Kevin Durant Sweepstakes

ColonelMustard

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If KD sits out training camp, he's no longer a megastar who sells merchandise, he's a shaky asset that is rapidly depreciating and becoming a huge headache for the team. And then the inevitable decisions come - do you pay KD if he's sitting? Do you fine him? Maybe Morey can get away with fining Simmons but if BRK fines KD, you think KD is ever going to play there again? And if BRK pays him, how long do they pay him?

In today's NBA, it's not that easy just to play chicken with KD, particularly when (to mix metaphors), KD holds most of the cards.
Kevin Durant makes a reported $75M / year from endorsements for products sales around the world. Jaylen Brown is nowhere on that list and for 2022 - 2023, outside of our basketball world, that will likely be the same equation.*

Kevin Durant, basketball - Brooklyn Nets
Endorsements: $75 million/year
Top brands: Nike, Coinbase, Alaska Airlines, Weedmaps, Gatorade, Sonic Drive-in, Beats Headphones

https://blog.hollywoodbranded.com/the-top-10-highest-endorsed-athletes-and-their-brands

I'm not sure if KD will actually sit out but there are a lot of monetary negatives:
- he gets fined daily
- he loses significant brand value and looks like a baby who took his ball and went home

For Tsai, this is the perfect opportunity to push back at the NBA and the GM. Durant signed a 4-year contract otherwise, sign a 1+1. He made his commitments and should honor them.
 
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PedroKsBambino

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Meh. If the Celtics actually have offered Jaylen Brown, they are not going to up it because Tyrese Maxey is on the table.

Celtics are in a great spot IMO. They have the best offer on the table, one that is not likely to get surpassed, and they are also perfectly content to just not make the trade and run it back as is.
Yes---though I'm of the view that Jaylen is almost surely the best player the Nets will get (even, probability-wise, if they get a pick-heavy deal elsewhere). And I still do think Sixers want to help the Nets weaken the Celtics, whether or not it will be a successful gambit.
 

tbb345

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It's hard to get through perception, vs. reality. I, for one, don't know who the real Durant is. I'm sure Ime does. I cannot imagine a scenario where Brad doesn't ask Ime his opinion on if he wants Durant here.
This right here gets to the crux of the issue. No one knows who the real Durant is unless the Celtics want to hire Rich Kleinman…and even that might go sour once he tells KD what to do.

Nash was KD’s personal coach/confidant in GS. Durant pushed for him to be hired, he was basically Durant’s choice…and now KD has lost all faith in him and he can’t coach. You don’t think Nash thought he knew who KD really was and made him tick?
 

tbb345

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Yes---though I'm of the view that Jaylen is almost surely the best player the Nets will get (even, probability-wise, if they get a pick-heavy deal elsewhere). And I still do think Sixers want to help the Nets weaken the Celtics, whether or not it will be a successful gambit.
Unless the Nets have the same fear of not signing Jaylen that people are claiming the Celtics have. Then it becomes 2 years of Jaylen vs. more control of Maxey
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Kevin Durant makes a reported $75M / year from endorsements for products sales around the world. Jaylen Brown is nowhere on that list and for 2022 - 2023, outside of our basketball world, that will likely be the same equation.*

Kevin Durant, basketball - Brooklyn Nets
Endorsements: $75 million/year
Top brands: Nike, Coinbase, Alaska Airlines, Weedmaps, Gatorade, Sonic Drive-in, Beats Headphones

https://blog.hollywoodbranded.com/the-top-10-highest-endorsed-athletes-and-their-brands

I'm not sure if KD will actually sit out but there are a lot of monetary negatives:
- he gets fined daily
- he loses significant brand value and looks like a baby who took his ball and went home

For Tsai, this is the perfect opportunity to push back at the NBA and the GM. Durant signed a 4-year contract otherwise, sign a 1+1. He made his commitments and should honor them.
I doubt KD loses any endorsement money for sitting out. In addition, KD has made $300+ in his career; I doubt money matters to him a great deal.

If KD sits out - and, if someone put a gun to my head and forced me to choose, that's what I would pick - maybe Tsai is that owner who puts his foot down and says that no player is going to run his franchise. But note that Harden just forced his way out of BRK and Tsai didn't do anything at that time. Do you think if KD holds out of training camp, reports to the team when he's tired of being fined, and starts pulling a Harden, that it's not going to become a media circus?

Also, I agree with everyone who thinks that if KD plays, BRK isn't going to be dealing him. But if we know that, KD has to know that too.

