Ime Udoka suspended for the 22-23 season

[PedroKsBambino]

I just found it amusing that in the last 17 years we’ve celebrated 6 championships, went through/still going through a once in a hundred years pandemic, Pats TE murdered 3 people, Russia invading a sovereign nation, reality show host as POTUS, all of the extended Marvel Universe movies, Herron getting traded without proper explanation from BB, multiple MLB cheating scandals…you get the idea, and this is what gets you to say hello.

As another poster said, we’ll see you in 2039

edit: and you got a tag out of it! I don’t have one of those. Sad.

Phew-you had it!

 

[Obscure Name]

Not sure this is exactly accurate. Wyc said “The suspension comes with, at least I’ll say, a significant financial penalty when you net it all out. That’s an accurate statement. Very significant financial penalty.” He sidestepped the question of whether the suspension was with or without pay. He said he did not plan to address this question at all in the presser, but decided in the end to give that much information. I'm not sure legally how this works, but it sounded to me like Ime is getting paid but agreed to give up some percentage of his salary, perhaps?

Quick googling, it looks like coach's contracts can have bonuses or escalators like player contracts, per win and such. "When you net it all out" sounds like it could cover lost income from obviously unobtainable benchmarks.

 

[RedOctober3829]

View: https://twitter.com/Amanda_Pflugrad/status/1573429591443660809?s=20&t=KfXdcICBJ7U6En24wlxB6Q

 

[Mueller's Twin Grannies]

If the FO wants to stop the leaks, then they should circulate a couple of different, fake stories among those they suspect and see which one makes it to Woj or Shams or anyone else, then go from there.

 

[SoxInTheMist]

If the FO wants to stop the leaks, then they should circulate a couple of different, fake stories among those they suspect and see which one makes it to Woj or Shams or anyone else, then go from there.

A great way to alienate everyone in the organization who isn't leaking information. I don't think I'd appreciate my boss feeding me stories/details about something just to see if I'd leak it. I don't really want to work for someone who doesn't trust me like that.

 

[DonBuddinE6]

If the FO wants to stop the leaks, then they should circulate a couple of different, fake stories among those they suspect and see which one makes it to Woj or Shams or anyone else, then go from there.

Are you married to Wayne Rooney, perchance?

 

[mcpickl]

I realize that an employment agreement can contain just about any terms not specifically prohibited by law... but under usual definitions of firing for-cause, you'd think this would be covered. And if so, you wouldn't have much of a leg to stand on suing for wrongful termination or getting the value of your contract paid out, right?

Can any of the ECB folks here give some ideas of why the team would be willing to pay more than a nominal go-away severance to an employee under these conditions? They've got a law firm's report confirming, it would appear, severe violations of team policies, and conduct bordering on criminal (whether or not a DA would pursue it). Under what circumstances would they be unwilling to just fire him after the conclusion of the investigation?

Maybe.

But he could still sue them to pay out his contract, whether he deserves it or not. Even whether he wins a case or not.

Does the woman in this affair want to be deposed? Does Wyc Grousbeck want to be deposed? Or Brad Stevens? Or Jayson Tatum?

My guess is it is worth some amount of money to avoid that, and they're negotiating to figure out what that number is.

 

[Mueller's Twin Grannies]

A great way to alienate everyone in the organization who isn't leaking information. I don't think I'd appreciate my boss feeding me stories/details about something just to see if I'd leak it. I don't really want to work for someone who doesn't trust me like that.

This is fair, but I imagine it's a very short list of suspects, if more than one.

Are you married to Wayne Rooney, perchance?

No, but I did once play footsie with Andy.

 

[Pablo's TB Lover]

If the FO wants to stop the leaks, then they should circulate a couple of different, fake stories among those they suspect and see which one makes it to Woj or Shams or anyone else, then go from there.

Just wow. Let's have some more female employees of the team get doxxed.

