Global Football Odds & Ends

Titans Bastard

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I really hope this ultimately gets expanded to include the US.

The USMNT is facing a dire medium-term scheduling crisis. In the current configuration, this is the last time WCQ will be remotely meaningful. The US will automatically qualify for 2026, and then competing for six slots in CONCACAF for 2030 and beyond will be very low-stakes.

Meanwhile, the growth of Nations League competitions and the death of the Confederations Cup means that there will be few good friendlies from outside of CONCACAF. It's a future of playing Gold Cups and then an endless loop of friendlies against Jamaica and El Salvador. It's bleak.

I think a global nations league-style competition would be compelling, and it would offer some really nice games for the US.
 

Kliq

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That reminded me of my high school games when we would play another Latino-majority school.
 

67YAZ

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Looks like my indoor games.
I caught the last 10 minutes of an indoor match last winter between a predominantly Russian team and a predominantly Ukrainian side. And it was only slightly more violent than this.
 

67YAZ

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Is an AFCON thread worthwhile? It doesn’t appear that the matches will be on TV, so I don’t expect a lot of commentary. But it’s a wild and fun tournament with the extra excitement of behind hosted in a country stalked by paramilitary and rebel groups. Absolutely anything could happen here - some word class matches (Nigeria-Egypt on match day 1 is juicy), some minnows getting lucky, a massive COVID outbreak, and a rebel group invading stadium are all distinct possibilities.

Hoping for a safe, healthy, and successful AFCON. Might try to find a stream somewhere for Nigeria-Egypt.
 

swiftaw

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Is an AFCON thread worthwhile? It doesn’t appear that the matches will be on TV, so I don’t expect a lot of commentary. But it’s a wild and fun tournament with the extra excitement of behind hosted in a country stalked by paramilitary and rebel groups. Absolutely anything could happen here - some word class matches (Nigeria-Egypt on match day 1 is juicy), some minnows getting lucky, a massive COVID outbreak, and a rebel group invading stadium are all distinct possibilities.

Hoping for a safe, healthy, and successful AFCON. Might try to find a stream somewhere for Nigeria-Egypt.
Matches are on Bein.
 

teddykgb

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Is an AFCON thread worthwhile? It doesn’t appear that the matches will be on TV, so I don’t expect a lot of commentary. But it’s a wild and fun tournament with the extra excitement of behind hosted in a country stalked by paramilitary and rebel groups. Absolutely anything could happen here - some word class matches (Nigeria-Egypt on match day 1 is juicy), some minnows getting lucky, a massive COVID outbreak, and a rebel group invading stadium are all distinct possibilities.

Hoping for a safe, healthy, and successful AFCON. Might try to find a stream somewhere for Nigeria-Egypt.
I think I’m going to be able to watch on fubo via Bein and I’m super excited
 

OCST

Sunny von Bulow
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Never been able to watch but even just following vicariously I love AFCON. CAF seems to be the most competitive federation along the spectrum of giants to minnows and the highest probability of “unexpected “ results. CONCACAF is just so top heavy, with the handful of big sides, dozens of minnows and not much where the fat part of the bell curve should be.
 

teddykgb

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So far the Cameroon v Burkina Faso has been a good watch. Tremendous volley for the first goal and a correct VaR penalty looks set to level
 

rguilmar

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Kinda wild second half in the Tunisia-Mali match. Referee blew the full time whistle at around the 85 minute mark and then blows it again before 90 minutes. No added time at all despite two VAR reviews (one for a PK and one for a red card), several substitutions, and a hydration break.
 

67YAZ

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The AFCON final is one for the Scousers as Senegal take on Egypt. Cameroon took Egypt to PKs, but could only convert once at the end. But it was a helluva run for the home side. They well outplayed expectations.

Egypt is playing some of its best football in a while. The squad is getting great supporting performances around Salah and staying organized defensively. For so long, opponents have over-played Salah and less disciplined Egyptian teammates have rushed up field to take advantage of space, which left them open to the counter time and again. They seem to have really sorted that this month. They are a tough side to break down and, of course, Salah is capable of magic on his own.

