I suspect Brandon Spikes isnt long for Foxboro.Van Everyman said:Brandon Spikes wouldn't stand for it.
I suspect Brandon Spikes isnt long for Foxboro.Van Everyman said:Brandon Spikes wouldn't stand for it.
Gunfighter 09 said:Based on..... what exactly? The forward thinking Tom Coughlin? The ability of the Patriots to keep guys out of legal trouble? The way the Colts hang together when a key player like the starting quarterback gets injured? How the Hawks will make sure there are no PED temptations around him?
moondog80 said:I'm not questioning his motive or sincerity, but this exactly the type of player I've always thought would benefit from in coming out while it's still novel. I probably would never have heard of him otherwise.
Yeah, glad to see someone calling out that stupid post. Lol @ "I'm not questioning his motive or sincerity"--the fuck are you doing then?soxfan121 said:
I urge you to read the article abs posted on the previous page, which discusses how and why Sam chose to make this public. He came out to teammates BEFORE the 2013 season - where he was voted Player of the Year by his teammates and SEC Defensive Player of the Year by SEC coaches, players and experts.
You hadn't heard of him because you don't follow college football. closely enough Because everyone who does follow things like "best player in the best conference in college football" had heard of this guy.
His motive and sincerity are not really questionable, at least if you've taken the time to read the NYT article or any number of places where Sam's comments about his decision are discussed. He told his Mizzou teammates because he felt that "if anyone had asked me on the street, I would have told them the truth". And once he did come out to his teammates (at a red-state, state-school) they not only kept the issue private but also supported Sam on and off the field and honored him as their best on-field player.
Gay athletes will have to overcome many preconceived and/or prejudiced ideas about who they are and why they are coming out. It will help everyone if we don't guess at motives and instead see if the person has said they have any motives and then judge from there.
We tossed alot of "SPAM FILTER" around here, too, until we wisened up. If we learn to stop doing this, so can they.gtg807y said:The quotes from that SI piece really are shitty. "It might be a problem in the locker room, because they toss around '(SPAM filter)' a lot in there." Well maybe make them stop doing that, asshats. And I would point out that Michael Sam caused such a locker room distraction with Mizzou coming out to his teammates last summer that they went on to their best season in years. Presumably that locker room is less mature and "professional' than one in the NFL.
Infield Infidel said:
The scouting report is by Bill Connelly, who writes great analytical stuff on college football for SBN, and is also a Mizzou grad
Just realized Sam is 24, that's going to be a knock on him, that he's old for the class.
It's also interesting that apparently many scouts already knew, so his projected draft range may already take it into account
singaporesoxfan said:Good for him! And if people are stupid enough to let someone talented drop in the draft because of his sexuality, I hope the Patriots jump at the chance to draft him.
As a completely unrelated aside, I wish he had been a linebacker, just to hear "Sam is the Mike" and "Mike is the Sam".
Right you are. Plus, this provides an occasion for self congratulatory stuff on the part of the fan bases.Gunfighter 09 said:
Based on..... what exactly? The forward thinking Tom Coughlin? The ability of the Patriots to keep guys out of legal trouble? The way the Colts hang together when a key player like the starting quarterback gets injured? How the Hawks will make sure there are no PED temptations around him?
I imagine these teams are conspicuous for treating that scout well, giving Freeman good scoops or have the best pupus in the press box.
A strong position coach and a couple of strong veteran leaders who are comfortable answering questions about this every week are the key things a franchise has to measure if they are going to take him where he is valued. If he lasts two or three rounds beyond where he should, teams will just pick him on value and not give a fuck about the "distractions."
Disagree on that last part. High motor, high football IQ, and difficult to fit in a traditional system are like the BB draft profile trifecta. He's ranked on the board based on his on field ability and football IQ almost exclusively and if he's available where they have him ranked, they'll pick him.dcmissle said:Right you are. Plus, this provides an occasion for self congratulatory stuff on the part of the fan bases.
If you were looking at history -- what actually happened in certain places -- then you might put Baltimore on the list.
Irony in NE -- everything else being equal, BB probably does not draft him because of the distraction factor alone . Indeed he gets drafted here in all likelihood only if he presents a compelling value because other teams have passes and not deemed him worth the trouble.
MannysDestination said:Disagree on that last part. High motor, high football IQ, and difficult to fit in a traditional system are like the BB draft profile trifecta. He's ranked on the board based on his on field ability and football IQ almost exclusively and if he's available where they have him ranked, they'll pick him.
I qualified with everything else being equal. You are postulating a situation in which everything else is not equal because of things the Pats particularly value. If that's the case, I agree with you.MannysDestination said:Disagree on that last part. High motor, high football IQ, and difficult to fit in a traditional system are like the BB draft profile trifecta. He's ranked on the board based on his on field ability and football IQ almost exclusively and if he's available where they have him ranked, they'll pick him.
Drocca said:Is anyone concerned that, in the locker room, he won't be able to focus on football with all the temptation?