 

[mcpickl]

This was the segment. Interesting that he also said 'everybody knew.'
View: https://youtu.be/Hv_kkF2ifY0

ESPN is a disaster.

They were having a thoughtful, difficult conversation handled really well by 4 panelists, then they drop this blowhard moron into the mix to throw everything off the rails.

Gotta be depressing to work in the media and keep seeing these know nothings who will just yell whatever nonsense pops into their heads keep getting promoted to bigger platforms.

 

[ifmanis5]

Are you married to Wayne Rooney, perchance?

Haha very good.
Perhaps a Vanessa Peroncell burner account?

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

If the FO wants to stop the leaks, then they should circulate a couple of different, fake stories among those they suspect and see which one makes it to Woj or Shams or anyone else, then go from there.

Do you work in PR?

 

[kevmyster]

If the FO wants to stop the leaks, then they should circulate a couple of different, fake stories among those they suspect and see which one makes it to Woj or Shams or anyone else, then go from there.

Should they also devise a way to keep the organization’s ships in the bay? Perhaps with a giant chain?

 

[radsoxfan]

If the FO wants to stop the leaks, then they should circulate a couple of different, fake stories among those they suspect and see which one makes it to Woj or Shams or anyone else, then go from there.

In this case, there’s also an entire outside legal team that knows all the info.

Lots of leak possibilities….

 

[Mueller's Twin Grannies]

In this case, there’s also an entire outside legal team that knows all the info.

Lots of leak possibilities….

Ah, I hadn't considered that aspect of it. It was not my best idea, so I'm fine not defending it and letting it go by the wayside. I defer to the experts in office management in this one.

Do you work in PR?

I work remote, but not that remote.

 

[benhogan]

In this case, there’s also an entire outside legal team that knows all the info.

Lots of leak possibilities….

the front office and outside legal knew about this 2 months ago

yet this story broke after who was told? and who would have access to Shams? and Woj?

a Lawyer, whose career is dependent on retaining privileged information usually doesn't last long divulging info to ESPN. What's the upside for them?

 

[ManicCompression]

I think the people with the most to gain from leaking is Ime Udoka and his agent. Both Woj and Shams came out with tweets saying the relationship was consensual before the team ever made a statement, thus setting the foundation for people thinking that the suspension was unwarranted. After today's press conference, it seems like the suspension stemmed from multiple issues and was not limited to a single consensual relationship (but of course, all we have is speculation). Hypothetically, what would benefit the Celtics is actual details of what Ime did coming out. It being shrouded in such secrecy makes me think they've kept it under lock and key.

What I found interesting about the Perk/Malika Andrews piece is that Perk is referencing reporting from Woj, who's sitting on the panel and is never called to task for being a useful idiot for whoever will provide him access.

 

[riboflav]

Assuming they were thorough, Wyc and the Celtics should be lauded for how they handled this. It stands in stark contrast to what any other sports org has ever done in this situation. While Ime has brought a level of shame to the Cs, we should feel prideful in how ownership and management seem to have handled this. Hiring an outside firm without prompting by the league, no leaks for weeks while an investigation was going on, and the fact that the NBA has not felt compelled to get involved I think speak volumes about how the Cs handled this.

EDIT: Would also add that Brad came across powerfully today at the PC.

 

[Tony C]

The whole "recording while driving" thing is annoying to me.

That said, it seems like the details he's alluding to will come out. They got to Matt Barnes pretty quickly, so someone out there is going to leak it.

Say SAS is an idiot without saying it. She’s as good as it gets.

View: https://twitter.com/minakimes/status/1573378769569849344?s=46&t=chN1L3B4i1pwXgc40Sm7HA

In terms of both of these, I appreciate Barnes saying "i f'd up" in re his original defense of Ime (also agree -- ominous, indeed). And, per the latter....yeah, she's great and the "just wait a beat" advice at the end is apt for Barnes but everyone else, too. Reading through this thread yesterday and seeing stuff on twitter, too...my only reaction was: why all the opinions? We obviously knew (and know) so little about went down...what is it that we live in a society where everyone has to take a side based on, in Stevens' term, BS? The ability to say "gee, I don't know enough to opine" seems an impossibility these days.

