Can you go into this? I know it was a disaster, but I'd love to read your thoughts on it.
How good was Kobe Bryant?
- Thread starter Kliq
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Yeah, I mean, take these for what they're worth, but Simmons had him at #8 when his book came out, this Bleacher Report list has him at 14, this FoxSports list has him at 12, and this crowd-sourced list has him at 12 as well. And I could link to numerous other lists where he appears between 12-10.
So I'd say it's probably fair to characterize the consensus on Kobe as a "borderline top 10 player" but not a top 10 lock by any means (with the obvious caveat that ranking players in this manner, especially across decades, is a fool's errand anyway for all the reasons others have already pointed out).
Now if the question is about how influential a player was then I think there is a better case that he is definitely in the top 10 and probably in the top 5.
So I don't have a lot of new thoughts of my own to offer here, but this guy's videos are tremendous in my opinion, and he posted this one a few weeks ago. The major points are about how people undervalue just how well Kobe adapted to being surrounded by other elite offensive talents, which doesn't always happen (eg. James Harden).
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5i3UexwTYg
The guy was the best offensive player on some all time great offenses, and I think a lot of the individual rate stats that suggest he was a chucker or a black hole don't capture the tremendous impact gravity and attention can have on a defense. This is a point made in the video. He took a lot of shots, but even when he was inefficient he was drawing huge amounts of attention from the defense.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5i3UexwTYg
The guy was the best offensive player on some all time great offenses, and I think a lot of the individual rate stats that suggest he was a chucker or a black hole don't capture the tremendous impact gravity and attention can have on a defense. This is a point made in the video. He took a lot of shots, but even when he was inefficient he was drawing huge amounts of attention from the defense.
There were multiple reasons why the US performed so poorly in Athens, and to get into every one would be a serious topic drift for this thread: Bad coaching; roster construction, which was exacerbated when various players (including Kobe, who was being tried for sexual assault/rape) either willfully skipped out or were unable to make it for other reasons; and FIBA foibles were the main ones.
But, if IIRC, the international game at the time consisted of ball movement, help/rotational defense, and 3 point shooting. The opponents were often much more fun to watch than the constant attempts at hero ball put on by Team USA. It wasn't long after that NBA teams started to realize that the 3 is not a gimmick, but instead is actually a useful weapon and is often one of the more efficient ways to score points.
It really is an amazing collection of basketball knuckleheads and shoot-first players. The team had four guards, Allen Iverson, Stephon Marbury, baby Dwyane Wade and young Richard Jefferson.