Penn State AD and Sandusky Charged

singaporesoxfan

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I found another article yesterday on the dissapearance of the DA; evidently he had just announced the breaking up of a large heroin ring. A DA in Maryland prosecuting the same ring had a similar fate.

http://www.yardbird.com/midnight_ride_another_missing_PA_prosecutor_2.htm
Man, I don't know anything about how credible that article is but together with this scandal it doesn't make the regional police look good.
 

Steve Dillard

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I found another article yesterday on the dissapearance of the DA; evidently he had just announced the breaking up of a large heroin ring. A DA in Maryland prosecuting the same ring had a similar fate.

http://www.yardbird.com/midnight_ride_another_missing_PA_prosecutor_2.htm
That article was written before this was known:
In April 2009 Bellefonte police revealed that before his disappearance, Gricar used his home computer to perform internet searches on topics such as "how to wreck a hard drive", "how to fry a hard drive", and "water damage to a notebook computer"
Also, his brother had killed himself by jumping off a bridge. Sounds like a man with a guilty conscience about something on his laptop hard drive that he didn't want anyone else to find.

I wonder if the Sandusky investigation hit too close to home.
 

Montana Fan

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No doubt, Joe Pa knew and helped cover up these crimes. Horrible, horrible bastard. There is no excuse for turning a blind eye to abuse. He knew about '98 and he knew about '02 and he let it pass. I hope they chew him up and spit him out today.
 

canderson

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Today's Harrisburg Patriot-News' front page is nothing but an editorial. No photos, no other stories.

It asks for the president to resign immediately and Paterno to not br allowed to coach/retire after this season.

http://webmedia.newseum.org/newseum-multimedia/dfp/jpg8/lg/PA_PN.jpg
 

dcmissle

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I'm inclined to think he'll try to hang on like Pres Nixon when everyone knows the outcome is inevitable -- unless, of course, Joe Pa has J. Edgar Hoover quality blackmail material on someone up the food chain.

But as a practical matter, he's done one way or another. It's not as if the program is on an elite level nationally as it is. Star recruits may be too embarrassed to sign up. It's going to be used in a brutal fashion against PA State when the coaches meet with parents in their living rooms, and that's probably just in these circumstances.

The bottom line is they flushed human lives to protect a football program. Not as bad as a runaway child who is killed in a snuff film, but the same mentality -- these boys and the ones who almost certainly will meet the same fate (cause Sandusky remains on the loose) are expendable. Yep -- it's that ugly.
 

soxfan121

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Deadspin's Emma Carmichael interviewed the co-author of Sandusky's biography Touched.

We talked to Richeal, who was born with a condition called hip dysplasia and has been disabled his entire life, after noticing this anecdote in the introduction he'd written for the book (former NFL coach Dick Vermeil wrote the foreword):

My first real contact with Jerry Sandusky came from a rather odd question he posed to me: "How much do you weigh, young man?" I was puzzled, because I knew he wasn't interested in me as a linebacker, but I told him I weighed about 95 pounds. "Get up on that scale," he ordered. I did and the locker room scale topped out at 96.

"Not bad," Jerry said, trying to sound as mean as possible, "but you still have some work to do." Sensing my confusion, Jerry stared at me and continued. "We gotta get you up to 100 pounds before you're ready to fight me."

Fight him? I barely knew him. "When you get to 100 pounds, it's gonna be you and me in the center of the locker room in a boxing match. Then I'll show you who the real boss is. It'll be you and me eyeball-to-belly button."
When Richeal was a senior at Penn State, he finally hit 101 on the scale. He writes that once the weight had been read out to a crowded locker room, the players cheered and he and Sandusky met at the center of the room. They staged a bout—"eyeball-to-belly button"—and Richeal leveled him with "a swift (and well-rehearsed) right hook."

Richeal, now 51, said repeatedly that he had never witnessed Sandusky act inappropriately with players or with young men from Second Mile. He said the "boxing" incident wasn't anything out of the ordinary because "you don't think like that.

