Pats cut Sanu

Jed Zeppelin

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2008
39,014
Any chance this is a release and re-sign? Or if that was the case would it have been a restructure already?

This position group is already so bad, not ideal to ship out a proven, if flawed, NFL receiver, but if he's totally cooked and the savings are put to use, I won't shed many tears over it.
 

BaseballJones

goalpost mover
SoSH Member
Oct 1, 2015
9,776
Thus closing the books on one of the worst trades of this era, unfortunately.
Sadly yes. But not because Sanu isn't a good player. He is. He's been good everywhere he's gone. He played well in NE at the start then got hurt. He will be good for someone this season. Bummer it won't be for NE (unless Jed's idea comes to fruition). But it does open up a spot for a younger guy.
 

DourDoerr

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
Gold Supporter
SoSH Member
Oct 15, 2004
2,114
Berkeley, CA
I'd hope they think they're keeping better players. And $6 million is freed to perhaps scoop up a better vet WR in a trade or cut from another team. Cutting Sanu doesn't settle the WR position.
 

DeadlySplitter

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 20, 2015
22,034
welp, can't imagine a second round pick used for much worse.

But Bill always busts on the second pick anyways! /s
 

Soxy

Well-Known Member
Gold Supporter
SoSH Member
Dec 1, 2008
5,764
Second round pick. Yikes.

Probably a combination of Sanu being underwhelming and some of the younger guys showing their value during camp. Byrd and Ross have both reportedly had good camps. Gunner is, by all accounts, night and day better than what he showed last year. Who knows with Meyers. Edelman and Harry aren't going anywhere.

It's kind of funny in hindsight how often Belichick mentioned that they spent a 2nd round pick on Sanu during the offseason. Maybe it's just me, but he seemed to bring it up at any opportunity, especially around the draft. Of course, Belichick knows as well as anyone that the 2nd round pick is a sunk cost, so let the cream rise to the top. If the high pick doesn't make the cut, so be it. Which doesn't really soften the blow, because a 2nd round pick getting cut in their first training camp would be considered a colossal failure, but you also can't let that prevent you from keeping somebody else who seems more useful and helpful. Spilled milk at this point.
 

Seels

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2005
3,391
NH
Saw it coming. Hated the trade the day it was made. An inline receiver on a team full of them never made sense.
 

Mystic Merlin

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 21, 2007
33,608
Hartford, CT
Sanu has been a very productive receiver by any metric, but, without needing to needlessly declare this the worst trade in all of history or use of a second round pick or whatever, this flat out was a failure of a move by the Pats.

I’m heartened that the sunk cost of a second rounder didn’t keep him on the roster, however, and it also suggests that they see more value (TBD how it plays out of course) in other options. Any hope of improvement over last year’s WR production is welcome.
 

scottyno

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 7, 2008
6,684
Can't see BB cutting him just to save money if he didn't think that someone else on the roster (gunner?) was a better fit right now.

He looked good before he got hurt last year, and had years as a productive guy, who knows what might have been if he stayed healthy, oh well.
 

Mooch

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
1,794
I wonder if the lack of preseason sealed his fate in New England. With less time to evaluate various positions, Belichick will opt for versatile guys who can play multiple spots. Sanu probably got edged out by several guys at the back end of the roster who can possibly play special teams in addition to their primary depth roles. Some of those guys might have flamed out in actual preseason game situations but they’ll now learn on the fly in real games that matter. The Pats don’t have the luxury to keep a one-dimensional guy like Sanu who didn’t even get a chance to get real reps this year.

I’m not a fan of Sanu, but I think he got caught in a tough spot this year.
 

cshea

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 15, 2006
26,153
306, row 14
At least they are willing to eat it and move on instead of forcing it.

Man, the WR position is precariously thin right now. I haven’t been following the league, Are there any potential vets on the bubble elsewhere that the Patriots could bring in? Edelman is 33, Harry caught 12 balls last year, Byrd has 28 career catches. I though Meyers was OK last year but most roster projections I’ve read have him as a cut, albeit most also had Sanu making it.
 

lexrageorge

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2007
10,627
I had hopes for Sanu. IIRC, he needed surgery on his ankle after last season, which would explain his performance, or lack thereof, last season. And he declared himself healthy and fit at the start of camp.

