Another Strat-O-Matic All Star! Course, we saw how well that worked with the other one...
Red Sox 2020 Roster Thread
- Thread starter DeadlySplitter
- Start date
This is marvelous. We really need descriptors for their roles on the staff.
the Red Sox optioned Mazza and Hall to get down to 28 players.
They also swapped outfielder Andreoli (released) for Seth Blair in the player pool. Blair is yet another dumpster dive pitching flyer.
They also swapped outfielder Andreoli (released) for Seth Blair in the player pool. Blair is yet another dumpster dive pitching flyer.
Not all that long ago, I'd have known nearly every player on the roster and have some idea of where they fit in and why.
In 2020, I don't recognize any of these names. Strange times.
Hey, somebody somewhere thought Covey could pitch. (1st round draft choice) Of course, they were wrong.
Nobody ever thought Weber could pitch, and that seems to be correct.
Congrats Chaim on finding a worse pitcher than Weber.
Covey has always been horrendous and always will be horrendous.
8 games in a row against NYY and Tampa coming up soon, so maybe this is a subtle way of aiming for the #1 draft pick.
Covey has always been horrendous and always will be horrendous.
8 games in a row against NYY and Tampa coming up soon, so maybe this is a subtle way of aiming for the #1 draft pick.
It blows my mind that Weber managed to pitch to a sub-5.50 era over 40 major league innings last year.
Stock has been swapped out for Hart.
Additionally, a waiver claim was made for a non-pitcher for once: Christian Arroyo, so far a failed prospect that the Rays (surprise!) got in the Longoria trade.
View: https://twitter.com/RedSox/status/1294006024777666561
Additionally, a waiver claim was made for a non-pitcher for once: Christian Arroyo, so far a failed prospect that the Rays (surprise!) got in the Longoria trade.
View: https://twitter.com/RedSox/status/1294006024777666561
Arroyo might be a bit of a post-prospect. He's had 71 games in the majors for the Giants, Rays, and Indians , and it's been pretty rough: .622 OPS. But he crushed AAA in a few stints, both as a River Cat and Bull, and he's only 25. He was a 25th overall pick with the Giants, he made a few top 100 lists, and he was the biggest prospect piece in the Longoria trade.
I like it a lot.
I like it a lot.
Giants fans had high hopes for him when he came up in 2017. He can play 2b, SS and 3b.
Unfortunately, all of his stats scream AAAA -- he rakes at AAA and then disappears in the majors. I suspect Arauz is more of a prospect than Arroyo at this point.
I don't envy Bloom at all (except for the $ part... and having a dream job....other than those two things, I don't envy Bloom) considering the shit hand he was dealt when he came on board; the Cora mess, Sale getting the knife, The Mookie situation, then the Covid hit (granted other teams had this), then Rodriguez (will he ever pitch again?). It was a shit hand he was dealt and then someone took a dump on his cards. If he can turn this team around in 2 years he should get a statue made of him in front of Fenway.... Theo had it pretty easy when he showed up (just needed to add one little piece really).... this is closer to the Ben Cherington situation in which he pulled a rabbit out of a public port-a-potty.
I agree with you on Bloom (I think the Cora thing is underrated in its impact on the current situation). Theo had to do more than add one little piece though. The fact that I can't tell if your "one little piece" refers to Ortiz, Schilling, or Foulke suggests he needed more than just one piece. He was responsible for acquiring ~2/3 of the 2004 "25".
Well he had Ortiz the prior season (and have to add Millar and Mueller to that mix).... I was referring to Schilling as the one piece that he needed to add to the '04 roster from the '03 roster. But yeah.... it was two... forgot about Folke.
Didn't Theo become GM after the 2002 season?
Edit: Yes, he did. So Ortiz was one of his first signings as GM (as were Mueller and Millar).
some pretty crappy pitchers are up to replace the traded ones. the string is still a month from being played out...
