Justin Turner and COVID

OurF'ingCity

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The thing that sucks the most about this is the hubris of it all. “We just won the World Series, there was no way we were going to stop him celebrating, he’s our teammate” is a fucking bullshit thing to say when I’ve seen my dad in person a total of one time (from a distance) over the last six months because he’s in a high-risk category and when doctors and other first responders had to isolate themselves (and in some cases still are) from their own wives and children for months.

The other thing that sucks about this is I just know that no one is going to get Covid from this and the takeaway for many fans is going to be “well if Turner did all that and no one got sick I guess I can do whatever I want.”
 

donutogre

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Sean Doolittle sure fucking had it right earlier this year:

“We’re trying to bring baseball back during a pandemic that’s killed 130,000 people,” Doolittle said. “We’re way worse off as a country then we were in March when we shut this thing down. And, like, look at where other developed countries are in their response to this. We haven’t done any of the things that other countries have done to bring sports back. Sports are like the reward of a functioning society. And we’re trying to just bring it back, even though we’ve taken none of the steps to flatten the curve.
What happened last night is a perfect encapsulation of how fucking stupid so many people in the USA are.

The thing that sucks the most about this is the hubris of it all. “We just won the World Series, there was no way we were going to stop him celebrating, he’s our teammate” is a fucking bullshit thing to say when I’ve seen my dad in person a total of one time (from a distance) over the last six months because he’s in a high-risk category and when doctors and other first responders had to isolate themselves (and in some cases still are) from their own wives and children for months.
Exactly. Tons of normal people are making sacrifices big and small to try and keep their loved ones and communities safe. I sure as shit want to see my family and friends; I've hung out with two people who aren't my wife in the last seven months. And yet, rich assholes do whatever the fuck they want.
 

Euclis20

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It's the greatest moment of his professional life, who gives a fuck. Hundreds of thousands dead, millions infected (over half a million in the last week alone!). Kids all over the country haven't been to school since March, weddings are being cancelled and we can't even go to funerals. I'm trying very hard not to ruin this for my in-laws who are all Dodgers fans (and only Dodgers fans, they don't really care about other teams in the area) experiencing their first title, but I'm seeing red over this. How much of a suspension is needed for putting literally hundreds of people at risk? How many draft picks need to be taken away before the message sinks in? Bury everyone involved under the stadium before going back to LA.
 

BigSoxFan

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It's the greatest moment of his professional life, who gives a fuck. Hundreds of thousands dead, millions infected and the numbers are currently exploding. Kids all over the country haven't been to school since March, weddings are being cancelled and we can't even go to funerals. I'm trying very hard not to ruin this for my in-laws who are all Dodgers fans (and only Dodgers fans, they don't really care about other teams in the area) experiencing their first title, but I'm seeing red over this. How much of a suspension is needed for putting literally hundreds of people at risk? How many draft picks need to be taken away before the message sinks in? Bury everyone involved under the stadium before going back to LA.
And we’re talking about a title after a 60 game season...
 

PseuFighter

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My first reaction was: here I am, walking past a drive-through testing site most days, seeing two lines of cars that extend for blocks, with people pulling up to a crew of testers in freaking hazmat suits, and then I see Justin Turner out there celebrating with his team less than hour after it was announced he's positive, against the wishes of MLB, and a team caught up in the moment and doesn't care, putting everyone around them at risk, and I can't help but be so sad for this country.
 

ninjacornelius

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This should be the biggest scandal in sports right now. It's orders of magnitude more serious than the Astros' trash cans, and we just saw two perpetrators of that little conspiracy serve out one-year suspensions. MLB should immediately launch an investigation into a) how Turner contracted it, b) how long after confirmation of a positive test was he allowed to remain on the field, and c) how he managed to return to the field for the post-game celebration. After the investigation is complete and blame is apportioned, fines and suspensions should be sent fucking flying from Manfred's office. I have zero confidence that this will actually happen, but it's what needs to happen.

I mean, in some states, the willful transmission of a fatal disease is considered a criminal act. That's the level of brazenness that Justin Turner exhibited last night.

Edit: I'm not arguing that Justin Turner could or should be prosecuted. I'm just saying that if we as a country took this disease even half as seriously as we should, we'd be having those types of conversations.
 
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InsideTheParker

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This should be the biggest scandal in sports right now. It's orders of magnitude more serious than the Astros' trash cans, and we just saw two perpetrators of that little conspiracy serve out one-year suspensions. MLB should immediately launch an investigation into a) how Turner contracted it, b) how long after confirmation of a positive test was he allowed to remain on the field, and c) how he managed to return to the field for the post-game celebration. After the investigation is complete and blame is apportioned, fines and suspensions should be sent fucking flying from Manfred's office. I have zero confidence that this will actually happen, but it's what needs to happen.

