Red Sox Trade Deadline 2022

budcrew08

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Mar 30, 2007
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On the bright side- it’s over. This is our team the rest of the way, and speculating about what could have been is completely pointless. Some guys should be coming back, the deficit is not insurmountable, etc. Hopefully some guys relax and get more comfortable knowing where they are going to be the rest of the way? 52-52 with 58 left. Something like 35-23, can we do it? Might as well try.
Why not? Did we give up after the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? No!
: Forget it, he’s rolling.
(stupid movie reference)
 

Daniel_Son

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May 25, 2021
805
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Reading SOSH, it sounds like Bloom lost the trade deadline again this year.
He definitely lost it last year, when all he did was bring in an injured DH who'd never played first base, and a couple of mop-up relievers.
The only thing he's won in the last year is a couple of playoff series against the Yankees and Rays.
That makes him 2-4 in the last year, since he lost the ALCS, both trade deadlines, and last offseason too. No wonder so many people here think he stinks.
Yeah, an injured DH who only put up a 154 OPS+ and led them to the ALCS. Horrible deadline.
 

mikeford

woolwich!
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Aug 6, 2006
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Probably because they traded for another MLB caliber catcher (not as good as vaz, but not awful) and upgraded at the 2 positions of need people have been complaining that they haven't upgraded at yet. It may not all work out, but you can easily make the argument that they're just as good now as they were 24 hours ago, and have a better farm.
Are we talking about the masturbator? Because I don't think a wRC+ of 55 constitutes an MLB caliber catcher. Would put him 47th out of 59 catchers with 100 PA or more this year. Vazquez, for reference, has a 111 wRC+, good for 14/59.
 

scottyno

late Bloomer
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Dec 7, 2008
10,140
Are we talking about the masturbator? Because I don't think a wRC+ of 55 constitutes an MLB caliber catcher. Would put him 47th out of 59 catchers with 100 PA or more this year. Vazquez, for reference, has a 111 wRC+, good for 14/59.
With better defense, a better arm, and better framing. He's absolutely an MLB caliber catcher when you include defense.
 

Ferm Sheller

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Mar 5, 2007
15,566
I really don't understand the Vazquez trade without subsequent similar moves. Those prospects better be studs.
I think if we made Chaim swallow a truth pill right now he'd admit that he wishes that he could undo the Vaz trade in light of the things that he thought/hoped were going to happen but didn't happen today.
 

Beomoose

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May 28, 2006
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Maybe Hosmer goes on a tear, but catcher seems like a toss off and pitching has only added by the subtraction of Diekman.

We'll see. They didn't do a fire sale to get under the threshold, at least.
Yeah, an injured DH who only put up a 154 OPS+ and led them to the ALCS. Horrible deadline.
And we let him walk.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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Aug 23, 2008
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I like the moves to bring in more real major league players in positions of need (especially 1B) but nothing particularly creative happened here.

This will possibly be the most important offseason of Chaim’s career here. There is now a glut of similarly interesting and relatively interchangeable prospects from 11-30 (maybe even 40). There is cash to burn. It’s imperative to utilize these resources to hit Opening Day 2023 with a refreshed roster.

It’s nice to have a bunch more interesting prospects in the system but those second and third tier guys can crater in value FAST if they stall at any point. A key part of Chaim’s role moving forward will be identifying the right guys to keep and the right guys to move. Is Raffaela’s rise unsustainable? Move him at peak value this winter, etc.

I’d have been very curious to see what we could get for Schreiber but I also understand the impulse to keep a guy who might be a stud and is under team control.
 

Manzivino

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Jul 31, 2006
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I don’t think it’s all that complicated. Vazquez was traded because they were probably going to lose him in the offseason for nothing. Eovaldi/Martinez they’re comfortable QOing and either getting a comp pick (and the $400k slot money to go with it) or having them on a reasonable 1-yr deal. Nobody else had any trade value other than X, who I think they’re going to make a legit attempt to sign long term.
 

SemperFidelisSox

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May 25, 2008
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All Bloom really said when asked specifically about keeping Vazquez was “There’s a lot of different things we were trying to accomplish. We wanted to give this group a chance at the postseason.”
 

8slim

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Nov 6, 2001
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Still grading it as a shoulder shrug.

Seems like Bloom is simply continuing to walk the tightrope of rebuilding organizational depth while still at least nominally competing at the major league level.

I think 2023 is when we’ll be able to start to judge Bloom’s performance, to at least some degree.
 

P'tucket rhymes with...

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Dec 12, 2006
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The Coney Island of my mind
I really don't understand the Vazquez trade without subsequent similar moves. Those prospects better be studs.
I wonder if Bloom doesn't pull the trigger on it knowing that he wouldn't be able to find the market for JD and Eovaldi, but it's probably of little consequence in the long run. If they really like Vaz, they can get him back in December.
 

pk1627

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May 24, 2003
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I think I’d have tried to tear it down more but have no problem with them trying h to stay competitive.