I don't know that he would be rapidly depreciating if he sits. He will still have a lot of contract left and teams won't forget KD's talent level.
OK. Maybe "rapidly depreciating" was hyperbole. And maybe BRK thinks they can get JB, White, and a pick at any time so Sean Marks figures what does he have to lose by waiting? But KD has been pretty low key about this up until the meeting with the Nets and it seems to me that KD is slowly ratcheting up the pressure on BRK to make a move.
 

benhogan

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Kevin Durant makes a reported $75M / year from endorsements for products sales around the world. Jaylen Brown is nowhere on that list and for 2022 - 2023, outside of our basketball world, that will likely be the same equation.*

Kevin Durant, basketball - Brooklyn Nets
Endorsements: $75 million/year
Top brands: Nike, Coinbase, Alaska Airlines, Weedmaps, Gatorade, Sonic Drive-in, Beats Headphones

https://blog.hollywoodbranded.com/the-top-10-highest-endorsed-athletes-and-their-brands

I'm not sure if KD will actually sit out but there are a lot of monetary negatives:
- he gets fined daily
- he loses significant brand value and looks like a baby who took his ball and went home

For Tsai, this is the perfect opportunity to push back at the NBA and the GM. Durant signed a 4-year contract otherwise, sign a 1+1. He made his commitments and should honor them.
the narrative: KD just wants to win Championships because he's a winner and that's what winners do!

Championships aren't handed in Oct, Nov and Dec so sitting has zero impact on that. KD can sit down with JJ Redick and explain this to a record ESPN viewing audience next month.

KD's stance with the Nets:
-Steve Nash is out of his depth that never won a CHiP as a player, HC needs to be replaced!
-Sean Marks has made numerous questionable deals, GM needs to be replaced!
-KD is just trying to help Brooklyn right the ship but Tsai won't address the Nash/Marks problem
-Its time to move on to an organization that values WINNING


Just ask Kyrie, he'll back all this up...Bron has done the same in LA with Frank Vogel

The irony here, KD in the news = more endorsement $$$. The Durant Franchise cash flow machine is fully intact.

The NBA is a players league. Joe Tsai vs. Kevin Durant is a first-round knockout
 

John Marzano Olympic Hero

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Are we just going to omit the fact that they were hurt in Year 1? And Embiid is a much, much better basketball player than Kyrie Irving. He’s a legitimate MVP. No chance in hell I’m letting an Embiid/Durant frontcourt form with Harden being perfect in the distributor role.
Those are good points. But Harden and Durant were teammates in OKC and didn't win anything and then they couldn't get along last year. I mean, yeah, on paper the trio looks good but IDK, I'm not too concerned*. I think that in order to have a Big Three you need to have an alpha dog, but you also have to have one or two teammates who don't mind getting that dog his touches. I don't think that Durant, Embiid or Harden would be that Chris Bosh or Robert Parrish or Dennis Rodman type. I may be wrong, but they all seem to want the ball.

* Of course if Durant does get traded there and they challenge the 96 Bulls, I will completely forget this opinion and pretend I never wrote it.
 

BigSoxFan

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Those are good points. But Harden and Durant were teammates in OKC and didn't win anything and then they couldn't get along last year. I mean, yeah, on paper the trio looks good but IDK, I'm not too concerned*. I think that in order to have a Big Three you need to have an alpha dog, but you also have to have one or two teammates who don't mind getting that dog his touches. I don't think that Durant, Embiid or Harden would be that Chris Bosh or Robert Parrish or Dennis Rodman type. I may be wrong, but they all seem to want the ball.

* Of course if Durant does get traded there and they challenge the 96 Bulls, I will completely forget this opinion and pretend I never wrote it.
No idea how a Durant and Embiid pairing would work given their temperamental personalities but the on court fit is basically perfect, IMO. That inside/out game would be absolutely deadly. Harden really isn't a huge volume shooter anymore. Only averaged 13.6 SPG in Philly last year, which was a low since his 2011-2012 season. Clearly doesn't have the burst/quickness that he once had so I think he would settle in nicely in the Bosh/Allen "3rd banana" role. And perfectly as a distributor.

On defense, the size/length of Embiid/Durant would be insane. Good luck getting anything inside on that pairing. I just think that Kyrie is such a cancer that it's hard to draw firm conclusions about anyone associated with him. I do think it's perfectly reasonable to wonder about Durant's commitment to any franchise and general flakiness since he clamored for the Nets and now is looking to leave shortly afterwards. That would be my greatest concern if Celtics do this deal.
 

EvilEmpire

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If KD sits out - and, if someone put a gun to my head and forced me to choose, that's what I would pick - maybe Tsai is that owner who puts his foot down and says that no player is going to run his franchise. But note that Harden just forced his way out of BRK and Tsai didn't do anything at that time.
I think if Tsai puts his foot down, it will only be for a month or so into the season until Brooklyn can figure out what they can do with Simmons. Being able to trade him might open up better trade opportunities, maybe even ones that Durant likes.