The media reports on his camp performance were not glowing, however, and it became apparent that both the $6M and roster spot could be put to better use. Keep in mind that very few (if any) veteran WR's released by Belichick amount to much of anything after they are cut, so I'm not expecting him to contribute much elsewhere.
 

OurF'ingCity

Well-Known Member
Gold Supporter
SoSH Member
Apr 22, 2016
4,859
New York City
I always felt that this was something close to an inevitability given his poor performance last year and the fact that cutting him results in no dead money.

That trade was obviously a complete failure in retrospect, but at the time they were desperate to placate Brady's desire for more established receivers, it seemed like. One of the reasons it was probably for the best that Brady left.
 

mwonow

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 4, 2005
5,707
I wonder if the lack of preseason sealed his fate in New England. With less time to evaluate various positions, Belichick will opt for versatile guys who can play multiple spots. Sanu probably got edged out by several guys at the back end of the roster who can possibly play special teams in addition to their primary depth roles. Some of those guys might have flamed out in actual preseason game situations but they’ll now learn on the fly in real games that matter. The Pats don’t have the luxury to keep a one-dimensional guy like Sanu who didn’t even get a chance to get real reps this year.

I’m not a fan of Sanu, but I think he got caught in a tough spot this year.
This could be a trickle-down thing, too - for example, if they're high on some of the young defensive guys, maybe they needed a WR who plays ST so that they can cut Bethel to make room for one (who's the young guy who keeps making plays at CB? Or even the converted TE who's an edge rusher now?)

EDIT: Trickle down might be money, too - e.g., is Fournette worth more than Sanu, and if so, can they reallocate Sanu's dough?
 

scottyno

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 7, 2008
6,684
What do we think our 3 WR sets are now?

Edelman
Harry
Byrd?
Gunner? They went with Edelman/Amendola in 3 WR package for awhile so they don't seem to have a problem with going with essentially 2 slot guys.
 

Shelterdog

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Feb 19, 2002
12,089
New York City
When people talk about going for it now, not letting the window close on Brady/BB, this is exactly the kind of move that they're looking for -- a slight overpay at a position of need that you needed to improve if you were going to have a shot at the superbowl.

It worked out very poorly. Maybe if he wasn't injured it would have worked better; who knows.

It's also not quite as bad as people say because second round picks aren't as valuable as people think. The reason the Pats have so many draft busts in the second round is that every team has a lot of second round draft busts-picks bust at roughly fifty percent league wide in the second. (Still a shitty deal though).
 

NomarsFool

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 21, 2001
4,236
Wow. I'm amazed he was that bad in camp. I really hoped it was just a nagging injury thing last season.
 

Shelterdog

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Feb 19, 2002
12,089
New York City
Gunner? They went with Edelman/Amendola in 3 WR package for awhile so they don't seem to have a problem with going with essentially 2 slot guys.
I wonder if they go with "whoever's best in space" (not sure who that is, maybe Gunner) and really try to amp out the jet sweeps and option runs to take advantage of Newton.
 

Soxy

Well-Known Member
Gold Supporter
SoSH Member
Dec 1, 2008
5,764
When people talk about going for it now, not letting the window close on Brady/BB, this is exactly the kind of move that they're looking for -- a slight overpay at a position of need that you needed to improve if you were going to have a shot at the superbowl.

It worked out very poorly. Maybe if he wasn't injured it would have worked better; who knows.

It's also not quite as bad as people say because second round picks aren't as valuable as people think. The reason the Pats have so many draft busts in the second round is that every team has a lot of second round draft busts-picks bust at roughly fifty percent league wide in the second. (Still a shitty deal though).
Second round picks may bust more than people think, but if you only get half of a bad season out of your second round pick, then cut them the following training camp, that's not good. That would put Sanu in the conversation for worst second round pick in Patriots history. Here's the list of all of the Pats' second round picks. Even guys like Ras-I Dowling and Terrence Wheatley managed to play more games in a Patriots uniform than Sanu.