"Now, you know, I'd be kind of uncomfortable," he allowed, "but I had no reason to be then. It was just a running gag because I weighed under 100 pounds. He'd say, you know, 'We gotta put some meat on those bones.'"

"I want to believe it's not true," Richeal said of the allegations against his friend and co-author. "I'm not an accuser or a judge, so I'll have to sit back and let it all play out. The person I knew, I never ever saw anything like that. I saw him with Second Mile kids many times—at his home, at the stadium for game days, at practices. And it was never anything like that. He never did that around me."

He added: "But I wasn't a little kid."
 

Jnai

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This really doesn't apply to witnessing a 10-year old being raped. That's pretty clearly rape. A 10-year old cannot consent to this kind of activity. If someone witnesses this kind of activity, their obligation is to immediately contact the police, isn't it? Fleeing the scene and waiting until tomorrow to tell your boss isn't the way to deal with this.
Easy to say and harder to do. It's not like calling the cops when you see some random guy stab some other random guy. There are no personal implications when you do that.

This was probably like something out of The Shining for this guy. He saw something completely fucked up that he had no intention of ever seeing. He was obviously distressed. He went home and immediately told the most important figure in his life (his dad), who apparently advised him to go talk to the other most important figure in his life (his football coach, mentor, boss, and someone who could immediately deal with the problem).

Obviously it would have been much easier for everyone if this kid just went to the cops. But I just feel like this is one of those classic Fundamental Attribution Error scenarios.
 

Dehere

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I saw Francesa's show today and he was nailing it. One of his best performances I've ever seen from him. Not only that but Kim Jones - a Penn State grad - was even better. Honestly she doesn an incredible job and she should be co-hosting
Although this is tangential I have to say I agree 100%. Career high for Francesa. Kim Jones, who is phenomenal, looked at times on YES like she might cry. I think Kim will be relentless at Paterno's press conference today, and Francesa's show is must-listen for anyone in FAN's radius.
 

Sille Skrub

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Today's Harrisburg Patriot-News' front page is nothing but an editorial. No photos, no other stories.

It asks for the president to resign immediately and Paterno to not br allowed to coach/retire after this season.

http://webmedia.newseum.org/newseum-multimedia/dfp/jpg8/lg/PA_PN.jpg
This was really well done except for the part about Paterno staying on for the rest of the year.

This is one of the most horrific stories I have ever read. It is simply unfathomable to me that this happened and that it has taken so long for anything to be done about it.

Penn State should fire everyone who knew anything about this on every level. I've long admired Joe Paterno, but he let everyone down here and should resign immediately.

Ultimately, Paterno's legacy will not be about what he did, but what he failed to do.
 

SouthPaw21

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I am surprised that the media is not talking more about the fact that Mike McQueary was a grad assistant in 2002 when he witnessed this terrible act. Nothing happens to Sandusky, and McQueary is made a full time staff member in 2003?
 

loshjott

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This was really well done except for the part about Paterno staying on for the rest of the year.

This is one of the most horrific stories I have ever read. It is simply unfathomable to me that this happened and that it has taken so long for anything to be done about it.

Penn State should fire everyone who knew anything about this on every level. I've long admired Joe Paterno, but he let everyone down here and should resign immediately.

Ultimately, Paterno's legacy will not be about what he did, but what he failed to do.
I agree with all this but who will fire Paterno? The University President already issued a statement saying he fully supports the two guys who just lost their jobs over this. Does anyone on the board of trustees have the cojones to put pressure on the president or to fire Paterno themselves? Do they even have that authority? Seems like nobody in charge has the will to do anything other than stonewall.
 

canderson

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The problem is Paterno could only be fired by the governor himself; Spainer has tried to get Paterno to step down at least three times and each time Paterno told him to pound sand.

He truly runs Penn State. He answers to no one except perhaps the governor.
 

Shelterdog

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I'm not closely following the story but is there any reporting suggesting that Sandusky got pushed out of Penn State in the late 90s because of allegations of this sort?
 
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Easy to say and harder to do. It's not like calling the cops when you see some random guy stab some other random guy. There are no personal implications when you do that.