Also, with regard to Tsai not doing anything when Harden wanted out: I think that is a much different situation when you have KD and Irving ready to play ball. There was still some hope there of a good playoff run. Now? If KD is gone this season is fucked no matter what they do. Maybe for longer than this next season.

I don't think two years of Brown changes that trajectory very much at all, so better to suffer through until the start of the season and see what things look like. If there really are no better options once the season gets going I think the Brown deal will still be there.
 

moondog80

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As John Hollinger mentioned the other day, Brooklyn might be empowered to just let Durant sit out by the fact that their 1st round pick this year does not go directly to Houston, it's actually a pick swap. Given that Houston will likely suck, Brooklyn sucking this year too might be their last crack at a decent draft pick for a long time (the 2024 and 2026 picks go directly to Houston, 2025 is a saw but the Rockets might be OK by that point).
 

snowmanny

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Meh. If the Celtics actually have offered Jaylen Brown, they are not going to up it because Tyrese Maxey is on the table.

Celtics are in a great spot IMO. They have the best offer on the table, one that is not likely to get surpassed, and they are also perfectly content to just not make the trade and run it back as is.
I think that’s correct.

My recollection of the KG trade process was that all along the Celtics offered the single most valuable asset (Jefferson) and the TWolves (and I suppose KG) sort of fished around for awhile then went with the obvious deal.

Only thing here is if Nets drag it out much longer. I am squinting hard to figure out what better offer is going to materialize in the season. And you know if (IF) everybody plays, Kyrie, Brown, Simmons is a pretty good three: I’m not sure why Brooklyn would wait around and trash their season.

But I too love Jaylen Brown, except for his handle in traffic, and would be fine just running it back with the new additions.
 

nighthob

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Yes---though I'm of the view that Jaylen is almost surely the best player the Nets will get (even, probability-wise, if they get a pick-heavy deal elsewhere). And I still do think Sixers want to help the Nets weaken the Celtics, whether or not it will be a successful gambit.
If all Boston has to top is Tobias Harris and Tyrese Maxey they don't even need to offer Jaylen.
 

Smokey Joe

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A+ fanfic
I'm just dropping in to say that I enjoyed this post and I'd like to subscribe to your zine.
i'm changing the ending to "In a meeting with Celtics owner Wyc Grousebeck, Kevin Durant offered to stay with the Celtics if they change the direction of their organization and fire Brad Stevens and Ime Udoka." Then he gets traded to the Lakers for LeBron because the Celtics just drafted Bronny.
 

Euclis20

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Yes---though I'm of the view that Jaylen is almost surely the best player the Nets will get (even, probability-wise, if they get a pick-heavy deal elsewhere). And I still do think Sixers want to help the Nets weaken the Celtics, whether or not it will be a successful gambit.
You could make reasonable arguments for Siakam or Ingram over Brown (and vice versa), but no one on Philly's roster (outside of Embiid) are even in the conversation.
 

JM3

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Kevin Durant makes a reported $75M / year from endorsements for products sales around the world. Jaylen Brown is nowhere on that list and for 2022 - 2023, outside of our basketball world, that will likely be the same equation.*

Kevin Durant, basketball - Brooklyn Nets
Endorsements: $75 million/year
Top brands: Nike, Coinbase, Alaska Airlines, Weedmaps, Gatorade, Sonic Drive-in, Beats Headphones

https://blog.hollywoodbranded.com/the-top-10-highest-endorsed-athletes-and-their-brands

I'm not sure if KD will actually sit out but there are a lot of monetary negatives:
- he gets fined daily
- he loses significant brand value and looks like a baby who took his ball and went home

For Tsai, this is the perfect opportunity to push back at the NBA and the GM. Durant signed a 4-year contract otherwise, sign a 1+1. He made his commitments and should honor them.
Good luck keeping your WEEDMAPS sponsorship without playing basketball...

Kevin Durant's Thirty Five Ventures inks deal with Weedmaps (nypost.com)
Kevin Durant, Rich Kleiman On Cannabis, Partnership With Weedmaps: ‘The Band-Aid’s Been Ripped Off’ (forbes.com)
 

ColonelMustard

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This right here gets to the crux of the issue. No one knows who the real Durant is unless the Celtics want to hire Rich Kleinman…and even that might go sour once he tells KD what to do.

Nash was KD’s personal coach/confidant in GS. Durant pushed for him to be hired, he was basically Durant’s choice…and now KD has lost all faith in him and he can’t coach. You don’t think Nash thought he knew who KD really was and made him tick?
Thanks for pointing this out. Very strange. They have championship rings together from his time as a consultant. It gets even stranger, this article states that Nash's coaching staff is made up of coaches primarily with ties to Durant.

https://www.netsdaily.com/2022/8/10/23299698/the-very-odd-relationship-between-kevin-durant-and-steve-nash

One thing the article also mentioned, Durant came out in a full-throated defense of Nash after the humiliating playoff loss even when he didn't need to. He could have wrapped the anchor around Nash's neck at that time too.

