Retired African American baseball players on race, baseball, America

The Gray Eagle

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Aug 1, 2001
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This is a really great and informative conversation about race, baseball and America, with Doug Glanville, Jimmy Rollins, Dontrelle Willis, Torii Hunter, Ryan Howard and Latroy Hawkins.

It's on the Athletic, so it's probably behind a paywall. (They recently had a free 90-trial, sign up, it's really worth it.)

https://theathletic.com/1849574/2020/06/02/a-conversation-retired-african-american-mlb-players-on-race-baseball-america/
Some of the conversation:

Hunter: We had a situation, LaTroy and I in our organization — no names. But we had a situation where players were getting called the n-word or being told, “Turn your kind of music down.” Different things like that. And now we’re in that front office. We said, “Hey, do something about it.” And we went to (chief baseball officer) Derek Falvey right away. Bam! Derek Falvey did something about it. That’s what we need.

Derek Falvey got the information, didn’t cover it up. He got (this guy) out of there because we can’t do that. It’s time for change. That’s why I have so much respect for Derek Falvey, for listening to LaTroy and I, listening to some of the players on the team, that voiced their opinion about what this guy was saying to them, their problem, their complaint. That’s what it’s going to take.


Willis: My grandfather fought in the war. My mom was in the Army. My cousin is a sheriff in Hayward (Calif.). I have people who have brought things to the community. It breaks my heart that we’re at this point in 2020 where we’re right back to the fight that our grandparents fought and died for, hoping it would be better for our parents.


Hawkins: I saw a quote that said, “Caucasians want our rhythm. But they don’t want our blues.” That resonated with me. It’s true. We’re entertainers. In all walks of life, you’ve got African Americans doing great things. But there is still a harness, like Torii said, a harness pulling ’em back. You really can’t be yourself. Once you leave the entertainment realm and you’re driving down the street, anything can happen.

It’s just sad. It’s just one of those things: When. Will. It. Change? People are upset. People are furious. Everybody is talking about people burning things down, looting, doing this and that. I look at it like this. You know who taught black people how to loot and riot? The KKK. They did it first. People are tired. They’re tired of not being heard.

Colin Kaepernick did a peaceful protest and he got crucified for it. Now things aren’t peaceful. And people are still getting crucified for it. But if the right people don’t start listening, our people and the people that stand with us, they’re going to be relentless. They’re tired of seeing African Americans, minorities, killed in the street like dogs. They’re tired. We’re tired.

Hunter: When you talk about white privilege, I had someone tell me, “My parents had to work. And they got everything they got by working.” I said, “That ain’t white privilege! That’s not what we’re talking about!” We’re talking about, you can drive down the street and police get behind you and you ain’t even worried about it. You can tell your kid, “Have a good day!” I can’t say that. I say, “Hey, this happened, this happened and this happened.” So they won’t get killed. They’ve got to come home and say, “Someone called me the n-word today at school.” What are you supposed to do?

What we have to do is come to a peaceful solution, build relationships with one another, be uncomfortable being uncomfortable. Come to my house. Let me go to your house. Let me get to know you, you get to know us. Let’s have a little dialogue about what we need to do for change. And you know what? It’s all about relationships. If we can get back to that, that’s what is going to change this.

Rollins (on George Floyd's murder):
But to see him sit there minute after minute after minute, you already have him cuffed. You want to keep him down? Put your hand on his back. Put your hand on his shoulder. As he tries to make a move, do something. But no, you literally sat there in defiance like, No, I’m going to do what I want to do. Like his life doesn’t matter. The only thing that matters is, “He will listen when I tell him to do whatever it is I tell him to do.” He didn’t want to get in the car, so they say. So now, this is his consequence.