But I don’t really know how they mean to stay competitive without improving that awful bullpen. They should have fewer automatic outs in the lineup now but they still will struggle to get 27 outs
As Wacha and Hill come back, put Bello and Winckowski in the pen?
 

simplicio

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Apr 11, 2012
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I like the moves to bring in more real major league players in positions of need (especially 1B) but nothing particularly creative happened here.
Getting a free first baseman along with prospects who don't need protecting for a guy that was set to get crunched off the 40 man this winter feels creative to me, I dunno.
 

strek1

Run, Forrest, run!
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Jun 13, 2006
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Bloom spinning this like we're now positioned to make a playoff run without addressing any pitching issues doesn't impress me.
 

amfox1

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As Wacha and Hill come back, put Bello and Winckowski in the pen?
Bello is likely to move to the pen this year. He's at 88 IP after pitching 95 IP last year. Team is probably targeting 125-130 IP for him.
Winck is less likely IMO. He's at 87 IP after pitching 123 IP last year. Team is probably targeting 150-160 IP.
 

cantor44

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Dec 23, 2020
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At the risk of engendering Rovin Romine's probably justifiable accusation of an emotive post: can someone please explain to me what the fuck just happened? I think the Hosmer/Pham deals might make sense for a team that's cooking that could use a little more depth (a la Steve Pearce) ...but why trade Vaz when he's having a decent year (and is durable as shit) if you're not selling off assets aggressively? Once again, from my perspective, Chaim's stuck betwixt and between. I'm beginning to believe he's deeply risk adverse - like it's a psychological issue. Doesn't wanna spend prospects, doesn't wanna spend big money, doesn't wanna sell impending free agents. Just what does he want to do? Find bargains? He under stocked the 2022 team in the off season, and then doesn't have the guts to do what the Cubs did last year at the deadline when they're floundering ...Man, he is deeply conservative.

Deep breath and give him the off season to see ... but seems pretty baffling right now.
 

Raindog

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Jun 4, 2011
2
Why not? Did we give up after the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? No!
: Forget it, he’s rolling.
(stupid movie reference)
I'm a lurker that hasn't posted before because I'm happy to sit back and watch, but you sir, have engaged me by calling Animal House a stupid movie. Please retract this statement or I will be forced to become a contributing member.
 

Granite Sox

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Feb 6, 2003
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Re why Vazquez and not Martinez/Eovaldi: there’s a hypothesis that the Sox would not want to QO Vazquez after the season, so better to get something for him now. As opposed to JD and Eovaldi, who should expect a QO; if they turn down a QO and still leave then the Sox would at least get some compensation for them.
 

Bosoxian

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Aug 17, 2021
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I'm a lurker that hasn't posted before because I'm happy to sit back and watch, but you sir, have engaged me by calling Animal House a stupid movie. Please retract this statement or I will be forced to become a contributing member.
I think he said the reference was stupid.
Another lurker
 

Jimbodandy

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Jan 31, 2006
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Re why Vazquez and not Martinez/Eovaldi: there’s a hypothesis that the Sox would not want to QO Vazquez after the season, so better to get something for him now. As opposed to JD and Eovaldi, who should expect a QO; if they turn down a QO and still leave then the Sox would at least get some compensation for them.
The possible compensation slot dollars could add up fast with the potential departures this offseason. If the offers were junk, there's a case to be made for the draft money.

Not to mention being able to stay competitive down the stretch.
 

SouthernBoSox

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Jul 23, 2005
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The Hosmer trade in a vacuum is a perfect trade. You upgrade the major league roster, you do so at zero financial cost, and you sub one okay prospect for two okay prospects. It a great move and to think otherwise would be foolish.

At the surface it appears as a team that’s in total limbo. A team not far out of the wild card but with very glaring issues both this year and with pending free agents.

At first glance it appears as though Chaim had no vision. Couldn’t really pick a path…

However, once you start factoring in qualifying offers and draft compensation it seems to make more sense. They weren’t going to QO Vasquez. Therefore they felt compelled to grab value when they could.

The rest will be stamped with the QO and will not leave for nothing.

Very strange deadline. Very strange. I am neither happy or sad, but, it’s very clear, this upcoming offseason will be the make of break of Chaim’s career.

I do find the lack of getting under the luxury tax to be a real head scratcher.
 

Diamond Don Aase

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Jan 16, 2001
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The possible compensation slot dollars could add up fast with the potential departures this offseason. If the offers were junk, there's a case to be made for the draft money.

Not to mention being able to stay competitive down the stretch.
There would be no draft compensation if Martinez accepts the Qualifying Offer, which he effectively has before each of the past three seasons. A year older and with only one of those three seasons having been particularly productive, there is no reason to think that Martinez would not accept the QO.
 

