Renfroe to Sox 1y/3.1M

Red(s)HawksFan

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I said this in the Hot Stove thread already, but the Phillies seem like an obvious fit, especially now that DD is in charge. The other cheap option for anyone who misses out I guess is Jake Marisnick, not really a full-timer, but you could use him for defense. He was on the notorious 2017 Astros, though.
Coincidentally (or not) he had his best year at the plate in 2017 (not counting the SSS abbreviated 2020 season). He could be a fit with the Sox as a 4th/5th OF but it's not as though the OF they have now is deficient defensively. If it's not going to be JBJ, I think I'd rather see the Sox try to get the best bat they can and fit him wherever they can. Even if that means at DH with JDM getting some outfield starts.
 

JBJ_HOF

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Jon Morosi is king of the "sources .. are interested in.." tweets with nothing ever happening and a bunch of teams linked.
 

scottyno

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I agree that after one season Verdugo appears to be a guy you build around. Which is why I think you sell high and trade him for a young top end starter with a similar build around profile. That starter fills a huge void that the free agent market doesn’t seem to offer (young and good). Meanwhile, Springer brings All Star and post season juice back to a lineup who missed and will continue to miss Mookie.
What you just described isn't Blake Snell though, he's 28, not that young, and had 1 insane year in 2018, 2019 he wasn't good and 2020 he was good but not the type of guy I want to give up 5 years of verdugo for.
 

chawson

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Right, it’s not our money, and while the team could decide to go right back into the tax, expecting them to add $60M+ in payroll, more in tax, lose draft pick compensation and the budget that goes with it, and likely throw in another top prospect and/or cheap MLBer in the proposed Snell deal, all during a pandemic when this year‘s revenues are again likely to be way down, seems like WEEI-level wishcasting. The odds of them taking such an approach seem overwhelmingly low.

They can still take advantage of the fact that most teams appear to be trying to reduce spending this year. Heck, Renfroe is an example of that. That allows them to retool now by staying just within the cap, keep their powder dry, and permit even bigger spending next year, on a potentially much better crop of FAs.
Excepting the star shortstops, E-Rod and maybe Syndergaard, it's hard for me to see big FAs in next year's crop that Bloom would be in on.

Rosenthal had a paywalled piece in The Athletic Sunday ("Big names, big trade possibilities for MLB's creative thinkers") that said the Angels may be willing to package Brandon Marsh deal with Justin Upton (2/$21.2M AAV) so they can afford pitching. Now, I love JBJ, but would you rather spend $18M on his age 31-32 seasons or $42M to get 6 premium years of a top CF prospect like Marsh, plus two years of a maybe-not-cooked Upton (who had an elite .402 xwOBA from 8/28 on last year and hits more bombs in our park). To me, that's a compelling deal. There just aren't any Brandon Marshes on the FA market, and there are very few teams who can take on Upton's salary to get him.

I still kinda like the idea of Springer, but I think there’s a difference between adding FA salary and adding via trade this winter. Bloom excels at creative trades, and the pandemic has made that market more dynamic than ever. There are interesting FAs for sure, but there's gotta be a ton of good players available by trade/salary dump that we aren't able to see. Considering our prospect deficit, the Mookie debacle and the greater-than-usual number of teams looking to clear payroll, I would hope JH can use the team's financial advantage to "buy" young players in situations like this one, taking on high-dollar short-term contracts, to set us up going forward.
 
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Minneapolis Millers

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...Now, I love JBJ, but would you rather spend $18M on his age 31-32 seasons or $42M to get 6 premium years of a top CF prospect like Marsh, plus two years of a maybe-not-cooked Upton (who had an elite .402 xwOBA from 8/28 on last year and hits more bombs in our park). To me, that's a compelling deal. There just aren't any Brandon Marshes on the FA market, and there are very few teams who can take on Upton's salary to get him. ...
Yes, I’m hoping that Bloom pulls an unexpected trade like that out of the hat. It’s like when we flexed our financial muscles to get Moncada. Except here, as you note, Upton’s not necessarily a net negative, and if he rebuilds value, we could probably trade him in the future and at least offload some of the salary obligation, maybe even get an additional worthwhile piece back.

