How do you feel about your club?

Kliq

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Mar 31, 2013
22,673
With Champions League over and the 2019-2020 finally in the rear view, might as well do a assessment about how we all feel about our respective clubs and rate our confidence in them on a scale of 1 to 10. I'll start with mine.

Club: Tottenham Hotspur
Rating: 4

Spurs crashed to earth after riding all the way to the UCL Final last season with a truly wretched season that saw a beloved coach fired, a hated coach hired to be his replacement, perhaps the best player from that UCL run sent to Italy, and various other key players either injured or regressed. Almost anything that could have gone wrong did go wrong, however the team was able to scrape together enough competence at the end to at least qualify for Europa League. However, the days of Spurs regularly finishing in the Top 4 and being around the title race at certain points seem like they might be in the rear view.

With Kane, Son, Lloris and Alderwireled Spurs still have a collection of top-end talent, followed by capable professionals in Moura, Sissoko, Sanchez, Lo Celso, Lamela and Bergwijin. Outside of that the team has obvious problems at a number of positions, most clearly at fullback with Serge Aurier (perhaps out the door as an improbable bidding war in Germany and Italy appears to be taking place) and Ben Davies providing below-average defense and service on both sides. There also are significant issues in central midfield, Sissoko is good but Harry Winks is not, and record signing Tanguay Ndombele had a lost first year in London, battling injuries, fitness and staying on Jose Mourinho's good side. That was addressed in a smart acquisition of Pierre-Emile Hojbjerg, but some signs of life from Ndombele would be great.

Attacking Midfield also remains a major concern, primarily because the team never got a suitable replacement for Christian Eriksen, and the sudden decline of Dele Alli, who hasn't played a full season since 2017-2018. Dele is still only 24 and the team desperately needs him to regain his prior form and use his creativity to create scoring chances for the talented forwards that Tottenham still have. Lo Celso was pretty good last season, but he isn't a true replacement for Eriksen, at least he wasn't last season (0 goals, 2 assists) and the team needs talented players on the attacking side who can create chances for Kane/Son/Lucas/Bergwijin.

Perhaps most troubling is that there doesn't appear to be any clear direction for the future of the team. Canning Poch and bringing in Mourinho was a very aggressive move to try and get something immediate with this core of players; you don't bring Jose in to start a rebuild. However, Spurs don't spend money and have sold key players from that core group, sending mixed signals to supporters and making the Jose appointment even more confusing. What is Tottenham actually trying to do? The team also lacks prospects right now who feel like they have the potential to become big stars. That is one thing where Arsenal feel clearly ahead of Tottenham; as miserable as their season was, the development of players like Saka and Nketiah create a wave of optimistic excitement that does not exist at Tottenham at the moment. Young players like Ryan Sessengon and Gedson Fernandes were brought in but did nothing in year one.

At the end of the day, Tottenham should probably score some goals next year, but terrible fullback play will remain an issue as it doesn't appear to be a top priority during the offseason, and the Jose show can spin out of control at any time, if it was ever on track in the first place.
 

67YAZ

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Dec 1, 2000
8,731
Club: Liverpool
Rating: 10

There's nothing to complain about. The club spent the past year winning everything in sight and setting records along the way. There is a clear and manageable wage structure in place while using (pre-COVID) growing annual profits to reinvest in the club with Anfield expansions and a new training complex.

Sure, it wasn't fun to miss out on Timo Werner, but years of being a Patriots fan allows me wave away these kinds of disappointments by uttering the phrase, "In Klopp We Trust." The manager shows an uncanny knack for finding "his guys" and coaching up young'uns. With Harvey Elliott, Rhian Brewster, and Curtis Jones on the fringes of the first team already, the talent pipeline looks ready to produce key players while the squad's core is still in its prime years and under contract for a few more years still.

If I was to complain about anything, it would be the new Nike uniforms that are somehow both basic and ugly as hell.
 

wonderland

New Member
Jul 20, 2005
525
I think it’s going to be an interesting year for Liverpool. They didn’t play that well after the restart. Was that due to the fact they didn’t have much to play for or are they on the gradual decline from playing so many matches the past few years while not adding too many parts and becoming stale?

I could see them following the City model (100 pts, 98 pts, and last year 81 pts) as Liverpool went 97 and 99 the last two years.
 

SocrManiac

Tommy Seebach’s mustache
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Apr 15, 2006
8,634
Somers, CT
Juventus
Rating: 5

Juventus have made no secret for the past few years that the main goal and ambition is in Europe. They moved heaven and earth to bring a Portuguese specialist in to aid in the quest, but the results the past two years have been disappointing.

Domestically, the side was maddeningly inconsistent. With the payroll and talent on the roster, there was no excuse not to comfortably put Serie A away to focus on the Big Ears. Unfortunately, new manager Sarri nearly pulled off the impossible and guided the team to a stumbling, uninspired title, Coppa failure, and an early exit in Europe.

On the bright side, Ronaldo scored his first free kick goal in 43 attempts (much to the relief of guys he’s been pummeling in walls).

Defensively, they leaked goals all year. Much of this was put down to a misunderstanding of Sarri’s system, but injuries and luck played a part. Chiellini continues to be a critical cog and his absence was keenly felt. Bonnuci’s ability to play out of the back becoming David Luis-like in its lack of justification for his defensive liabilities. De Ligt is likely going to have his arms amputated after seemingly conceding a penalty per match due to some sort of ball/hand magnetism. Even in a straightjacket with his limbs sewn to his sides, it seems likely he’d have heard several head-scratching whistles for handling in the box.

