Stop hoarding TP(E) - the what should the Celtics do with the TPE thread

What should the Celtics do with their TPE

  • Use it before the current season starts

    Votes: 6 4.6%
  • See what is available around the NBA trade deadline and level up for the playoffs

    Votes: 55 42.3%
  • Save it for next summer's free agent bonanza

    Votes: 69 53.1%

  • Total voters
    130

HowBoutDemSox

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Bjelica would seem to fit---he's available I assume. $7.1 mil salary. Can the 175% rule get that within the Kanter exception, or would it require a piece of the Hayward exception?
Can’t use the 175% rule for the TPE, only +/- $100k, 175% is only for simultaneous trades and TPE transactions are by definition non-simultaneous trades.
 

lovegtm

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Out of all the names mentioned, I like Barnes the best for fit and likely acquisition cost.
 

Cesar Crespo

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Harrison Barnes looked decent in his "Get me the Hell out of here" game.
Is he really on the block or are people assuming he is? The Kings are 10-11 atm.

Barnes would be a decent fit, though. See if you can get Bjelica or GRIII in the process too.
 

Cellar-Door

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Is he really on the block or are people assuming he is? The Kings are 10-11 atm.

Barnes would be a decent fit, though. See if you can get Bjelica or GRIII in the process too.
I think Bjelica is definitely available, I haven't seen anything to suggest Barnes is.
 

DGreenwood

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Any talk of using the TPE on Barnes this year should also include what salary we would send out to stay below the luxury tax threshold. I really don't think Ainge will be willing to start the clock on the repeater tax a year early.

The Celtics are currently about 13.5 million below the threshold and Barnes cap number is about $22.2 million so he'd put us about $8.7 million over the tax line (before subtracting outgoing salaries).
 
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Swedgin

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Is he really on the block or are people assuming he is? The Kings are 10-11 atm.

Barnes would be a decent fit, though. See if you can get Bjelica or GRIII in the process too.
I would be surprised if they move Barnes. You could certainly argue a well run organization should want to get value out of a guy like Barnes given where they are in terms of the team building cycle. But this is the Kings and reportedly Barnes was on the owners "guys" because of the Golden State history.

Bjelica, who I like, is riding the DNP train. They are not loosing anything by moving him and do him/his agent a solid if they trade him somewhere he can play a little and rebuild some value for his next deal.
 

amarshal2

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Late to this but that was a nice audition. Add me to the Barnes is TPE plan A crew. Give them Romeo or Neismith, a future first, and dump a little salary (bye Jeff) and dramatically improve the team for the next three years. I’d love to see what a Smart-Brown-Tatum-Barnes-C lineup can do to teams with Kemba in the Lou Will role.
 

BigSoxFan

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Late to this but that was a nice audition. Add me to the Barnes is TPE plan A crew. Give them Romeo or Neismith, a future first, and dump a little salary (bye Jeff) and dramatically improve the team for the next three years. I’d love to see what a Smart-Brown-Tatum-Barnes-C lineup can do to teams with Kemba in the Lou Will role.
Welcome to the crew! Barnes has my full TPE attention now.
 

kazuneko

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Late to this but that was a nice audition. Add me to the Barnes is TPE plan A crew. Give them Romeo or Neismith, a future first, and dump a little salary (bye Jeff) and dramatically improve the team for the next three years. I’d love to see what a Smart-Brown-Tatum-Barnes-C lineup can do to teams with Kemba in the Lou Will role.
Who is your 5th starter in that lineup if Kemba is heading to the bench?
 

DGreenwood

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Late to this but that was a nice audition. Add me to the Barnes is TPE plan A crew. Give them Romeo or Neismith, a future first, and dump a little salary (bye Jeff) and dramatically improve the team for the next three years. I’d love to see what a Smart-Brown-Tatum-Barnes-C lineup can do to teams with Kemba in the Lou Will role.
I don't want to sound like a broken record but Teague plus Romeo or Nesmith is not enough salary to stay under the tax line. You'd need to clear about another $3.5 million. So it would need to be Nesmith and Romeo, plus Teague. If you don't want to give up both of Nesmith and Romeo, you'd need to add at least two more players in place of one of them (unless you want to include Theis or TT).
 
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benhogan

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I don't want to sound like a broken record but Teague plus Romeo or Nesmith is not enough salary to stay under the tax line. You'd need to clear about another $3.5 million. So it would need to be Nesmith and Romeo, plus Teague. If you don't want to give up both of Nesmith and Romeo, you'd need to add at least two more players in place of one of them (unless you want to include Theis or TT).
Harrison doesn't work on many levels.