If the Sox could do that (not sure Rosenthal is right about the Angels’ willingness to trade Marsh in a salary dump), they could still be in on a top ‘21 FA...
 

sean1562

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Going back to the last full season, 2019, here is what a Pederson/Renfroe platoon would look like

Pederson v RHP .252/.349/.571
Renfroe v LHP .239/.331/.575

Fangraphs has a 2/20 projection on Pederson. Worth it for the larger side of a .900ish OPS platoon? In 2019, as a platoon, they would have hit 47 homeruns.
 

Stanley Steamer

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I agree that Pederson or JBJ would be reasonably solid complements for Renfroe, whom I liked in what little I saw last fall. Good defense is almost essential, and all the OF have skills. It's about carefully accruing damaging offense in the lineup. Verdugo looks good, Renfroe can likely offer SLG. Benintendi is an absolute mystery at this point. I would prefer JBJ out of sentiment and defense, but Pederson may have more offensive value.
Any decent RH candidates, outside of Springer?
 

chawson

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I agree that Pederson or JBJ would be reasonably solid complements for Renfroe, whom I liked in what little I saw last fall. Good defense is almost essential, and all the OF have skills. It's about carefully accruing damaging offense in the lineup. Verdugo looks good, Renfroe can likely offer SLG. Benintendi is an absolute mystery at this point. I would prefer JBJ out of sentiment and defense, but Pederson may have more offensive value.
Any decent RH candidates, outside of Springer?
(Edit: I read this as RF at first but you probably mean right-handed hitting.)

Via FA: Danny Santana, Puig, Profar, Enrique Hernandez, Pederson. Pillar and Grossman are options too I guess.
Via trade: Canha (1/$6.8M)?, Haniger (2/$8~M)? Kole Calhoun (LHH, 1/$8M)? Polanco (LHH, 1/$12M) as part of a bigger deal with Pittsburgh? How about Lorenzo Cain (2/$32M) for CF packaged with Houser (FA '25) and/or Hader (FA '24)? The Brewers apparently want to cut payroll.

Yes, I’m hoping that Bloom pulls an unexpected trade like that out of the hat. It’s like when we flexed our financial muscles to get Moncada. Except here, as you note, Upton’s not necessarily a net negative, and if he rebuilds value, we could probably trade him in the future and at least offload some of the salary obligation, maybe even get an additional worthwhile piece back.

If the Sox could do that (not sure Rosenthal is right about the Angels’ willingness to trade Marsh in a salary dump), they could still be in on a top ‘21 FA...
I'm not sure Rosenthal is right about that either, but the language was pretty specific about those players, which made me think someone talked on background.

Another reason this winter seems a good time for the Sox to absorb other teams' contracts for prospects is that our two primary big-market competitors are somewhat limited. The Yankees seem to be resetting their Competitive Balance Tax after two years over the threshold and the Dodgers, who exceeded the threshold last year, may take their foot off the gas after winning it all.
 

Apisith

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So, he’s on course for a 3.5WAR season. And he’s under control for two more years.

His wOBA is .334 and xwOBA is .351, so he’s slightly underperforming his batted ball data. Nothing screams overachievement or that regression is incoming.

What a pickup so far from Bloom. Cashman-esque.
 

JimD

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Bloom must be loving life working for a club that doesn't have to cut players because they might qualify for a $4 million arbitration award.
 

Sam Ray Not

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Renfroe .272 / .330 / .473 / .802
Verdugo .276 / .341 / .436 / .777
Kiké .236 / .294 / .417 / .713
=====
$9.7M

Betts ,253 / .371 / .471 / .842
Beni .283 / .340 / .429 / .769
JBJ .159 / .240 / .274 / .514
====
$42.5M
 
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Sox Puppet

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Surprised to see that Benintendi and Verdugo have such similar stat lines.

Renfroe has really been a find. I was totally down on him the first third of the season, but credit to Bloom for identifying talent and to Cora for sticking with him through his offensive struggles.
 

