Penn State AD and Sandusky Charged

JohntheBaptist

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He's wandered with Alice into Wonderland.
My thoughts exactly. That he thinks anyone wants to talk about Nebraska right now is just insane. That he'd even suggest it.

He needs to go today, but that NYT article gave me the impression that the Board is trying to find a way to do it without embarrassing him, which is just furthering this completely vomitous charade. Fuck all of them.
 

Al Zarilla

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Penn State will end up naming Galen Hall interim coach. Whole staff is gone at the end of the season.

They could cancel the season but there's a lot of TV money involved. Seems like a lot of fans aren't coming to Saturday's game. Home attendance was already down a few thousand due to people who stopped coming because they wanted Joe gone so badly.
Same kind of thing happened at FSU with Bobby Bowden, although I don't know if attendance was down, and there certainly wasn't a terrible scandal.
 

canderson

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Tom Corbett (PA's governor) is meeting with Penn State's entire board Friday (well I guess they could move it up, but it's set for Friday) in a special-called meeting.

I'd guess that's when all this gets sorted.

Edit: Spelling the governor's name correctly is a good idea.
 

8slim

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My thoughts exactly. That he thinks anyone wants to talk about Nebraska right now is just insane. That he'd even suggest it.

He needs to go today, but that NYT article gave me the impression that the Board is trying to find a way to do it without embarrassing him, which is just furthering this completely vomitous charade. Fuck all of them.

Thank you. JoePa does not deserve a graceful exit. He ignored child rape.
 

Tyrone Biggums

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Thank you. JoePa does not deserve a graceful exit. He ignored child rape.
Sure looks like it, again we don't know the whole story but that is the way it looks right now. I don't think they'll get any sanctions brought against them and I doubt this makes more than one or two change their commitments, however the schools legacy is tarnished forever. Paterno had an opportunity to make more of an impact than any national title, and he failed.
 

Kremlin Watcher

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The PSU Board of Trustees has over 30 members. That's too big a group to take rapid and decisive action. Someone has to take control or this will be a disaster.
 

mascho

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Matt Millen just broke down in a live interview on Sportscenter. He was all over the place in his remarks: saying we have to let the process play out, then choking up, then practically calling for vigilante justice. Seemed like he just can't process it all and doesn't know what to say.

NY Times now reporting that PSU is planning Paterno's exit. I agree with others that he has coached his last game.

Edit- Typo
Yeah, I just caught a replay of Millen's interview on Sportscenter. Emotions run the gamut from "let the investigation play out" to "I'd take matters into my own hands, that is the way I am."

Tough to watch. This story is just disgusting and the University has to hold everyone accountable. Paterno simply cannot be in the coaches' box Saturday.
 

Mr Weebles

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The Times article confirms what I heard this morning. The Board of Trustees voted Paterno out, he was asked to resign and refused.
Seriously?

His program has been covering up kid-fucking and he refuses to resign?

What a bag of shit.
 

Marciano490

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A carefully drafted denial about what "the very specific actions" means. I'm sure there was a detail or two that McQueady left out. But that doesn't mean Paterno didn't know the essential truth. More than a vague statement by McQueady about "inappropriate" conduct. Do we believe Paterno didn't follow up about "what are you talking about?"

The Grand Jury report actually states otherwise.
Exactly. I don't get this line of defense - I knew he was showering with a ten year old boy, but I didn't know the exact actions?

Is Penn St. strictly a state school? I thought it was quasi-private, or is that Pitt?
 

mikeford

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Kim Jones is going IN on Penn State on Francesa's show right now w/r/t him still being around the campus up to a week ago AND that members of the football faculty appeared to try to ignore him or "did not have time for him".
 

canderson

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Is Penn St. strictly a state school? I thought it was quasi-private, or is that Pitt?
PA's universities are kind of fucked up (shocking!), but it is public yet not under direct control of the state. Wiki sums it up well:

Penn State is a "state-related" university, part of Pennsylvania's Commonwealth System of Higher Education. As such, although it receives funding from the Commonwealth and is connected to the state through its board of trustees, it is otherwise independent and not subject to the state's direct control.
 

loshjott

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Paterno's done, it's just a matter of when at this point: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/09/sports/ncaafootball/penn-state-said-to-be-planning-paternos-exit.html?_r=1
Good article that summarizes everything in a very pithy way. Those last few paragraphs were obviously in the can waiting for Paterno's obituary, which - in a sense - is what this is.
 