 

[djbayko]

Wait, he was having TWO affairs with married women at the same time?

well now I’m getting close to Nip’s camp.

That was one of the rumors going around yesterday, but there were a bunch of rumors.

Have you seen solid reporting on this?

 

[Cesar Crespo]

If the FO wants to stop the leaks, then they should circulate a couple of different, fake stories among those they suspect and see which one makes it to Woj or Shams or anyone else, then go from there.

You rewatch Game of Thrones or something? The Tyrion Lannister method.

 

[Ale Xander]

It’s also the Machiavelli method

 

[Lose Remerswaal]

Assuming they were thorough, Wyc and the Celtics should be lauded for how they handled this. It stands in stark contrast to what any other sports org has ever done in this situation. While Ime has brought a level of shame to the Cs, we should feel prideful in how ownership and management seem to have handled this. Hiring an outside firm without prompting by the league, no leaks for weeks while an investigation was going on, and the fact that the NBA has not felt compelled to get involved I think speak volumes about how the Cs handled this.

EDIT: Would also add that Brad came across powerfully today at the PC.

Funny how this is a complete 180 from what folks were saying yesterday. Before there were even the limited facts that we have.

 

[Mueller's Twin Grannies]

You rewatch Game of Thrones or something? The Tyrion Lannister method.

I've got the drinking down, still working on the knowing things.

 

[EvilEmpire]

Funny how this is a complete 180 from what folks were saying yesterday. Before there were even the limited facts that we have.

Not everyone.

 

[Over Guapo Grande]

edit: and you got a tag out of it! I don’t have one of those. Sad.

Not all tags are great.
Signed
Me

 

[GeorgeCostanza]

Not all tags are great.
Signed
Me

Well you certainly have standing in the matter. That is an….unfortunate one you’ve got there

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

In terms of both of these, I appreciate Barnes saying "i f'd up" in re his original defense of Ime (also agree -- ominous, indeed). And, per the latter....yeah, she's great and the "just wait a beat" advice at the end is apt for Barnes but everyone else, too. Reading through this thread yesterday and seeing stuff on twitter, too...my only reaction was: why all the opinions? We obviously knew (and know) so little about went down...what is it that we live in a society where everyone has to take a side based on, in Stevens' term, BS? The ability to say "gee, I don't know enough to opine" seems an impossibility these days.

Have you read this thread?

More seriously, does SAS make $12M a year by saying, "maybe we should wait for more facts to come out"?

 

[radsoxfan]

the front office and outside legal knew about this 2 months ago

yet this story broke after who was told? and who would have access to Shams? and Woj?

a Lawyer, whose career is dependent on retaining privileged information usually doesn't last long divulging info to ESPN. What's the upside for them?

Not saying that’s the likely scenario… though plenty of people do stupid things for who knows what reason.

Mostly just pointing out a lot of people knew about this, not just Brad, Wyc and Steve.

 

[benhogan]

Not saying that’s the likely scenario… though plenty of people do stupid things for who knows what reason.

Mostly just pointing out a lot of people knew about this, not just Brad, Wyc and Steve.

the players (+ their agents) + the coaches found out ~48hrs ago that IME was suspended for a year (with little detail)

Woj/Shams broke the story ~46hrs ago that Ime was suspended for a year (with little detail)

Brad/Wyc/Steve + the lawyers have tons of details and have known about this for 2 months.

Not sure you have to be a sleuth here or go Tyrion Lannister to figure out its not coming from the C's front office or their lawyers

 

[Lose Remerswaal]

Not everyone.

quite true, which is why I’d didn’t say “everyone”. There were a few of us begging for a statement while many were railing against Wyc overreacting to help an angry senior VP friend.

