Report: A-Rod banned through 2014?

Yeah Jeets

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Nov 19, 2013
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Bone Chips said:
Allegations made by ARod of MLB sliding a bag under the table filled with $150,000 in cash to a witness. Also accused one of the investigators of having sex with one of the witnesses.

Un-freaking-believable.
I like how the lawyer refused to answer a question from Mike because it dealt with "evidence", but had no problem with A-Rod saying this 30 seconds later. 

The lawyer wasn't just alright with the interview, dude was sitting three feet away. What the fuck.
 

soxhop411

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Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal1m
Why Selig didn’t testify against A-Rod, per source: It is employer’s burden to justify penalty. MLB chose to justify it by using Manfred.
 
Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal1m
Manfred, not Selig, has testified for MLB in every drug-related arbitration since collectively-bargained program was enacted.
 
So what is A-rod B*tching about when Selig has NEVER testified, does he think he should be treated differently becuase he is a-rod?
 

SaveBooFerriss

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soxhop411 said:
“@BobKlap: Had a labor attorney tell me it’s a “million to one” chance a federal court would hear A-Rod appeal. But he’s still going to sue everyone.”
 
Well, this is just wrong.  You don't "appeal" an arbitration decision.  You file a suit to vacate it.  If Arod files a suit to vacate in federal court, the federal court has to "hear" even if it is just on a motion to dismiss.  
 
On calling Selig, unless MLB's position is that Selig played no role in the discipline, I think the Arbitrator should have let Arod call him as a witness.   
 

Tim Salmon

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soxhop411 said:

Ken Rosenthal ‏@
Ken_Rosenthal1m
Why Selig didnt testify against A-Rod, per source: It is employers burden to justify penalty. MLB chose to justify it by using Manfred.

 

Ken Rosenthal ‏@
Ken_Rosenthal1m
Manfred, not Selig, has testified for MLB in every drug-related arbitration since collectively-bargained program was enacted.

 

So what is A-rod B*tching about when Selig has NEVER testified, does he think he should be treated differently becuase he is a-rod?
Putting aside the improbability of A-Rod's allegations, the fact that he is accusing MLB of tampering with witnesses as part of a vast conspiracy to drive down player salaries and provide relief to its most popular franchise puts this arbitration on different footing. That said, I wouldn't be surprised if his lawyers asked for Selig to testify just for the opportunity to badger him, with no real aim.
 

ifmanis5

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Summary from our friends at WABC....
 
 
Alex Rodriguez said he was supposed to testify Friday at his grievance hearing, after MLB Commissioner Bud Selig was to testify Thursday. He said he “lost my mind” today after learning Selig would not testify.
 
His attorney said a decision will be made tonight as to whether his lawyers will return to the hearing tomorrow. It sounds like Rodriguez will not return unless Selig testifies, although Rodriguez said he is too “pissed” right now to make a decision.
 
He repeatedly denied in the 30 minute plus interview that he did anything wrong. "Did you do any PEDs?" No. Rodriguez denied many other allegations made against him in the past, including the report that he leaked names of other PED users to the media. He even claimed he never gave an autographed ball with his phone number on it to an attractive female fan during the 2012 playoffs.
 
 
"I feel like I should be there opening day. That is what I am working hard for.
 
When Rob Manfred, our COO, who is a very smart guy. he says to me in the courtroom 'this wasn't my decision, this was Bud Selig's decision.' I said, 'great, we are going to get him on Thursday, and I will speak on Friday, this is the way it should end.' and then we hear he’s not coming. I know you don’t like New York, but you got to come and face me. this is my whole life, my whole legacy. I’m part of history. so if you are going to try and destroy all of that, I’m saying no, you tell me why I should face one inning. because you are retiring next year. That’s not fair mike.
 
If i gave Bosh $5 million, he would say whatever i wanted to. ... and making a mockery not only of major league baseball and Yankees and me, and all of this could have been avoided. i reached out to Selig several times and said I will fly up to you in January, February, i will come see you at your house. we can have coffee, or brunch,  in your house in Milwaukee or in a Starbucks. and anything you want to ask me, I will go without an attorney ... (Attorney friend told me) you should probably but take an attorney, I said I am not taking an attorney, I am going myself, man to man. And I made the same offer to rob Manfred. And they said we don't want to see you, we want to see you at the end.
 
if it wasn’t for my attorneys holding me back, I would have love to talk to my fan base, my daughters, my kids. ... there are a lot of people who don’t like me. I get it, mike I get it. people in the streets tell me I hate your guts, you are getting railroaded.
 
leaked players names -- That's laughable. Absolutely not. That’s disgusting.
 