In the beginning, it was more shock. It was like, “This dude, he really just sat there on his neck.” And then, the next day, you think about it, I remember I was picking up some food, and like Torii, I just started crying. Just angry. What do you do? This man has no remorse. There was not one second it appeared he considered (stopping). It was kind of like, “I hear you, but I’m not going to do it. I don’t want to. I don’t have to do it. I’m protected by the badge. If he dies, he dies.” That was his attitude.

And that’s the part that really, really gets to you. How many other people, whether behind the badge or just in life, literally have the same feeling, think the same way? That if this person dies because I’m white and he’s black, and he didn’t listen to what I said, then I’m going to do what I want with him until I get his compliance? And if he dies, he dies.

I understand the frustration white people have with the rioting, the looting, the protesting. It all escalates. It starts as protest. Then police come around and it turns riotous. And then looting happens. But you can look at two men in the black community historically. You have Martin Luther King Jr. and Malcolm X. Stood on different sides of the fence. And they both were assassinated fighting for the right thing. So, what is the right way to do it?

Howard: I said, “Officer, can you tell me what I was doing?” He said, “Well, I ran your plates and nothing came back.” I was like, “Isn’t that a good thing? I didn’t speed, didn’t run any lights. I wasn’t doing anything crazy, but you felt the need to pull me over.” Then another police officer pulled up, a black police officer. He went over to the dude and said, “You know who that is?” He came over and talked to me, the dude wound up leaving.

I said, “Look, man, if I’m breaking a law, I don’t care who I am, what I do, that don’t matter. If I’m running a light or not signaling and you pull me over, that’s fine. But when he tells me he pulled me over because he ran my tag and nothing came back what am I supposed to do?” The black officer said, “Yeah, that dude has done that a few times.” He ended up getting reprimanded by his superiors. But when you have people like that working in that capacity, what can you do?

Hawkins: Every city I played in, I always immersed myself into the police department just so they could see my face, get to know me and what type of person I am and understand that I am not a threat. I did that here in Prosper (Texas). I had the guys come over, asked them who their favorite baseball players were. Nolan Ryan? Well, I’ve got a Nolan Ryan ball, here you go. I did the same thing with the fire department, just so they understood that I’m not a threat. I’m on your side. I understand you’ve got a very tough job to do. Every day.

I’ve got a cousin who is a police chief in Indianapolis. I’ve got nephews who are police officers. I understand. I just make sure the police know who I am, make sure they know who my wife is, who my daughter is so when she’s out driving they can be like, “OK, that’s LaTroy’s daughter.” Just to be on the safe side. I don’t think anybody else of any other color does that. And I do it for my own safety and the safety of my family.
 

Dummy Hoy

Angry Pissbum
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Jul 22, 2006
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White people so rarely have the opportunity to listen to black folk speak openly and unconditionally about their experience. And given the opportunity to actually listen, they too often avoid it, or try to qualify it, or deny it, or”not all white people”it. I was fortunate enough to spend a few years working in urban schools where the majority of my colleagues (and then friends) were black.

Do not pass up the opportunity to to listen, to really listen and empathize, to these voices.

I thought this was one of the best pieces I’ve seen from the Athletic and most certainly one of the most important. I really hope they release the whole 90 minute conversation.
 

PC Drunken Friar

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Sep 12, 2003
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White people so rarely have the opportunity to listen to black folk speak openly and unconditionally about their experience. And given the opportunity to actually listen, they too often avoid it, or try to qualify it, or deny it, or”not all white people”it. I was fortunate enough to spend a few years working in urban schools where the majority of my colleagues (and then friends) were black.

Do not pass up the opportunity to to listen, to really listen and empathize, to these voices.

I thought this was one of the best pieces I’ve seen from the Athletic and most certainly one of the most important. I really hope they release the whole 90 minute conversation.
This was very well done and the insights are great and stories show a lot. But, as I stated in the Athletic thread, it is so disappointing that they included a bigot in Torii Hunter on this panel. They could have gotten any number of other former players.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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Mar 11, 2007
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This was very well done and the insights are great and stories show a lot. But, as I stated in the Athletic thread, it is so disappointing that they included a bigot in Torii Hunter on this panel. They could have gotten any number of other former players.
Whoa. I've only great things about Hunter... .what has he said or done that makes him a "bigot"?
 

moondog80

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Sep 20, 2005
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Mercifully, it is a tiny proportion of the population that would disregard Torii Hunter's experience with race relations based on his view on gay marriage.
 

