Sons of Peter McNeeley- Boxing Thread

eddiew112

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Guerrero's chin is pretty impressive considering that he started his career at 126 and Thurman dropped down from 154
 

ElUno20

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Broner fought an excellent, smart fight. he hasnt made the 10000% adjustment from the stuff maidana caught him with but its there. he slips punches better and more importantly knows to take that slight half step out of range when his opponent is jabbing and loading up. The fight being shit is all on molina. But considering his circumstances i can see why he had no fire. I just hate the whining after fights. Broner was there in front of him all night and the first thing out of his mouth is some bullshit about running.


Thurman made me a full fledged fan tonight. I cant think of 1 guy at welterweight he wouldnt have a shot at beating. He's the complete package.

The production was a little different and leonard was too nice and a bit nonsensical at times but overall im excited for what this can do for the sport.
 

ElUno20

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UnfrozenCavemanGrebeck said:
Pretty solid start for this series. My one complaint - NBC really needs to reevaluate their commentators for these broadcasts.
Agreed. a few complaints to add.

i understand everyone loves Leonard but he spent the night trying to keep it that way instead of doing his job. He was so off base most of the Broner fight i was hoping for more cursing from the crowd so we could get the long mute of the audio. Then he goes in on Broner for not closing the show, man just stfu. He fought a smart ass fight and basically up 20 you're mad the starters aren't being put back in ? Gtfoh.

The fighters need their entrance music and at the least their corner men coming out with them. The generic entrances last night were pretty weak and boring. Let the guys have their flavor.

Also if the point is to make these guys household names, and im in no way a marketing expert, on the way down to the ring put their twitter handle on screen. Even storage wars does that.
 

theapportioner

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ElUno20 said:
i understand everyone loves Leonard but he spent the night trying to keep it that way instead of doing his job. He was so off base most of the Broner fight i was hoping for more cursing from the crowd so we could get the long mute of the audio. Then he goes in on Broner for not closing the show, man just stfu. He fought a smart ass fight and basically up 20 you're mad the starters aren't being put back in ? Gtfoh.
 
Yeah, for somebody who obviously knows boxing, I was disappointed at how simplistic his analysis sounded. I mean, one has to entertain, dumb things down, and what-not but I felt like I learned much more about the fighters' abilities through Marciano's short paragraphs in the 25 years ago thread, than through whatever the announcers said on-air.
 

Marciano490

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I'm no Leonard fan. #marvinwon. But boxing is a hard sport to announce. You never know how the action will ebb or flow and there's so much nitty gritty that the public is wholly unaware of it's difficult to talk about the more scientific aspects. I get the frustration though - I watch football and baseball and don't really feel I have a good sense of the game or technique.
 

Marciano490

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The best American heavyweights are TEs and LBs. There is absolutely no incentive for an athletic 6'5 dude to start boxing instead of playing football. The amateur football system in America is too lucrative and the amateur boxing system too much of a joke for anyone to give up the former for the latter. That's why you have to wait for a guy like Wilder - who I think has a ton of potential - to someone miss going off to play college ball and focus on boxing instead. Or you get some guys like Michael Grant back in the day who start boxing in their twenties after football.

The other issues is heavyweights are just so big now that it's hard for even the greatest amount of skill to overcome the size disparity. Guys like Adamek, Jirov, Toney who were great boxers just can't contend with monsters like Klitschko. They really need a superheavyweight division that starts at 231 or so. Maybe Ali or Foreman or Holmes could've competed nowadays, but Tyson, Frazier, Marciano, Dempsey - all those guys never would've sniffed a title in the modern era.
 

FL4WL3SS

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Marciano490 said:
I'm no Leonard fan. #marvinwon. But boxing is a hard sport to announce. You never know how the action will ebb or flow and there's so much nitty gritty that the public is wholly unaware of it's difficult to talk about the more scientific aspects. I get the frustration though - I watch football and baseball and don't really feel I have a good sense of the game or technique.
It may be difficult to announce, but anything would have been more valuable than just repeating how much Molina was impressing him for standing in there vs. Broner. He said this each round multiple times.
 
Then he kept repeating how strong Thurman was during the entire second fight. There was no substance to any of his commentary. The only thing that was of any substance was him saying that Broner should be going to the body more because Molina was wide open, which made me watch for that the rest of the fight.
 
I think Ray Leonard gets the announcing gigs because he's a former superstar and he's very articulate. His analysis sucked though.
 