“I think he’s done a great job. The last two years, he’s been dealt a wild hand: injuries, trades, disgruntled players, guys in and out of the lineup, and stuff that he can’t control,”
 

bakahump

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Couldnt it be a simple (Shitty) case of "I need to get out of here using any leverage I can.....Sooo......Yea I cant play for that coach he sucks"

He may not truly believe he sucks (which is worse then if he did). And maybe Nash (and the other coaches with ties to Durant) realize its only business.
 

RorschachsMask

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ColonelMustard

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I doubt KD loses any endorsement money for sitting out. In addition, KD has made $300+ in his career; I doubt money matters to him a great deal.

If KD sits out - and, if someone put a gun to my head and forced me to choose, that's what I would pick - maybe Tsai is that owner who puts his foot down and says that no player is going to run his franchise. But note that Harden just forced his way out of BRK and Tsai didn't do anything at that time. Do you think if KD holds out of training camp, reports to the team when he's tired of being fined, and starts pulling a Harden, that it's not going to become a media circus?

Also, I agree with everyone who thinks that if KD plays, BRK isn't going to be dealing him. But if we know that, KD has to know that too.

OK. Maybe "rapidly depreciating" was hyperbole. And maybe BRK thinks they can get JB, White, and a pick at any time so Sean Marks figures what does he have to lose by waiting? But KD has been pretty low key about this up until the meeting with the Nets and it seems to me that KD is slowly ratcheting up the pressure on BRK to make a move.
Like I said in my original post, I am unsure if Durant will sit out but there will be monetary consequences. I never conjectured on the damages.

Tsai, as others have stated, has some leverage here. As @EvilEmpire noted, Tsai does not have to act immediately. Tsai can also push the league into action. This impacts business valuation for franchises.

Also, I personally don't believe Durant will miss one game of the 2022 - 2023 season if he can help it. Durant currently sits at 21st on the all-points list. One full season with 1500 to 1600 points will push him past Olajuwon to number 12 on the list. https://www.nba.com/stats/alltime-leaders/
 

djbayko

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One thing the article also mentioned, Durant came out in a full-throated defense of Nash after the humiliating playoff loss even when he didn't need to. He could have wrapped the anchor around Nash's neck at that time too.

“I think he’s done a great job. The last two years, he’s been dealt a wild hand: injuries, trades, disgruntled players, guys in and out of the lineup, and stuff that he can’t control,”
If you subscribe to this whole thing at least partly being due to the Nets' unwillingness to max extend his best buddy, then this could make sense. At least the GM part, and he could believe that Nash is weighing in on that decision.
 

EvilEmpire

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Like I said in my original post, I am unsure if Durant will sit out but there will be monetary consequences. I never conjectured on the damages.

Tsai, as others have stated, has some leverage here. As @EvilEmpire noted, Tsai does not have to act immediately. Tsai can also push the league into action. This impacts business valuation for franchises.

Also, I personally don't believe Durant will miss one game of the 2022 - 2023 season if he can help it. Durant currently sits at 21st on the all-points list. One full season with 1500 to 1600 points will push him past Olajuwon to number 12 on the list. https://www.nba.com/stats/alltime-leaders/
Eh. I don't think Tsai has much leverage or will push the league to do anything. Waiting until the season starts to line things up a bit better to trade KD isn't much of a line in the sand. Between KD, Kyrie, and Simmons I think there is very little chance that Brooklyn will be able to clean slate everything enough for the team to move forward, reset the franchise, and still have a productive season.

We'll see how it all works out, but I think the decision-making is probably already looking beyond the upcoming season. Too many variables in play to count on that going well no matter what happens.
 

tbb345

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If you subscribe to this whole thing at least partly being due to the Nets' unwillingness to max extend his best buddy, then this could make sense. At least the GM part, and he could believe that Nash is weighing in on that decision.
IMO, this is exactly what happened. I think Durant is upset at the post season press conference where it seemed like Marks was sending shots at Kyrie and thinks that Nash and Marks are lock step in that thinking…

Just another reason to not trade for him
 

djbayko

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IMO, this is exactly what happened. I think Durant is upset at the post season press conference where it seemed like Marks was sending shots at Kyrie and thinks that Nash and Marks are lock step in that thinking…

Just another reason to not trade for him
Yes, I find the theory that Durant wants out because Kyrie is staying on the team laughable. All evidence since the beginning of time and through this past playoffs indicates that he is 100% on World B's side.
 