Pjanic is now out, mainly because he’s the last jersey I purchased. The Dybala rumors have already started, but that’s more of a marker that it’s the transfer season and not that he’s actually moving. Higuain and Khederia are out (thank fuck in Sami’s case).

There’s a new manager, who apparently isn’t impressed a lot. He brings a bucket of experience including one game in charge of a youth squad (where he was pummeled badly). Hopefully Pirlo has some Zidane in him because the rest of the credentials aren’t there yet. Juventus is a punishing place to manage. Is he going to be a Lampard, or is he going to be a Gattusso?
 

67YAZ

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Dec 1, 2000
8,731
I think it’s going to be an interesting year for Liverpool. They didn’t play that well after the restart. Was that due to the fact they didn’t have much to play for or are they on the gradual decline from playing so many matches the past few years while not adding too many parts and becoming stale?

I could see them following the City model (100 pts, 98 pts, and last year 81 pts) as Liverpool went 97 and 99 the last two years.
The intensity level was just inconsistent after the restart. I do think the players felt like the title was in the bag, so they tried to do just enough to get over the line. But already Klopp has talked about a need to do more rotation this coming season to keep guys fresh following a short summer break and a very congrested season ahead.

It will be interesting to watch the side evolve if Thiago comes in and Gini heads out to Barca (with the caveat that it's silly season and all). Thiago's passing would open up a lot of new attacking options, especially against parked buses. But Gini has been the ultimate role player for Klopp, doing anything and everything in the midfield at a A-/B+ level including pressing for the full 90 match after match.
 

Titans Bastard

has sunil gulati in his sights
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Dec 15, 2002
14,446
New England Revolution
Rating: 3

The Revs sucked for most of the 2010s, with a few good years interspersed in the middle. The highlight was 2014: powered by MVLee Nguyen and lucking into Jermaine Jones, the Revs reached the MLS Cup for the fifth time and lost for the fifth time. (But damn, that 2014 conference final second leg game against NYRB was the best atmosphere I've ever experienced at an MLS game.)

But mostly, the 2010s were defined by the traditional "Krapathy" that afflicts the club, as the Krafts couldn't be bothered to hold Mike Burns accountable, who himself was afraid to hold Jay Heaps accountable for fear of being exposed. A lot of bleak years.

The team is on the upswing since Bruce Arena became the coach/GM. Is the Bruce a little past his sell-by date? Sure, but a somewhat stale Arena represents a major improvement on Burns/Heaps and the misbegotten and blessedly brief Friedel era. The Revs feel like a decent mid-table team now, perhaps with the potential for a bit more down the road in 2021 if Arena plays his cards right. The Revs aren't going to be starf*****s like the LA Galaxy, but Arena's arrival did coincide with a willingness to invest in higher end players like Carles Gil, Gustavo Bou, and Adam Buksa (TBD on whether Buksa works out, of course).

Off the field, there's also been something of an uptick in investment. The Revs got a snazzy new training facility and the organization launched a reserve team in USL League One, which creates a pipeline to the first team, albeit one that isn't especially full of talent yet compared to other MLS reserve teams. And that's all positive, but the big things are the stadium and an attempt to seriously engage with existing soccer fans in the area. As always, not much to report on that front.
 

SocrManiac

Tommy Seebach’s mustache
SoSH Member
Apr 15, 2006
8,634
Somers, CT
The highlight was 2014: powered by MVLee Nguyen and lucking into Jermaine Jones, the Revs reached the MLS Cup for the fifth time and lost for the fifth time. (But damn, that 2014 conference final second leg game against NYRB was the best atmosphere I've ever experienced at an MLS game.)
Completely unrelated to the thread, but this was the best tailgate I’ve ever attended and I fully agree with your atmosphere comment.

After the game, the complete lack of traffic control was hilarious. We went back to our tailgate spot crowd watched. There was a Jetta we used to mark progress and it was stuck for over two hours- the crowd simply couldn’t escape.

My wife was 6 months pregnant at the time and freezing. I took a couple of the guys in my group up to Walgreens to see what we could find that would burn. We were about to walk out with a massive package of paper towels when we spotted the last pack of Duraflame logs between the vestibule doors. We had heat!!!

One of the guys was wearing a camo onsie and smuggled no fewer than twelve cans of Bud Light unto Gillette on his person.

Goddamn, what a night.
 

67YAZ

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Dec 1, 2000
8,731
Club: Chicago Fire
Rating: 5

This is all about optimism for the future, not the current onfield product.

The Fire finally have an owner who wants a successful club, not simply an asset that appreciates in value. In short order, Mansueto brought the club back into Chicago proper and worked out a fair deal with the city of Bridgeview to end one of the saddest, most exploitative stadium deals anywhere. The Fire then got a local TV deal and brought in Arlo White & Tony Meola to call the matches. The badge and uniform redesign may have been poorly executed, by Mansueto has already indicated a willingness to redo those if fans don't come around. But it's the sidelining of the club's independent supporter's organization in favor of their own corporate-run group that's the biggest blackmark off-the-pitch.

Let's charitably call the soccer-side of things a work in progress. Mansueto clearly had a plan in place when he took over, quickly bringing in Georg Heitz to oversee football operations. Hietz then very quickly built out his staff with a cadre of experienced hands from Europe, including bringing Ralph Wicky over from the youth national team. And then they tossed in local legend Frank Klopas for fun.