I am sure those folks will be more reasoned next time

 

[Cellar-Door]

the players (+ their agents) + the coaches found out ~48hrs ago that IME was suspended for a year (with little detail)

Woj/Shams broke the story ~46hrs ago that Ime was suspended for a year (with little detail)

Brad/Wyc/Steve + the lawyers have tons of details and have known about this for 2 months.

Not sure you have to be a sleuth here or go Tyrion Lannister to figure out its not coming from the C's front office or their lawyers

yeah, the Shams leak was obviously from Ime's camp, the initial report by Woj I guess COULD have been from someone with the team who found out at the pre-announcement stage, but likely it's an agent or someone at the league who found out when the Celtics started informing people internally and preparing the announcement.
It's obviously not counsel, and I REALLY doubt it's anyone at the ownership or executive level.

 

[Jimbodandy]

You all don't ignore enough people, including me. I still think that it would have been good to say early on day 2 that they were investigating and would have more to say when it made sense and to please stop speculating or something. But I'll admit to buying into the "sleeping with coworkers" narrative and am pretty embarrassed by it. Proper investigation, proper conclusion. The org acted professionally. Good stuff. They deserved more benefit of the doubt.

 

[ManicCompression]

yeah, the Shams leak was obviously from Ime's camp, the initial report by Woj I guess COULD have been from someone with the team who found out at the pre-announcement stage, but likely it's an agent or someone at the league who found out when the Celtics started informing people internally and preparing the announcement.

Ethan Strauss just put out a piece about this https://houseofstrauss.substack.com/p/espn-caa-woj-and-ime-udoka

Behind a paywall, but the relevant thing here is:

So why the happy talk [Ed. from Woj] about his prospects? Longtime HoS readers probably have an inkling of what’s about to be cited. From The Athletic on March 7, 2022:

Spencer Breecker, 35, CAA Sports’ head of coaches and executives division
Breecker’s summers are busy. If there is an open coaching search, the agent is likely to have a client involved. He’s been with CAA Sports since the agency bought Kauffman Sports Management Group, where he was managing partner. He represents a number of head coaches and lead basketball ops executives around the league, including Monty Williams, Michael Malone, Taylor Jenkins and Ime Udoka.

So longtime CAA man Adrian Wojnarowski is reporting on a coach who’s repped by the very same agency, all while sounding like Udoka’s PR as the scandal broke. Once again, would it kill ESPN to give a disclosure or two on these matters?

I sent an inquiry to Breecker on whether he continues to rep Udoka, because I want to make sure that I’m up to date on an arrangement that isn’t publicly updated, but have yet to get a response. In any event, the Woj reporting has soft-pedaled Udoka’s circumstance and standing. Beyond that, since all NBA roads at ESPN lead through Woj, most everyone else has to operate within that reporting framework.

 

[Kenesaw Martin Landau]

Pretzel logic from the The Ringer

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2022/9/23/23369149/ime-udoka-boston-celtics-suspension

 

[riboflav]

Yeah I also want to follow up that I wasn't a saint midway through this thread. I had concerns of how the actions of ownership were going to be perceived by the players and the rest of the league, meaning players on other teams. In hindsight, I've done some reflecting and now regret having those concerns. I passed them off last night as these concerns would be normal fodder for a sports message board of random fans to express worry about how ownership was handling this situation was going to effect the players (not team performance only but also them as individuals). Looking back, I would've been better off worried far more about the effects on how this was all going to effect the women of Celtics, both those involved directly and those also involved indirectly. That effect on the women of the Celtics is a far greater concern than anything I had alluded to yesterday.

 

[riboflav]

Without more info and hopefully it seems the Cs have done the exact right thing here, it is very noble that the Cs major concern from the get-go was the effect this would have on their workplace and not on the team's chances at gaining another title. It would have been easier, even in this MeToo era, to try to sweep this under the rug and keep their eyes solely focused on raising banner 18. To their credit, they seemingly were willing to risk it all in order to do the right thing. This is how it's coming across now and I do hope that was always their intention. Please let it be.