PEDs -- No.
 
Obstruct a witness -- What does that mean  ... When it’s not about the money mike, it’s always about the money. That’s what it’s about.
 
Yankees future – I’m taking one fight at a time. right now its baseball. ... I’ve played for the city of New York. I love the fans, I love the city. my girls grew up here. this will be part of my life for the next 50 years. This is the city. I have never gotten more love walking around this city. I thought people would be banging me over the head. I’ve never been welcomed
 
angry at the Yankees -- yeah. Yeah, I am. I do have a responsibility. I am the third baseman of the Yankees. My goal is to get back on board. I saw what the red sox did. There is no reason why we can’t do the same thing in 2014. And I think we can do that.
 
I don't think I am going back.
 
regret this morning -- i have no regrets. I did the right thing, and I did it again. the bottom line is I’ve worked for 20 years, I’ve dedicated more than half to baseball. whether you like me or not, what’s wrong is wrong. and the system is wrong. whether you are in federal court or state court or kangaroo court that we are in today, players need protection. if I appeal, the union has already told me that if i go on Friday and they think i lied, they can give me another hundred games. now I’m at 311. now I appeal that and I’m at 411. and that could go on for seven or eight years. how can a player, the next 18 years old years, be sufficient under that kind of system.
 
Think about what I’ve been through. If you are any one of the 13 players, with what I’ve been through, do you think anyone is going to fight major league baseball.
 
These guys are very powerful, they have unlimited resources. And today we found they have no recourse. Think about that combination.
 
The one question I would have for the fans of baseball. This has been a disgusting process, and I am more embarrassed than anyone to be on the front pages, in the news. This is the game I love more than everything. This is what I have my PHD in, baseball. ... This is what I do, I live it. If I had one more year at $12 million, would someone throw 211 games at me.
 
We've been there for 12 days and we haven’t heard one thing that is credible. We said open the transcripts for everyone.
 
 
I’m so pissed off at the system. I’ve been here every day, I’ve been respectful. I can’t believe that someone would have the courage to make a historical decision on my life, on my daughters life, I have to explain this to my daughters. And the guy who rob Manfred said it’s his decision and his decision only ... He doesn’t have the nerve to face me face to face.
 
I am going home to see my daughters.
 
 
I am so heated up right now and so pissed off that I cannot think straight right now. That’s why I have many lawyers. I’m going to reid smith, we are going to huddle up. and ultimately we will make the final decision.
 
100% i am ready for opening day. and for the first time in a long time i feel like i will have a full off season to prepare. ... there’s hope. I feel like we are going to come back and have a good year. and i feel like i am going to be right in the middle of it.
 
i was just in NJ celebrating Mariano Rivera. I have a lot of close friends on that team. and I think that’s the misconception. I love my manager, I have a great relationship with joe. great relationship with Jeter, very close with Texeiria. Pettitte and mo are leaving, the responsibility is on us to win a championship. very close in the clubhouse.
 
signed baseball controversy -- i never signed any baseball, no. I never saw a signed baseball. ... i did not. ... it’s sad we even have to talk about that. 20 years of my career i have never done that. in this day and age there are probably 27 cameras on the YES network. you cannot get away with that. not me, not a bat boy, not a manager, not a coach. no one can get away with that.
 
I put my head down and play baseball. I get too much attention as it is. I know there are a lot of people who don’t like me and a lot of people who are supporters. in an ironic way what happened over the last six months has been the best thing that has happened in my career. it has humanized me, people are coming to my defense, and people who have said, I hate your guts, what MLB is doing is flat out disgusting.
 
 
the most emotional day was the day i got hit and then the home run ...
 
i reached out to seven or eight owners that are friends. they basically all said the same things, my hands are tied, i cant help you. i tried to do this early on, i wanted to go meet somebody face to face. ... I think they wanted this big spectacle and they got it.
 
Selig relationship -- I know you don’t like New York. come to New York and face the music. ... He hates my guts. ... I don’t think they like big salaries. ... One hundred percent this is personal. I think this is about my legacy and i think this is about my legacy. he is trying to destroy me, and by the way he is retiring in 2014. and to put me on his big mantle on the way out, that’s a hell of a trophy.
 
testifying? -- I can’t make any decisions right now, I am way too hot. I am going to back with my lawyers and huddle up. and I will go back and make the final decision.
 
What happened today -- I exploded much worse than Paul O'Neill with any of his explosions with the coolers.
 

Bibsley

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In some countries, not least the UK, Mr. Rodriguez would be looking at a libel suit and quite possibly jail time for what he came out with today. The man's out of his mind, or at the very least completely self-obsessed.
 

