with Maye.
While I don't totally disagree if Maye is ready.....
This is looking at things from the wrong lens.... Maye matters, ridicule does not matter, honestly the coaches don't matter, 90% of the players don't matter. If they think Maye will be a better QB for not playing this week he shouldn't play. Making the decision because the team is bad is the exact kind of ass covering, sugar fix mistakes that badly run franchises do to continue being bad.
This is where I'm at and said it in the Maye thread. They don't need to hand him the keys, but they need to let him drive. Script a few series and see how it goes.
What's the harm in having those series scripted and then letting the game dictate if and when you use him? Get the ball on the 30 after a punt, put him in. Up 2 scores, hold off. This isn't complicated.
OK - changed my mind due to these 3 additional factors to the futility of Jacoby:
1. Morale. Players will start to check out if something doesn't change - see all the penalties.
2. Business. Empty seats. Miami fans in the stands. Nobody even there to chant "Play Maye"
3. "Run the Dang Ball Bert!"
And if there were a fourth reason, maybe the OL is starting to stabilise. I didn't watch the game, but heard positive reports out of at least one post game show that the OL wasn't most of the problem even factoring in a sub-par Miami pass rush.
I voted Maye, but closer to ideal would be: start Brissett but as soon as it looks like he’s not effective, winning, losing or tied, throw Maye in for a few series. How long he stays in is up to how well he does. Or maybe Jacoby has the game of his life and you roll with that until next game, and do the same thing again.