The roster rebuilding has been a mix of promising young players (Aliseda, Navarro), bargain-value prime-age players (Beric, Gimenez, Sekulic), and a bunch of homegrowns, headlined by rookie starter Mauricio Pineda. There's a lot more work to do turning over this roster, no doubt, but it would nice to see some semblance of a system or identity come together during this wacky season. The tactics used to beat the Sounders - defend as a block & punish mistakes - haven't been replicated again. Guys on the pitch are clearly struggling to carve out roles and stitch together fluid passages of play. Quality in the final third is almost nonexistent. There's a ton of work to do.

But at least there is an owner in place who cares and will hold folks accountable if there is no progress!

And +1 for dumping Aleksander Katai.

Club: Chicago Red Stars
Rating: 4

The Red Stars consistently have the best uniforms in North America. They also have Julie Ertz, who - for my money - is still the best defensive player in the women's game.

Unfortunately, the Red Stars had maybe the best pure goalscorer in the women's game in Sam Kerr, but couldn't hold on to her. Keila Watt has been better than advertised out on the wing, but there's no consistent goal-scoring threat in the middle or on the other wing, so too often Watt runs into 2 or 3 defenders. The sidelining of Yuki, their most traditionally creative midfielder, has been curious. She wasn't on the injury report in Utah, but never made it on the pitch for the knockout matches. I really have no idea where the goals are going to come from, though it's an excellent bet the Red Stars won't let many in.

-2 points for the NWSL not having any matches scheduled for the rest of this year. Could this be it for the league?
 
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tmracht

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Aug 19, 2009
3,070
Oh man can I make this a multipart series?

Chelsea: 8
They're back to buying all the talent they can find except keeper as of now. Silva brings experience and Sarr while not a world beater is decent depth at CB. Chilwell could be huge. The team was expected to fall out of Champions League position after having lost Hazard and the transfer ban levied, but Lampard was able to navigate the season leaning on the youth.

The team should be beyond exciting in attack if Werner and Ziyech can settle into the EPL. Goalie remains a question, but otherwise it's an exciting time. Oh yeah and Captain America was ascending until his muscle tear in the cup final.

Revs: 5
They're not good as currently built but the investment is finally coming from above. Arena is old and sometimes shows it with the mentality but their was some invention when Gil and Bou were healthy. Buksa has a future, midfield is a mess, and I'm not sure what their best formation is. But there is at least something to look forward to. Which had been severely lacking in recent years.

Fenerbahce: 3
Just not the same the past few seasons coming off the championship challenge three seasons ago. 6th and 7th aren't good enough for a club of that stature. They haven't made good signings and with the Champions in bed with AKP the funding for Basaksehir will be stronger than Fener.
 

Tangled Up In Red

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Nov 8, 2004
4,540
Bernal
Chelsea: 8
The team should be beyond exciting in attack if Werner and Ziyech can settle into the EPL. Goalie remains a question, but otherwise it's an exciting time. Oh yeah and Captain America was ascending until his muscle tear in the cup final.
And aren't they rumored to be getting Havertz?!
 

OCST

Sunny von Bulow
SoSH Member
Jan 10, 2004
24,483
The 718
Everton

5

Pros:

  • Unbelievable coup hiring Carlo F'n Ancelotti last year.
  • Exciting young talent
    • Richarlison is fantastic, works very hard (yes he flops, he also gets the crap beat out of him)
    • Mason Holgate had an elite-level year at CB (although dropped off in the restart).
    • Calvert-Lewin took a giant leap forward, he and Richy were a lethal 1-2 punch for much of the season (although also dropped off in restart)
    • Yerry Mina is a huge talent, literally and figuratively
    • Off-and-on Michael Keane suddenly decided he was good again during the restart and was arguably the team's best player then
    • Jonjoe Kenny had a very good loan at Schalke and so either will try to dislodge Seamus Coleman or be sold at a decent price
  • New stadium on the docks is a go and looks fantastic, ETA 2024
  • For several months mid-season, from when Duncan Ferguson took over as interim, through the hiring of Carlo and until just before the COVID interruption, Toffees were at the top of the form table and looked very tough.
Cons:
  • Before and after the mid-year hot streak, we were dreadful
  • Midfield is a black hole of suck: cannot get service to our forwards, get torn apart by good attacking squads. You couldn't cobble together two good midfielders with the best spare parts from all of these guys.
    • Gylfi Sigurdsson has fallen off a cliff. 12 goals, 6 assists in 2018/19, but even then he had a rep of ghosting through games, having minimal impact for 89 minutes but chipping in along the way with a golazo. Last year, 2 goals, 1 assist, and completely ineffectual. Slow as molasses. Shies away from contact. Always passing back to the CBs, never carrying the play. Granted, Carlo played a 4-4-2 and he's a natural No.10 that doesn't fit there, but still, he's awful.
    • Theo Walcott. Bless his heart, he plays hard and he still has loads of pace. His end product is terrible. I compare him to the Scout #9 piece in Stratego: gets to the other end of the board in a flash, utterly ineffective when he gets there.
    • Alex Iwobi. Brought in for a hefty fee at the close of last year's window when we couldn't close a deal for Zaha. Another guy who seems wasted in a 4-4-2. Might do well as a classic No. 10 also, and could have challenged for that in Marco Silva's 4-2-3-1, but he's been poor.
    • Bernard. has a MOTM performance a couple of times a year, then doesn't influence proceedings. At 5'5" and of slight build, he seems not to make it through 90', he can't take the pounding. Just recently learned he suffered through debilitating panic attacks last season, so here's hoping he can put that behind him.
    • Fabian Delph. Fuck this guy. Was brought in to provide veteran leadership, but was possibly our most petulant and sulky player, which is no mean feat. Famously rounded on his teammates during a set piece and started pointing and yelling at them for poor positioning, and then promptly gave up an OG when the free kick bounced off his body. Also picked a fight with fans on Instagram. Also made of glass.
    • Jean-Pierre Gbamin. Very well regarded DM signed from Mainz. Suffered a bad quad tear in the third game of the season last year. Had recovered and was in training to return when he ruptured his Achilles. Still out. Supposedly coming back before the end of the calendar year, but will he ever play well again, or even at all?
    • Tom Davies. I've been a fan but he's just not very good. Does most things passably well enough to be a 4th/5th option, has no real strength. To be fair he has been jerked around between roles and systems by 7(!) different managers. I would favor a loan to the Championship - let him play every week in a stable system and let him get his corners knocked off in a physical competition. Worked wonders for Holgate, who was a marginal prospect before his loan to West Brom two seasons ago, helped them make the playoffs, and played himself into consideration for the England side last year.
  • Speaking of England: England's Number One, Jordan Pickford, has shown himself to be a child-man who can't regulate his emotions. He is an excellent shot-stopper, a very good outlet passer, but also a petulant asshole who does not command the position.
  • Seamus Coleman, loyal club servant and a top RB for many years, is old and never the same after his leg got snapped in half.
  • Yerry Mina can't stay healthy.
  • 19yo Moise Kean hasn't shown anything.
And to be honest there's just a malaise. Everton should mean Goodison the bear pit, a side that fights to the death, the one place Wenger named without hesitation when asked the toughest place to play in England. But too often they've just been limp and passive.