Hoplite

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It's seeming increasingly unlikely that the Yankees will know what will happen to A-Rod by the winter meetings. Once the hearings end (if they ever do), the arbitrator has another 25 days to make a decision. The winter meetings are in 18 days.
 

Average Reds

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ItOnceWasMyLife said:
I fear this misdirection is working on some levels.  What a douche.
 
If by "working" you mean that it has a chance to help him win the arbitration case, I would strongly disagree.
 
If by "working" you mean that it is turning public opinion in his favor, I would strongly disagree.
 
If by "working" you mean that he's making MLB look bad, you are probably right.  I'm not sure what that buys him, but it sure is entertaining.
 

Average Reds

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By the way, the video at Deadspin is pure gold.  A-Rod is out of his mind.  Like, Rob Ford-levels of insanity.
 
Also, his bullshit is so self-serving it's comical.  Which of course makes his choice of fatty Francesa the perfect interview.
 

lostjumper

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Arod said that MLB gave Bosch 5 million for the files. that can't be true, can it? That's a ton of money for some ped records. Couple that with the fact that MLB impeded with an actual criminal investigation and they don't come out looking great in this.
 

Sampo Gida

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Rovin Romine said:
 
I've bolded everything wrong with your post. 
 
You have a couple of good points hidden in there, but mostly it's just wishful thinking or speculation. 
 
It's weird how people do this with the law, yet they don't seem to do it with plumbing.  "Well I guess if I just run a pipe from my sink, I can just route it into the rain gutter."   But it's about the same level of thoughtfulness.  
 
***
 
1) The issue is whether or not the records were stolen, not whether Bosch reported them as such.  "Reporting" does not make them stolen or not stolen, but it does make it easier to prove that they were stolen at trial (if the defense is, say, I was freely given the records.)  
 
The ultimate issue is ownership.  The records were owned by Biogenesis.  
A) There is no theory that allows for an employee to steal records from their employer, no matter how unfairly they thought they were treated.  
B) If Fisher did not have legitimate ownership, Jones cannot be charged with stealing from Fisher.  Jones could be charged with burglary if he damaged Fisher's car in taking the documents, or if he did not have the true owner's permission to get the documents.  Jones could also be charged with dealing in stolen goods if he did not have the true owner's permission to obtain the documents, or if he sold them to the true owner knowing they were stolen (which seams to be the case).  He can also be charged with theft but the victim is Biogenesis, not Fisher.
 
Market value would normally present a problem with this kind of theft, but there's already been a market valuation.  
 
2) MLB could be charged with obstruction if they knew that there was an open investigation that wanted those records, and if they bought the records for the purpose of hindering that investigation.  Such a charge is unlikely though.  It really depends on the timing of the purchase and the exact notice that was given to MLB.  Currently there's nothing that's been reported that leads me to believe such a charge would stick.  (I mean, it could or it couldn't, but it's not like there's a smoking gun in public knowledge.)   Beyond that there's the assessment of the value of prosecution.  There's something to be said for charging large corps who may employ illegal activity, but the ultimate target here is Bosch.  It looks like both the feds and the state are still investigating and my charge him.  So there's not a lot of "ultimate" harm done to the state of FL, vis a vis the records debacle.  
 
3) If the lawsuit was frivolous in FL, Bosch could have pocketed attorney's fees and had substantial protection against discovery costs.  However, it was a valid lawsuit and Bosch settled with MLB.   Pursuant to that settlement, Bosch was indemnified by MLB; MLB also agreed to defend him in civil actions.   Bosch also agreed to testify.   It would be odd if Bosch asserted that MLB didn't have permission to buy his records back from a former employee who stole them.  I suppose he could do so, but I doubt it would hold water.  Much would depend on the actual language of the agreement he signed with MLB. 
 
Also, it does not really matter what Bosch "preferred" to have happen to the records, given that he cannot destroy documents which are the subject of at least one lawsuit and two investigations.  Ownership does not equal absolute license to do as you please with an object.  
 
Well, if I get it wrong I don't have a major leak on my hands like I would with plumbing
 
1.  I just said don't think you are at risk of being charged for theft if the owner does not report what you stole as being stolen. 
2. According the link above FL authorities said that MLB knew they were after the records
3. By frivolous I mean in the sense that MLB filed it for the purpose of getting records and Fischers testimony.  The judge in the case had this to say
 


Judge, what they [MLB] are trying to do is to use this case to get the evidence to discipline their players under the collective bargaining agreements, and the cases are very clear, this court lacks jurisdiction and there can be no discovery,’’ said Sonn of Fort Lauderdale.
 