Bernie Carbohydrate

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i'm changing the ending to "In a meeting with Celtics owner Wyc Grousebeck, Kevin Durant offered to stay with the Celtics if they change the direction of their organization and fire Brad Stevens and Ime Udoka." Then he gets traded to the Lakers for LeBron because the Celtics just drafted Bronny.
Indeed, and add a chapter when Draymond gets into a sideline screaming match with a teammate (Tatum? Smart?) because KD was not given the final shot in a close game.

Quoth Drurant after he tangled with Draymond Green in 2019: “I wanted that moment.”
 

lovegtm

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Eh. I don't think Tsai has much leverage or will push the league to do anything. Waiting until the season starts to line things up a bit better to trade KD isn't much of a line in the sand. Between KD, Kyrie, and Simmons I think there is very little chance that Brooklyn will be able to clean slate everything enough for the team to move forward, reset the franchise, and still have a productive season.

We'll see how it all works out, but I think the decision-making is probably already looking beyond the upcoming season. Too many variables in play to count on that going well no matter what happens.
There's some value in tanking just this year, because Houston is still bad (might get good soon), and the Nets owe a swap, not a pick.

Might be their last chance to pick decently for awhile.
 

RorschachsMask

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Bulpett still not saying if Jaylen was technically offered, but he’s clearly backed off the disputing it angle.

View: https://twitter.com/SteveBHoop/status/1558121146943414272?s=20&t=HmSBOm8ikjWwmGDX3El9ZQ


“Until such time as Kevin Durant is traded or he and the Nets broker an uneasy peace, there is one blaring reason the Celtics are destined to remain a part of the public discourse.

“Jaylen Brown is the single best player we’ve heard tied to this thing, so Brooklyn has to keep that alive,” one league executive told Heavy Sports. “I still don’t know how real that is, and, trust me, we’ve been trying to find out for our own sake”
 

Smokey Joe

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Wyc being one of the smarter owners around, it would not surprise me at all if he wants no part of KD, but is perfectly happy to keep the “offer” of Brown and White on the table as a favor to Joe Tsai.
 

BigSoxFan

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Wyc being one of the smarter owners around, it would not surprise me at all if he wants no part of KD, but is perfectly happy to keep the “offer” of Brown and White on the table as a favor to Joe Tsai.
Wyc is willing to potentially alienate his 2nd best player to help out an owner whose team he competes with in the division? That seems...unlikely.
 

RorschachsMask

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Wyc is willing to potentially alienate his 2nd best player to help out an owner whose team he competes with in the division? That seems...unlikely.
No chance lol.

Bulpett was literally the only writer/insider that “disputed” Jaylen ever truly being offered, and now his source straight up said he has no clue if it’s true or not. Seems like a pivot/backtrack, IMO.
 

BigSoxFan

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No chance lol.

Bulpett was literally the only writer/insider that “disputed” Jaylen ever truly being offered, and now his source straight up said he has no clue if it’s true or not. Seems like a pivot/backtrack, IMO.
Yeah, we'll never know the full truth but based on what we've seen, seems most likely to me that the Celtics have interest but only to a point because they know they have a good team capable of winning it all without KD. Brooklyn is willing to deal but only for a return that the Celtics are not willing to meet. I'm interpreting KD's actions as trying to put more pressure on the Nets to lower their demands to a point that the Celtics (or someone else) will accept. But nobody is budging in August because they don't have to so we're in a standoff. The real question for me is do the Celtics have a cutoff date where they just give up? Are they willing to let KD stuff go into the season and potentially create some distractions for a team that looks like a 55-60 win squad, if fully healthy.
 

TripleOT

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The Celtics should assign a drop dead date on any KD deal that involves Jaylen Brown, preferable one before the start of the pre-season. If the Nets don’t meet it, they will have to find value elsewhere for their disgruntled superstar
 

Jimbodandy

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Yeah, we'll never know the full truth but based on what we've seen, seems most likely to me that the Celtics have interest but only to a point because they know they have a good team capable of winning it all without KD. Brooklyn is willing to deal but only for a return that the Celtics are not willing to meet. I'm interpreting KD's actions as trying to put more pressure on the Nets to lower their demands to a point that the Celtics (or someone else) will accept. But nobody is budging in August because they don't have to so we're in a standoff. The real question for me is do the Celtics have a cutoff date where they just give up? Are they willing to let KD stuff go into the season and potentially create some distractions for a team that looks like a 55-60 win squad, if fully healthy.
I agreed with every word of this up to and after your question about when the Celtics give up pursuit. I see no evidence that there was ever pursuit, nevermind ongoing pursuit. Even those that completely buy the planted/leaked story that Jaylen was offered aren't making a case that talks continue.