View: https://twitter.com/RedSox/status/1297228795267747841
View: https://twitter.com/RedSox/status/1297228795267747841
It's apparently not just Pawtucket, but also Boston College. source: https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/heres-where-every-mlb-team-will-host-an-alternate-training-site/
Red Sox managed to pass Shawaryn and Gonsalves through waivers. Shawaryn is off the player pool but still in the organization. Gonsalves is on the 60 man player pool with an RJ Alavarez released.
View: https://twitter.com/RedSox/status/1298689059527819264
View: https://twitter.com/RedSox/status/1298689059527819264
in order to make room for one of the two prospects in the Mitch trade, Marco Hernandez was outright released.
I forgot Marco was still on the team. I had such high hopes for him.
couldnt they have released Brasier instead?
couldnt they have released Brasier instead?
The optics would have been terrible. Can't release a guy mocking BLM so soon after the RNC.
View: https://twitter.com/BillKoch25/status/1300139701505003520
Left the game with an Injury
Left the game with an Injury
Bryan Mata is down and hurt at the #RedSox alternate site. Looked like his left leg.
Bill Koch
@BillKoch25
Mata is leaving the game. Trainers were trying to stretch his left hamstring. Unable to put much weight on his left side at all. @SoxProspects lists Mata as the No. 3 player in the #RedSox organization.
It's very early, but so far Chaim Bloom has done a great job getting pieces to help the rebuilding process. Martin Perez is good 4/5 starter on a good contract going forward, Verdugo looks like an All Star level player under team control for a while, and Pillar and Moreland were signed on reasonable deals that were flipped for future minor league help.
I'd like to see what he can do to build a bullpen with a normal offseason. But if he can do that and Sale and Eduardo can heal up, the team will be a contender sooner than later.
I'd like to see what he can do to build a bullpen with a normal offseason. But if he can do that and Sale and Eduardo can heal up, the team will be a contender sooner than later.
Is Perez a "good 4/5 starter"?
Career: 4.72 era, 95 era+, 1.48 whip, 5.8 k/9
2018-2020: 5.38 era, 85 era+, 1.57 whip, 6.6 k/9
2020: 4.58 era, 101 era+, 1.27 whip, 6.1 k/9
I mean...I guess?
Career: 4.72 era, 95 era+, 1.48 whip, 5.8 k/9
2018-2020: 5.38 era, 85 era+, 1.57 whip, 6.6 k/9
2020: 4.58 era, 101 era+, 1.27 whip, 6.1 k/9
I mean...I guess?
A guy who takes the ball every 5 days and gives you 5+ innings at league average ERA is great number 5 starter, and a decent number 4.
Those numbers probably stack up pretty well with the back end of most ML rotations.
Bingo.
Most teams' #5 isn't even a single guy. It's a patchwork of pitchers that, on a successful team, puts up league average numbers in aggregate. If you have one guy doing it behind 3-4 better pitchers, you have a hell of a rotation.
Hoping Mata's injury was just a cramp. Especially since he hit 99 MPH on Sunday.
https://www.providencejournal.com/sports/20200830/bryan-mata-left-hamstring-leaves-outing-at-red-sox-alternate-site
Just for fun, I looked up the #5 starter for the last four Sox' championship teams, going by # of starts and ERA...
2004: Derek Lowe: 33 gs, 5.42 era, 89 era+, 1.62 whip, 5.2 k/9
2007: Julian Tavarez: 23 gs, 5.15 era, 92 era+, 1.50 whip, 5.1 k/9
2013: Ryan Dempster: 27 gs, 4.57 era, 90 era+, 1.45 whip, 8.2 k/9
2018: Brian Johnson: 13 gs, 4.17 era, 106 era+, 1.43 whip, 7.9 k/9
So I suppose Perez fits in there reasonably well.
