NBA 2022 Year-end awards

NomarsFool

NomarsFool

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coremiller said:
I think it's worth noting this is a very limited problem. It only affects super-max eligibility, and the number of players who are borderline for a super-max in any given year such that an all-nba team will qualify them is extremely small, no more than a couple at most.
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Exactly. Also, there is no agreed upon way to objectively value every aspect that a player brings to the table. There are certainly flaws in it being a subjective vote, but else are you going to do? Tie it just to points/game? People on this board debate endlessly about all the different metrics that try and combine everything. At the end of the day, for the few players that might be upset because they were on the edge of the line there's a simple answer - be better so that you are clearly above the line.
 
jezza1918

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NomarsFool said:
Exactly. Also, there is no agreed upon way to objectively value every aspect that a player brings to the table. There are certainly flaws in it being a subjective vote, but else are you going to do? Tie it just to points/game? People on this board debate endlessly about all the different metrics that try and combine everything. At the end of the day, for the few players that might be upset because they were on the edge of the line there's a simple answer - be better so that you are clearly above the line.
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Ahh ok didn't realize it was only tied to super-max, appreciate you pointing that out @coremiller. And yes I agree with the quoted on the whole, people have been debating these subjective awards across sports since they began, and there really isn't a better way to do it. The thing that stuck out with me was the $$ tied up with the Tatum thing last year...It's one thing to lose out a $1.5 mil by finishing 4th instead of 3rd for the Cy Young, it's a whole other financial ballgame with what happened to Tatum. But again, that was my frame of mind before learning it was a pretty rare circumstance.
 
snowmanny

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If I were the players I would want Conference based awards, like MLB. All-Conference first and second teams...maybe a third team. Two conference MVPs. The awards are so flawed anyway, even MVP, that if I were the players my goal would to get as many players awarded as possible. Baseball has 18 Gold Glovers; basketball can't have twenty all-defensive players?

From a fan perspective I think it would be much more interesting as well.

Ed- you'd have a Jokic/Luka/Booker debate out West and a Giannis/Embiid/Tatum debate out East. Two debates, more discussion of superstars.
 
jmcc5400

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DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
This story is only bound to get bigger given the dollars and names involved. Draymond, Arenas and Hollins have a valid point.

As a side, the Simmons comment about Jalen Green was just Sprtsguy33 being flip but it feels similar to the sort of things his predecessors in print might have published back in their day. The very same people whose sloppy work and biases prompted Simmons to start his blog.

View: https://twitter.com/theBrowsexual/status/1518596804241248259?s=20&t=0JxNyrzakoFbE-WUE2sVxQ
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The irony is that Bill's "fuck Jalen Green" comment was made in the context of his support for Herbert Jones, who is a much more "Draymondish" player (i.e., not really score first, defense-centric). It is, of course, deeply cringey for Bill to have framed the debate in such a coarse way - a 52 year old white media mogul discussing a 19 year old black kid - but the merit of validating Jones's performance over Green's this year is pretty solidly reasoned.
 
Kliq

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The "Fuck Jalen Green" line which was clearly made as a sarcastic response, is the biggest nothing-burger I can think of. I can't believe people are still talking about it; things like that are said a million times a day.
 
DeJesus Built My Hotrod

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Kliq said:
The "Fuck Jalen Green" line which was clearly made as a sarcastic response, is the biggest nothing-burger I can think of. I can't believe people are still talking about it; things like that are said a million times a day.
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It clearly wasn't nothing to the players. And as @jmcc5400 notes, the sentiment that Simmons was trying to express was valid, even if he fumbled the messaging.

Again, my expectation is that the next CBA negotiations will include figuring out if there is a workable alternative. As others have noted, this is a problem relegated to a very small population of players but they also happen to be part of the league's power structure so it will be surprising if its not addressed.

Finally, the Tatum clip where he references his "loss" is striking to me. He doesn't seem to be over it and other stars clearly think its a problem as well.
 
the moops

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DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
It clearly wasn't nothing to the players.
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Unfortunately that is what we get when an entire conversation about all-rookie team gets boiled down to one off the cuff comment. I am no Simmons fan, but if you listen/read to the entire segment it is obvious that this was much more a praise of one player than a disparage of another
 
jmcc5400

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the moops said:
Unfortunately that is what we get when an entire conversation about all-rookie team gets boiled down to one off the cuff comment. I am no Simmons fan, but if you listen/read to the entire segment it is obvious that this was much more a praise of one player than a disparage of another
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If memory serves, he actually said that he liked Green after the unfortunate FJG comment. I agree that nothing genuinely disparaging was *meant* by the comment, but it was still ill-advised in light of Bill’s position and audience.
 
the moops

the moops

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jmcc5400 said:
If memory serves, he actually said that he liked Green after the unfortunate FJG comment. I agree that nothing genuinely disparaging was *meant* by the comment, but it was still ill-advised in light of Bill’s position and audience.
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Or it was highly advised considering everyone is talking about him now. The whole any press is good press theory
 
NomarsFool

NomarsFool

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Basketball is a pretty interesting situation because the size of the pie awarded to the players is fixed - it's just a question of how that pie is distributed. So, from a union perspective, it is interesting to watch them figure out how much of that pie should go to superstars like Lebron and Tatum, and how much of that pie should go to the other players in the league.
 
cheech13

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jmcc5400 said:
If memory serves, he actually said that he liked Green after the unfortunate FJG comment. I agree that nothing genuinely disparaging was *meant* by the comment, but it was still ill-advised in light of Bill’s position and audience.
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He did! He went on to praise both Green and Sengun from the Rockets but his argument was that Herb Jones’ defense for a playoff team was more important than Green’s offensive numbers on a really bad team. He said it wrong, and it should have been cut from the pod, but his overall point wasn’t as malicious as it is currently being framed.
 
Jimbodandy

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cheech13 said:
He did! He went on to praise both Green and Sengun from the Rockets but his argument was that Herb Jones’ defense for a playoff team was more important than Green’s offensive numbers on a really bad team. He said it wrong, and it should have been cut from the pod, but his overall point wasn’t as malicious as it is currently being framed.
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It wasn't malicious at all, but it's a shitty look. Simmons should have known better.

The players are the product, the talent. Saying "fuck <insert player>" is stupid.
 
The Raccoon

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That's great for TL!
Getting some recognition for his contribution to this season when most of the public attention is on the 1-2 punch of JT and JB and the DPOY / deputy.
 
Time to Mo Vaughn

Time to Mo Vaughn

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The ESPN article said that Brown, Tatum and Horford each received a first team vote and White had a second team vote. Pretty incredible.
 
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