Average Reds

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PA's universities are kind of fucked up (shocking!), but it is public yet not under direct control of the state. Wiki sums it up well:
That's more related to the educational curriculum than the oversight of the University through the Board of Trustees. It's a state school in terms of oversight, and in a case like this, the Governor (who is a member) should be able to bend the Board of Trustees to his will.
 

HomeRunBaker

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I am surprised that the media is not talking more about the fact that Mike McQueary was a grad assistant in 2002 when he witnessed this terrible act. Nothing happens to Sandusky, and McQueary is made a full time staff member in 2003?
Or that the first known incident involving Sandusky and this type of behavior occurred in 1998 and he suddenly "retired" in 1999? Paterno's mistake was not completely disassociating Sandusky from Penn State University.
 

PC Drunken Friar

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Yeah, I just caught a replay of Millen's interview on Sportscenter. Emotions run the gamut from "let the investigation play out" to "I'd take matters into my own hands, that is the way I am."

Tough to watch. This story is just disgusting and the University has to hold everyone accountable. Paterno simply cannot be in the coaches' box Saturday.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tz1GlYKqAI8
 

Sprowl

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As the buck got passed up the Penn State food chain, like a game of telephone, the charges got softer and vaguer. McQueary, the graduate assistant, reported separately to Paterno (the morning after) and to Curley and Schultz (ten days later). Paterno reported to Curley that the graduate assistant reported Sandusky "fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a young boy."

The Grand Jury "found the graduate assistant's testimony to be extremely credible" that McQueary was explicit about reporting anal rape to Curley and Schultz, both of whom denied hearing about anything more than "inappropriate conduct." It was a meeting of three people, two of whom downplay the information as "not that serious." Curley denied hearing about "sexual conduct" "of any kind," and said "Absolutely not" when asked if the graduate assistant had reported anal sex. Curley and Schultz then report to Spanier, who says that it was not reported as sexual, but merely "horsing around."

The Grand Jury believed McQueary, and did not believe Curley or Schultz about what was reported at the meeting. There must be independent confirmation about what McQueary told Curley and Schultz.
 

canderson

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Jones said Paterno had a team meeting, and he told players he didn't know anything about Sandysky and this is all a surprise to him.

She also said McQueary told players he didn't think he'd be around for the weekend.

Paterno sounds dilusional, no?
 

soPhisHticated

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I always thought this was going to be Paterno's last season, I would have never expected this.

I've heard that the reason why the press conference was hastily cancelled was that JoePa was planning to resign, but Penn State officials called it off because they want to plan the transition and manage messaging. They may be afraid of what JoePa will say.

There's a rumor going around State College that Scott Paterno is trying to arrange an off-campus press conference for his father to speak to the press soon.
 

natpastime162

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Jones said Paterno had a team meeting, and he told players he didn't know anything about Sandysky and this is all a surprise to him.

She also said McQueary told players he didn't think he'd be around for the weekend.

Paterno sounds dilusional, no?
Which is why I would like to hear from Paterno. Screw the game and ask Paterno why he wasn't as disraught, hurt, and angry like many of the recent posters in this thread.
 

JimBoSox9

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Why isn't Mike McQueary (the GA) getting more heat? He SAW it, then still, til last week saw Sandusky around the campus and didn't do anything about it.
While McQueary failed on a basic human level, I do find it easier to understand what happened with him than with the others involved. Think about the cult of personality that even the average college football builds, and then add that this is JOE PATERNO, a man elevated to sainthood in State College. Between playing for him and working for him, McQueary has worshiped at the altar of JoePa for 10 years. Add on to that, he also likely had a lot of respect for Sandusky, and knew how close Sandusky and Paterno were. I can understand why, when faced with something horrific that must have shattered his reality, he didn't take matters into his own hands. Crawling into his head - he went to who he thought was the wisest and most powerful man in this situation, told him everything, and when nothing came of it, trusted that the right decision had been made.

I hope McQueary understands his level of action was woefully inadequate, he deserves a ton of blame and no forgiveness, but I can also sympathize with the pressures and fears a lowly graduate assistant must have had in a situation that involved Paterno and Sandusky like this.
 

berniecarbo1

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While McQueary failed on a basic human level, I do find it easier to understand what happened with him than with the others involved. Think about the cult of personality that even the average college football builds, and then add that this is JOE PATERNO, a man elevated to sainthood in State College. Between playing for him and working for him, McQueary has worshiped at the altar of JoePa for 10 years. Add on to that, he also likely had a lot of respect for Sandusky, and knew how close Sandusky and Paterno were. I can understand why, when faced with something horrific that must have shattered his reality, he didn't take matters into his own hands. Crawling into his head - he went to who he thought was the wisest and most powerful man in this situation, told him everything, and when nothing came of it, trusted that the right decision had been made.