We're obviously judging with the benefit of hindsight, and I'll admit that I thought it was a reasonable risk to take at the time (they badly needed receiver help), but it clearly didn't work out. No way to sugarcoat that.
 

SMU_Sox

loves his fluffykins
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2009
6,666
Dallas
+1 to the WR core being thin.

What do we think our 3 WR sets are now?

Edelman
Harry
Byrd?
That depends. Edelman can play all 3 roles. Harry was used exclusively at X last year and from reading the tea leaves this year, and Byrd is probably a guy can play each position. I still don’t know who does what at which receiver role. They have a lot of guys including Harry whose best true role is in the slot. Gunner was getting use outside too. Seems like BB is throwing everything at the wall and seeing what sticks. Given who they have I don’t blame him.
 

bankshot1

Member
SoSH Member
Feb 12, 2003
19,226
where I was last at
When people talk about going for it now, not letting the window close on Brady/BB, this is exactly the kind of move that they're looking for -- a slight overpay at a position of need that you needed to improve if you were going to have a shot at the superbowl.

It worked out very poorly. Maybe if he wasn't injured it would have worked better; who knows.

It's also not quite as bad as people say because second round picks aren't as valuable as people think. The reason the Pats have so many draft busts in the second round is that every team has a lot of second round draft busts-picks bust at roughly fifty percent league wide in the second. (Still a shitty deal though).
But even if you have an underperforming 2nd rounder, you have that player under team control for 4 seasons (lets say 64 games), at a discounted rate. And maybe if the team is disappointed they can trade out in years 2-4, and salvage it with a player or pick. It seems the Pats traded those 64+ games for 8 games at full MSRP. And then they bailed as there were no trade takers for Sanu.

Im not an expert in NFL salary magic, but ballparking this, in an empty ballpark, this was a pretty pretty pretty bad trade.
 

E5 Yaz

Transcends message boarding
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Apr 25, 2002
65,457
Oregon
But even if you have an underperforming 2nd rounder, you have that player under team control for 4 seasons (lets say 64 games), at a discounted rate.
So, you're saying the meal was awful ... and such small portions
 

Pandemonium67

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 17, 2003
4,734
Lesterland
In hindsight the move was a poor one, of course, but it made at least some sense at the time it was made. The Pats had an otherworldly defense that made the team look capable of going deep into the postseason. The O, which had lost AB and was losing (or had lost) Josh Gordon, was holding them back. Especially the WR corp. I think the 2nd rounder was the price they needed to pay to upgrade, and BB decided to go for it.

The real fuckup was having Sanu return punts. We talked about it at the time in the game thread. He'd gotten off to a decent start at WR, then got hurt returning a punt for 8 yards. That was it. He never recovered as a WR, and the Pats O never came around.

I'm not glad he's gone. I'd have preferred that the offseason helped him recover and become one of the best receivers in camp. But that's clearly not the case, so I'm glad BB is moving on. Bring on the Jeff Thomas era.
 

ShaneTrot

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Nov 17, 2002
5,257
Overland Park, KS
BB just always moves on from a sunk cost. I am disappointed because he seemed like the answer to their prayers last year and it did not work out.
 

DJnVa

Dorito Dawg
SoSH Member
Dec 16, 2010
41,936
Seems like a nice guy, wish it worked out. BB did give him a few extra days to latch on somewhere.

What's this save us on cap?
 

Super Nomario

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 5, 2000
12,870
Mansfield MA
Man, I wouldn't have been surprised by this at the start of the offseason, but I'm surprised given they added no veteran pass- catchers. Shows what I know. In Bill we trust but he is on a lousy streak with skill players.

Gunner? They went with Edelman/Amendola in 3 WR package for awhile so they don't seem to have a problem with going with essentially 2 slot guys.
Not for the most part. Amendola would get like 250 yards when Edelman was healthy.
 