I hope this sort of stuff stops because it is precisely the kind of thing that could hurt him. He has announced himself as a proud gay man. That is terrific. But it should not serve as a lever to out others. That would be PC run amuck. Every gay player should be entitled to make his own decision about his profile based on his own circumstances.soxhop411 said:Really good point
Justin Miller @justinjm1 7m
Gay NFL players now must decide whether they want a rookie to be the first open one in the league
A tweener with high IQ and a great motor - sounds like a Bruschi type who could start off as a STmer and grow into a LB role.MannysDestination said:Disagree on that last part. High motor, high football IQ, and difficult to fit in a traditional system are like the BB draft profile trifecta. He's ranked on the board based on his on field ability and football IQ almost exclusively and if he's available where they have him ranked, they'll pick him.
Kenny F'ing Powers said:Just heard on 98.5 that they will be having Michael Sam on shortly. Maybe worth a listen.
dcmissle said:Right you are. Plus, this provides an occasion for self congratulatory stuff on the part of the fan bases.
If you were looking at history -- what actually happened in certain places -- then you might put Baltimore on the list.
Irony in NE -- everything else being equal, BB probably does not draft him because of the distraction factor alone . Indeed he gets drafted here in all likelihood only if he presents a compelling value because other teams have passes and not deemed him worth the trouble.
Lose Remerswaal said:We tossed alot of "SPAM FILTER" around here, too, until we wisened up. If we learn to stop doing this, so can they.
It is not wrong because job 1 is to entertain, and this would be awesome( . ) ( . ) and (_!_) said:Is it wrong that I want the Pats to draft him just for the amazing Belichick press conference where he states that he is only going to talk about football over and over again to a room full of non-football reporters? I just get incredible joy out of people trolling the media and this would be epic.
soxfan121 said:
I urge you to read the article abs posted on the previous page, which discusses how and why Sam chose to make this public. He came out to teammates BEFORE the 2013 season - where he was voted Player of the Year by his teammates and SEC Defensive Player of the Year by SEC coaches, players and experts.
You hadn't heard of him because you don't follow college football. closely enough Because everyone who does follow things like "best player in the best conference in college football" had heard of this guy.
His motive and sincerity are not really questionable, at least if you've taken the time to read the NYT article or any number of places where Sam's comments about his decision are discussed. He told his Mizzou teammates because he felt that "if anyone had asked me on the street, I would have told them the truth". And once he did come out to his teammates (at a red-state, state-school) they not only kept the issue private but also supported Sam on and off the field and honored him as their best on-field player.
Gay athletes will have to overcome many preconceived and/or prejudiced ideas about who they are and why they are coming out. It will help everyone if we don't guess at motives and instead see if the person has said they have any motives and then judge from there.
I doubt the people who actually feel that way will respond.MannysDestination said:
Is it really necessary to troll here?
moondog80 said:
Did you miss the part where I said I don't question his motives? I don't, not for a moment. Still, even though it wasn't his intention, it could end up working out well for him, a lot moreso than it would a few years from now for the 17th guy to come out (for whom it will have zero impact). And maybe I'm wrong about this, but am I in the minority for not knowing who he was 24 hours ago? Seems to me that if you're not a skill player, not considered a first round draft talent, and don't play for a high profile school, it's pretty hard to break through as a name to the non-serious college football fan.
maufman said:Notwithstanding his terrific college career, Sam isn't a good NFL prospect. For every "tweener" who turns into a Tedy Bruschi, there's a dozen who turn into nothing. He's a 4th or 5th rounder on merit, imo -- a marginal player. And regrettably, marginal players who are deemed to be distractions don't tend to get a fair shake.
I hope Peter King is wrong in saying that Sam won't be drafted, but I fear he's right.
absintheofmalaise said:He wasn't trolling the people who are supporting Sam.
maufman said:Notwithstanding his terrific college career, Sam isn't a good NFL prospect. For every "tweener" who turns into a Tedy Bruschi, there's a dozen who turn into nothing. He's a 4th or 5th rounder on merit, imo -- a marginal player. And regrettably, marginal players who are deemed to be distractions don't tend to get a fair shake.
I hope Peter King is wrong in saying that Sam won't be drafted, but I fear he's right.
Kenny F'ing Powers said:
I’m not trying to be a dick, but who cares what your opinion is on where he should be drafted? He’s a SEC Defensive player of the year. Over the last 10 years, here’s the round that the SEC defensive POY was drafted in:
7th round: 0
6th round: 0
5th round: 0
4th round: 0
3rd round: 0
2nd round: 0
1st round: 10
Now, maybe he isn’t a first round talent like his previous 10 predecessors, but there’s no fucking way this kid goes undrafted. He's the best defensive player in the best conference in football. Whether he makes it in the NFL is an entirely different story, but he will be drafted.