I'd rather have the C's go cheap. Call Detroit, see if Ellington or Mykhailiuk are available?

Save the full $28.5MM TPE for a big Summer move
 

the moops

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Harrison doesn't work on many levels.

I'd rather have the C's go cheap. Call Detroit, see if Ellington or Mykhailiuk are available?

Save the full $28.5MM TPE for a big Summer move
The only guys making around 28.5 next year are Mitchell, Bam, Fox, Horford, and Jrue. I guess we could get old Al back, but otherwise those guys aren't coming here or if they did come here, we would have to give up Brown or Tatum anyway and wouldn't need the exception.

Just seems like the only way to make full use of it is on two separate guys
 

benhogan

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The only guys making around 28.5 next year are Mitchell, Bam, Fox, Horford, and Jrue. I guess we could get old Al back, but otherwise those guys aren't coming here or if they did come here, we would have to give up Brown or Tatum anyway and wouldn't need the exception.

Just seems like the only way to make full use of it is on two separate guys
Sure or sign and trade. Atlanta didn't want to go max on Collins and Trae is about to get expensive
 

DGreenwood

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That would require Kemba to be traded, which is likely to be really difficult to achieve.
Right. A sign and trade for anything close to the full TPE would require a lot of outgoing salary to stay under the hard cap that the sign and trade would trigger.
 

benhogan

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Honestly given how much he's still owed (roughly $70 million depending on how much '21 ends up being), how little D he plays, and how much of a clubhouse pouter he is, I would be asking the Kings how much it's worth to them to get rid of him for nothing. He's getting paid the money that we're all terrified of Boston having to pay Marcus, only he brings next to nothing to the table for it.
Yea, you're right here. After watching him a little more closely I'm off Buddy Hield o_O

Hield has been a tire fire this season. The new GM is probably sickened by his play already and would probably move him for some expirings
 

Pilgrim

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Yea, there was a lot of Harrison Barnes slander the other day, but it basically boiled down to the fact that he is a decent role player/bench quality player. I'm pretty sure thats all the Celtics can hope for from the TPE- its just about the relative merits and availability of a bunch of Barnes quality guys.

If people think there is a way to get a star level talent, I would love it to be true. But who it is and how does it happen?
 

the moops

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Harrison Barnes is much more than a decent role player/bench quality player. He would be starting and finishing games for this team. He slides nicely into the 4 position here and with Smart at the 1 makes the defense super switchable. He is easily having his most efficient scoring season, and probably his best year of his career.

I would send them Langford, Nesmith, and a 2nd with no hesitation. Or Langford/Nesmith, salary, and a 1st.
 

BigSoxFan

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I can’t believe he’s still only 28 years-old. Barnes would be a very nice addition to this team. He had another great game today. Feel like he would fit well with the Jay’s. I would gladly let Theis go if his salary were needed to make it work. Let Thompson/TL handle the 5 for next 1.5 years. Tacko becomes the depth option.
 

128

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Harrison Barnes is much more than a decent role player/bench quality player. He would be starting and finishing games for this team. He slides nicely into the 4 position here and with Smart at the 1 makes the defense super switchable. He is easily having his most efficient scoring season, and probably his best year of his career.
Seconded. Barnes, whom some posters here have essentially called the poster boy for mediocrity, had 28 points, 7 rebounds, 4 assists, 1 steal and no turnovers tonite in the Kings' win over the Nuggets. He was 5 for 7 from beyond the arc and 10 for 16 overall.

Whether he makes sense financially for the C's is a valid question, but the idea that he wouldn't help them on the court is ridiculous.
 

BigSoxFan

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Lonzo Ball is now up to 37% for the year from 3 point land as well. He’s been scorching of late.
 

lovegtm

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And he shot that last year as well, so it's getting to be a solid sample size. Up to 62% at the line as well. I think he's a good fit for the C's, not a great pairing with Smart, but good alongside Walker/PP.
What is the feeling on what NO would be willing to deal him for? I don’t have a good read on his market.
 

Cesar Crespo

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And he shot that last year as well, so it's getting to be a solid sample size. Up to 62% at the line as well. I think he's a good fit for the C's, not a great pairing with Smart, but good alongside Walker/PP.
The FT % isn't even worth mentioning this season as he's 10/16 from the line, although it is worth keeping any eye on due to his improvement there last year from horrid to awful. 51/139 from 3 this year though. Last 2 years, 199/534, .373 from 3. 53/92, .576 from FT.