In the end, Dresnick admitted that Sonn’s argument had some merit, but said that his client — as a third party — had no legal standing to challenge the lawsuit. As a result, Sucart has 20 days to appear for a deposition, pending any new motions on the lawsuit.
 
The judge, however, indicated he was puzzled by the fact that the defendants named in the suit, including several ballplayers, haven’t raised a similar challenge.

Read more
here: http://www.miamihe
 
 
rald.com/2013/06/27/3472495/now-up-to-bat-in-steroids-scandal.html#storylink=cpy
 
 
http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/06/27/3472495/now-up-to-bat-in-steroids-scandal.html
 

Murderer's Crow

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Average Reds said:
 
If by "working" you mean that it has a chance to help him win the arbitration case, I would strongly disagree.
 
If by "working" you mean that it is turning public opinion in his favor, I would strongly disagree.
 
If by "working" you mean that he's making MLB look bad, you are probably right.  I'm not sure what that buys him, but it sure is entertaining.
 
I actually think that if everyone watched the video, a lot more people would come out on Arods side. He has a clear and simple diversion point that will probably work well. "If Selig is telling the truth, why wouldn't he testify?" I maintain that I want both parties to lose big-time here but I'm really not coming out of this outburst hating Arod any more than I did yesterday.
 
Edit: To clarify - I don't mean to confuse siding with Arod as believing him. Nobody should believe him.
 

Rovin Romine

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lostjumper said:
Arod said that MLB gave Bosch 5 million for the files. that can't be true, can it? That's a ton of money for some ped records. Couple that with the fact that MLB impeded with an actual criminal investigation and they don't come out looking great in this.
 
We're trusting what ARod says now?
 
***
This fiasco has made my Wednesday.  
 
Those quotes are awesome.  
 
The Deadspin video is wonderful. 
 
ARod strikes me as that special kind of client who is embroiled in something - but they have no idea of what it is or how the process works.  But they have a friend who assures them it's kind of fairness mano a mano thing, sort of like going to the principals office when you were in 4th grade.  
 

Sampo Gida

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Horowitz not allowing them to question the guy who decided on Arods suspension length shows that he is in Buds back pocket. The last arbitrator to rule against MLB was fired, so you can’t be surprised this one knows how he has to rule to keep his job.
 
Meanwhile, Arod can not testify because MLB is the judge and jury on his testimonies accuracy, and he faces a longer suspension by testifying, even if he is truthful because anything he says that contradicts MLB will be construed as a lie.
 
So Arod figured out this is a sham, which was not news to his legal team (which is why they are going to court).
 
I mean, here you have MLB’s main evidence as coming from MLB knowingly purchasing stolen property (although some would say they were recovering it for Bosch) that impeded a FL investigation (perhaps even encouraging the theft), with a dubious chain of custody, and coerced testimony which is always unreliable, as a result of a frivolous (in a technical sense if not a legal sense)  lawsuit.
 
So good for Arod in walking out.  
 
Maybe his legal team can add Horwitz to the list of people to sue after the hearing and run up some more legal fees.  In the end it might have been cheaper for Arod to have accepted the 211 game suspension.
 

Rovin Romine

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Sampo Gida said:
 
Well, if I get it wrong I don't have a major leak on my hands like I would with plumbing
 
1.  I just said don't think you are at risk of being charged for theft if the owner does not report what you stole as being stolen. 
2. According the link above FL authorities said that MLB knew they were after the records
3. By frivolous I mean in the sense that MLB filed it for the purpose of getting records and Fischers testimony.  The judge in the case had this to say
 
 
 
 
http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/06/27/3472495/now-up-to-bat-in-steroids-scandal.html
 
True enough re: the leak.
 
1) You can be criminally charged for theft if the state has evidence you stole.  Most successful prosecutions require the owner to testify in court (note - they can be subpoenaed to testify whether they want to or not.)
 
1a) Although I didn't mention this before there is an additional wrinkle in that these are medical records.  
 
2) Yes.  See my previous points on this though. 
 
3) You quoted an article that quoted an attorney, not the judge.  That attorney's argument was unsuccessful.  The lawsuit was resolved - if it was a frivolous lawsuit it would have been objected to as such.  Again, see my points on this.  
 

Average Reds

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crow216 said:
 
I actually think that if everyone watched the video, a lot more people would come out on Arods side. He has a clear and simple diversion point that will probably work well. "If Selig is telling the truth, why wouldn't he testify?" I maintain that I want both parties to lose big-time here but I'm really not coming out of this outburst hating Arod any more than I did yesterday.
 
I don't think that helps A-Rod any, which was my point.
 