I hope McQueary understands his level of action was woefully inadequate, he deserves a ton of blame and no forgiveness, but I can also sympathize with the pressures and fears a lowly graduate assistant must have had in a situation that involved Paterno and Sandusky like this.

Agree with everything you say except, I empathize, I do not sympathize. There is a big difference. Here is Matt Millen's interview on ESPN. When your hero's fall, it is like someone tears your heart out. It is like when you realize your parents are human and make mistakes. Your innocence is shattered. That is what you are seeing with Matt Millen.

http://espn.go.com/v...egoryid=2564308
 

DLew On Roids

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Imagine the sounds that 10-YO boy was probably making, and then imagine what kind of man could hear it and not rip the perpetrator apart limb by limb. Fuck Mike McCreary.
 

SumnerH

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Exactly. I don't get this line of defense - I knew he was showering with a ten year old boy, but I didn't know the exact actions?

Is Penn St. strictly a state school? I thought it was quasi-private, or is that Pitt?
Others have answered, but I'll point out that the University of Pennsylvania is a private (Ivy league) university, which sometimes confuses people because of the name.
 

SaveBooFerriss

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I still can't get past "What the fuck was a 50 year old man doing in a shower with a 10 year old boy?"

Even if there isn't clarity about what happened in the shower, that is enough for me to report Sandusky to authorities and ban him from Penn State.
 

drtooth

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The cancelling of Paterno's PC sounds to me like Spanier is trying to save his own hide and cover his ass. Paterno may have knowledge of the depth of Spanier's involvement in this scandel and Spanier is trying to save himself.
 

JBill

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A piece from Grantland's Michael Weinreb, who grew up in State College and knew many of the main characters in this nightmare. Pretty moving.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7205085/growing-penn-state
 

bowiac

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For me, it's also that McQueary is sort of a nobody in all this. There's no outrage with McQueary because he's not known as St. Mike, and because he wasn't employed in any sort of management capacity at the time.

With JoePa - it's a "don't piss on me and tell me it's raining" situation.
 

jacklamabe65

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Things are accelerating. I agree with those who are speculating that Paterno has probably coached his last game.
With the winningest record in Division 1 history, thanks to the win a few weeks ago. If they actually waited to for justice to be served until ol' Joe won his big game - well, that's beyond criminal with this monster still running around free.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Imagine the sounds that 10-YO boy was probably making, and then imagine what kind of man could hear it and not rip the perpetrator apart limb by limb. Fuck Mike McCreary.
Instead, he parlayed this knowledge into a full-time assistant coaching gig under Paterno for nearly a decade. Well played fucker!
 

JBill

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The GA/coach must see Sandusky around all the time. There was a closed practice in 2007 where Sandusky was present and brought a child with him, as Francesa mentioned. He not only had to walk away from that child when the rape was happening, but for all these years afterwards he's been around the perp and done nothing to protect other victims. How do you do that? Do you pretend it never happened, do you lie to yourself?
 

Marciano490

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The GA/coach must see Sandusky around all the time. There was a closed practice in 2007 where Sandusky was present and brought a child with him, as Francesa mentioned. He not only had to walk away from that child when the rape was happening, but for all these years afterwards he's been around the perp and done nothing to protect other victims. How do you do that? Do you pretend it never happened, do you lie to yourself?
Gingers have no souls.
 

Average Reds

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With the winningest record in Division 1 history, thanks to the win a few weeks ago. If they actually waited to for justice to be served until ol' Joe won his big game - well, that's beyond criminal with this monster still running around free.
This is silly. Paterno had the Division I record for some time. The "record" he set recently was to pass Eddie Robinson of Grambling which I believe was a Division II school until they moved to Division I-AA when that classification was created in 1978.

There is no way the Grand Jury report and the indictment were held to allow him to break a record he already held. More to the point, there are plenty of places to focus our outrage without creating phantom issues like this.
 

Saturnian

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As a Penn State alum, I don't know if I could imagine a more disappointing, depressing story. I apologize in advance for what is sure to be a rambling, disjointed post.