Senegal is hands down the best and most talented squad on the continent. They will be disappointed not to win on Sunday. Cisse has given the side a clear, if bespoke philosophy and style of play, but they do sometimes struggle to break through against packed defenses. Mane is the main creative force - he tends to play a little deeper and more centrally than with Liverpool - but he hasn’t found a running mate up top that can consistently finish the chances he creates. Mane has netted 3 times and assisted twice, while Ahamadou Deing has scored twice (1 start & 3 sub appearances). 3 others have a goal each.

I expect this to be a cagey match. Egypt will leave Salah up high, play a low block, and look to run on the counter. Senegal will feel the weight of expectations and probably start cautiously, trying a few things to create some space for Mane to operate. My money is on a late Senegal goal giving them a 1-0 win and a huge confidence boost heading towards Qatar.
 
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67YAZ

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And of course they also meet in the World Cup playoff too.
Forgot about that! This is the opening of a high stakes trilogy for these two nations.

CAF qualifying is brutal - so many matches and so many poor pitches plus rough and tumble play that makes CONCACAF look friendly.

No matter how it shakes out, 3 quality sides will fail to qualify from CAF, maybe more if there’s an upset - Mali over Algeria might not even be an upset right now. Though I probably should rethink Ghana as a quality team after their performance this month.
 

Kliq

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Salah winning AfCon would also likely make him a good candidate for the Ballon d'Or, for those who care about that sort of thing.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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Normally maybe, but it's a World Cup year, so it won't matter.
I wonder whether and how they'll change up the schedule for the Balon D'or process. Usually they have the voting in November and announce the results in late November or early December. The World Cup runs from 11/21 - 12/18. It would seem dumb to vote prior to (or during) the World Cup. On the other hand, if they waited until after the World Cup it probably means not doing the announcement until January as they probably wouldn't want it lost in the Christmas period.
 

SocrManiac

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Could be the clip, but the framerate doesn’t look great. That means they still haven’t solved one of the largest problems

Until there is clarity on the exact moment of either the kick or the ball leaving the foot, these decisions remain completely arbitrary.

If the technology averaged body position between two frames of video bracketing that point, maybe they could say they’ve gotten it right. Until then… Meh. Still a roll of the dice on close ones.
 

dirtynine

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I think it’s fair to say we’ve been in the “uncanny valley” of VAR since its introduction. The tech has been good enough to be fairer than what we had, but not good enough to avoid being awkward as far as integrating it into the game. Hopefully this is a step towards making it disappear - in the sense that the technology becomes unobtrusive enough that we don’t really think about it anymore (like in tennis).
 

OCST

Sunny von Bulow
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Still think the problem with VAR is yhetgr human factor, the way the people running it use it.

The inconsistency of outcomes is crazy-making but it would be ok if they stuck to the “clear and obvious error” standard. But when they have to use a protractor and replay it 10x it’s by definition not a clear and obvious error even if (big if) they get the call right.

it’s shocking to give the NFL credit for doing something well but they apply the standard of review correctly, most of the time. PL is a disaster by comparison.
 

dirtynine

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AFCON final 5 minutes away from penalties. 0-0 Senegal Egypt in 117’. Both teams have had sure winners saved in the last 2 minutes.
 

PedroSpecialK

Comes at you like a tornado of hair and the NHL sa
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Only shortcoming from Queiroz this whole tournament was not giving Salah a kick in pens. 4th Egypt penalty was one of the worst I've ever seen, and Mané seals it with an unsavable pen.
 

67YAZ

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Mane seals the deal!

He made up for a weak ass PK in the the 7th minute & exorcises Cisse’s demons for missing the decisive PK in 2002.

Egypt played ugly, boring anti-football. Glad they lost.
 