The current Celtics team is the 22-23 opening unit, unless Tsai changes his mind and cleans house of player personnel and coach.

The wishcasting of the Durantstans is huge right now (not you, that was a great post).
 

BigSoxFan

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I agreed with every word of this up to and after your question about when the Celtics give up pursuit. I see no evidence that there was ever pursuit, nevermind ongoing pursuit. Even those that completely buy the planted/leaked story that Jaylen was offered aren't making a case that talks continue.

The current Celtics team is the 22-23 opening unit, unless Tsai changes his mind and cleans house of player personnel and coach.

The wishcasting of the Durantstans is huge right now (not you, that was a great post).
Yes, the continued interest is my big assumption here. It's certainly possible that the Celtics did make their original offer that Shams reported and then said, ok, thanks. And now they're moving on while the media runs with this story and assumes they're still actively pursuing it. My guess is that the Celtics' interest remains but, as you said, there is nothing to substantiate that claim. Only circumstantial stuff like "why haven't they issued some statement of no interest to put it to bed"?
 

Jimbodandy

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Yes, the continued interest is my big assumption here. It's certainly possible that the Celtics did make their original offer that Shams reported and then said, ok, thanks. And now they're moving on while the media runs with this story and assumes they're still actively pursuing it. My guess is that the Celtics' interest remains but, as you said, there is nothing to substantiate that claim. Only circumstantial stuff like "why haven't they issued some statement of no interest to put it to bed"?
Yeah, and I get why people think that they should issue a public statement. I just don't think that they care. If they talked with Jaylen and White, they talked with Marks, they're in internal alignment with ownership, maybe Tatum and a couple of others are looped in, then they've done their job. It's not important that we know. A cloud hanging over the team would be bad. Uncertainty hanging over the fanbase isn't important. I doubt that Belichick would say anything.

I supposed something like "we like our team and have no immediately plans to change it" would be nice, but I think that Brad wants to stay away from a deep dive over what was and wasn't offered and the immediate questions in its aftermath. "Well was that offer made? Was it then retracted, or is it still standing? Did you even consider upgrading White to Smart and adding picks? If so, how many picks?" It's not like a generic statement would stop those questions. It might even fan the flame. Just my .02 though.
 

RorschachsMask

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Only circumstantial stuff like "why haven't they issued some statement of no interest to put it to bed"?
Besides multiple reputable guys saying they were told Jaylen is/was on the table, what you say here is why I think there is something to it.

There was light trade rumors about Jaylen for Simmons last fall. Shams had an article where he said the Celtics were interested, but that it would cost Jaylen. Not that the Celtics would do it, just that it would cost Jaylen. Almost immediately, multiple local guys came out and said it wasn’t true, that Jaylen wouldn’t be on the table. And not just them coming out and denying it, but Brad actually went on the radio three days later and flat out denied it.

Stevens responded to the speculation Thursday on 98.5 The Sports Hub's Toucher and Rich (via Celtics Blog).

"I just walked up to Jaylen and said, 'Your name is all over the place as you know. Obviously, from our standpoint, you're a Celtic and obviously a guy that we think exceptionally high of. Nothing doing,'" Stevens said. "I just wanted to make sure that he has that peace of mind."
We have one other example of Jaylen being in trade rumors under Brad, and there was a swift denial from anyone who could deny it.

The Jaylen offer was first mentioned two and half weeks ago. Why haven’t the local guys come out and said he’s not on the table? Why hasn’t the team put out a statement?

I love the team we have now, and understand why anybody is opposed to the move. I just think the interest is very real on the Celtics part.
 

BigSoxFan

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Besides multiple reputable guys saying they were told Jaylen is on the table, what you say here is why I think there is something to it.

There was light trade rumors about Jaylen for Simmons last fall. Shams had an article where he said the Celtics were interested, but that it would cost Jaylen. Not that the Celtics would do it, just that it would cost Jaylen. Almost immediately, multiple local guys came out and said it wasn’t true, that Jaylen wouldn’t be on the table. And not just them coming out and denying it, but Brad actually went on the radio three days later and flat out denied it.

We have one other example of Jaylen being in trade rumors under Brad, and there was a swift denial from anyone who could deny it.

The Jaylen offer was first mentioned two and half weeks ago. Why haven’t the local guys come out and said he’s not on the table? Why hasn’t the team put out a statement?
I think most would agree that there was legitimate interest from the Celtics. Too much out there to suggest otherwise. The question now is does that original interest remain or is it finished? That, to me, is less conclusive and I don’t think the lack of a public statement proves or disproves it.

My hunch is that they remain interested because if you wanted KD a month ago, why wouldn’t you want him now? Nothing has changed and you knew back in July about the various risks.