While there have been some solid seasons lately, it's been easy to lean on the "Penn State does things the right way!" crutch as a means of
rationalizing the programs fall from national prominence. Similar to the "The Yankees outspend all other teams but $50 million each year,and have a roster littered with steroid abusers!" crutch in a lot of ways. In both cases, I knew on some level that the truth was not so pretty. It was unlikely that the Sox were fielding a team of 25 guys that were just really big fans of whey protein. And my honest opinion on the PSU football program was more "I hope JoePa retires before losing control of the program like Bowden did, thus tainting his legacy" than "Joe Pa is a paragon of virtue, and a shining example of how to run a clean program". The way the steroid story played out was such that I was prepared for the inevitable leak implicating somebody on the Red Sox. The Sandusky story is so out of left field, and far worse than any previous scandal (Tressel knowing about, yet not divulging information about free tattoos? RichRod holding more practices than allowed by the NCAA? The horror!?!), that there is no way to wrap my head around it. It just makes no sense that anyone could sit on a story like this for 15 minutes. I hadn't read about the investigation, but it's been going on for two years. This was never going to end well, but how was taking no action the best way to do things? How do you let Sandusky within 10 miles of campus? How did anyone look him in the face? I find myself once again, hoping against hope, trying to find a whisper of a hint of a reason why this isn't as bad as it sounds, that somehow no one really knew what this cretin was doing. I know better than to hold my breath waiting for that explanation.
 
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With the winningest record in Division 1 history, thanks to the win a few weeks ago. If they actually waited to for justice to be served until ol' Joe won his big game - well, that's beyond criminal with this monster still running around free.
I'm sure that factored into it somehow. How many schools could this kind of thing happen at, being allowed to continue and covered up for over a decade? Complete cronies.

As for McQueary, I think there's a number of reasons for the lack of vitriol directed towards him. I'm not entirely sure on how this story came along from the beginning, but he seems to be one of the few people involved who didn't stonewall or outright lie to the grand jury, and he deserves some credit for that. I can see some sympathy for his original situation, too -- he was an ex-player who probably revered Penn State, Paterno, and Sandusky, so to witness something like that it is easy to understand why he wasn't sure about what to do. What would you do if you saw your father raping some random 10 year old?

So for him to call his father and talk to Paterno personally the next morning, I can somewhat understand that. He still probably should have stopped what was going on while it was happening, or he could have at least made his presence known so that the assault ended. After that, though, what the hell was he thinking? He reported it to Paterno, and then Sandusky stayed around, and McQueary himself apparently got a promotion. Why would you even want to be a part of that with Sandusky still around? How could you ever talk to that guy again without wondering if he's raping kids off-campus? The promotion makes it even worse, since it makes you wonder if the way he handled it was to help his own career, which is just sickening. That doesn't seem to be the case, since at his meeting with Paterno he was "obviously distraught", but it doesn't excuse keeping quiet about it for so long.

The fact that McQueary was not only almost immediately promoted but also stayed on as an assistant with the team for so long while Sandusky was still around is just so egregiously wrong. It's like everyone he talked to -- all of his father-figures, authoritative coaches he probably grew up idolizing -- told him, "don't worry about it, it wasn't that bad", or "it's not a big deal" or "it happens all the time, just forget about it". Including Paterno. I mean really, how can McQ come to him "obviously distraught" about alleged sexual abuse and Joe Pa not even clarifying what he's talking about or finding out how serious it was? He was either told by McQueary or he knew without having to ask and stuck his head in the sand for plausible deniability. Either of which is completely reprehensible considering the consequences.

Everyone involved just looks so bad from all of this, and everyone they deal with just looks worse. I hope Paterno does hold his own press conference to talk about it, because it seems like he's either completely out of touch with reality about the whole situation, or that the administrators above him are trying to hush him up because he might say something about them.
 

HomeBrew1901

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What would you do if you saw your father raping some random 10 year old?
Yell at him to get him to stop and call the fucking cops and stay with the kid until the cops got there. Not too fucking hard of a decision to make, I don't care who it involves.

All of this, Oh how McQueary must of felt stuff, is absolute bullshit. McQueary is just as guilty as Paterno and the rest of the fucks that covered this up.

Edit: Spelling

Edit 2: probably should ahve read the whole post, my eyes saw red when you posted what I quoted and snapped. Good post afterward.
 

ngruz25

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Not condoning his actions, especially in the years following the incident, but I'm guessing he was in a state of shock from witnessing the rape of a child. I wouldn't expect him to act rationally immediately after a trauma like that.
 

JohntheBaptist

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What would you do if you saw your father raping some random 10 year old?

If I saw my father raping a 10 year old boy I'd beat him within an inch of his life. Arguably worse than I would a stranger.

And yeah, secure the safety of the kid. I can't stop thinking of that--the kid is getting raped, sees potential help arrive and then disappear, only to be left to survive more of it with no one else to help him.