They're about to sign Allan from Napoli, a good CM and an Carlo favorite. Also rumored to be in on Doucoure from Watford, that would be fine. If they can add a good winger and solve RB, and if Gbamin can get healthy, and if Pickford can grow up, if if if.... shape.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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Jul 2, 2006
22,345
Philadelphia
Arsenal: 6

Cons:

- Just had our worst league finish in a very long time.
- Roster still includes a lot of mediocre holdovers from the Wenger era.
- Fighting an uphill battle to get back into the CL given the resources of other clubs.

Pros

- Mikel Arteta has been hugely impressive so far. He still has much to prove, but you couldn’t ask for a better first six months of management. Tactically he appears very sharp: The refrain we’ve heard from many players is that Arteta gives them a game plan every match and that they’re amazed at how often match situations play out exactly as he told them to expect. Just as importantly, Arteta has done wonders for the club’s culture. He has been clear from day one that he would need a very high level of commitment, effort, and professionalism and the players (with a couple notable exceptions) have bought in.

- Raul Sanllehi is gone, which means the entire post-Wenger triumvirate of directors (Gazidis, Sanllehi, Mislinstat) has left. Power on the footballing side now rests with Edu and Arteta, with Per Mertesacker also playing an important role as academy director. It’s too early to judge this group bit there is a lot to like. They have cleared out a lot of longtime mainstays, they are doing some creative things with the academy, and there are signs that they will be incorporating analytics and video scouting a lot more than in the past. Whether they deliver results is anybody’s guess. But for the first time in a very long time, Arsenal is now run by young directors who seem to have a progressive outlook on how to do things and look for competitive advantage.

-Young talent. The club has amassed a really nice core of talented young players, most notably Bukayo Saka, Gabriel Martinelli, William Saliba, Gabriel Magalhaes (who should be announced any day), and Kieran Tierney. There are 5-6 other young playerswho dont have such ceilings but seem like useful squad players and with still some break out potential. This is a very strong core to potentially build around.

The new management team has a big challenge. They really need to be active this window - both buying and selling - and this is a very tough window for that. The midfield remains a total mess. We need at least two new players there. Arteta then needs to start the next stages of his project on the field. And he needs to not only get his side playing better, but competing to finish top four against two truly elite sides in City and Liverpool and two other sides in Chelsea and United that finished top four last year and could be much improved when the transfer window closes. It’s a massive challenge for any manager. But there’s at least reason to hope that if we give Arteta a few more important players to work with, he’ll give us a puncher’s chance. Most importantly, it feels like the club is going in the right direction at last and the foundations are being laid for a more competitive team in the future.
 
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Rwillh11

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 23, 2010
225
Everton

5
This is substantially more optimistic that where I am at. Ancelotti seems great, but there is no money, no wingers and no midfield. It seems like the league figured out the 4-4-2 after the restart, and we haven't got the personal for it anyways. I'm not sure how they fund Allan + Doucoure without selling an important player(s?) - and even if they do there are massive holes. Siggurdson can't play in a midfield 2, Iwobi has looked awful on the wing. They still have a bunc of deadwood like Sandro, Bolaise and Besic (at least Cuco Martina is off the books). Maybe you can imagine things looking better moving back to a 4-2-3-1 if they get their midfield targets - but Calvert-Lewin was totally ineffectual as the lone striker. Anthony Gordon is exciting, but the academy otherwise seems to have dried up for the time being.

The new stadium is something to look forward to, and Ancelotti is likely to get the best out of what he has. Unfortunately, I don't think they have the side to challenge for Europe this year unless everything breaks perfectly, and if they don't make it I'd have to imagine Richarlison and Digne are gone, even if they both seem to genuinely enjoy playing for Everton. I suppose if thats the case, we will see if Ancelotti can build a team the way he wants with a sizeable budget (if he sticks around for it).

I'd say its about a 3.5. With Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin, being caught in a relegation battle seems unlikely - although if the midfield plays like it did after the restart, its possible. But pushing for Europe also doesn't seem that realistic, and given the expenditures over the last few years and the lack of exciting young players, it's hard to be too excited.
 