But they also have a really good team without the deal so my other hunch is that they move on, if no deal, sometime in the coming weeks. Obviously, if the Nets dropped their demands to Horford, White, and pick bonanza sometime during the season, I’m sure we’d happily oblige. But that isn’t happening.
 

RorschachsMask

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I think most would agree that there was legitimate interest from the Celtics. Too much out there to suggest otherwise. The question now is does that original interest remain or is it finished? That, to me, is less conclusive and I don’t think the lack of a public statement proves or disproves it.

My hunch is that they remain interested because if you wanted KD a month ago, why wouldn’t you want him now? Nothing has changed and you knew back in July about the various risks.

But they also have a really good team without the deal so my other hunch is that they move on, if no deal, sometime in the coming weeks. Obviously, if the Nets dropped their demands to Horford, White, and pick bonanza sometime during the season, I’m sure we’d happily oblige. But that isn’t happening.
Grant not helping matters lol.

View: https://twitter.com/RealBobManning/status/1558149453026050048?s=20&t=ppgSt-9UcK-CJVd-_d0A9A
 

tbb345

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Besides multiple reputable guys saying they were told Jaylen is/was on the table, what you say here is why I think there is something to it.

There was light trade rumors about Jaylen for Simmons last fall. Shams had an article where he said the Celtics were interested, but that it would cost Jaylen. Not that the Celtics would do it, just that it would cost Jaylen. Almost immediately, multiple local guys came out and said it wasn’t true, that Jaylen wouldn’t be on the table. And not just them coming out and denying it, but Brad actually went on the radio three days later and flat out denied it.



We have one other example of Jaylen being in trade rumors under Brad, and there was a swift denial from anyone who could deny it.

The Jaylen offer was first mentioned two and half weeks ago. Why haven’t the local guys come out and said he’s not on the table? Why hasn’t the team put out a statement?

I love the team we have now, and understand why anybody is opposed to the move. I just think the interest is very real on the Celtics part.
Because they don’t think they need to? I think you are placing way way too much on the lack of a public statement/leak.

If the FO talked to Jaylen and told him the scenario, there’s literally 0 reason to make a public statement or leak something. Most of the time players/agents don’t believe those things anyway.

In regards to the swift denial last year, the team was also in a very different place (Brad new on the job, Jaylen coming off injury, lack of success during the season) so Brad could have felt it was necessary to comment to keep Jaylen confident about his place on the team.
They just made the Finals with Jaylen as one of the main catalysts. There’s a lot less uncertainty around the team, Jaylen knows he’s important.

The interest could be very real but I don’t think the response to those articles is some major tip off that confirms that
 

tbb345

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I think most would agree that there was legitimate interest from the Celtics. Too much out there to suggest otherwise. The question now is does that original interest remain or is it finished? That, to me, is less conclusive and I don’t think the lack of a public statement proves or disproves it.

My hunch is that they remain interested because if you wanted KD a month ago, why wouldn’t you want him now? Nothing has changed and you knew back in July about the various risks.

But they also have a really good team without the deal so my other hunch is that they move on, if no deal, sometime in the coming weeks. Obviously, if the Nets dropped their demands to Horford, White, and pick bonanza sometime during the season, I’m sure we’d happily oblige. But that isn’t happening.
Maybe the knife that Durant placed in the back of his hand picked coach (former personal coach, confidant) Steve Nash is turning teams off? After all, this was someone that was apparently very close to him and supposedly knew Durant the man and what made him tick
 

nighthob

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Wyc is willing to potentially alienate his 2nd best player to help out an owner whose team he competes with in the division? That seems...unlikely.
Especially after the Nets hijinks in signing Irving in December of 2018 and actively derailing Boston's 2019 season. Followed by demanding a lottery pick to facilitate an Irving sign & trade after everything they'd already done to Boston. If Tsai was drowning and crying for help I'm not sure that Wyc would do much more than throw him a medicine ball.
 

RorschachsMask

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Because they don’t think they need to? I think you are placing way way too much on the lack of a public statement/leak.

If the FO talked to Jaylen and told him the scenario, there’s literally 0 reason to make a public statement or leak something. Most of the time players/agents don’t believe those things anyway.

In regards to the swift denial last year, the team was also in a very different place (Brad new on the job, Jaylen coming off injury, lack of success during the season) so Brad could have felt it was necessary to comment to keep Jaylen confident about his place on the team.
They just made the Finals with Jaylen as one of the main catalysts. There’s a lot less uncertainty around the team, Jaylen knows he’s important.

The interest could be very real but I don’t think the response to those articles is some major tip off that confirms that
It’s just a combination of everything, to me. It wasn’t just Shams, it was Fischer, Windy, Woj, Weiss, and multiple others with their own sources. Then yes, there being nothing even close to a denial or anything.