Look, this entire act on A-Rod's part is such a transparent attempt to extort MLB that it's almost comical.  (Note:  I am in favor of it and enjoying it.)  If he had gone on with anyone who was a serious reporter, he would have been torn to shreds. But he didn't go on with anyone - he went on with Tubby Francesa, who was so astounded that he had A-Rod in the studio that his inner Yankee fan came out and he didn't ask him a single difficult question.  So A-Rod achieved his objective, which was to play the righteous indignation card while touting an issue (Selig's refusal to testify) that has nothing to do with his guilt or innocence. 
 
The more I think of it, the more I believe the following:
  • A-Rod's lawyers knew full well that Selig would not testify
  • They kept pushing for it because his inevitable refusal would give A-Rod a "graceful" way to declare the process fraudulent, thus preventing him from being questioned under oath
  • It also gives them a pre-emptive excuse if/when the arbitrator upholds the suspension, which he almost certainly will do now.  (Even if he reduces the number of games.)
  • Using Francesa for a PR assault is part of the overall game plan to expose the sleazy investigative tactics of MLB in court. 
The fact that they appear to have abandoned the arbitration tells me that they are going for broke - they must feel that they have so much dirt on MLB that they will be able to force a favorable settlement from them to avoid having it all come out.  Maybe they are right, maybe they are wrong.  But the one thing that no one except the most ardent Yankee fanboy would believe that A-Rod isn't lying through his teeth today.
 
I will change my mind on this if A-Rod begins to give interviews to people with a shred of objectivity and an IQ in the triple digits.
 

Ed Hillel

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Sampo Gida said:
Horowitz not allowing them to question the guy who decided on Arods suspension length shows that he is in Buds back pocket. The last arbitrator to rule against MLB was fired, so you can’t be surprised this one knows how he has to rule to keep his job.
 
Meanwhile, Arod can not testify because MLB is the judge and jury on his testimonies accuracy, and he faces a longer suspension by testifying, even if he is truthful because anything he says that contradicts MLB will be construed as a lie.
 
So Arod figured out this is a sham, which was not news to his legal team (which is why they are going to court).
 
I mean, here you have MLB’s main evidence as coming from MLB knowingly purchasing stolen property (although some would say they were recovering it for Bosch) that impeded a FL investigation (perhaps even encouraging the theft), with a dubious chain of custody, and coerced testimony which is always unreliable, as a result of a frivolous (in a technical sense if not a legal sense)  lawsuit.
 
So good for Arod in walking out.  
 
Maybe his legal team can add Horwitz to the list of people to sue after the hearing and run up some more legal fees.  In the end it might have been cheaper for Arod to have accepted the 211 game suspension.
 
They all look terrible, including the Player's Union, which allowed this process in the first place. I can't stand ARod, but I'm not really sure I can blame ARod for anything he has done at this point where this process is concerned. I'm guessing they probably had this whole scenario acted out, with him banging his hands down and walking out to WFAN in the likely event of the ruling that Selig didn't have to testify. ARod obviously has no reason to say anything under oath now, and I'm not really sure he was going to even if Selig did testify (or were they proposing a promise to do so if Selig did?). Either way, fuck Selig and fuck ARod (though I am rooting for him for Yankees cap implications).
 

Sampo Gida

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Having Bud testify really is not that unprecedented
 


Selig testified in 2000 on the rationale of his decision to suspend Atlanta pitcher John Rocker for all 45 days of spring training and the first 28 days of the season, a penalty cut to the first 14 days of the regular season by arbitrator George Nicolau. Selig also testified in the 2002 contraction grievance, which settled.
 
Among other baseball commissioners to testify were Bowie Kuhn in the 1980 Ferguson Jenkins case, Peter Ueberroth in the 1980s collusion proceedings and Fay Vincent in the 1992 Steve Howe arbitration.
 
“The MLBPA believes that every player has the right under our arbitration process to directly confront his accuser,” the union said in a statement. “We argued strenuously to the arbitrator in Alex’s case that the commissioner should be required to appear and testify. While we respectfully disagree with the arbitrator’s ruling, we will abide by it as we continue to vigorously challenge Alex’s suspension within the context of this hearing.”
 
 
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/baseball/rodriguez-walks-out-of-grievance-hearing-after-arbitrator-refuses-to-order-selig-to-testify/article15524533/
 

Rovin Romine

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Ed Hillel said:
 
They all look terrible, including the Player's Union, which allowed this process in the first place. I can't stand ARod, but I'm not really sure I can blame ARod for anything he has done at this point where this process is concerned. I'm guessing they probably had this whole scenario acted out, with him banging his hands down and walking out to WFAN in the likely event of the ruling that Selig didn't have to testify. ARod obviously has no reason to say anything under oath now, and I'm not really sure he was going to even if Selig did testify (or were they proposing a promise to do so if Selig did?). Either way, fuck Selig and fuck ARod (though I am rooting for him for Yankees cap implications).
 