OCST

Sunny von Bulow
SoSH Member
Jan 10, 2004
24,483
The 718
This is substantially more optimistic that where I am at. Ancelotti seems great, but there is no money, no wingers and no midfield. It seems like the league figured out the 4-4-2 after the restart, and we haven't got the personal for it anyways. I'm not sure how they fund Allan + Doucoure without selling an important player(s?) - and even if they do there are massive holes. Siggurdson can't play in a midfield 2, Iwobi has looked awful on the wing. They still have a bunc of deadwood like Sandro, Bolaise and Besic (at least Cuco Martina is off the books). Maybe you can imagine things looking better moving back to a 4-2-3-1 if they get their midfield targets - but Calvert-Lewin was totally ineffectual as the lone striker. Anthony Gordon is exciting, but the academy otherwise seems to have dried up for the time being.

The new stadium is something to look forward to, and Ancelotti is likely to get the best out of what he has. Unfortunately, I don't think they have the side to challenge for Europe this year unless everything breaks perfectly, and if they don't make it I'd have to imagine Richarlison and Digne are gone, even if they both seem to genuinely enjoy playing for Everton. I suppose if thats the case, we will see if Ancelotti can build a team the way he wants with a sizeable budget (if he sticks around for it).

I'd say its about a 3.5. With Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin, being caught in a relegation battle seems unlikely - although if the midfield plays like it did after the restart, its possible. But pushing for Europe also doesn't seem that realistic, and given the expenditures over the last few years and the lack of exciting young players, it's hard to be too excited.
I'm hard pressed to disagree with you on the downside.

You are, of course, correct re: the staggering amount of money tied up in players who aren't fit for purpose and can't easily be moved on.

Optimistically, a midfield of Gomes + a healthy Gbamin + Allan (deal supposedly done, although they might Everton it up) + Doucore? + dross protects the back four, wins balls, and supplies service. DCL is poor as a lone striker, but paired with Richy they were excellent before the restart - a classic bash-and-dash tandem. If we could just get them the ball...

Having (name your clod here) in front of Digne in a 4-4-2 hampers Digne's ability to get forward which is what amounts to our transition to attack right now.

Maybe a 4-3-3 with Kean also up top?

Unfortunately, you're probably right {reaches for drink, sobs quietly}
 

Mighty Joe Young

The North remembers
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Sep 14, 2002
8,401
Halifax, Nova Scotia , Canada
Liverpool

8

Im actually probably at a 10 with regards to the team as constituted. But, the competition is going to be much improved and I don’t think Liverpool were really a 99 point team. So it’s going to be a scrap.

I think Klopp is going to feature two rather distinct teams this year - his classic 4-3-3 setup with the starting 11 pretty much set except for some rotation in midfield. If it ain’t broke.

And .. this is probably dependent on bringing in Thiago .. a 4-2-3-1 setup with a double pivot of Fabinho and Thiago , Mane/Firmino/Keita and Salah up top would be an outstanding lineup.

They have to figure out Wijnaldum‘s contract. Rumours of Barcelona interest are growing stronger and I could see him being sold .. particularly as they seem to have a ready replacement in Thiago Alcantara.

They are needing a Lovren replacement (thank you for your service) ..

It’s a shame that finances appear to be crippling any bigger moves given the money that their major competitors are /will be spending .. Losing Werner hurts .. Looks like they are selling Harry Wilson, Marco Grujic and maybe Shakiri so that should help the bottom line.

Team depth is in good shape .. the new LB they just brought in .. Tsimikas .. looked quite impressive in the friendly on the weekend. The kids are looking good.

So .. as optimistic as I can remember being .. in Klopp we Trust.
 

nolasoxfan

Member
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Jun 11, 2004
6,930
Displaced
Liverpool

9

Typically, I would worry about complacency from a team that won nearly everything there was to win in a 12-16 month period, but I don’t think Klopp will allow it to settle in. I do, however, worry a little about soft tissue injuries after such a grueling schedule, as it’s hard to play at that high a level for so long without some type of physical breakdown. Here, their deep and talented ‘bench’ should help overcome any time lost from minor injuries. Full steam ahead in 2021.
Note: I subtract .5 for minor injury concerns and .5 for the heinous away jerseys because it’s hard to imagine anyone winning in those goddamned Nike rags.
 

teddykgb

Member
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Jul 16, 2005
11,025
Chelmsford, MA
In regards to Liverpool I’m kind of surprised to see them chasing Thiago. He’s a fantastic player but the entire Liverpool strategy is about using the MFs as wedge dive workhorses who cover the advancing fullbacks. They generally bypass the midfield in favor of getting it long quickly to the attackers. Thiago can of course play those passes but ideally they don’t hit those from the midfielder. Then you add in Thiago’s injury history and the pressing style and it seems like a bad fit.

I’d not be happy to see him there so I can’t imagine he’d be a failure but I’m not sure he transforms much. I’d be less happy to see Aouar show up at Anfield
 

Rwillh11

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 23, 2010
225
I'm hard pressed to disagree with you on the downside.

You are, of course, correct re: the staggering amount of money tied up in players who aren't fit for purpose and can't easily be moved on.

Optimistically, a midfield of Gomes + a healthy Gbamin + Allan (deal supposedly done, although they might Everton it up) + Doucore? + dross protects the back four, wins balls, and supplies service. DCL is poor as a lone striker, but paired with Richy they were excellent before the restart - a classic bash-and-dash tandem. If we could just get them the ball...