Lose Remerswaal

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Surprised to see that Benintendi and Verdugo have such similar stat lines.

Renfroe has really been a find. I was totally down on him the first third of the season, but credit to Bloom for identifying talent and to Cora for sticking with him through his offensive struggles.
Beni with 241 PA, Dugo with 305, so not quite as similar.
 

azsoxpatsfan

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In 19 games in April, Renfroe hit .167/.235/.250/.485 with 1 homer and 2 doubles. In 49 games since, he’s hitting .307/.362/.547/.910 with 10 homers and 13 doubles. He has a 5.9 UZR/150 and 5 DRS for the season. So he’s been hitting over .300 with a .900+ OPS and plus defense over the past two months. That’s not just decent, that’s All-Star level
 

Pitt the Elder

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In 19 games in April, Renfroe hit .167/.235/.250/.485 with 1 homer and 2 doubles. In 49 games since, he’s hitting .307/.362/.547/.910 with 10 homers and 13 doubles. He has a 5.9 UZR/150 and 5 DRS for the season. So he’s been hitting over .300 with a .900+ OPS and plus defense over the past two months. That’s not just decent, that’s All-Star level
Shades of JD Drew?
 

MtPleasant Paul

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Renfroe's total performance this year is not out of line with what he did in San Diego where he hit 85 home runs in three years. And Tampa Bay gave up two pretty good players in Tommy Pham and Jake Cronenworth to get him.

So we got a good player under similar circumstances to the acquisition of David Ortiz. Maybe the recent spurt means he is bringing his career to another level as did Papi. The increase in OBP is a good sign.
 

opes

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Renfroe's total performance this year is not out of line with what he did in San Diego where he hit 85 home runs in three years. And Tampa Bay gave up two pretty good players in Tommy Pham and Jake Cronenworth to get him.

So we got a good player under similar circumstances to the acquisition of David Ortiz. Maybe the recent spurt means he is bringing his career to another level as did Papi. The increase in OBP is a good sign.
Oooff, now that is a big claim to make without backing something up. Even Ortiz's 03 or 08 season is miles ahead of what Renfroes currently doing. Too me, this is not a comparison. To compare David Ortiz to Hunter Renfroe in this small sample size isnt worth a breath. Also ortiz was DFA'd so I don't see the comparison.
 
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jon abbey

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And Tampa Bay gave up two pretty good players in Tommy Pham and Jake Cronenworth to get him.
This is a bit misleading as TB also got two prospects in this deal including Xavier Edwards, who mlb.com currently has as the #66 overall prospect in MLB, he’s still just 21.
 

MtPleasant Paul

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Oooff, now that is a big claim to make without backing something up. Even Ortiz's 03 or 08 season is miles ahead of what Renfroes currently doing. Too me, this is not a comparison. To compare David Ortiz to Hunter Renfroe in this small sample size isnt worth a breath. Also ortiz was DFA'd so I don't see the comparison.
You should have read my post more carefully. I did not say that Ortiz and Renfroe were the same quality player - only that their careers might be following a similar arc. And both players did come to Boston after their teams - the small market Rays and the terminally cheap Twins of that era - released them rather than go to arbitration
 

Le Bastonois

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Jun 16, 2019
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His full name is Dustin Hunter Renfroe.

STARKVILLE, Miss. --- Catcher/outfielder/pitcher Hunter Renfroe of Crystal Springs, Miss., the 2010 Mississippi Association of Independent Schools Player of the Year and a 31st-round draft pick of the Boston Red Sox, has signed a national letter of intent with Mississippi State University, head baseball coach John Cohen announced Thursday.

Renfroe was a 6-1, 196-pound multi-sport standout during his prep career at Copiah Academy in Gallman, Miss. In addition to baseball, he also starred for the Copiah Academy Colonels in football, track and basketball.

"Hunter is an exciting player ... an impressive combination of arm strength, power and versatility with all the tools to be a great player," said Cohen. "If you are recruiting a high-level player like Hunter, you are going to run into some draft issues. That's a testament to the quality of player that we are recruiting."