This was probably like something out of The Shining for this guy. He saw something completely fucked up that he had no intention of ever seeing. He was obviously distressed. He went home and immediately told the most important figure in his life (his dad), who apparently advised him to go talk to the other most important figure in his life (his football coach, mentor, boss, and someone who could immediately deal with the problem).

Obviously it would have been much easier for everyone if this kid just went to the cops. But I just feel like this is one of those classic Fundamental Attribution Error scenarios.
A couple things: first of all, you're equating a date rape to what the grad assistant says he saw in the showers. There's no "gray area" when an adult is performing sexual acts of any kind on a minor. There just isn't.

You keep coming back to "personal implications." As if, there is a righteous and justified reason -- these so-called personal implications, by which it sounds like you mean his job, his connections at the school, his social life and standing in the community -- to neither stop the crime as it is happening without regard to how it may affect him personally nor to bring the information to police and whoever else has the ability to take punitive action against Sandusky. Now the grad assistant did go to Paterno, which is a reasonable step considering that Paterno has control over who works for him and is arguably the most powerful guy in that entire town. The problem is he didn't also go to law enforcement, which has the professional ability to investigate and the legal obligation to assess what happened and/or stop it. It sounds like the father might have talked him out of going to the cops in an effort to keep his son's name out of things (in case it got turned on him as a snitch) and a misplaced belief that Paterno would care about what his underlings were doing and would disassociate himself from guys like Sandusky.

 

Average Reds

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I agree with all this but who will fire Paterno? The University President already issued a statement saying he fully supports the two guys who just lost their jobs over this. Does anyone on the board of trustees have the cojones to put pressure on the president or to fire Paterno themselves? Do they even have that authority? Seems like nobody in charge has the will to do anything other than stonewall.
I have now read the Grand Jury Report. Anyone who is uncertain about what Penn State should do next should read it. It helps to clarify the mind.

If the Board of Trustees had any integrity, they would have demanded resignations from the President and Paterno as part of the Sunday night meeting. They may yet do so, but it's becoming clear that this must happen. I cannot see Paterno coaching another game under any circumstances. I know that this is his intention, but it's bizarre in the extreme for him to think that it's an appropriate move.

What most infuriates me is that this isn't new news to the people involved. All the key players at PSU have known for some time that this was coming, and they could have avoided much of the damage to their institution if at minimum, they had not allowed Paterno to come back this year. The fact that no changes had been discussed or enacted is almost the textbook definition of depraved indifference - not as a legal charge, but as a practical fact of life.
 

Average Reds

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I'm not closely following the story but is there any reporting suggesting that Sandusky got pushed out of Penn State in the late 90s because of allegations of this sort?
This has not been confirmed to my knowledge, but after reading the Grand Jury report, it's hard not to believe this was the reason for his resignation
 

Marciano490

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A couple things: first of all, you're equating a date rape to what the grad assistant says he saw in the showers. There's no "gray area" when an adult is performing sexual acts of any kind on a minor. There just isn't.

You keep coming back to "personal implications." As if, there is a righteous and justified reason -- these so-called personal implications, by which it sounds like you mean his job, his connections at the school, his social life and standing in the community -- to neither stop the crime as it is happening without regard to how it may affect him personally nor to bring the information to police and whoever else has the ability to take punitive action against Sandusky. Now the grad assistant did go to Paterno, which is a reasonable step considering that Paterno has control over who works for him and is arguably the most powerful guy in that entire town. The problem is he didn't also go to law enforcement, which has the professional ability to investigate and the legal obligation to assess what happened and/or stop it. It sounds like the father might have talked him out of going to the cops in an effort to keep his son's name out of things (in case it got turned on him as a snitch) and a misplaced belief that Paterno would care about what his underlings were doing and would disassociate himself from guys like Sandusky.
F*ck that. You're a 28-year-old former D1 athlete and you walk in on a ten-year-old being raped by someone you know, and you scurry off into an office? That's despicable, far more so than anything Paterno did. He couldn't even scream stop, much less break up the rape? It's not like he was passing a dark alley in NYC and stumbled open a woman being raped at gunpoint. What danger was this guy in from a 60 year old man? When I first read the grand jury report, I assumed the grad student was some 140 pounder who was in charge of picking up towels.
 