Van Everyman said:I'm keeping an eye out for when Ben Volin writes about this in the Globe. I thought his piece on the Jonathan Martin/Ritchie Incognito debacle this fall, whole obviously informed by his former gig as a beat writer for the Dolphins, demonstrated an unsettling sympathy for locker room culture. Whether he writes an insightful, balanced piece on this (or sounds like Herm Edwards that can speak in complete sentences) for me will be a solid indication as to whether he's long for this gig.
https://twitter.com/BenVolin/status/432894497123737600The more I hear about Michael Sam being a "distraction" the more I think it's simply a cop-out by teams that just don't want to deal with it
This. Hes also ranked as the 12th best pass rusher in the draft, and with everyone with their panties in a bunch to try to replicate the impossible to replicate seahawks d model, this kids getting drafted.Kenny F'ing Powers said:I’m not trying to be a dick, but who cares what your opinion is on where he should be drafted? He’s a SEC Defensive player of the year. Over the last 10 years, here’s the round that the SEC defensive POY was drafted in:
7th round: 0
6th round: 0
5th round: 0
4th round: 0
3rd round: 0
2nd round: 0
1st round: 10
Now, maybe he isn’t a first round talent like his previous 10 predecessors, but there’s no fucking way this kid goes undrafted. He's the best defensive player in the best conference in football. Whether he makes it in the NFL is an entirely different story, but he will be drafted.
Kenny F'ing Powers said:
I’m not trying to be a dick, but who cares what your opinion is on where he should be drafted? He’s a SEC Defensive player of the year. Over the last 10 years, here’s the round that the SEC defensive POY was drafted in:
Kenny F'ing Powers said:
I’m not trying to be a dick, but who cares what your opinion is on where he should be drafted? He’s a SEC Defensive player of the year. Over the last 10 years, here’s the round that the SEC defensive POY was drafted in:
7th round: 0
6th round: 0
5th round: 0
4th round: 0
3rd round: 0
2nd round: 0
1st round: 10
Now, maybe he isn’t a first round talent like his previous 10 predecessors, but there’s no fucking way this kid goes undrafted. He's the best defensive player in the best conference in football. Whether he makes it in the NFL is an entirely different story, but he will be drafted.
maufman said:
I'm sorry I had the temerity to express an opinion about a professional football player on a website dedicated to the discussion of sports. Go fuck yourself.
I would also note that my 4th/5th opinion isn't much different from the late-3rd that appears to be the consensus among people who follow this stuff closely. I thought the Mizzou beat writer for the St. Louis Post-Dispatch made a good argument why C.J. Mosley should have been the DPoY, and that Sam wasn't even clearly the best player on Mizzou's defensive line.
I'll be rooting for Sam to beat the odds, but I'm not going to change my opinion about his prospects just because I know something about his personal life that I didn't before.
Missing from that list is obviously New England since they also fit the GM's description.The former general manager said that it would take an NFL franchise with a strong owner, savvy general manager and veteran coach to make drafting Sam work. He rattled off franchises like Pittsburgh, Green Bay, San Francisco, Baltimore and Indianapolis as potential destinations. The former general manager added that a team with a rookie head coach would not be an ideal landing spot.
Richie Incognito @68INCOGNITO Follow
@MikeSamFootball #respect bro. It takes guts to do what you did. I wish u nothing but the best
You're not delusional at all. The Tebow experiment proved the Pats are willing to bring in a marginal player who the rest of the league deems to be too much of a distraction, even if that player doesn't seem to fit with their system. If Sam doesn't slip in the draft, he'll probably end up someplace where he's a better fit for the system, but if he does slip, I think the Pats are one of the prime contenders to take a flier on him.Shelterdog said:Maybe I'm delusional but I think if anything this makes it more likely that the Pats draft him. They seem to have been really focussed lately on picking up guys with mental toughness-Tavon Wilson, Cole and Ebner all lost close family members, Thompkins overcame all kinds of adversity (some self-infliced)--and, at least to me, it would take a hell of a lot of guts and mental fortitude to come out to a SEC football team. Plus it's a reasonably open minded region and it would be pretty surprising if BB and Kraft weren't as welcoming as any senior executives would be in a company in the Boston area.
The biggest question is where you'd fit him in. He's a little big (and maybe slow) for a special teams demon, a little small for DE, and while he's a nice size to convert to a 3-4 ILB we're not running that any more.
Reverend said:Is there another industry on the planet besides sports where otherwise apparently sane individuals can argue that well-paid professional adults aren't ready to handle something that a bunch of college guys had no problem with?
EvilEmpire said:Player has a high motor, is an award-winner at the college level, who might not fit in the pro game at his current position, and who will generate a ton of media attention.
I'm sure a team will draft him because talent is talent and someone will take a chance to see what he can do. But the potential for a Tebow-like situation might be creeping up there. There will be a vocal contingent of fans who want him to succeed at all costs because of what he represents to them, which isn't a bad thing at all, but might make it a bit harder for a team if they feel he isn't working out.
Good luck to him, I hope he makes it.