FL4WL3SS

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As far as the Molina v. Broner fight goes - I think Molina was trying to get Broner to wear down by letting him throw a ton of punches. This strategy obviously didn't work as Broner actually got stronger as the fight went on and Molina couldn't get into a groove. His strategy for that fight was terrible. He needed to throw a lot more punches early and get Broner on his heels so he could then land that big haymaker he tried to throw all night. Instead he kept throwing it early and not establishing himself.
 
I also thought the officiating was terrible and really threw Molina off his game. Broner is definitely the more skilled fighter, but I thought Molina might be able to win with his height and power advantage.
 
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Agreed that officiating for the Broner fight was piss poor. He wouldn't let Molina put his head down to get inside and that seemed to really throw off his game plan. What his exact game plan was, I couldn't tell you because they have to censor the corners between rounds. I usually enjoy hearing Goosen work a fight so that is another gripe I had with enjoying these free fights (I feel like a jerk for complaining about non-PPV cards)
 

Marciano490

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Thinking about it more, there are actually a lot of good boxing announcers.  Honestly, I hate Leonard and tune him out whenever he talks, so I'll take people's word for it that he was subpar.  But, Roy Jones does an excellent job. He's not super articulate, but if he tells you that a fighter is vulnerable to hooks to the body, chances are that fighter is going down from a body shot.  He knows the sport so well and can really get into the technique without being pedantic.  Andre Ward also does a great job, though his affect is a bit flat.  He's another guy who knows the sport inside and out, and it doesn't hurt that he's still a top 3 pound for pound guy.  Paulie Malinaggi is probably my favorite - very knowledgeable, knows most of the fighters personally and is fun to listen to.  He stays positive but is not afraid to call guys out. 
 
Mauro also does a great job - he's got a good voice and let's the action unfold.  He also rises to the occasion and let's you feel the action.  The HBO crew besides Jones/Ward is pretty meh.  Lampley loves hearing himself talk too much and is too fond of leaning on his rote phrases - "battered from pillar to post" etc.  He, like Kellerman, is also way too prone to pick a narrative and stick with it throughout the fight.  Once you can tell which fighter they're pulling for it can be pretty absurd as they crow about jabs that barely land for their guy, then ignore hard hooks from the other fighter.  So many times I'll watch a fight on HBO and feel like what I'm watching and what they're watching are two different fights.  I used to like Kellerman when he was a wide-eyed boxing nerd, but now he's pretentious and another bandwagon announcer.  Plus, for a guy whose only fight on record was with his girlfriend, he's very eager to call out professional fighters' hearts and chins.  Actually, Lampley is another guy who likes to hit women.  In sum, there are a lot of good announcers out there, but fuck HBO except for Jones and Ward.
 

ElUno20

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I dont completely hate max because i listen to him clown around on his show everyday so it softens him up a bit but i see your points.

Roy and ward are both excellent. But i do feel online Roy gets shit because he is very country so a lot of the time his analysis doesn't sound as polished. But roy does something jim and max never do, he will admit during a fight that he was wrong and move on. He wont stick with a narrative to save face

Paulie and roy are tied in my book. Both very fun to listen to
 

Marciano490

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Yeah, Roy's good for a couple malapropisms per fight and he's not as polished as Paulie, but he picks up on everything and can break down a fight and fighter better than anyone else out there.
 
Oh, I miss Larry Merchant a lot.  I know he was polarizing, but he was always my favorite and I'll always adore him for that Mayweather interview after the Ortiz fight.
 
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6Zert5VaWk[/youtube]
 

Marciano490

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Kovalev vs. Pascal should be a lot of fun this Saturday on HBO free.  Kovalev is a real deal power puncher and Pascal swings away and has a porous defense, but is quick and aggressive.  Kovalev puts him down, but Pascal likely gets his licks in.
 

mascho

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Marciano490 said:
Kovalev vs. Pascal should be a lot of fun this Saturday on HBO free.  Kovalev is a real deal power puncher and Pascal swings away and has a porous defense, but is quick and aggressive.  Kovalev puts him down, but Pascal likely gets his licks in.
Heh. I was honestly coming in here to ask you about this fight. Cool. Thanks man.
 

Marciano490

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Mark Schofield said:
Heh. I was honestly coming in here to ask you about this fight. Cool. Thanks man.
 
Yeah - definitely watch this one.  I think Kovalev is the best puncher in the sport right now and Pascal is always entertaining.  I'd rather see Kovalev v. Stevenson, but on paper at least this is one of the better matchups that could be made in the higher divisions.  Sucks the UFC has a good card running at the same time.
 