2004: Derek Lowe: 33 gs, 5.42 era, 89 era+, 1.62 whip, 5.2 k/9
2007: Julian Tavarez: 23 gs, 5.15 era, 92 era+, 1.50 whip, 5.1 k/9
2013: Ryan Dempster: 27 gs, 4.57 era, 90 era+, 1.45 whip, 8.2 k/9
2018: Brian Johnson: 13 gs, 4.17 era, 106 era+, 1.43 whip, 7.9 k/9
So I suppose Perez fits in there reasonably well.
Clicking around roster resource, it seems like there are a few different styles of back-of-the-rotation types. There's the innings eater, the young guy with upside, the reclamation project, the just-a-guy (post-prospects and other membra disjecta), and these days, a new type: the opener. Very few teams have legitimate good starters — i.e. established pitchers who can provide both quality and quantity — in these roles. Those teams are generally contenders.
I thought this was an interesting question, so here's a twenty minute 4/5 starter census, based on Roster Resource's depth charts and a bunch of my own snap judgments. I've gone through and coded them, and I'm sure I've mischaracterized at least a few. Obviously some of these distinctions are pretty subjective. Like, what do we call a guy who was expected to be a stabilizing veteran presence but has instead been awful? Is one down year enough to make a pitcher a reclamation project? It's tricky. The young pitchers are the largest group, but I have made no effort to distinguish their relative promise or present performance.
So please read this in the spirit it is being offered, as a qualitative snapshot of rotation depth around the league and how teams are allocating those roster slots.
IE — Innings Eater: reliable innings, so-so rate stats.
YG — Young Guy: under 26.
RP — Reclamation project: a once-good starter for another team. Matt Harvey. The challenge is when it works too well: i.e Sonny Gray with Cinci.
JAG — The kinds of career minor leaguers and long relievers Boston has been starting this season: 29 year old rookies, perennial non-tender candidates, that sort of thing.
OP — Opener: starters who are aiming to get through the order no more than once.
GS — Good Starter: somebody who could be a credible front-of-the-rotation starter on another team.
NYY Happ (IE), King (YG)
TBR Morton (GS), Fleming (YG)
BAL Akin (YG), Wojciechowski (JAG)
BOS Brewer (JAG), Hart (JAG)
TOR Anderson (YG), Ray (IE)
CLE Carrasco (GS), Civale (YG)
CHW Cease (YG), Dunnning (YG)
KC Keller (YG), Harvey (RP)
MIN Hill (GS), Pineda (GS)
DET Turnbull (JAG with good results?), Skubal (YG)
HOU Bielak (YG), McCullers (GS)
SEA Margevicius (YG), Sheffield (YG)
OAK Fiers (IE), Minor (IE)
LAA Barria (YG), Teheran (RP)
TEX Allard (YG), TBA (OP)
NYM Gsellman (GS), Porcello (IE)
PHL Arietta (IE), Howard (YG)
WAS Voth (JAG), Fedde (JAG)
MIA Hernandez (YG), Sanchez (YG)
ATL Tomlin (JAG), Milone (JAG)
CHC Chatwood (GS), Lester (IE)
STL Kim (GS), Oviedo (YG)
MIL Anderson (RP), Suter (JAG)
CIN Gray (GS), Mahle (YG)
PIT Brubaker (JAG), Brault (JAG)
SF Anderson (JAG), Cahill (RP)
LAD Gonsolin (GS), Urias (YG)
SD Paddack (YG), Richards (RP)
COL Senzatela (YG), Castellani (YG)
ARI Young (JAG), TBA (OP)
There are sixty 4/5 slots. By my count:
23 YG
13 JAG
10 GS
7 IE
5 RP
2 OP
FWIW, only 60.2 of Brian Johnson's 99 innings pitched in 2018 were as a starter. I can't figure out how to pull those out to get his ERA+ or whip info, though. Eovaldi also had 50 innings of starts for the Sox with a total ERA+ of 133 for the Sox (he also had one relief appearance)
Yeah, it's hard to determine a team's "number five" starter when it's a mish-mash of people. Or even in 2004...Lowe's numbers made him the fifth starter, but I'd argue that Arroyo really was that for them.