Ganthem

a ray of sunshine
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Apr 7, 2022
726
At the risk of engendering Rovin Romine's probably justifiable accusation of an emotive post: can someone please explain to me what the fuck just happened? I think the Hosmer/Pham deals might make sense for a team that's cooking that could use a little more depth (a la Steve Pearce) ...but why trade Vaz when he's having a decent year (and is durable as shit) if you're not selling off assets aggressively? Once again, from my perspective, Chaim's stuck betwixt and between. I'm beginning to believe he's deeply risk adverse - like it's a psychological issue. Doesn't wanna spend prospects, doesn't wanna spend big money, doesn't wanna sell impending free agents. Just what does he want to do? Find bargains? He under stocked the 2022 team in the off season, and then doesn't have the guts to do what the Cubs did last year at the deadline when they're floundering ...Man, he is deeply conservative.

Deep breath and give him the off season to see ... but seems pretty baffling right now.
How did he under stock the team?
 

snowmanny

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Dec 8, 2005
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I don’t know if it is Chaim. I think some of this might come from the top. Isn’t this kind of sort of what they did in 2014? They traded off Lackey and Lester and Miller but brought in Craig and Céspedes and Rusney and sort of acted like they weren’t really out of it (they were).

edit - my theory being that Henry has a hard time throwing in the towel this early. 2012 dump off was later.
 

Cesar Crespo

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Dec 22, 2002
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There would be no draft compensation if Martinez accepts the Qualifying Offer, which he effectively has before each of the past three seasons. A year older and with only one of those three seasons having been particularly productive, there is no reason to think that Martinez would not accept the QO.
And that's not the worst thing for the Red Sox given the amount of money they'll have and it'll be only a 1 year commitment.
 

scottyno

late Bloomer
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Dec 7, 2008
10,140
There would be no draft compensation if Martinez accepts the Qualifying Offer, which he effectively has before each of the past three seasons. A year older and with only one of those three seasons having been particularly productive, there is no reason to think that Martinez would not accept the QO.
If they offer the QO and he accepts then they've got DH covered for 1 year. They aren't going to offer it to him if they'd hate him taking it. 2020 was horrible, but I think you kind of have to throw that out for a DH who values in game video so much and wasn't able to use it. 2021 was great, 2022 to date on the whole has been meh, not great not terrible, but mediocre.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill
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Sep 9, 2008
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At the risk of engendering Rovin Romine's probably justifiable accusation of an emotive post: can someone please explain to me what the fuck just happened? I think the Hosmer/Pham deals might make sense for a team that's cooking that could use a little more depth (a la Steve Pearce) ...but why trade Vaz when he's having a decent year (and is durable as shit) if you're not selling off assets aggressively? Once again, from my perspective, Chaim's stuck betwixt and between. I'm beginning to believe he's deeply risk adverse - like it's a psychological issue. Doesn't wanna spend prospects, doesn't wanna spend big money, doesn't wanna sell impending free agents. Just what does he want to do? Find bargains? He under stocked the 2022 team in the off season, and then doesn't have the guts to do what the Cubs did last year at the deadline when they're floundering ...Man, he is deeply conservative.

Deep breath and give him the off season to see ... but seems pretty baffling right now.
It does feel like he got caught in the switches. Who knows. Maybe he got played or maybe he thought he had some things that disappeared on him.

Maybe this is what he really wanted. Or maybe he's sitting there wondering what the fuck just happened. It really doesn't make sense to me, but it's hard to know.

Each move seems ok on its own. Nothing huge. It seems inconsistent but in the end I think it's just some running in place and we still have lots of work to do that's going to matter more than anything that happened or really could have happened in the trading window.
 

RG33

Certain Class of Poster
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Nov 28, 2005
6,436
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At the risk of engendering Rovin Romine's probably justifiable accusation of an emotive post: can someone please explain to me what the fuck just happened? I think the Hosmer/Pham deals might make sense for a team that's cooking that could use a little more depth (a la Steve Pearce) ...but why trade Vaz when he's having a decent year (and is durable as shit) if you're not selling off assets aggressively? Once again, from my perspective, Chaim's stuck betwixt and between. I'm beginning to believe he's deeply risk adverse - like it's a psychological issue. Doesn't wanna spend prospects, doesn't wanna spend big money, doesn't wanna sell impending free agents. Just what does he want to do? Find bargains? He under stocked the 2022 team in the off season, and then doesn't have the guts to do what the Cubs did last year at the deadline when they're floundering ...Man, he is deeply conservative.

Deep breath and give him the off season to see ... but seems pretty baffling right now.
I think it is reasonable to say that Chaim didn’t think Vaz was very good to begin with as there have been rumors for 3 years that they were looking to move on from him, and we all know Chaim came from a franchise that doesn’t put a high value on the position (think Patriots and RBs).

For 2 months of Vaz, they got two solid prospects to build more depth and probably think they can replace 80%+ of his production knowing that they were letting him walk in the offseason anyways.

Not to come off as a Chaim apologist, but again, I think these are the smart moves that good Execs make over the long haul.
 

budcrew08

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Mar 30, 2007
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I'm a lurker that hasn't posted before because I'm happy to sit back and watch, but you sir, have engaged me by calling Animal House a stupid movie. Please retract this statement or I will be forced to become a contributing member.
Didn’t mean stupid… definitely funny reference. I was calling myself stupid.