ElUno20

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Chris Arreola is currently in a dogfight against a scrub who was supposed to be a tuneup on spike tv
 

Lanternjaw

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Long time no speak, fellas...
 
Loved the Arreola/Harper bout last night... but had Arreola trained properly (which he seldom ever does) he'd have knocked that Harper out inside of 3 rounds and saved himself his umpteenth broken nose.  Loved Seeing Berto rally for a KO.  Love both fighters but favored Berto a bit over Josesito bc I saw him fight live in Saratoga before he won a belt.  
 
Tonight's Kovalev/Pascal bout should be a great one, too.  Just finished watching the Campbell/Kellerman/Rafael discussion on the ESPN front page and at the end I couldn't help but to wish that Kovalev, Pascal, Stevenson, and whoever else is left in the light heavyweight division was in their prime 5 years ago.  To see Joe Calzaghe face these fighters during his "gonna finally show the world I'm great" tour would've been pure bliss.  I've got Kovalev by close but unanimous decision tonight with both fighters winning lucrative fights going forward as a result.  Should be a great one with at least one knockdown.
 
Got tickets for Provodnikov/Matthysse  at Turning Stone.  I've always been able to get ringsides at TS but this bout was brutal... just glad to be in the house.
 
BTW, be on the lookout this year for Taras Shelestyuk, a former Olympic bronze medalist from Ukraine, to make a big move in the super welterweight division.  Saw his pro debut at TS a couple years ago and his 2nd to last bout, again at TS.  He's 11-0 with 8 KO's, a southpaw with terrific hand speed, power, and lateral movement, and a fighter who is humble and hungry.  Trains at the Wild Card gym, too, and typically has Marvin Samodia in his corner... very exciting fighter.
 

Marciano490

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Prov vs Matthysse should be an incredible fight. It's bouts like that that go under the radar but make me furious when people saying boxing is dead.

I disagree with your take on tonight's fight. Think Kovalev scores a ko and there are at least three knockdowns in the fight. Happy to make a same charitable wager to that effect.
 

Lanternjaw

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I think Pascal has a a good chin and that Hopkins finally got old in that last fight with Kovalev, so Pascal fought a tougher brand of B-Hop.  Probably Kovalev's toughest fight... no wager, lol - but we'll see!
 

Marciano490

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Cunningham has a body like he could punch through walls and go 20 rounds but his punches look softer than a welterweight's and he's gassed through 7.
 

Time to Mo Vaughn

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Looked like Cunningham by maybe a round to me. Would be interested in the thoughts of people that watch a lot more fights though.
 

Marciano490

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He really needs to hook off his right or eat a Kovalev jab and throw it. It's right there for him.
 

ElUno20

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Joke of a stoppage.

I have no idea why Adonis is afraid of kovalev. Straight up and down a basic ass fighter
 

Marciano490

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Yeah that felt early. Especially after Pascal came back before. Disagree with your assessment of Kovalev though, he's the best there is over 147. Needs to keep that right up though, Stevenson would get that hook in.
 

Marciano490

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Anybody planning to go to Peterson-Garcia at the Barclay's on April 11 or Klitschko-Jennings at MSG April 25?
 

ElUno20

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Tomorrow begins like 8 straight weeks of medium to huge fights.
i know I'm probably on the late train, but if you're a boxing fan you need The Ropes grantland podcast in your life. It's very entertaining
 

ElUno20

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Rafael just tweeted that Adonis Kovalev have agreed to a 50-50 split and now will go to a purse bid
 

Marciano490

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ElUno20 said:
Rafael just tweeted that Adonis Kovalev have agreed to a 50-50 split and now will go to a purse bid
 
Lot of heavy artillery in that fight, but Kovalev should win going away.
 
Who said boxing's dead again?
 

ElUno20

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With may and pac finally getting done, it strips away everyone's excuses for not making fights
 

Time to Mo Vaughn

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Was watching the Gonzalez/Russell Jr. fight that just finished. Are 90% of knockdowns concussions? How do these guys not all have CET at the of their careers?
 

Marciano490

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Adonis fighting Bika tomorrow on free nbc at 3 pm. Should be a fun action fight. Liike for a Stevenson KO.
 

Marciano490

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Great, great card on NBC tomorrow night from Brooklyn.  Garcia-Peterson and Lee-Quillin.  Both should be action fights between high-level competitors.  I think good Peterson and bad Garcia show up and Lamont wins the main event.  Lee has power and you always have to respect that, but I think Quillin is too skilled for him and takes the fight.