The right-handed hitting Renfroe hit .583, collecting 49 hits, including an MAIS-record 20 home runs as a senior in 2010. The all-state and four-time all-district selection drove in 70 runs and legged out five doubles and five triples in helping lead coach Scooter Prince's Colonels to a 27-9 finish and the Academy State 3A championship. He drew 62 walks and stole 16 bases in 18 attempts.

In 10 mound appearances he compiled a 4-0 record with a save, a 3.91 earned run average and 28 strikeouts in 14-1/3 innings.

Renfroe was selected to play in the Academy 3A-2A All-Star Game in Jackson, where he earned MVP honors.

He hit .400 or better in each of his four seasons at Copiah Academy and earned the second of his three team MVP honors in 2009 after hitting .425 with 15 home runs as a junior. He also played USSA summer league baseball with the Mississippi Worth Bandits, coached by George Hartzog.

"I have always talked about playing for MSU, even as a young child, and now I have that chance," said Renfroe. "I am very excited about playing for Mississippi State."

The MSU signee is the son of Tammy and Todd Renfroe of Crystal Springs, Miss.


 

sean1562

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Hunter Renfroe is seeing the Sox slide and is doing everything he can to make sure we get into the playoffs. .260/.316/.726 for a 1.042 OPS in August with 10 HRs this month. He has been on fire since May 1 after an awful April. Without the Renfroe and Hernandez signings last offseason, this team is easily in third place. Great pickups by Bloom at bargain bin prices. 6.3 bWAR for $9.1 million.

edit: ahhh dumb mistake, obviously should have said 4th place, behind the Jays.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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Hunter Renfroe is seeing the Sox slide and is doing everything he can to make sure we get into the playoffs. .260/.316/.726 for a 1.042 OPS in August with 10 HRs this month. He has been on fire since May 1 after an awful April. Without the Renfroe and Hernandez signings last offseason, this team is easily in third place. Great pickups by Bloom at bargain bin prices. 6.3 bWAR for $9.1 million.
Even with them this team is easily in 3rd place
 

grepal

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Oooff, now that is a big claim to make without backing something up. Even Ortiz's 03 or 08 season is miles ahead of what Renfroes currently doing. Too me, this is not a comparison. To compare David Ortiz to Hunter Renfroe in this small sample size isnt worth a breath. Also ortiz was DFA'd so I don't see the comparison.
I think the point should be made that Hunter and Papi were classic low risk high reward acquisitions. Papi was a legendary acquisition. That does not diminish that Hunter is a bargain and for that matter so are other moves Bloom has made.
 

Brianish

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Also Ohtani's stolen a bunch of bases, but hasn't he also been thrown out a ton? Is he just being overly-aggressive?
 

scottyno

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Also Ohtani's stolen a bunch of bases, but hasn't he also been thrown out a ton? Is he just being overly-aggressive?
Yeah that one is silly because it's not subjective at all like most of the others are, we literally have every players base-running sprint speed, Ohtani is fast but he's not particularly close to being the fastest base-runner in the league

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderboard/sprint_speed
 
Renfroe .272 / .330 / .473 / .802
Verdugo .276 / .341 / .436 / .777
Kiké .236 / .294 / .417 / .713
=====
$9.7M

Betts ,253 / .371 / .471 / .842
Beni .283 / .340 / .429 / .769
JBJ .159 / .240 / .274 / .514
====
$42.5M
This is looking even better now, with Betts/Beni/JBJ combining for 3.5 fWAR / 4.8 bWAR and Renfroe/Verdugo/Kiké combining for 7.5 fWAR/ 8.7 bWAR so far. Kiké alone is nearly beating the entire old OF in bWAR.
 

scottyno

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What is he gonna get from arb? 10 mil? More?

Hell of an all-around season.
Aaron Judge got 10.2 million as a 2nd year arb player player this year. The comps aren't perfect, but they're at least sort of similar players at the same position, and Judge is clearly better, so I'd imagine less than 10.