I mean, in most states, the willful transmission of a fatal disease is considered a criminal act. That's the level of brazenness that Justin Turner exhibited last night.
If there is any kind of petition we could sign to endorse this approach, please post a link here.
 

Van Everyman

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If there is any kind of petition we could sign to endorse this approach, please post a link here.
Yes except it should be the House of Representatives Government Oversight Committee conducting the investigation, not Manfred. Hold that antitrust exemption over their heads like a motherfucker.
 

Bongorific

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I can’t believe I didn’t see this story until about 10:30 this morning. This is a tremendous scandal. A huge stain on baseball.

How unbelievably selfish on everyone’s part: Turner, Dodgers, MLB, Mookie. It’s hard to imagine anything more selfish than a positive player wanting to be, and welcomed into, a maskless team photo.

A year suspension for Turner and loss of draft picks for Dodgers.
 

joe dokes

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Um, does he already have covid brain?
View: https://twitter.com/redturn2/status/1321307731869999111?s=20
Justin Turner - "Thanks to everyone reaching out! I feel great, no symptoms at all. Just experienced every emotion you can possibly imagine. Can’t believe I couldn’t be out there to celebrate with my guys! So proud of this team & unbelievably happy for the City of LA #WorldSeriesChamps"
It's on video. Does he think he willed himself invisible like Wade Boggs?
 

Kliq

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The most annoying part of it to me is that the entire argument that he has worked his entire career to celebrate this moment, wanted to be with his teammates, etc. is that it still doesn't absolve him for not wearing a mask. While it would still be a terrible decision to run out there with the mask on, it would have at least been a slightly better look for baseball if he had done all of that with a mask on. He couldn't be bothered by that at all though, even though pretty much every American has been wearing a mask for months, even though most of them have not you know, just tested positive for COVID. Turner and the Dodgers couldn't have cared less about the virus, and the reactions I am seeing on social media to people like Rosenthal calling him out are disgusting. We are FUCKED by this virus with so much of this country willing to be so ignorant.
 

bankshot1

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After testing positive, why was Turner still in the stadium? Turner has responsibility for his selfish and likely uninformed actions, but this is on MLB and the Dodgers for not following protocol and getting Turner into quarantine as soon as they knew he tested positive. .
 

Kliq

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After testing positive, why was Turner still in the stadium? Turner has responsibility for his selfish and likely uninformed actions, but this is on MLB and the Dodgers for not following protocol and getting Turner into quarantine as soon as they knew he tested positive. .
According to MLB they did try and stop him from getting onto the field; but he burst through their attempts like he was Earl Campbell!

I get the urge to blame MLB and the Dodgers, and the Dodgers as a whole, especially the players and the coaches do deserve a lot of that, but at the end of the day, Turner is a grown man who tested positive and decided to not give a fuck. IDK if MLB should have had like, a bunch of cops come in and forcefully throw him out of the building (I know I wouldn't want to be the cop in that scenario, that is for sure) but I feel like 95% of the blame has to go to Turner here.

It's also worth noting that the way the Dodgers have reacted to this seems like the polar opposite of how Cleveland reacted, with players saying they didn't want Clevinger back on the team after putting them at risk. Obviously the circumstances of the season being over and having just won the World Series make a big difference, but I wonder if in general it shows a shift in the general attitude of the players.
 

ninjacornelius

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If there is any kind of petition we could sign to endorse this approach, please post a link here.
I don't want to get too conspiratorial, but I'm pretty sure that Manfred won't take any action because MLB is complicit in a lot of what happened last night. I'm reading through the 2020 MLB Operations Manual and there's a pretty clear chain of custody on the results of positive COVID tests: the very first people notified are the Joint Committee, "composed of one non-medical representative from MLB, one non-medical representative from the MLBPA, and two physicians (one appointed by each of the parties)." So a representative from MLB knew that Justin Turner tested positive before anyone on the Dodgers (including Turner) did. If the reporting is correct, then the Joint Committee would've known about the positive test immediately prior to the Dodgers learning about it, so we can probably assume that they knew about it in the 7th inning or so.