The whole "Selig isn't testifying" thing is likely a PR smokescreen for ARod not testifying.  Meaning, if ARod thinks the arb process is lost, his only fallback is to try to get it vacated (or stayed) in Federal court (which is damn unlikely.)   If he testifies in arb, but thinks arb is lost regardless, he's only putting evidence on record (testimony under oath) that might be used to sink his civil suit.   Now, the civil suit is a longshot in any event, but ARod might still be clinging to his dream of exposing the seedy underbelly of MLB.  
 
This is basically the Lance Armstrong Saga 2.0.
 
Step 1 - Deny, deny, deny - while futzing with witnesses behind the scenes.  And cheating.  
 
Step 2 - Limp into the Administrative Process for dealing with your suspension. 
 
Step 3 - At some point, in that process, realize you're screwed and try to get the Feds to intervene.
 
Step 4 - Seize on a meaningless issue which ignores the actual evidence against you - "I never tested positive.  They're out to get me.  They've always hated wonderful, talented, me!  They won't confront me the way I want them to.  I'm special and godlike.  Somebody please pay attention to me."
 
Step 5 - Reiterate your sour grapes, "it was all rigged from the begging," stance. 
 
Step 6 - Watch the sponsors leave, watch the lawsuits flow in (or your own lawsuits fail.)
 
Step 7 - Kind of sort of admit that you really should have cooperated and/or taken the deal in the first place.  Not that you did anything wrong - well, nothing that everyone else wasn't doing anyway.  And, dammit, you were singled out.  
 
***
I think Arod has basically forgotten that a bunch of other players admitted to getting PEDs from Bosch.   
 
When you take a step back and look at the big picture, he really never should have gone into arb in the first place.  I'm sure his lawyers are happy with their paychecks though.  Likely none of them will be exchanging Xmas cards with him next year. 
 

Hoplite

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So the winter meetings are in what, 18 days? If the suspension hearing isn't able to be wrapped up this week, it will need to be rescheduled for a later date. Once the hearing eventually does wrap up, the arbitrator has 25 days to make a decision. Meanwhile, the Yankees don't know if they'll have a third baseman or how much money they'll have to work with.
 

glennhoffmania

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I love it when ARod tries to sound all smart and serious.  It only makes him seem douchier.
 
Here's what I don't understand.  This guy has done everything possible to embarrass MLB, threaten law suits, filed law suits, and chose to go down the path of a long, drawn out arbitration.  Why in the world does he think Selig or Manfred should agree to meet him for coffee or brunch before this thing is settled?  He really is fucking delusional.
 

glennhoffmania

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Hoplite said:
So the winter meetings are in what, 18 days? If the suspension hearing isn't able to be wrapped up this week, it will need to be rescheduled for a later date. Once the hearing eventually does wrap up, the arbitrator has 25 days to make a decision. Meanwhile, the Yankees don't know if they'll have a third baseman or how much money they'll have to work with.
 
Yeah, you said that already.
 
Hoplite said:
It's seeming increasingly unlikely that the Yankees will know what will happen to A-Rod by the winter meetings. Once the hearings end (if they ever do), the arbitrator has another 25 days to make a decision. The winter meetings are in 18 days.
 

mauidano

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Rovin Romine said:
 
The whole "Selig isn't testifying" thing is likely a PR smokescreen for ARod not testifying.  Meaning, if ARod thinks the arb process is lost, his only fallback is to try to get it vacated (or stayed) in Federal court (which is damn unlikely.)   If he testifies in arb, but thinks arb is lost regardless, he's only putting evidence on record (testimony under oath) that might be used to sink his civil suit.   Now, the civil suit is a longshot in any event, but ARod might still be clinging to his dream of exposing the seedy underbelly of MLB.  
 
***
I think Arod has basically forgotten that a bunch of other players admitted to getting PEDs from Bosch.   
 
When you take a step back and look at the big picture, he really never should have gone into arb in the first place.  I'm sure his lawyers are happy with their paychecks though.  Likely none of them will be exchanging Xmas cards with him next year. 
 
This....
Hoplite said:
So the winter meetings are in what, 18 days? If the suspension hearing isn't able to be wrapped up this week, it will need to be rescheduled for a later date. Once the hearing eventually does wrap up, the arbitrator has 25 days to make a decision. Meanwhile, the Yankees don't know if they'll have a third baseman or how much money they'll have to work with.
and this....
 
glennhoffmania said:
I love it when ARod tries to sound all smart and serious.  It only makes him seem douchier.
 
