Michael Sam could be the first openly gay NFL player
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I'm more horrified with my daughter growing up in a nation where discrimination is legalized. I don't follow college football enough to know if Michael Sam would help the Pats or not, but I hope they do draft him. And if someone else does, I'll buy that teams hat and make them my second favorite team.
Sounds like he's an unsuccessful lobbyist who aspires to be a talk radio personality and has a history of anti-gay rhetoric.
http://www.thewire.com/politics/2014/02/you-can-ignore-wannabe-radio-host-who-wants-ban-gay-nfl-players/358466/
http://www.thewire.com/politics/2014/02/you-can-ignore-wannabe-radio-host-who-wants-ban-gay-nfl-players/358466/
Can we please try to avoid stigmatizing other marginalized groups when we celebrate the bravery of a member of one?dcmissle said:
Royal Reader said:
The NFL is filled with psycho's. Aaron Hernandez. Richie Ingocnito. Ray Rice. Ray Lewis. And on and on.
For a guy who says he just wants to be known for his on-the-field ability, Monday was a bad day. Especially since he's also a tweener and scouts aren't sure what position he will play. Being described as "stiff and slow" is not good for a transition to OLB. Seems like a late 3rd day pick.
The NFL is full of people who've done bad shit.johnmd20 said:
Some of these people may have mental health issues. Some people with mental health issues may play in the NFL and not have done any bad shit.
It is not filled with 'psychos.' The NFL is filled with black men, but we don't say it's full of n______s.
Reverend said:
A few reasons
Most of his traditional stats came against lesser teams, and he has as serious motor. He doesn't quit on plays and that allows him to be in position when something comes to him because of pressure from the other side.
He was part of a 3 DE rotation, where all three guys were excellent. He's probably third best of the three guys, but offenses couldn't use double teams too much because the guy on the other side was just as good (if not better), and using the rotation made sure all three guys stayed fresh. Kony Ealy will be a first or second day pick, and the third guy, Marcus Golden, might better than Sam or Ealy.
Missouri is a DE mill right now, Aldon Smith, Sheldon Richardson.
It's also kind of a down year for SEC defenders. Espcially when you consider Clowney had a sub-par season and missed games. The only other SEC defenders sniffing around the first round are Kony Ealy, CJ Mosely, Clinton-Dix from Alabama and maybe Easley from Florida.
Ealy played on the same time as Sam, Easley was hurt and Mosely and Clinton-Dix look like good NFL prospects but are not franchise changing players.
Ealy played on the same time as Sam, Easley was hurt and Mosely and Clinton-Dix look like good NFL prospects but are not franchise changing players.
The "people" were the SEC coaches, so I assume they vote by how players played in the games in which they coached against them, and by what they see on tape.
From what I heard, what he displayed yesterday does not bode well for transition to OLB. But fear not. I'm not comparing the two by any stretch, but Richard Seymour was prematurely castigated as a tweener in perhaps the most embarrassing critical column ever written about the Pats. Burials can be premature. David Terrell. Where RU?soxfan121 said:
He looks like a very good pass rush specialist. He gets off the ball quick but he's too stiff to be out their in coverage. He was decent against the run in college but I'm not sure how that's going to translate to the NFL. Either way he's likely not an every down player.
Did you bother reading the article? You should, as it was explained what some of the stats mean to scouts. For instance, the vertical jump translates to push off the line at the snap. Sam even mentions that he was dissapointed in that metric specifically. If he's to be a pash rush specialist as an undersized lin mean or OLB, that first step to get into the backfield is huge for Sam. And his stiffness in the run projects poorly for him in coverage. And remember, that 40 time is as a D-limeman, not with the linebackers.soxfan121 said:
lostjumper said:
I read it, thanks.
Sam isn't a LB and isn't a conversion prospect. He is what he was before he had a thread about him - a high motor, max-effort, undersized pass rushing DE who can't play every down.
But there are jobs in the NFL for the 17th fastest DE in the 40 with college awards and a high motor. As a mid round pick. To quote the immortal Denny Green, "HE IS WHO WE THOUGHT HE WAS."
So, and please forgive me, why is that "bad"? And specifically, why for "a guy who says he just wants to be known for his on-the-field ability" was it "bad"? You really don't see why that sentence you wrote is worth questioning? I would think that performing as expected could be seen as mildly disappointing or not special but "bad" is overstating things, IMO. YMMV.
And people wanted to see if he could be more than that. The combine didn't produce significant results that would indicate that. Hence, it was bad if he was looking to move up in the draft.soxfan121 said:
You keep mentioning his 17th fastest time as a positive, but he's one of the smallest guys at his position. He really needed to get a time in the top 10, if not the top 5. So to summarize, Sam was slow for his size, incredibly weak upper body strength, and surprising weak and stiff lower body. I think Sam wanted to do a lot more at the combine, and it was a bad showing for him. He's likely a 5th-7th round pick now. I would say that qualifies as a bad day.soxfan121 said:
Yeah, his chart on mockdraftable.com is ugly: http://mockdraftable.com/player/4596/lostjumper said:
Tangentially related, Roy Simmons passed away on Feb 20. One of the handful of NFL players who came out after they retired.