What the Operations Manual doesn't make clear is whether or not the Joint Committee is notified of any inconclusive tests as they come in. The reports say that the Dodgers learned of Turner's inconclusive test in the 2nd inning. It's possible that, in the event of an inconclusive test, the Joint Committee is bypassed and the information is relayed straight to the team and player. However, I doubt that's what happened. There was a Marlins-Orioles game back in August where the first pitch was delayed because of several inconclusive tests, and the decision to delay the start came directly from MLB. So in this instance, MLB was made aware of these inconclusive tests, and MLB delayed the game until the tests came back negative.

So someone at MLB knew that Justin Turner had an inconclusive test in the 2nd inning, and someone made the decision not to take any action until a second test came up positive in the 7th inning. For two hours, someone from MLB let a player with a non-negative test result run all over the field, interacting with teammates, competitors, coaches, and trainers.

It's harder to lay the blame on the post-game stuff on anyone but Turner and The Dodgers, as he clearly violated the self-isolation protocol which required him to "immediately wear a face covering" (which he failed to do) and "isolate from all people" (which he also failed to do). Exactly where he went in the stadium after he was removed from the game, and exactly what kind of supervision he was under while there, wouldn't be spelled out in the Operations Manual -- he would've been sent to a "Dedicated Isolation Area," but what happens after that is up to the team and its COVID-19 Action Plan. I'm guessing that either The Dodgers' Action Plan wasn't followed (which would be Turner's fault), wasn't enforced (which would be the team's fault), or both.

Long story short, there seems like there's just enough plausible deniability to spread around, and MLB probably has an incentive to make this all go away quietly, so no one will be punished for any of this.
 

Bozo Texino

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Um, does he already have covid brain?
View: https://twitter.com/redturn2/status/1321307731869999111?s=20


Justin Turner - "Thanks to everyone reaching out! I feel great, no symptoms at all. Just experienced every emotion you can possibly imagine. Can’t believe I couldn’t be out there to celebrate with my guys! So proud of this team & unbelievably happy for the City of LA #WorldSeriesChamps"
The responses to this tweet prove just how fucked we are as a country.

This thing ain't going away. Even when a vaccine is available.
 

bankshot1

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According to MLB they did try and stop him from getting onto the field; but he burst through their attempts like he was Earl Campbell!

I get the urge to blame MLB and the Dodgers, and the Dodgers as a whole, especially the players and the coaches do deserve a lot of that, but at the end of the day, Turner is a grown man who tested positive and decided to not give a fuck. IDK if MLB should have had like, a bunch of cops come in and forcefully throw him out of the building (I know I wouldn't want to be the cop in that scenario, that is for sure) but I feel like 95% of the blame has to go to Turner here.

It's also worth noting that the way the Dodgers have reacted to this seems like the polar opposite of how Cleveland reacted, with players saying they didn't want Clevinger back on the team after putting them at risk. Obviously the circumstances of the season being over and having just won the World Series make a big difference, but I wonder if in general it shows a shift in the general attitude of the players.
I blamed Turner for his actions. He is responsible.

But I also blame MLB and LAD for not following protocols likely spelled out regarding how to deal with this issue.

They also ignoring common sense.

if you knew someone had tested positive, and MLB & LAD did, why would you not immediately quarantine the individual?

They ducked their responsibility as well and put hundreds of people at risk..

I get the sense that once MLB delivered the product and got paid, they could give a shit about player safety.
 

Mugsy's Jock

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The Red Sox had it right all along -- no victories means no handshake lines or on-field celebrations, means safety.
 

OurF'ingCity

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Long story short, there seems like there's just enough plausible deniability to spread around, and MLB probably has an incentive to make this all go away quietly, so no one will be punished for any of this.
MLB will wait to see what happens. If Turner's actions result in a big breakout among players/coaches/etc. they will have no choice but to levy potentially serious punishment. If there is no breakout, they will quietly announce a small fine in a press release with some banal language about being disappointed about the lack of following protocol.

Which of course isn't how it should be, but everything is a PR stunt these days.
 

Lose Remerswaal

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What the Operations Manual doesn't make clear is whether or not the Joint Committee is notified of any inconclusive tests as they come in. The reports say that the Dodgers learned of Turner's inconclusive test in the 2nd inning. It's possible that, in the event of an inconclusive test, the Joint Committee is bypassed and the information is relayed straight to the team and player. However, I doubt that's what happened. There was a Marlins-Orioles game back in August where the first pitch was delayed because of several inconclusive tests, and the decision to delay the start came directly from MLB. So in this instance, MLB was made aware of these inconclusive tests, and MLB delayed the game until the tests came back negative.

