That was part of my original post where you said
We are deep into digression in a thread about coach Brad but I am contesting you said 0% chance of getting Beal without Jaylen. 0% usually means impossible? Do I have my hypoteneuses all mixed up?
It's tough in-game with some of these moves, especially the way the Celtics have been playing of late. They fall behind by 20 points and you think "ok, now we'll see Nesmith and more of Pritchard". But then they make a run and Brad, understandably, gets the starters in their and keeps them in because the game is within reach. We all used to make fun of Francona for doing kind of the same thing.
tbb was talking about a scenario where Beal forces a trade, which I missed in my initial read. My 0% post wasn’t assuming that scenario so that’s the disconnect.
FWIW : Garnett was a no-letup regular game time alpha, but a reluctant crunch time presence. Pierce couldn't pull off the non-stop intensity of KG, but was a quite willing crunch time big dog (perhaps too much, but never shy). That complementarity worked wonders!
If Beal comes here it won't be to play 2nd fiddle. He'll be the go to guy in crunch time, which would be good. He's more of a true man up scorer than Tatum, and he's a better passer. He'd be like a big Kemba (pre-injury).
This is insulting to KG. Crunch time defense is important too and he had some amazing clutch plays.
Garnett was a perfect guy to be part of a pairing or 3 man star group. He played amazing defense, was respected enough that he forced everyone else to play hard all the time, could score and pass, but also... he didn't care if he got the final shot at all. That's one of the hardest things to get in a team with multiple "stars". It was a reason MIA worked so well honestly too, Bosh didn't care if he got the shot, LeBron and Wade adjusted as well.
Let’s be honest......every star player needs a KG next to them. He’s the model for the perfect star partner and our generational star trade acquisition.
Both of these. 2008 KG on this team, even with gimpy Kemba and a mediocre to poor 5-12, they'd be a top-3 team. Can you imagine?
I think you're making my point. I'm not sure Tatum would see it as clearly as you do. I'm sure the answer to that problem is that it's the coaches job to make it clear but I don't think listening to Brad is high on Tatum's priority list. This may be a situation that Beal would rather avoid getting into with a family friend.
I think the thing is.... if Tatum isn't going to defer to Beal, he's not going to defer to anybody, and then you're in trouble.
Pierce was Boston's alpha scorer. Garnett was the guy that largely sacrificed his offensive game to keep Ray happy. Garnett was absolutely the clubhouse leader, though.
I said it in a game thread a couple weeks ago, but I really wonder how a 2008 KG would gel with current NBA players. He made Glen Davis cry on the bench during a game. I can't imagine someone like Tatum taking well to getting screamed at in the huddle like that.
It goes both ways right? By that I mean, Beal was very accomplished as a second fiddle playing off of Wall. I think he would excel at taking turns.
He doesn't even gel well with the middle aged honkies of this board. I recall everyone here freaking out when Kev trash talked Charlie Viilanueva. And compared to the Golden Age of trash talk (the 90s), he was rather tame. But even that much color was too much for modern times.
I'd feel a lot better about Tatum's chances of staying in Boston if they acquire Bradley Beal than if they don't acquire Bradley Beal.
By definition, a new voice can be “any” coach as they would bring a new voice. This isn’t college where the coach is as effective as his recruiting and teaching during the 20 hours per week you’re allowed (or whatever it is now). In the NBA everyone is running the same stuff, there are hardly any normal practices during the season, and it’s about managing your team and keeping them engaged. Brad has been dealt a real tough hand in two of the past three years but the Head Coach who is being paid handsomely has the job of figuring it out. Yeah, Brad is a good NBA coach......but is he the best coach to lead this team in 2022 and beyond? I can say same about Ainge which is why I’m a proponent of blowing up the top of the organization with a new GM and the coach he brings in.
See I don't get this. You look at a top 5 most successful franchise the last 5-8 years, despite not having the traditional key to that kind of success (a top 5-10 player in the league in his prime) and say... well let's blow this up... maybe we'll get insanely lucky. That's just straight up stupid.
Someone has to be blamed and it's easier to change the coach or GM than the players.
I don't disagree with the general principle. I disagree with jumping straight to it in a bizarre year like this. I especially don't agree with it for this team, because you're likely making off-season moves. Unless there is a reason to think Tatum and Brown are truly out on Brad (and it doesn't feel that way yet) you go until the ASB next year to get a real look at what you have.
Ok I’ll ask. Who on this team is underperforming this season?
Depends, does firing Brad come with a top 5 player in the league? Because outside of that, TOR really didn't do much, and now that team is a much bigger tire fire than the Celtics. I think Dwayne Casey could have done just fine if you gave him Kawhi.
You're not betting on getting insanely lucky. You're betting on a new voice re-energizing the core players.
What does the past 5-8 years have to do with today or tomorrow? Adapt or die.
That's the thing. It doesn't matter if it's his fault. It happened on his reign.
What does a new GM or Coach bring outside being new?
I was wondering if a guy like Doc would have made a difference this year. And maybe a different voice would have. I don't know. But I'd give CBS next year with presumably a normal environment to see if he and presumably a healthy team can play in a more coherent manner. I see making a change now as premature.
What would have to happen for you to want to move on from Brad? The team misses the playoffs this year? Is a .500 team next year?
It's not. The only reason this team has exceeded its expectations the last few years is because the team got injured. If your expectations for the teams the last few years were just losing in the ECF, sure.
He arguably has lost the locker room 2 out of the past 3 years, and Hayward left in FA during his most successful of those 3 years.
If they miss the playoffs or finish under .500, I'd be making the move too. I'd also replace Ainge if that happened.
In the interest of completeness, I'd also do it if they made the playoffs and the season ended like it did for last year's Sixers.
If your expectation for a team with 0 top 10 players in the league was more than making the ECF then you weren't being rational about how the NBA works.