Not me. Everyone said back when this hit the news that he was unlikely to go in the top half of the draft and that he might even slip to the 6th or 7th round or Free Agency.
Unless you heard otherwise?
Unless you heard otherwise?
Should we? I wrote just a couple of posts up that he's likely a 5th-7th rounder after a very disappointing combine.ZP1 said:
I think Sam will get drafted. If for no other reason than for headlines. I could see a team like Oakland or Jacksonville taking him for that reason. That being said the best place for him would be somewhere like the Giants or Patriots where they have strong veteran coaches who have won so if this experiment doesn't work out then the bad press will be limited. Not to mention I would love to see if Belichick could turn Sam into a good rotational pass rusher.
I could be wrong (of course) but I don't feel a contender would want this type of distraction in their locker room. Fair or not, Sam destroyed his stock by coming out that's just the way it is. Maybe a Jacksonville (attention) or an Oakland (community) would be the best fit but imo the NFL locker room isn't ready for this. I don't expect him to be draftedTyrone Biggums said:
I think he killed his draft stock by having the worst vertical leap and 3-cone among edge rushers at the CombineHomeRunBaker said:
My guess is someone will draft him in the 7th for the good PR, but I doubt he has much of a career in the NFL. From his college tape and stats, you can see he has a good football IQ. He can read plays well, and gets to the ball carrier because he's in the right place. That's huge for a football player, and it served him well in college. However, you also need athleticism along with the football mind to make it in the NFL. The reports at the combine were slow, undersized, stiff in the legs and hips, slow to change direction. That's terrible for an nfl player. It doesn't matter if you are in the right place in the nfl, if you can't react quickly and move slowly ball carriers and receivers will blow right by you.Super Nomario said:
Coaching won't help this. Coaching helps things like field awareness, technique, and football IQ. Those are things Sam already has. Unfortunately for him, he lacks athleticism, which is the piece you can't coach.
Jason La Canfora @JasonLaCanfora 2m
The Ravens are out of draft picks but would pursue Michael Sam aggressively as a priority undrafted free agent.
The Ravens are out of draft picks but would pursue Michael Sam aggressively as a priority undrafted free agent.
Most likely draft options remaining for Sam~
Option 1 "Home Team Pick:" St Louis (4 Rd 7 picks)
Option 2 "Publicity Pick" Dallas (6 Rd 7 picks)
Option 1 "Home Team Pick:" St Louis (4 Rd 7 picks)
Option 2 "Publicity Pick" Dallas (6 Rd 7 picks)
DrewDawg said:
No shit. The guy was SEC defensive player of the year with great character but has really shitty quantifiables in terms of athletic ability. He's a textbook UDFA candidate. Announcing that you think so doesn't make you special, Baltimore.
I think he's a textbook 5th-7th round draft pick, not an UDFA. He should be picked based on what he did on the field, and I'm getting angrier by the minute that he hasn't gone yet. Folks should be rightly pissed if goes undrafted today.
I don't know, he had one year of top production on a great defense with a much better player opposite him and he had brutal combine numbers. Add that to his size issues and it is completely reasonable for him to go undrafted.Deathofthebambino said:
Hypothetical:
So, aside from his playing ability (assume he could have gone anywhere from Rd 6 to UDFA) and focusing only on the "business" side of football: Should the San Fran GM draft Sam with one of their two remaining Rd 7 picks (28 & 30), especially considering the significant LGBT population in the Bay Area?
Good for business or bad for business?
So, aside from his playing ability (assume he could have gone anywhere from Rd 6 to UDFA) and focusing only on the "business" side of football: Should the San Fran GM draft Sam with one of their two remaining Rd 7 picks (28 & 30), especially considering the significant LGBT population in the Bay Area?
Good for business or bad for business?
Don't see why it would be good for business. He has no shot of making the team, so it is just going to lead to another story when they cut him. Also teams that suck and/or have bad attendance might draft a guy for publicity, not a good well supported team like SF.HurstSoGood said:
Why there are tons of draft eligible players and only a small portion ever get drafted. College production doesn't always translate into pro potential, you need look no further than the list of Heisman winners from 1999-2008 for that.E5 Yaz said:
Edit- as a further example of how size can be a factor among other things, Ben Gardner from Stanford had better production in 2012 than Sam and was having a good campaign this year as well before an injury. He then destroyed Sam's numbers in terms of athleticism. He just went mid-7th.
I'm resigning myself to the fact he isn't going to get taken. Watching teams take place kickers over the SEC Defensive player of the year is not helping my anger though.
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