First 2 seasons: 165/523, .315 from 3. 52/119, .437 from FT.

I wouldn't mind acquiring Barnes + Ball and shipping Smart out for something. I'd be interested in keeping Ball long term too if the money was right. I still don't see why the Kings would be trading Barnes though. They are probably going to try and make the playoffs and have a pretty decent core of young players in place with Fox, Haliburton and Bagley (who may have added the 3).
 

BigSoxFan

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What is the feeling on what NO would be willing to deal him for? I don’t have a good read on his market.
My guess is a young, cost-controlled player with upside and a pick. They already passed on extending him. This version of Lonzo can help a decent amount of teams but clearly the fit will vary.
 

Cesar Crespo

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My guess is a young, cost-controlled player with upside and a pick. They already passed on extending him. This version of Lonzo can help a decent amount of teams but clearly the fit will vary.
With as bad as NO needs shooting, they'd might bite on Nesmith. The "couple of 2nd round picks" thing is definitely not the asking price. I'm not sure what I'd move for Ball since I'm not sure how long he'd stick around. If he really can hit the 3 at a .370 clip on 7.5-8.0 3PA/36, he's pretty close to a perfect 3rd piece to pair with the Jays long term. The perfect piece would be his brother. It's somewhat of a big if, but Lonzo's 3 point sample size is getting sizeable. If he's a .370 shooter from 3, you can also play him with Marcus Smart. A Ball/Smart/Brown/Tatum/TL lineup would be something else to watch. I'm not convinced he's going to be even an average 3 point shooter though (which is what .370 is, really) so I'd really only be on board with him as a Marcus Smart replacement. Ideally, Ball would improve on that .370 but with everything else he offers, he can get by on average 3 point shooting on very heavy volume, probably even offers value doing so.

Plus there would be something extra rewarding if Ball was the piece that put the C's over the hump and lead to multiple titles. Ex Laker and all.

Anyone have any idea what kind of offers Ball will get long term? If the C's did acquire him, how likely is it the C's match any offer sheet?


If NO really is looking to move Ball, I think the time to strike would be now too. His value might be a little high, but if he continues to hit 3s at the current rate and volume, his value is only going to go up, up, up. Maybe to the point NO decides they'll offer any offer sheet. I guess you could gamble his 3 point percentage caters... but is that even a player you want? That could be more reason to wait. It's interesting.

I'm not really for Ball but I could easily talk myself into him if that's the direction the C's go. It may even be the right direction. I see the fit, it just all depends on the shot.
 

Cellar-Door

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Partly TPE related. Kevin O'Connor noted in his power rankings this morning that he had a number of execs text him this weekend that the Celtics were looking to do something.
He also notes that he's hearing they would like to upgrade wing and big positions, and speculated one or both of Thompson/Theis could be on the move, noting that Thompson just became trade eligible.
 

bosockboy

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Partly TPE related. Kevin O'Connor noted in his power rankings this morning that he had a number of execs text him this weekend that the Celtics were looking to do something.
He also notes that he's hearing they would like to upgrade wing and big positions, and speculated one or both of Thompson/Theis could be on the move, noting that Thompson just became trade eligible.
Feels like it’s time. It’s a wide open conference and they have two stars.
 

PedroKsBambino

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I know there are different, firmly held views around here on adding a wing but I continue to think that's a wise thing to be doing. We've talked through all the options there.

I'm less sure on the big. TT hasn't been great, but he's been ok especially of late, and I'm not sure how much better you are really going to get. Do you really believe in Andre Drummond? I liked idea of Nance but with the injury he's probably off the table as as noted, he's only sort of a big anyway. I could believe Bertans is available, but that contract isn't looking so great for what he is (a no-defense stretch 4). Aldridge has been bad this year and is hurt too.

What's the fit as a big?
 

128

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I know there are different, firmly held views around here on adding a wing but I continue to think that's a wise thing to be doing. We've talked through all the options there.

I'm less sure on the big. TT hasn't been great, but he's been ok especially of late, and I'm not sure how much better you are really going to get. Do you really believe in Andre Drummond? I liked idea of Nance but with the injury he's probably off the table as as noted, he's only sort of a big anyway. I could believe Bertans is available, but that contract isn't looking so great for what he is (a no-defense stretch 4). Aldridge has been bad this year and is hurt too.

What's the fit as a big?
Both Nance and Gordon should be back by the middle of March. That's not ideal, but I'm not sure that would/should be a dealbreaker if either is available and the C's are interested.
 