The Napkin

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this is awful. I hope they all burn.
And I can't wait to see my holier than thou PSU/JoePa cult family members. Fuck JoePa and his self righteous/pious act. He's evil and I look forward to his downfall.
 

RG33

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No doubt, Joe Pa knew and helped cover up these crimes. Horrible, horrible bastard. There is no excuse for turning a blind eye to abuse. He knew about '98 and he knew about '02 and he let it pass. I hope they chew him up and spit him out today.
There actually is doubt. You, nor anybody at this point, know what he knew or didn't know. I could care less about PSU and JoePa, but let's let things play out here. Clearly, at the very least, JoePa will be gone from coaching - but saying that there's no doubt he knew of crimes and covered up crimes is a bit reactionary. From the articles that have been written, and the indictment itself, there clearly are questions on what specifically told to JoePa and others - so, there is doubt.
 
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F*ck that. You're a 28-year-old former D1 athlete and you walk in on a ten-year-old being raped by someone you know, and you scurry off into an office? That's despicable, far more so than anything Paterno did. He couldn't even scream stop, much less break up the rape? It's not like he was passing a dark alley in NYC and stumbled open a woman being raped at gunpoint. What danger was this guy in from a 60 year old man? When I first read the grand jury report, I assumed the grad student was some 140 pounder who was in charge of picking up towels.
Did you even read what I wrote? I am not defending the grad assistant's actions at all. I think the appropriate response should have been to beat the guy's head in the moment he saw this going on -- not walk away and think about it and consult his dad and then get around to reporting it to a football coach. In fact, I am questioning Jnai's equivocation that this was similar to sexual contact between adults where it's not always clear whether a crime occurred when viewing it from afar (it's not) and the seeming validity he finds in the grad assistant's decision to not go to the cops because of the fallout this guy might have experienced personally if he was known as the snitch that got Sandusky in trouble.
 

Montana Fan

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Dude, McCreary didn't go to JoPa's house and tell him Sandusky was wrestling with a kid in the shower.

Look, my mom went to PSU and I've always been a fan. There's only one reason this has all been swept under the rug for years. Because JoPa covered for his friend.
 

mikeford

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What time is this Paterno press conference supposed to happen today? I have a hard time believing the media is going to just sit there and ask questions about football.
 

Marciano490

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Did you even read what I wrote? I am not defending the grad assistant's actions at all. I think the appropriate response should have been to beat the guy's head in the moment he saw this going on -- not walk away and think about it and consult his dad and then get around to reporting it to a football coach. In fact, I am questioning Jnai's equivocation that this was similar to sexual contact between adults where it's not always clear whether a crime occurred when viewing it from afar (it's not) and the seeming validity he finds in the grad assistant's decision to not go to the cops because of the fallout this guy might have experienced personally if he was known as the snitch that got Sandusky in trouble.
Yeah, I was agreeing wholeheartedly. The f*ck that was in reference to the grad assistant's actions and Jnai's equivocation; sorry, should've been clearer - but I thought when I basically parroted your points it was obvious I was agreeing with you.
 

RG33

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What time is this Paterno press conference supposed to happen today? I have a hard time believing the media is going to just sit there and ask questions about football.
If there is ONE question about football, I would be stunned.
 

InstantKarmma

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What time is this Paterno press conference supposed to happen today? I have a hard time believing the media is going to just sit there and ask questions about football.
12:30 ET.

You can watch it live here: http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/2011/11/8/2546876/watch-joe-paterno-press-conference-live-online-streaming-video

Edit: FTR, I hope every question is about this instead of the Nebraska game. Paterno is a piece of crap who deserves no respect at this point.
 

Mr Weebles

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12:30 ET.