Edit: to the point where this would not come out until five days before camp!

 

[benhogan]

You all don't ignore enough people, including me. I still think that it would have been good to say early on day 2 that they were investigating and would have more to say when it made sense and to please stop speculating or something. But I'll admit to buying into the "sleeping with coworkers" narrative and am pretty embarrassed by it. Proper investigation, proper conclusion. The org acted professionally. Good stuff. They deserved more benefit of the doubt.

you prefaced it several times by saying that if it was more than consensual you'd drive IME to the airport

don't be embarrassed, just gas the tank

 

[Lose Remerswaal]

Pretzel logic from the The Ringer

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2022/9/23/23369149/ime-udoka-boston-celtics-suspension

I haven’t read the link yet, but I wanted to compliment your screen name. Bravo.

 

[Jimbodandy]

you prefaced it several times by saying that if it was more than consensual you'd drive IME to the airport

don't be embarrassed, just gas the tank

Thank you, and done. But I did pre-judge the org based on bullshit rumors. Got to learn that lesson for next time.

 

[Mooch]

I haven’t read the link yet, but I wanted to compliment your screen name. Bravo.

Agreed.

Reminds me of when I named my fantasy baseball team “Oh Brother, Where Art Howe?”

 

[DJnVa]

Agreed.

Reminds me of when I named my fantasy baseball team “Oh Brother, Where Art Howe?”

 

[GB5]

Having grown up here and read pretty much everything he has written, good and bad, my eye is on Shank here.

He doesn’t ask random questions. I am going to stretch this out, and feel free to let me know that I am crazy.

Shank asked about prior misdeeds by Ime and whether the Celts properly vetted him before hiring him.
Me thinks they have something on Ime’s past. I could see this story going from 100% Ime, to 50% Ime and 50% on the Celts knowing he had a problem and allowing it to go on for too long, or improperly vetting him and missing everything. Either way the Celts organization gets dragged, and they look awful. My wildest worst case is that this takes Brad down with him. That’s probably too much, but it crossed my mind.

Either way I see a long 6-7 page expose on Ime and his demons and the Celts enabling in the Sunday Globe within the next few weeks.

 

[lexrageorge]

Having grown up here and read pretty much everything he has written, good and bad, my eye is on Shank here.

He doesn’t ask random questions. I am going to stretch this out, and feel free to let me know that I am crazy.

Shank asked about prior misdeeds by Ime and whether the Celts properly vetted him before hiring him.
Me thinks they have something on Ime’s past. I could see this story going from 100% Ime, to 50% Ime and 50% on the Celts knowing he had a problem and allowing it to go on for too long, or improperly vetting him and missing everything. Either way the Celts organization gets dragged, and they look awful. My wildest worst case is that this takes Brad down with him. That’s probably too much, but it crossed my mind.

Either way I see a long 6-7 page expose on Ime and his demons and the Celts enabling in the Sunday Globe within the next few weeks.

Why the reflexive need to "both sides" this situation?

 

[AlNipper49]

I don’t think so. Wyc, Brad and the org are going to do everything that their legal representation tells them to do. They were presented with a shitty situation and will not simply play it by the book. The best you’ll get is Brad using big boy words in a press conference. They will not be giving anything but the bare minimum that they need to do because that is smart thing to do.

people can laud them for doing the ethical thing, and perhaps that’s their motivation, but they’re doing the strategic thing. Good for them if it aligns. I feel good about it in a basketball sense is that they’ve done a good job of taking emotion out of a decision making process. It sounds so simple but so few can do it.

 

[JM3]

If Ime was some sort of known serial sex predator not sure why that would just be on the Celtics & not on all the other teams who employed him.

It's not like it's cool to hire a serial sex predator to be an assistant coach.

I assume this is just a dumb effort to discredit the hiring process & Celtics. If Nia Long didn't know, how are the Celtics supposed to know?