Having (name your clod here) in front of Digne in a 4-4-2 hampers Digne's ability to get forward which is what amounts to our transition to attack right now.

Maybe a 4-3-3 with Kean also up top?

Unfortunately, you're probably right {reaches for drink, sobs quietly}
Reports today make it seem like Doucore is closer to done than Allan, but in both cases the players want to go to Everton/Ancelotti but the fee is the sticking point. I feel like we've been here (like every transfer window for at least the last years) before, and often times it ends poorly.

I don't quite understand where the 50-70 million for the two of them is going to come from, given that we were supposedly right at FFP limits before, but is it being relaxed somehow given Covid? But the two of them and loans for cover at full back and right wing (with no major outgoings unless someone will take one of our underperforming midfielders) and I'd bump my rating up quite a bit.
 

Mighty Joe Young

The North remembers
SoSH Member
Sep 14, 2002
8,401
Halifax, Nova Scotia , Canada
In regards to Liverpool I’m kind of surprised to see them chasing Thiago. He’s a fantastic player but the entire Liverpool strategy is about using the MFs as wedge dive workhorses who cover the advancing fullbacks. They generally bypass the midfield in favor of getting it long quickly to the attackers. Thiago can of course play those passes but ideally they don’t hit those from the midfielder. Then you add in Thiago’s injury history and the pressing style and it seems like a bad fit.

I’d not be happy to see him there so I can’t imagine he’d be a failure but I’m not sure he transforms much. I’d be less happy to see Aouar show up at Anfield
I tend to agree with you concerning Thiago .. he’s kind of an odd fit and signing older, injury prone and expensive players isn’t really Klopp’s style. And - if you believe the Merseyside press they aren’t chasing Thiago .. all the rumours are coming from Germany and Spain. Still ..he‘s really good as a Plan B
 
Arsenal: 6

Cons:

- Just had our worst league finish in a very long time.
- Roster still includes a lot of mediocre holdovers from the Wenger era.
- Fighting an uphill battle to get back into the CL given the resources of other clubs.

Pros

- Mikel Arteta has been hugely impressive so far. He still has much to prove, but you couldn’t ask for a better first six months of management. Tactically he appears very sharp: The refrain we’ve heard from many players is that Arteta gives them a game plan every match and that they’re amazed at how often match situations play out exactly as he told them to expect. Just as importantly, Arteta has done wonders for the club’s culture. He has been clear from day one that he would need a very high level of commitment, effort, and professionalism and the players (with a couple notable exceptions) have bought in.

- Raul Sanllehi is gone, which means the entire post-Wenger triumvirate of directors (Gazidis, Sanllehi, Mislinstat) has left. Power on the footballing side now rests with Edu and Arteta, with Per Mertesacker also playing an important role as academy director. It’s too early to judge this group bit there is a lot to like. They have cleared out a lot of longtime mainstays, they are doing some creative things with the academy, and there are signs that they will be incorporating analytics and video scouting a lot more than in the past. Whether they deliver results is anybody’s guess. But for the first time in a very long time, Arsenal is now run by young directors who seem to have a progressive outlook on how to do things and look for competitive advantage.

-Young talent. The club has amassed a really nice core of talented young players, most notably Bukayo Saka, Gabriel Martinelli, William Saliba, Gabriel Magalhaes (who should be announced any day), and Kieran Tierney. There are 5-6 other young players who don't have such ceilings but seem like useful squad players and with still some break out potential. This is a very strong core to potentially build around.

The new management team has a big challenge. They really need to be active this window - both buying and selling - and this is a very tough window for that. The midfield remains a total mess. We need at least two new players there. Arteta then needs to start the next stages of his project on the field. And he needs to not only get his side playing better, but competing to finish top four against two truly elite sides in City and Liverpool and two other sides in Chelsea and United that finished top four last year and could be much improved when the transfer window closes. It’s a massive challenge for any manager. But there’s at least reason to hope that if we give Arteta a few more important players to work with, he’ll give us a puncher’s chance. Most importantly, it feels like the club is going in the right direction at last and the foundations are being laid for a more competitive team in the future.
I would give very similar reasoning to this, but probably rate my feelings about Arsenal as more of a 7 or 7.5.

One seeming constant in the late Wenger years and under Emery is that Arsenal really struggled against the bigger clubs - e.g., from January 2015 to the start of the 2019-20 season, Arsenal drew 8 and lost 14 of their 22 away matches against Top 6 teams in the table. And up to and including the 3-0 defeat against Manchester City right after the lockdown ended, in their 29 most recent Premier League matches against Man City, Liverpool and Chelsea (home and away), Arsenal took a total of 18 points to their opponents' 60 points. But Arsenal somehow managed to defeat each of those latter three clubs *in the past six weeks* - Liverpool in the league, Man City and Chelsea in the FA Cup - which is pretty impressive given that three-and-a-half of those weeks were the offseason. So that's supremely encouraging.
 

Stanley Steamer

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 11, 2012
1,436
Rossland, BC
Leeds United
Rating: 9
I figure it's down to me to start a thread for the team this year, so I'll save the detailed analysis for that, once transfer dealings are more clear.
That said, we're up! Most of the last two decades were spent daring to dream of that possibility, only to be crushed by the hard realities of life in the Championship. And now, I get a year (and hopefully more) off. With that comes the recognition that there will be a lot more losing this coming year, so a point off. But Marcelo Bielsa has brought joy back to my bereft club, and a sense of hope as well. Even though the talent pool at Leeds will pale in comparison to that of the vast majority of the sides they will face in the PL, I look forward to seeing if Bielsa can continue to get more than the sum of its parts, and mount a campaign of consolidation. And I actually believe he can, and they can. It feels strange to be so optimistic about my favorite football club.
 