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67YAZ

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And Egypt saving Salah for 5th means he didn't even take one.
This was such a stupid idea all along. They got away with it twice, but it burned Egypt this time.Queiroz is going to get a question or two about this when he gets back…
 

Zososoxfan

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I don't think it will make anyone happier about the incredibly close offside decisions, but at least it will be quick.
Could be the clip, but the framerate doesn’t look great. That means they still haven’t solved one of the largest problems

Until there is clarity on the exact moment of either the kick or the ball leaving the foot, these decisions remain completely arbitrary.

If the technology averaged body position between two frames of video bracketing that point, maybe they could say they’ve gotten it right. Until then… Meh. Still a roll of the dice on close ones.
Still think the problem with VAR is yhetgr human factor, the way the people running it use it.

The inconsistency of outcomes is crazy-making but it would be ok if they stuck to the “clear and obvious error” standard. But when they have to use a protractor and replay it 10x it’s by definition not a clear and obvious error even if (big if) they get the call right.

it’s shocking to give the NFL credit for doing something well but they apply the standard of review correctly, most of the time. PL is a disaster by comparison.
The 2 bolded quotes are the key for me. First, we have to get consensus on when the moment to measure is--is it when the ball first touches the foot, when the ball leaves the foot after contact, I guess it could also be somewhere in between but that's already getting messy. I think that solves half the problem though. The other problem is that VAR is too exacting at this point and there needs to be a recalibration of use to the 'clear and obvious standard'.

Ultimately, I think it comes down to a rule change. I'm not saying I've given this tons of thought and that THIS MUST be the new rule, but something like the attacking player's more advanced foot PLANTED ON THE FIELD has to be fully and completely beyond the last defender's* planted foot in order to be considered offside. I know this takes the 'lean' out of the rule and I think that's positive. It also means that an attacker a half-step ahead of the last defender* but who's foot isn't planted is onside. I'm OK with that. Hopefully the planted foot idea makes it easier for refs and VAR, because that and clarity is what I'm hoping for personally.

*I'm too lazy to write out the proper offside rule out in full.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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Could be the clip, but the framerate doesn’t look great. That means they still haven’t solved one of the largest problems

Until there is clarity on the exact moment of either the kick or the ball leaving the foot, these decisions remain completely arbitrary.

If the technology averaged body position between two frames of video bracketing that point, maybe they could say they’ve gotten it right. Until then… Meh. Still a roll of the dice on close ones.
On this point, with which I totally agree, the accompanying story does say that the cameras will work at 50 frames per second and some AI system will be used to attempt to better calculate the exact timing of the kick point.

As with all things AI, there is a big danger of garbage in, garbage out and so I wouldn't necessary take it on faith that it will be better, but they do seem to be explicitly attempting to address this issue (which is definitely a massive one).
 

SocrManiac

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If they’re using cameras recording at 24 frames per second, a player running a shade over 16mph moves a foot per frame. For reference, Traore has been clocked at over 22mph. Where they decide to stop the film matters entirely too much for the level of precision they’re claiming to have. Hell, scrub through that video frame by frame and look how far the players move between shots.

Blur the line to create the uncertainty, favor the attacking player, and call it a day. This should not be difficult.
 

SocrManiac

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Thanks, MMS. We posted at the same time.

So, the uncertainty is 6” or more at 16mph. That’s your starting point for the line thickness.
 

OCST

Sunny von Bulow
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If they’re using cameras recording at 24 frames per second, a player running a shade over 16mph moves a foot per frame. For reference, Traore has been clocked at over 22mph. Where they decide to stop the film matters entirely too much for the level of precision they’re claiming to have. Hell, scrub through that video frame by frame and look how far the players move between shots.

Blur the line to create the uncertainty, favor the attacking player, and call it a day. This should not be difficult.
The application has been to punish players who beat the defenders with pace and good anticipation for well timed runs, rather than the intent which is to prevent an attacker from camping out in front of goal instead of playing through the lines.