You can watch it live here: http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/2011/11/8/2546876/watch-joe-paterno-press-conference-live-online-streaming-video

Edit: FTR, I hope every question is about this instead of the Nebraska game. Paterno is a piece of crap who deserves no respect at this point.
Penn State sent out a media email saying they would only be answering questions about the upcoming game during this press conference. No questions about Sandusky allowed.
 

Jnai

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You keep coming back to "personal implications." As if, there is a righteous and justified reason -- these so-called personal implications, by which it sounds like you mean his job, his connections at the school, his social life and standing in the community -- to neither stop the crime as it is happening without regard to how it may affect him personally nor to bring the information to police and whoever else has the ability to take punitive action against Sandusky. Now the grad assistant did go to Paterno, which is a reasonable step considering that Paterno has control over who works for him and is arguably the most powerful guy in that entire town. The problem is he didn't also go to law enforcement, which has the professional ability to investigate and the legal obligation to assess what happened and/or stop it. It sounds like the father might have talked him out of going to the cops in an effort to keep his son's name out of things (in case it got turned on him as a snitch) and a misplaced belief that Paterno would care about what his underlings were doing and would disassociate himself from guys like Sandusky.
First, let's be clear: The GA obviously did not act in the way that I hope any of us would in similar circumstances, which is to immediately go to the cops.

But, knowing that, I think it's fair to ask why. And, I think for the observer, this is a classic FAE problem, where it's easy to dismiss the enormous social and personal implications of being the one who goes to the cops with this information vs. being the guy who tells the most important person in the football program.

Does it excuse his actions? No. But I do think it explains them to some degree.

And I don't think this is a one-off response either. Why did none of the hundreds (thousands? more?) of people in the Catholic Church who knew about institutional sex crimes not go to the cops? Is it because they're all horrible, despicable, degenerate people?

I think the point is, it's easy to sit here and say, "If I was in a similar scenario, I would immediately beat the crap out of the guy and drag him down to the police station." And yet, when people (lots of people!) are in this scenario, they rarely do this. Why?
 

RG33

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Dude, McCreary didn't go to JoPa's house and tell him Sandusky was wrestling with a kid in the shower.

Look, my mom went to PSU and I've always been a fan. There's only one reason this has all been swept under the rug for years. Because JoPa covered for his friend.
We don't know what he told him. JoePa has said he was not given "specifics". The grand jury found him credible in his statements. All I am saying, is that there is still doubt what JoePa knew or didn't know, and to say that he is evil or part of the crimes is a stretch. And being that he reported his friend to his superiors, how is that covering for him? How did JoePa know that they wouldn't immediately get the cops involved. Obviously, in retrospect, it may turn out to have been morally reprehensible for JoePa to not call the cops himself - but we just dont know what was said or not said at this point.

Edit- iPad auto-corrects
 

mikeford

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First, let's be clear: The GA obviously did not act in the way that I hope any of us would in similar circumstances, which is to immediately go to the cops.
I quibble. I would hope any reasonable human being with a soul would put a stop to a child being raped and worry about the cops after the fact.
 

RG33

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I quibble. I would hope any reasonable human being with a soul would put a stop to a child being raped and worry about the cops after the fact.
This. The GA is the guy you have to question on how the fuck he didn't 1.) tackle the guy, 2.) scream at the guy, 3.) get the kid outta there, 4.) call 9-1-1, 5.) beat Sandusky's brains in with a tire iron.
 

canderson

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WHAT THE FUCK

#Sandusky Pres Spanier cancels weekly Paterno conference. Joe "disappointed" #patriotnews
https://mobile.twitter.com/#!/sganim/status/133945666903871488

She's the Harrisbyrg Patriot-News reporter they hired from the Centre Daily Times.l about 6 months ago. She has followed this case for more than a year.
 

Steve Dillard

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We don't know what he told him. JoePa has said he was not given "specifics". The grand jury found him credible in his statements. All I am saying, is that there is still doubt what JoePa knew or didn't know, and to say that he is evil or part of the crimes is a stretch. And being that he reported his friend to his superiors, how is that covering for him? How did JoePa know that they wouldn't immediately get the cops involved. Obviously, in retrospect, it may turn out to have been morally reprehensible for JoePa to not call the cops himself - but we just dont know what was said or not said at this point.