RoDaddy

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jun 19, 2002
2,468
Albany area, NY
Someone (Reiss?) said he showed absolutely no separation this summer. Plus he's slow, as is Harry, an aging Edelman, and especially Jacobi Meyers if he makes the team. And expensive. Lot's of reasons to cut his ass

Throw in our unproven TEs and receiving could be real shitty this year
 

AlNipper49

Huge Member
Dope
Apr 3, 2001
40,737
Mtigawi
I have a business coach who continually tells me that I shouldn’t be judged on my bad decisions, everyone makes them, but how I recover from them. ‘Failing fast’ is something that he continually tells me is the better indicator of a good decision maker. I suppose this is one of those cases.
 

NomarsFool

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 21, 2001
4,236
So, the Patriots had more information on Sanu than any of us, and still didn't draft any WR in what was regarded as a loaded WR class?
 

Seels

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2005
3,391
NH
So, the Patriots had more information on Sanu than any of us, and still didn't draft any WR in what was regarded as a loaded WR class?
It's fine they got a 30 year old safety who looked way bigger than the kids at Fitchburg State
 

RGREELEY33

Potty Mouth
SoSH Member
Nov 28, 2005
4,318
Orange County, CA
I hate the outcome of this trade, but love the ability for this team to move on when they know they screwed up. No reason to keep him on the roster as a redundant 4th WR at $6.5 million, and BB and Caserio could care less what we think. You have to admire that about this organization.

Now, let's get ready for some SMASHMOUTH football.
 
Apr 24, 2019
528
Sanu, according to multiple reports, was slow in camp and couldn’t get much separation. Jeff Thomas has barely played at all. He’s fun to think about, and will almost certainly land a spot on the ps, barring a tremendously dynamic next week and a half, but, from what I’ve heard, he’s shown next to nothing. Jules, Harry, Gunner, Byrd, Ross/Meyers if he gets healthy FAST. Not exactly inspiring, but I’m nevertheless excited to see what’s what.
 

SMU_Sox

loves his fluffykins
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2009
6,666
Dallas
It's fine they got a 30 year old safety who looked way bigger than the kids at Fitchburg State
Not just replying to you. But a few things. First off I feel you. Re Dugger: 1) He was someone who really took off in the meeting rooms and at the senior bowl. His tape was good for a non FBS program but had some glaring issues. He was always a bit of a risk as a prospect. But he’s only 24 and age doesn’t matter if you’re a 6’2” 220 pound safety who can run a 4.5 flat. He’s also explosive. He’s in the top 10% of athletes at his position. Even if he’s maxed out he is an adonis and body beautiful so it doesn’t matter. Age might impact the tail end of his second contract if he gets there. If he doesn’t get there it won’t be his age that was the road block. It’s not a big deal imo.

2) man I really feel you on not taking a WR in this class. I was in love with the WRs in this class. 8 of my top 32 guys were WRs and 9/40. I think because they had 3 rookie WRs on the roster they didn’t take one this year. Now does that make sense given that two of them were UDFA’s and one was a DB convert and all three of them are better as either slots or flankers? Nooooooooooooo. But also yes, because they had other needs and wanted their year 2 guys to step up. Plus they did invest 32 into Harry. That’s not chump change even if they use him in his least effective way.

3) They don’t draft for short term need? Respectfully I think y’all are wrong there. They were barren at TE and drafted 2 guys. 2 perfect fits too. It wasn’t just Brand_Name, SuperNomario, and I who liked them. Phil Perry of NBC sports Boston specifically picked them too as the ideal double dip. Evan Lazar liked them too. I think it’s fair to say that those of us who like to be armchair drafters were keyed in on Asiasi and Keene for the Pats. Tight end was a massive need. Another massive need was ILB/OLB because KVN and Collins left and they drafted their like identical replacements in Jennings and Uche. And as for Dugger - we all know how important safety is for BB and in particular the Chung role. Chung is aging and is losing a step. His role takes at least 1-2 years to get comfortable in so they took Dugger. Dugger and JJW in a big nickel package? If they hit that would be a sick combination given their size. Also if they hit it would hopefully crush the SSS “BB can’t draft a DB in the 2nd round” BS narrative.

Edit: you can nitpick if you want on if Uche and Jennings are identical replacements - but they are about as close as you could get in this draft.