Here's what I don't understand.  This guy has done everything possible to embarrass MLB, threaten law suits, filed law suits, and chose to go down the path of a long, drawn out arbitration.  Why in the world does he think Selig or Manfred should agree to meet him for coffee or brunch before this thing is settled?  He really is fucking delusional.
AND all of this.  Someone sees the handwriting on the wall from his legal group.  Today's circus is nothing more than that. A-Rod is right there next to Broadway.   Distractions, smokescreens etc.  He's gonna lose big-time.  And his legal team?  They couldn't care less.  They are getting paid handsomely.  ALMOST feel bad for the Yankees.  Almost. :rolling:
 

twibnotes

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Its like Christmas on November 20th!


Yes and no. I want Arod wearing pinstripes and wasting the MFY's money.
 

Sprowl

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DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
Its like Christmas on November 20th!
 
A-Rod is Santa Claus of Black Friday, the start of the Holy Season. He has put himself on special double discount.
 

terrisus

formerly: imgran
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Man, this is a pretty epic meltdown.
 
It would be so much more enjoyable if one of the results wasn't the Yankees saving tens of millions of dollars.
Should make them pay the money into some sort of "PED Rehabilitation Fund" or something.
 
(Oh, and in regards to the "The longer this drags out, the longer the Yankees will have to be uncertain about next season and unable to move forward with other plans" line of thinking - I think any rational person knows that Rodriguez is going to be suspended for next season. So, I think they're pretty safe with going ahead assuming they're going to be saving that money - unfortunately).
 

nattysez

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I don't think it's fair to call this a meltdown.  This is all pretty clearly planned.  
 
As generally suggested in the thread, Slappy was going for the Ryan Braun approach:  prove that MLB's investigation was flawed and therefore he shouldn't be suspended.  When that failed (as evidenced by his attorney's repeated statement to Fat Mike that "the arbitrator should have ruled in our favor at the close of MLB's evidence"), they needed a new approach.  As soon as it became clear Selig wouldn't testify (which I suspect they knew was going to happen all along), Slappy had his "meltdown" so they could escape the now-failed arbitration gambit and try something else.  
 
However, what's not clear to me is what the next viable step is.  I expect the plan from here may be to allow the arbitrator to rule, then seek to enjoin the suspension.  But I have serious doubts that's going to accomplish anything.
 

Stu Nahan

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Average Reds said:
But he didn't go on with anyone - he went on with Tubby Francesa, who was so astounded that he had A-Rod in the studio that his inner Yankee fan came out and he didn't ask him a single difficult question.


I will change my mind on this if A-Rod begins to give interviews to people with a shred of objectivity and an IQ in the triple digits.
He got him on record with a full denial. I'm not quite sure what you wanted him to ask. He's a talk show host, not a lawyer. Also, while he may be biased, he's not an idiot. I understand that you're being hyperbolic. Mike is an obnoxious, know it all blowhard, but his IQ is safely in triple digits.
 

NDame616

will bailey
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Jul 31, 2006
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Originally I looked at this and said "good! Glad ARod is going to arbitration. Selig randomly picking a number and suspending him for that random number is wrong and ARod should fight it tooth and nail"
 
I don't know what other evidence MLB has about ARod that would add 160+ games that Braun, Peralta, etc got. I think if ARod played this "by the book" lets say, and his defense was just "yes, I took PEDs from Bosch, but I deserve the same amount of games as everyone else" he'd have a case. Make MLB show WHY it chose to push it to 211. That being said, maybe whatever they have is so terrible damning to ARod and MLB that they don't want it publicly known.
 
In the whole steroid era, "fixing it" the joint drug prevention policy etc...I've ALWAYS looked at Selig as the slimey bad guy who oversaw all of this, knew what was going on, and only changed it when the stuff hit the fan. I was hoping PEDs would be his legacy. For better or worse, 15 years from now when we all talk about PEDs in baseball, maybe we'll all just remember the epic ARod story, and not the used car salesman that made it all possible.
 

Montana Fan

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What I liked was when he put on his Game 7, ALCS, 2004, Red Sox are celebrating in Yankee Stadium and I'm really, really mad, face. Check out the Deadspin video if you want to see it. Hahahaha!
 

Average Reds

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Stu Nahan said:
He got him on record with a full denial. I'm not quite sure what you wanted him to ask. He's a talk show host, not a lawyer. Also, while he may be biased, he's not an idiot. I understand that you're being hyperbolic. Mike is an obnoxious, know it all blowhard, but his IQ is safely in triple digits.
 