 

[Lose Remerswaal]

Having grown up here and read pretty much everything he has written, good and bad, my eye is on Shank here.

He doesn’t ask random questions. I am going to stretch this out, and feel free to let me know that I am crazy.

Shank asked about prior misdeeds by Ime and whether the Celts properly vetted him before hiring him.
Me thinks they have something on Ime’s past. I could see this story going from 100% Ime, to 50% Ime and 50% on the Celts knowing he had a problem and allowing it to go on for too long, or improperly vetting him and missing everything. Either way the Celts organization gets dragged, and they look awful. My wildest worst case is that this takes Brad down with him. That’s probably too much, but it crossed my mind.

Either way I see a long 6-7 page expose on Ime and his demons and the Celts enabling in the Sunday Globe within the next few weeks.

Cool take. We seem to be past the rumors and the jumping to conclusions and then this parable out of whole cloth emerges.

Shank DOES ask questions trying to find an angle or get folks angry and saying things they shouldn’t. It’s why he has his own thread here.

 

[Bernard Gilkey baby]

. I saw that Ringer article and I was thinking, why can’t the writer just admit we all just really really want to know what went down because it’s really interesting. I, for one, am just a gossip who wants to know what happened. Why do we have to pretend we’re noble and we need to know for ethical reasons. I want to know because I’m the type of person who rubbernecks at highway car wrecks.

Does Ime hate to be married but prefers married women? Did he fall in love and lose all interest in basketball for the first time in his life? Does love scare him? Does love make him scary? Do the Celtics players feel like they are Florence Pugh and Ime is Olivia Wilde because Ime stopped paying attention to them? Did losing the Finals make him so sad that he became numb and decided to cause drama just to feel something? Anything? Is Nia Long going to be okay? Is she available?

 

[Kenesaw Martin Landau]

. I saw that Ringer article and I was thinking, why can’t the writer just admit we all just really really want to know what went down because it’s really interesting. I, for one, am just a gossip who wants to know what happened. Why do we have to pretend we’re noble and we need to know for ethical reasons. I want to know because I’m the type of person who rubbernecks at highway car wrecks.

Does Ime hate to be married but prefers married women? Did he fall in love and lose all interest in basketball for the first time in his life? Does love scare him? Does love make him scary? Do the Celtics players feel like they are Florence Pugh and Ime is Olivia Wilde because Ime stopped paying attention to them? Did losing the Finals make him so sad that he became numb and decided to cause drama just to feel something? Anything? Is Nia Long going to be okay? Is she available?

"Allen Ginsberg has entered the chat"

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

. I saw that Ringer article and I was thinking, why can’t the writer just admit we all just really really want to know what went down because it’s really interesting. I, for one, am just a gossip who wants to know what happened. Why do we have to pretend we’re noble and we need to know for ethical reasons. I want to know because I’m the type of person who rubbernecks at highway car wrecks.

Does Ime hate to be married but prefers married women? Did he fall in love and lose all interest in basketball for the first time in his life? Does love scare him? Does love make him scary? Do the Celtics players feel like they are Florence Pugh and Ime is Olivia Wilde because Ime stopped paying attention to them? Did losing the Finals make him so sad that he became numb and decided to cause drama just to feel something? Anything? Is Nia Long going to be okay? Is she available?

This is how you speculate folks. You can also pose as a baby while asking the Glob Sox beat writer questions but I doubt anyone else will be as good at either excercise.

More to the point, hell I too want to know about everything. Ime Udoka worked his ass off to get into the league, worked hard to get a coaching spot and then earned a plum job as a head coach of a storied franchise. He then, like countless other people before him, effectively threw it all away. Why? Etc etc

The problem is that we don't have that information and as much as many of us want it, making it up out of snippets and whole cloth doesn't get us closer to the truth. Given how high profile this story is, I suspect we will get the story with the fullness of time.