As far as the talks being still ongoing, I think it is. Himmelsbach wrote a piece in the Globe the other day, which was clearly a Celtics source. He said the following

But a league source said Celtics president of basketball operations Brad Stevens and coach Ime Udoka communicate with Brown “all the time” and have kept him in the loop, adding that Brown seems to understand the situation.
If the talks weren’t ongoing (even if sparingly), why would they keep in constant communication with Jaylen about it? What loop would there be to keep him in? And why would he “seem to understand the situation”?

Grant’s comments today kind of echo that, he probably shouldn’t have even said what he did, TBH.

Grant Williams on Jaylen Brown-Kevin Durant rumor: “I feel like he’s mature in his mindset … I talk to him, texted him, reach out as often as I can. It’s one of those things, it’s the league, it’s a business, it’s not something to be discouraged by. We love JB.”
I think Jaylen is a very good player, and an excellent person. I just think there’s a fair amount of evidence that it’s for real.
 

tbb345

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It’s just a combination of everything, to me. It wasn’t just Shams, it was Fischer, Windy, Woj, Weiss, and multiple others with their own sources. Then yes, there being nothing even close to a denial or anything.

As far as the talks being still ongoing, I think it is. Himmelsbach wrote a piece in the Globe the other day, which was clearly a Celtics source. He said the following



If the talks weren’t ongoing (even if sparingly), why would they keep in constant communication with Jaylen about it? What loop would there be to keep him in? And why would he “seem to understand the situation”?

Grant’s comments today kind of echo that, he probably shouldn’t have even said what he did, TBH.



I think Jaylen is a very good player, and an excellent person. I just think there’s a fair amount of evidence that it’s for real.
In regards to Grants comments and the quote, Grant really just likes to hear himself talk. I don’t think he has much more insight into this situation than you or I do, he’s just trying to make his friend know that he’s valued. I mean, there’s a decent chance that Grant himself is in the deal if it’s completed
 

Jimbodandy

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In regards to Grants comments and the quote, Grant really just likes to hear himself talk. I don’t think he has much more insight into this situation than you or I do, he’s just trying to make his friend know that he’s valued. I mean, there’s a decent chance that Grant himself is in the deal if it’s completed
Yeah this is 100% accurate. Trying to interpret Grant's words as some kind of validation of "when there's smoke, there's fire" is like 19th level wishcasting.
 

RorschachsMask

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Yeah this is 100% accurate. Trying to interpret Grant's words as some kind of validation of "when there's smoke, there's fire" is like 19th level wishcasting.
Accusing me of wishcasting is pretty lame, tbh. You’re the one who is brushing off reports from every reputable nba insider that Jaylen was/is absolutely on the table. You want to say Shams piece was a plant, okay. What about Woj, what about Fischer, Windy, Weiss, and the others? They all reported from their own sources.

What about the stuff Himmelsbach wrote? In an article that was clearly leaked by the Celtics. What exactly are they keeping him in the loop about? What situation does Jaylen seem to understand? If it was dead, that wouldn’t be the case.

Bulpett was the ONLY guy whose “disputed” that Jaylen was on the table, and he’s now backed off of that and straight up said his source has no clue if it’s true or not.

Don’t accuse me of wish casting when you’re guilty of exactly that, but the other way.
 

Jimbodandy

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Accusing me of wishcasting is pretty lame, tbh. You’re the one who is brushing off reports from every reputable nba insider that Jaylen was/is absolutely on the table. You want to say Shams piece was a plant, okay. What about Woj, what about Fischer, Windy, Weiss, and the others? They all reported from their own sources.

What about the stuff Himmelsbach wrote? In an article that was clearly leaked by the Celtics. What exactly are they keeping him in the loop about? What situation does Jaylen seem to understand?

Bulpett was the ONLY guy whose “disputed” that Jaylen was on the table, and he’s now backed off of that.

Don’t accuse me of wish casting when you’re guilty of exactly that, but the other way.
I'm sticking to the facts. And Grant is in the know about fucking zero and likes to hear himself talk. I love the kid, but seriously, reading something into that is something. If you don't like the word I chose, maybe there's a better one.


I don't doubt for a second that Jaylen was part of the discussion for KD. You're Brad and you call--and you're clear that JT is NOT on the table--then of course Jaylen is...or you don't call. And you call because it's KD. I've said this here, in this forum.

Therefore, of course "Jaylen was on the table during the conversation between Brooklyn" is an accurate plant. I don't dispute that. But the idea that the Celtics are ringing the phone off the hook trying to make this happen is being reported by nobody. Quite the opposite actually. A lot of dead air and "nothing has moved" stuff has been written since then. The only reports of the Celtics "interest" involve a conversation that happened.