So someone at MLB knew that Justin Turner had an inconclusive test in the 2nd inning, and someone made the decision not to take any action until a second test came up positive in the 7th inning. For two hours, someone from MLB let a player with a non-negative test result run all over the field, interacting with teammates, competitors, coaches, and trainers.
No one was watching that Marlins/Orioles game. Last night's game likely was watched by more folks than any other game this season. That's why it was handled differently. Not an acceptable reason to me, but must have been to those in charge
The Red Sox had it right all along -- no victories means no handshake lines or on-field celebrations, means safety.
First time I've laughed about the Sox season this year. Thank you for this
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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It's also worth noting that the way the Dodgers have reacted to this seems like the polar opposite of how Cleveland reacted, with players saying they didn't want Clevinger back on the team after putting them at risk. Obviously the circumstances of the season being over and having just won the World Series make a big difference, but I wonder if in general it shows a shift in the general attitude of the players.
Wasn't the biggest issue in Cleveland that Clevinger and Plesac broke rules and then put the team at risk as a result? And that Clevinger lied (by commission or omission) about being with Plesac after he was caught? At least so far, no one has lied or bent the truth in Turner's case. In fact, that's the part of the story that hasn't been talked up enough yet. How did he contract the virus? Did he break quarantine protocol? Did his wife?

If this wasn't a case of some hotel employee slipping into the bubble and infecting Turner and perhaps others, if Turner engaged in some behavior that put him at greater risk, he's an even bigger villain than he is for partying with the team after the game.
 

Jungleland

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I still can't wrap my head around the first test coming back in the second inning. Totally possible I'm uninformed as to the MLB testing timelines, but if they're testing a day before each game how on earth are they not making sure results are, you know, processed and available before the next day's game? These things don't take 36 or even 24 hours to turn around.

It strikes me as complete bullshit that those with power to have him not play didn't know he shouldn't play before the game started. And as much as the piling on of Turner for going back on the field to celebrate is justified, the former is a far bigger potential scandal in my book.
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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The most annoying part of it to me is that the entire argument that he has worked his entire career to celebrate this moment, wanted to be with his teammates, etc. is that it still doesn't absolve him for not wearing a mask. While it would still be a terrible decision to run out there with the mask on, it would have at least been a slightly better look for baseball if he had done all of that with a mask on. He couldn't be bothered by that at all though, even though pretty much every American has been wearing a mask for months, even though most of them have not you know, just tested positive for COVID. Turner and the Dodgers couldn't have cared less about the virus, and the reactions I am seeing on social media to people like Rosenthal calling him out are disgusting. We are FUCKED by this virus with so much of this country willing to be so ignorant.
Right, I've crushed it at work with our team a few times during this pandemic, and what we DIDN'T do was meet at the office/go to the bar and start fucking yakking it up and celebrating. I drink a beer alone and maybe on Zoom with others. And it usually took a lot more effort than less than half that an MLB team needed this year in the shortened season. FOH Turner you selfish prick.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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They don't give a shit about player safety or public safety. All they ever cared about was getting the season done. And once they got it under the wire they all stopped giving a shit.

There's also the question of how Turner got Covid in a bubble and the answer is probably that once they saw it was getting close to the end they stopped giving a shit.

I wish the Rays had come back in the game. I really do because it would have made this whole thing come to light instead of it being a footnote because they just barely made it under the wire. MLB should be ashamed of itself and if these players now all just leave and scatter and spread it will be an absolute disgrace.
 

soxhop411

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Lol. MLB and the Dodgers are far from blameless.

first of all, why the fuck was Turner playing yesterday or even at the stadium before he actually got a conclusive test result. He should have been told to stay at the hotel until his test results came in.
 

ninjacornelius

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MLB announcing an investigation seems like a good first step, but I'm scared that it's going to be either incomplete or toothless. For starters, the Operations Manual that MLB references doesn't outline any standard of punishment for teams or players who fail to comply with COVID protocols. These details may be in the individual Team Action Plans, but I doubt it. Any fine or suspension handed down to Turner would probably be contested by the MLBPA. The Dodgers may be more on the hook, but they can always say "hey, we tried to stop Turner but he ignored our protocols so it's all his fault." He's a free agent after this season -- why wouldn't The Dodgers throw him under the bus?

And then there's the matter of why Turner was on the field at all, why the game wasn't postponed until the test results were complete, why he was allowed to stay in the game after the 2nd inning, etc. We'll never get satisfactory answers to any of this because then MLB would have to admit culpability.

This whole thing makes me angrier than any other sports fuckup in recent memory.
 

