Kyrie Irving traded to Celtics for IT, Crowder, Zizic, BKN 1st, 2020 2nd
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Bad trade to start. But if the BKNY pick is in play, it's awful.
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Yeah, if the Nets pick was even slightly protected (like the protections on the LAL/SAC pick) that would make a big difference.
Ainge bid against himself and got played by Dan Gilbert and a GM that they hired a few weeks ago.
Holding on to these picks then letting one go for a pg who isn't prime CP3 is a massive swing and a miss.
If - IF - you knew that the BKN pick was only going to be in the 6-10 range, would everyone feel the same way? I think this is going to turn out just fine.
Also, in the last 14 months, they have added Brown, Horford, Heyward, Tatum, and Kyrie. That's an INCREDIBLE infusion of talent
Also, in the last 14 months, they have added Brown, Horford, Heyward, Tatum, and Kyrie. That's an INCREDIBLE infusion of talent
Yeah, it's less that trading the Nets pick in a vacuum is so terrible than it is that they have hoarded these picks for so long. I am just not convinced that 2 years of Kyrie Irving is the best value they could get from that pick.
If the Nets pick drops to 6-10, I'll be willing to take another look at this, but I just don't know how the Nets aren't sitting at the top of the lottery next year, unless a couple of other teams truly tank the season.
Kyrie
Hayward
Tatum
Brown
Horford
Smart, Morris, Rozier
They need a PF/center. This has the potential to be a GREAT team for the next 6-7 years
Hayward
Tatum
Brown
Horford
Smart, Morris, Rozier
They need a PF/center. This has the potential to be a GREAT team for the next 6-7 years
I'd rather the BKN pick wasn't involved in this, but I can live with this deal. Kyrie is fantastic and this team can make a legit run now. I'll miss IT, but he was a big liability on D.
So, let's try to unemotionally look at the assets traded:
Crowder: Fine complementary player on a great contract, but how many minutes given the arrivals of Hayward and Tatum would he be getting?
Thomas: Great story, motivational leader ... but coming off a bad hip, and was last season his career peak?
Zizic: Maybe he'll be a solid big man ... but is a big man really an important part of Stevens's game plan?
BKN pick: A completely valuable unknown
Crowder: Fine complementary player on a great contract, but how many minutes given the arrivals of Hayward and Tatum would he be getting?
Thomas: Great story, motivational leader ... but coming off a bad hip, and was last season his career peak?
Zizic: Maybe he'll be a solid big man ... but is a big man really an important part of Stevens's game plan?
BKN pick: A completely valuable unknown
I just don't understand how Danny gave up so much when he should have been trading from a position of power. With Kyrie unhappy and demanding a trade, Danny had the leverage, not Cleveland. At any time, Danny could have just said screw it, we don't need to make this trade.
He just bailed Cleveland out of a huge mess, IMO, and gave up way too much in the process.
He just bailed Cleveland out of a huge mess, IMO, and gave up way too much in the process.
I don't like this but I'm not at full hate-hate. If the Nets dont suck outright then I'll actually love this.
I look at it this way: Ainge just traded more for two years of Irving than most superstar trades ever made in this league.
If the BKN pick is unprotected I don't like it. If that pick is protected top 3 or top 5 I like it. At some point you need to upgrade the starting 5 not build more depth. Kyrie is only 25 and fits both timelines. He's much more valuable going forward than Thomas.
Irving is a proven superstar at 25. You keep Tatum and Brown. You still have a potential top 5 pick.
Do I wish the Brooklyn pick wasn't included? Of course, but that's the ultimate unknown.
Ainge's track record with these trades is extremely strong. Once again, I'm putting my faith in him 100%.
Do I wish the Brooklyn pick wasn't included? Of course, but that's the ultimate unknown.
Ainge's track record with these trades is extremely strong. Once again, I'm putting my faith in him 100%.
Kyrie had other suitors, so he was not competing against himself. Cleveland was going to get a good deal. It just shouldn't have been this good.
Who knows, maybe Brooklyn wins 35 games or something. The LA trade was pretty good for them.
I see a couple challenges with this one...
1) It's valuing Kyrie at the high end of what I think one can, and also the Nets pick at the low end of where it might land.
2) Crowder was, in my mind, the likely smallball 4 and Zizic was a bench big they needed something from (minutes more than production). They might have a plan for how to solve for that, but they need some size now.
3) It is a definite culture change, so I hope they got it right
1) It's valuing Kyrie at the high end of what I think one can, and also the Nets pick at the low end of where it might land.
2) Crowder was, in my mind, the likely smallball 4 and Zizic was a bench big they needed something from (minutes more than production). They might have a plan for how to solve for that, but they need some size now.
3) It is a definite culture change, so I hope they got it right
I'm fully on board with moving IT, by the way (anyone who game threads knows my feelings well). Just wish it were the LA pick.
fanboys love IT, but he is absolutely a DISASTER under a max deal. If Rondo doesn't get hurt and the Bulls win in the first round would anyone object to this?
Ainge just one of the few guys in the game who successfully stood up to the Warriors. and he's FIVE years younger than IT. And who played good D in the playoffs. I know you all love a team that plays hard for 48 mins every night, but in the NBA that is meaningless. This Celtics team is so much better now than it was on June 1. Crowder looked like toast to me. Zizic is a rotational big. commodity type guy
Also, now the Celtics are a destination team. They will be able to get vets looking for a title, etc.
Ainge just one of the few guys in the game who successfully stood up to the Warriors. and he's FIVE years younger than IT. And who played good D in the playoffs. I know you all love a team that plays hard for 48 mins every night, but in the NBA that is meaningless. This Celtics team is so much better now than it was on June 1. Crowder looked like toast to me. Zizic is a rotational big. commodity type guy
Also, now the Celtics are a destination team. They will be able to get vets looking for a title, etc.
I'm not an expert but from my perch, Ainge theoretically had all the leverage, and he paid retail
Not saying you're wrong, but some of these in this story are interesting
2011, Denver for Carmelo Anthony (and Chauncey Billups): Wilson Chandler, Raymond Felton, Danilo Gallinari, Timofey Mozgov, New York’s 2014 First Round Pick (unprotected), Golden State’s 2012 and 2013 Second Round Picks & $3 million
http://uproxx.com/dimemag/the-top-10-nba-superstar-trades-with-the-largest-impact/2/
Three.
Anecdotal, but I doubt Kyrie has more draw and appeal around the league than IT.
I guess I'm in the minority here. Irving is 25 and is under control for three more years. Was everyone here willing to give IT a max deal?
This team is set up to be the best team in the east over the next 5-7 years and the still have the LAL pick.
This team is set up to be the best team in the east over the next 5-7 years and the still have the LAL pick.
Prom night.
Moving on... I want to like this. Kyrie, to my mind, is a significant upgrade on IT (younger, healthier, more defensive upside, an extra contract year.. at the least). I feel it also positions the Celtics to rule the East once Lebron heads for Hollywood. Crowder's best attribute is that his a great trade chip, so cashing that in makes sense. I talked myself into being optimistic about Zizic, but nobody knows anything there.
And, well, then there's the pick. Figure there's about a one-in-four chance it lands in the top four. Maybe one-in-three.
I trust in Danny and Brad. Have to believe Brad has a vision for Kyrie leading the offense.
Edit: I am going to miss rooting against the Nets though.
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You can ignore IT, he wasn't coming back next season.
I'm walking back off the ledge a bit here, but I still think it was too much. I don't think Kyrie was the guy you trade the Brooklyn pick for. Butler was traded for far far less.
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