Huntington Avenue Grounds

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 17, 2008
1,899
Lunenburg, MA
New York Red Bulls
Rating: 3

In a lot of ways, RBNY was the model MLS franchise in the 2010's. Great development pipeline (Adams, Miazga, Long), up and coming coach (Jesse Marsch), beautiful SSS, and (regular season) successes with three Supporters Shields. Throw in a legend playing out his career (Henry) and a scrap heap pickup that hit huge (Wright-Phillips) and it was a great ride. 10 straight playoff appearances bore out this consistency.

Then......things happened. RB Leipzig came along and the fizzy drink aligned their footy resources to the success of
that flagship product. That meant feeder clubs to push talent along, and things started going sideways. Above players sold off, coach sent to Austria (with continued success), a new rival in the biggest market in the country (NYCFC), retirement and age taking core members of those teams away and you had the makings of a minor league team in a minor league league. Add all that to the playoffs exits that would make pre-2004 Sox fans proud and you have a disgruntled fan-base rooting for a team that is there to produce talent for their bigger brothers.

Where do they go from here? Keep developing and not bringing in the Eurostar on the back 9 of his career? Play a high tempo, pressing brand of football that works great in a long haul league season but all success is predicated on playoff performance where that can be neutralized for 90 minutes when the intensity is dialed up on the opposing bench? I really don't know where it's going but it has the feelings of a rebuild into something that nobody in the States wants to see.

I need a drink.
 

sodenj5

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 14, 2005
6,619
CT
Real Madrid

Confidence: 7

Real in ways simultaneously underperformed and outperformed last season. After the return from quarantine, they played the best football they played all year. Courtois at times looked like the best keeper in the world. Hazard has to be looked at as a massive disappointment, but despite his absence for most of the year, the team played well.

The thing that gives me long term confidence is Real had a plan for life after Cristiano. We’re starting to see the transition from the old guard to the new. Mendy is overtaking Marcelo. Fede Valverde was a critical role player. Vinicius and Rodrygo continue to show progress and growth. Odegaard looked fantastic with Sociedad and is coming back to the club. He’ll likely get some regular minutes with Modric likely becoming a regular sub off the bench this year.

Some guys haven’t planned out exactly as planned. You hope that was a worst case scenario for Hazard and he bounces back instead of the beginning of the end for him. Jovic couldn’t break into any significant minutes to spell Benzema, and then got Corona at a party while he was away from the team rehabbing.

The knock on Zidane was he flushed La Liga away because all he cared about was the Champion’s League and he relied on Cristiano to do everything. Well this year he comes back and wins La Liga without Ronaldo. Zidane isn’t a perfect manager, but he may be the perfect manager for Madrid. That, along with Real’s apparent commitment to buy and develop young talent, gives me confidence that they can compete not only this year, but in the future as well. Mbappe would also help. Wouldn’t hate to see that.
 

Zososoxfan

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 30, 2009
9,209
South of North
FC Barcelona
Rating: 1

Messi's leaving in a fit of justified despondency and rage. Alba has 4 years remaining on his contract, Busi has 3. Everyone on the squad has astronomically high wages. The President refuses to resign even though he's been destroying the club (not just the football ops either) for the past 5 years. Every playing legend of the past 10 years, both active and retired, supports Messi and has described the club--specifically its management--as being in a total meltdown and crisis. Deulofeu is shitting on people on social media and he's not even wrong. Fucking Deulofeu!
 
Last edited:

OCST

Sunny von Bulow
SoSH Member
Jan 10, 2004
24,483
The 718
New York Red Bulls
Rating: 3

In a lot of ways, RBNY was the model MLS franchise in the 2010's. Great development pipeline (Adams, Miazga, Long), up and coming coach (Jesse Marsch), beautiful SSS, and (regular season) successes with three Supporters Shields. Throw in a legend playing out his career (Henry) and a scrap heap pickup that hit huge (Wright-Phillips) and it was a great ride. 10 straight playoff appearances bore out this consistency.

Then......things happened. RB Leipzig came along and the fizzy drink aligned their footy resources to the success of
that flagship product. That meant feeder clubs to push talent along, and things started going sideways. Above players sold off, coach sent to Austria (with continued success), a new rival in the biggest market in the country (NYCFC), retirement and age taking core members of those teams away and you had the makings of a minor league team in a minor league league. Add all that to the playoffs exits that would make pre-2004 Sox fans proud and you have a disgruntled fan-base rooting for a team that is there to produce talent for their bigger brothers.

Where do they go from here? Keep developing and not bringing in the Eurostar on the back 9 of his career? Play a high tempo, pressing brand of football that works great in a long haul league season but all success is predicated on playoff performance where that can be neutralized for 90 minutes when the intensity is dialed up on the opposing bench? I really don't know where it's going but it has the feelings of a rebuild into something that nobody in the States wants to see.

I need a drink.
I love the stadium.

RB are my MLS team but it's just hard to get juiced.

Most American fans don't know the story of RB around the world football community - they just know it's a team named after a product, which is just kind of gauche.

I say this every time this comes up, if they could buy the Cosmos brand and logos from the whack-job who owns them, they'd vault to the top of the pack in terms of street cred and mindshare. There are dozens of bearded tattoo guys walking around Greenpoint and Boerum Hill wearing Cosmos shirts.
 