PC Drunken Friar

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Mercifully, it is a tiny proportion of the population that would disregard Torii Hunter's experience with race relations based on his view on gay marriage.
Bigotry is bigotry. There were others that could have been interviewed.

I understand his experiences are valuable to hear and learn from...but he is still a shitty human being. Find someone else.
 

Kliq

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Mar 31, 2013
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Bigotry is bigotry. There were others that could have been interviewed.

I understand his experiences are valuable to hear and learn from...but he is still a shitty human being. Find someone else.
Kind of like how Tony Dungy was being praised for his leadership when he was talking about forgiving Drew Brees earlier today.
 

EdRalphRomero

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Oct 3, 2007
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Mercifully, it is a tiny proportion of the population that would disregard Torii Hunter's experience with race relations based on his view on gay marriage.
Whatever the size of that proportion, I am 100% in it. I don't want to listen to a member of the Klan talk about his experience as a gay man in America, and I don't want to hear anything out of Torii Hunter. He's a bigot and the world would be a better place if bigots like him were told far more often to STFU about everything.
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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Mar 11, 2007
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Torri Hunter actually had a no trade clause to Boston because of racist taunts.
I don't blame him.... Boston is still chock full of racists. It's definitely not as bad as when I was a kid but it's still a horribly racist city (I think most of them are coming from the 'burbs though now). Wouldn't it be nice if players could say that they didn't want to be traded to Houston or St. Louis (or wherever) because they heard hateful anti-gay rhetoric coming from the fans? I've heard tons of people call A-Rod a f*# and used to often make jokes about he and Jeter butt-fucking. I wonder how often Torii said anti-gay things to players either on his team or opposing teams.
 

GoDa

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Sep 25, 2017
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I don't blame him.... Boston is still chock full of racists. It's definitely not as bad as when I was a kid but it's still a horribly racist city (I think most of them are coming from the 'burbs though now). Wouldn't it be nice if players could say that they didn't want to be traded to Houston or St. Louis (or wherever) because they heard hateful anti-gay rhetoric coming from the fans? I've heard tons of people call A-Rod a f*# and used to often make jokes about he and Jeter butt-fucking. I wonder how often Torii said anti-gay things to players either on his team or opposing teams.
As opposed to where?

I certainly wouldn't deny that there are racist a-holes in Boston, but I think a lot of people just equate a 'lesser degree of diversity' in the city of Boston with 'more racism.' With respect to sports, the worst racism I've ever seen and it isn't even close, was in a bar in Philadelphia. Was warned away from a couple of bars in Montgomery, AL... on the advice of avoiding racist rednecks. And, though I don't remember anything sports-related... while southern California is incredibly diverse, get people into smaller more homogeneous groups and you'll hear some things.

Anyway, Torii Hunter is a dink.
 

cornwalls@6

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Apr 23, 2010
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Bigots don't get to call out other bigots, and retain any credibility. Fuck Torii Hunter. The rest of that conversation was powerful and well worth reading. As far as the as latest iteration of the beyond tiresome attack/defend Boston's racial climate, if the last couple weeks have reminded us of anything, it's that the sickness of racism exists everywhere, Boston Included. There are no utopias in this country. The best you can say is that some places, at least in terms of institutions and policies, might try a little harder than others. But this silly game of gotcha, your city's more racist than mine*, is foolish, accomplishes nothing, and hugely misses the larger point, and the greater struggle IMO.


* I don't really think anyone here is doing that, just commenting on the general topic as it pops up in the culture periodically.
 
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