It was obvious hyperbole.  Still, the point stands:  Francesa did not ask a single difficult question.
 
Here's an example of what I mean.  Let's say you are Mike Francesa and you have been bloviating on this issue for months.  A-Rod just strolls into your studio out of the blue and issues a flat denial of PED use in connection with Anthony Bosch 
 
That sort of assertion is simply screaming for follow up questions, and off the top of my head I can think of a bunch of good ones:
  • Are you aware that Bosch has admitted that he provided PEDs to MLB players? 
  • Are you aware that a dozen players have admitted that they received PEDs from Bosch?
  • Are you arguing that the only players who received supplements from Bosch but no PEDs are you and Gio Gonzalez?
  • If you have done nothing and there's no evidence that you have taken PEDs from Bosch, how do you explain that MLB has cleared Gonzalez but won't do the same for you?
  • If there's no evidence, why are you not confident that the arbitration process will clear you? 
  • Why do you want Selig to testify?  What role did he play in uncovering evidence against you?  What is the relevance of his testimony at the arbitration hearing?  Why did the arbitrator rule that he did not have to testify?
And here's the one I'd really want to hear:
  • When reports first surfaced early in the year of your ties to Bosch, you initially denied having anything to do with him.  Said there was no connection, that you didn't even know who he was.  We now know that was a complete lie.  So how are we supposed to believe your denials now?
Again, that's just off the top of my head.  I'm sure there's another 20 questions I could ask to pin A-Rod down if he was in front of me, because his story is simply preposterous on its face.  But Francesa has made clear that he wants to believe this is a witch hunt, so he's not going to do that.
 
And to be clear, I'm not really faulting Francesa here - he is who he is.  But let's not pretend that this was A-Rod on 60 Minutes.  This was a cheap PR stunt that proves exactly nothing. 
 

glennhoffmania

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Those are all great questions.  But we would've gotten no good responses.  ARod would continue to say he's being railroaded, that the whole process is unfair, that he loves NY, and he wants to go see his daughters- but only after he has an all night session with his lawyers.  So while I agree that Mike could've been a little tougher on him I think the result would've been the same.
 

Average Reds

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glennhoffmania said:
Those are all great questions.  But we would've gotten no good responses.  ARod would continue to say he's being railroaded, that the whole process is unfair, that he loves NY, and he wants to go see his daughters- but only after he has an all night session with his lawyers.  So while I agree that Mike could've been a little tougher on him I think the result would've been the same.
 
The lack of a good response would have clearly exposed A-Rod as the fraud he is. 
 
Instead, you'll have morons like Tubby characterizing A-Rod's appearance as being "brave" and using the empty shell of his meaningless denials as if they are actual evidence of innocence.
 

TheYaz67

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terrisus said:
Man, this is a pretty epic meltdown.
 
It would be so much more enjoyable if one of the results wasn't the Yankees saving tens of millions of dollars.
Should make them pay the money into some sort of "PED Rehabilitation Fund" or something.
 
(Oh, and in regards to the "The longer this drags out, the longer the Yankees will have to be uncertain about next season and unable to move forward with other plans" line of thinking - I think any rational person knows that Rodriguez is going to be suspended for next season. So, I think they're pretty safe with going ahead assuming they're going to be saving that money - unfortunately).
 
Well, yes and no.  I mean, the CBA has a pretty defined set of rules, procedures and penalties that are meant to serve both the league's ends and to "protect" the player.  There is no special formula defined in the CBA that caused MLB to arrive at a number of 211 games - they are obviously arguing for a big number like that b/c they view A-Rod as a multiple-time abuser (but with no positive tests they can use) who tried to impede an investigation, and want to set a precedence to discourage such behavior in the future.  But a more technical reading, if the arbitrator hews to it, may result in A-Rod getting only 50 or 100 games.  If that happens, then the Yankees do have a more complicated money and playing time set of issues on their hands....
 

Jaylach

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Sep 26, 2007
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I know this has been said before, but I can't help but feel the need to reiterate it.
 
What stands out the most to me in this whole ARod thing is his total lack of denial. He's been pretty stone cold about how unfair the process is, how he doesn't deserve a 200+ game suspension, how MLB is out to screw him, etc. Yet, when it comes to declaring his innocence, he doesn't really say much. Sure, maybe in passing he'll say "Well, I'm innocent" .. but not at all like he's fighting agains the MLB and their "fraudness". 
 
We all know he's guilty, he knows he's guilty.. but I just find it telling that he's not playing the "I'm innocent and was framed" card.