Cellar-Door

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 1, 2006
34,464
West Ham


Rating 2-3?

All the same issues remain, shit owners, no structure of any kind, no scouting, crap facilities, bare bones analytics, no DOF, no professionals between the owner and the manager.
A boring manager, woefully unbalanced squad, no money to buy
 

candylandriots

unkempt
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Mar 30, 2004
12,327
Berlin
Crystal Palace: 4

They are starting their 8th consecutive year in the Premier League. Roy Hodgson gets more out of the team than he should. But Wilf Zaha wants out and I doubt that they'll get anything near what he's worth to the team itself, since he could be the difference between them staying up and going down (which probably makes him worth GBP 100 million to Steve Parrish?). It's the oldest team in the league, and also one of the highest paid, despite their mid-table finishes. Jordan Ayew was their top goal scorer, who they got for peanuts, while Christian Benteke has scored like 2 goals in the last 2 years or so. They lost seven of their last eight, salvaging a draw on the last game of the season, though they were on a roll before corona. Shit, I had given them a 5, but I just talked myself into changing it to a 4. I still love Selhurst Park though, for probably many of the same reasons that most of us love Fenway.

Union Berlin: 8

I was super impressed with their first season in the Bundesliga. Manager Urs Fischer deserves a statue for bringing them up and keeping them there. This is a team without any stars, but they manage to get it done. Their set pieces are a huge strength (in contrast to Palace, that does jack shit with them), but does make me worry about where the other goals come from. They've lost their goalkeeper, who was possibly the best player on the team, so it will be a tough transition next season bringing in someone new. It's probably my favorite stadium of any that I have been to, and the game day experience is fantastic.
 

Titans Bastard

has sunil gulati in his sights
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Dec 15, 2002
14,446
I need a drink.
I've got just the thing!





Being treated as a subsidiary is always undignified, but NYRB could still be a good team if the greater Red Bull organized cared (see: Red Bull Salzburg's record in Austria). It just seems like the team has dropped to fourth priority among Red Bull clubs with the advent of Red Bull Bragantino last year. NYRB's player recruitment over recent years has been weak and there's currently a lull in their academy production. The wild success of Tyler Adams masked the fact that NYRB's academy really didn't have all that much else in his general age cohort. They have some interesting prospects now with NYRB II, but they are not that close to being game-changers at the MLS level yet. And while NYRB II has a good track record of improving random journeymen, you mostly get squad contributors like Florian Valot and Brian White; stalwarts like Aaron Long are rare and not easily repeatable.

Given the importance of the New York market to the overall perception and domestic relevance in MLS, if Red Bull's seemingly low commitment to NYRB's success continues I have to imagine there will eventually be a desire to get a new owner.
 

bosox4283

Well-Known Member
Gold Supporter
SoSH Member
Mar 2, 2004
4,673
Philadelphia
Atletico de Madrid: 7

La Liga is, in a way, all about money. Atletico have the third largest budget at about 350 million euros, which is about half as much as Real Madrid and Barcelona and nearly twice as much as fourth (Sevilla) and fifth (Valencia).

Of course, the main reason Atletico enjoys this financial position is because Simeone, our beloved madman, has elevated the club's prestige and quality during his nine years at the helm. Gracias al Cholo.

So, given Atletico's financial position, the expectation is that Atletico finish in the top 3 and qualify for the Champions League. Atletico achieved both of these goals this year. In the Champions League, my hope is that Atletico advance to the final 8 and offer something exciting. This year, we had the Liverpool matches, which were thrilling.

My rating of a seven is that, after a somewhat of a transition year, Atletico need to more firmly establish and execute their football style. We all know that Simeone is a defensive-minded coach, one who prioritizes stopping goals more than scoring goals. My belief is that this style worked when Simeone became coach -- the team's quality wasn't what it is now, but he has a group of players that sort of fit his rough and rugged mode of play.

This team's composition is different. Players like Joao Felix, Llorente, Carrasco, Correa, Lodi, and even Thomas Partey offer creativity and a knack for creating scoring chances. Simeone might be able to harness their talent in a counter-attacking style, but I often hope he modifies his tactics to give these players a little more room to showcase their individual talents.

On the other hand, I worry that players like Koke and Saul, who have been such integral parts of the team for so long, are regressing a bit. I'm also concerned that players like Morata and Costa, who are sometimes strong goal scorers, are not as consistent as they need to be for Atletico to compete for the league title or make a run in the Champions League.

The core of the team is young, and this year will be the second the team plays together. Simeone needs to figure out how to maximize his talent and deepen his team's goal-scoring cohesion. Until that time, I'll enjoy his antics and get excited about those few performances each year that give me hope and get my adrenaline pumping.
 

Rwillh11

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 23, 2010
225
I'd say its about a 3.5. With Richarlison and Calvert-Lewin, being caught in a relegation battle seems unlikely - although if the midfield plays like it did after the restart, its possible. But pushing for Europe also doesn't seem that realistic, and given the expenditures over the last few years and the lack of exciting young players, it's hard to be too excited.
So....worth revisiting this now that we apparently have a whole new midfield. There are still depth issues, but this now an exciting first 11. Interesting to see whether Ancelloti lines with a midfield diamond, which might allow him to accomodate the strongest players in their best position, or sticks with same formation last year (perhaps with James on the right and ???? on the left). But it's now an exciting front 2, a very solid midfield, a few creative players, and a solid if very shallow defense.

Surprised they were able to pull it off and still have questions about financial implications down the line, but I'd bump myself up to a 7 - I think this is a team that can challenge for a European spot.