Van Everyman

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Which, again, is why the House should (at least threaten) to hold a hearing on this. We're in the middle of a public health crisis and a professional sports league with an antitrust exemption from the government is flouting rules so a grown man can celebrate a trophy from a 60-game season, putting god knows how many people at risk. AOC would absolutely tear Manfred and Friedman a new one for this.
 

Comfortably Lomb

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Which, again, is why the House should (at least threaten) to hold a hearing on this. We're in the middle of a public health crisis and a professional sports league with an antitrust exemption from the government is flouting rules so a grown man can celebrate a trophy from a 60-game season, putting god knows how many people at risk. AOC would absolutely tear Manfred and Friedman a new one for this.
Yea, that's what we need our government to do! A meaningless hearing about some jackass baseball player acting like a jackass so Representative Egomaniac can get their 10 minutes of video time! That will solve everything!
 

mauidano

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This will be a non-story by the end of the day with all the other insanity gushing through the news pipeline.

The season is over and the Dodgers are willing to negotiate the punishment obviously.

MLB needs to hammer Turner and the Dodgers or the whole process was a farce. I expect some sweeping under the rug/slap on the wrist sadly.
 

Soxy

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This really is a perfect example of why this country is failing in regards to COVID-19. This same exact thing will happen the next two months during the holidays, across households all over the country. It's like people think they can negotiate with the virus. "No, I don't think you understand; we just won the World Series! I may never get another chance to celebrate this! You have to let me celebrate with my teammates!"

Bunch of people everywhere in the US during the next four weeks: "I've stayed inside for 8 months. I'll be damned if I let COVID take away my family's Thanksgiving dinner. That's where I draw the line!!!"

And a lot of people are like, "okay that makes sense." It's maddening.
 

The Gray Eagle

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Yea, that's what we need our government to do! A meaningless hearing about some jackass baseball player acting like a jackass so Representative Egomaniac can get their 10 minutes of video time! That will solve everything!
Yes it is exactly what we need our government to do-- to treat this virus seriously and make it clear that people need to wear a damn mask, especially when YOU KNOW YOU ARE POSITIVE for it.
 

Mystic Merlin

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This happened AT the World Series minutes after the game ended. Manfred was standing within at most 100-150 feet from these guys for a while, for fuck’s sake. The investigation should be ‘we can confirm from video evidence that you were milling around the infield without a mask after being removed from the game being celebrated’ and therefore you’re suspended for X games.

They are just buying time to make up a potential penalty.
 

Dahabenzapple2

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The thing that sucks the most about this is the hubris of it all. “We just won the World Series, there was no way we were going to stop him celebrating, he’s our teammate” is a fucking bullshit thing to say when I’ve seen my dad in person a total of one time (from a distance) over the last six months because he’s in a high-risk category and when doctors and other first responders had to isolate themselves (and in some cases still are) from their own wives and children for months.

The other thing that sucks about this is I just know that no one is going to get Covid from this and the takeaway for many fans is going to be “well if Turner did all that and no one got sick I guess I can do whatever I want.”
I just saw my dad for the first time in a while last Friday night after seeing my mom for the last time on her death bed 12 hours before she passed away.

I didn’t take my mask off. But this spoiled Douchebag needs to celebrate with his teammates?!?!

I will see my family at the service tomorrow AM and cousins I havn’t seen in years. I will not go within 6 feet of any of them and of course I will have a mask on. You don’t think I’d LOVE to hug my 89 year old dad who just lost his wife of 62 years?

I don’t even believe we should have an in person service but it’s my father’s wishes and he’s very very frail and I will be there to support him with all my heart and soul - but I’ll be in the funeral home for a very short while and may not even stay for the short service he requested for after the 2 hour viewing.

Selfish assholes of the highest order - ALL of them / Roberts & Friedman sound like morons.
 

Bozo Texino

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I just saw my dad for the first time in a while last Friday night after seeing my mom for the last time on her death bed 12 hours before she passed away.

I didn’t take my mask off. But this spoiled Douchebag needs to celebrate with his teammates?!?!

I will see my family at the service tomorrow AM and cousins I havn’t seen in years. I will not go within 6 feet of any of them and of course I will have a mask on. You don’t think I’d LOVE to hug my 89 year old dad who just lost his wife of 62 years?

I don’t even believe we should have an in person service but it’s my father’s wishes and he’s very very frail and I will be there to support him with all my heart and soul - but I’ll be in the funeral home for a very short while and may not even stay for the short service he requested for after the 2 hour viewing.

Selfish assholes of the highest order - ALL of them / Roberts & Friedman sound like morons.
I'm so sorry.