I was informed in 2002 by an assistant coach that he had witnessed an incident in the shower of our locker room facility. It was obvious that the witness was distraught over what he saw, but he at no time related to me the very specific actions contained in the Grand Jury report. Regardless, it was clear that the witness saw something inappropriate involving Mr. Sandusky.
A carefully drafted denial about what "the very specific actions" means. I'm sure there was a detail or two that McQueady left out. But that doesn't mean Paterno didn't know the essential truth. More than a vague statement by McQueady about "inappropriate" conduct. Do we believe Paterno didn't follow up about "what are you talking about?"

The Grand Jury report actually states otherwise.

Joseph V. Paterno testified to receiving the graduate assistant's report at his home on a
Saturday morning. Paterno testified that the graduate assistant was very upset. Paterno called
Tim Curley ("Curley"), Penn State Athletic Director and Paterno's immediate superior, to his
home the very next day, a Sunday, and reported to him that the graduate assistant had seen Jerry
Sandusky in the Lasch Building showers fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a
young boy.
 

canderson

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Paterno said he was looking forward to the opportunity to discuss concerns related to the scandal, as well as to talk about Saturday's game against Nebraska. The football players don't deserve having the press conference canceled, Paterno said.
http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2011/11/penn_state_football_press_conf.html
 

berniecarbo1

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Paterno press conference Canceled per Sportscenter.
They will sequester Joe Pa for the balance of the season. He will coach from the press box, not give interviews and let the Coordinators handle the the press. Then if by some disgusting fluke PSU should actually make it to the Big 10 CG in Indianapolis (right now they are in first place in thier division with Nebraska, Ohio State and Wisconsin left. If they win 2 of three they are in) then all hell in the Big 10 will break lose. Can you imaginie this cloud hanging over that game as the first CG for the league, on national TV. It would be a PR disaster. You know the league is praying this scandal distracts the team so that they tank the balance of the season. Joe Pa cannot come back to Happy Valley under any circumstances next year. And this will certainly taint him the rest of his life. He knew of "stuff" going on since 1998 and yet he allowed Sandusky to be around the PSU program up until last week??? How do you explain that?? Sorry, you can't. What a sad, sad ending to what I thought was a brilliant program. I guess nothing is what we think it is.
 

8slim

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I'm wondering how people can square the widely accepted viewpoint that for the past several decades JoePa for all intents and purposes "ran" Penn State... with the notion that he was unaware of the '98 incident, and wasn't aware of the full scope of the '02 incident.

It's simply inconceivable he didn't know exactly what was happening. And 1998 and 2002 JoePa was not 2011 JoePa -- he was still a sharp guy back then.

The PSU Board of Trustees needs to purge the entire athletic department and many other people in the administration. Yesterday.
 

mikeford

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Paterno's done, it's just a matter of when at this point: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/09/sports/ncaafootball/penn-state-said-to-be-planning-paternos-exit.html?_r=1
 

Dehere

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Matt Millen just broke down in a live interview on Sportscenter. He was all over the place in his remarks: saying we have to let the process play out, then choking up, then practically calling for vigilante justice. Seemed like he just can't process it all and doesn't know what to say.

NY Times now reporting that PSU is planning Paterno's exit. I agree with others that he has coached his last game.

Edit- Typo
 

terrynever

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Penn State will end up naming Galen Hall interim coach. Whole staff is gone at the end of the season.

They could cancel the season but there's a lot of TV money involved. Seems like a lot of fans aren't coming to Saturday's game. Home attendance was already down a few thousand due to people who stopped coming because they wanted Joe gone so badly.
 

dcmissle

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Paterno said he was looking forward to the opportunity to discuss concerns related to the scandal, as well as to talk about Saturday's game against Nebraska. The football players don't deserve having the press conference canceled, Paterno said.

He's wandered with Alice into Wonderland.

What the players deserve is his prompt resignation. He could materially improve this situation by doing exactly that.