Jakarta

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I know there are different, firmly held views around here on adding a wing but I continue to think that's a wise thing to be doing. We've talked through all the options there.

I'm less sure on the big. TT hasn't been great, but he's been ok especially of late, and I'm not sure how much better you are really going to get. Do you really believe in Andre Drummond? I liked idea of Nance but with the injury he's probably off the table as as noted, he's only sort of a big anyway. I could believe Bertans is available, but that contract isn't looking so great for what he is (a no-defense stretch 4). Aldridge has been bad this year and is hurt too.

What's the fit as a big?
Steven Adams? Unfortunately this year would take up most of the Hayward TPE.

But it got me thinking that perhaps it can be expanded to be something like SA and Lonzo and/or JJ for Kemba, Romeo and a future first (maybe 2), while preserving the TPE.

SA has a contract extension at reasonable money (17.5m per year) that starts next year, but he’s signed for a year longer than Kemba. He would provide a bit of beef to contend with Guys like Embiid but less switchable than the TT/DT/TL.

Lonzo has been discussed elsewhere and if the shooting is real would be a good fit skill and timeline wise with JT and JB.

Kemba is admittedly a weird fit with Bledsoe and Ingram. However, the current roster doesn’t appear to be working so perhaps a shakeup buying low on one of the better culture guys in the league would be seen as a worthwhile upside gamble if enough other small assets are attached.

Would then probably want to trade one of the other bigs for whatever you can get. The TPE could then be used in the offseason to replace Lonzo if he’s not resigned, or otherwise add to the roster (someone like Otto Porter).
 

chilidawg

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Steven Adams? Unfortunately this year would take up most of the Hayward TPE.

But it got me thinking that perhaps it can be expanded to be something like SA and Lonzo and/or JJ for Kemba, Romeo and a future first (maybe 2), while preserving the TPE.

SA has a contract extension at reasonable money (17.5m per year) that starts next year, but he’s signed for a year longer than Kemba. He would provide a bit of beef to contend with Guys like Embiid but less switchable than the TT/DT/TL.

Lonzo has been discussed elsewhere and if the shooting is real would be a good fit skill and timeline wise with JT and JB.

Kemba is admittedly a weird fit with Bledsoe and Ingram. However, the current roster doesn’t appear to be working so perhaps a shakeup buying low on one of the better culture guys in the league would be seen as a worthwhile upside gamble if enough other small assets are attached.

Would then probably want to trade one of the other bigs for whatever you can get. The TPE could then be used in the offseason to replace Lonzo if he’s not resigned, or otherwise add to the roster (someone like Otto Porter).
I'd do Adams/Ball for Kemba, Romeo and picks in a heart beat. Would make sense roster wise to include TT if they'd take him too. Not sure what the upside is for NO there though.
 

PedroKsBambino

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I don't think Adams can be dealt since he signed an extension this year with NOLA.
 

HomeRunBaker

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I'd do Adams/Ball for Kemba, Romeo and picks in a heart beat. Would make sense roster wise to include TT if they'd take him too. Not sure what the upside is for NO there though.
Did Kevin McHale take the Pelicans job while I wasn’t looking? You’d probably have to begin with Smart instead of Kemba to begin with and probably include TL as a 5 project to be part of their big rotation, then add a bunch of picks to not get hung up on.
 

ZMart100

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Didn't Ainge say he wanted shooting from a big? I don't think Adams is what he is looking for.
 

mcpickl

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I know there are different, firmly held views around here on adding a wing but I continue to think that's a wise thing to be doing. We've talked through all the options there.

I'm less sure on the big. TT hasn't been great, but he's been ok especially of late, and I'm not sure how much better you are really going to get. Do you really believe in Andre Drummond? I liked idea of Nance but with the injury he's probably off the table as as noted, he's only sort of a big anyway. I could believe Bertans is available, but that contract isn't looking so great for what he is (a no-defense stretch 4). Aldridge has been bad this year and is hurt too.

What's the fit as a big?
I think as a big, it's not a center they're looking for but to move one of the centers and replace him on the roster with a 4 that could play small ball 5. As you described, I'd guess they're looking for a sort of a big.
 

benhogan

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I know there are different, firmly held views around here on adding a wing but I continue to think that's a wise thing to be doing. We've talked through all the options there.

I'm less sure on the big. TT hasn't been great, but he's been ok especially of late, and I'm not sure how much better you are really going to get. Do you really believe in Andre Drummond? I liked idea of Nance but with the injury he's probably off the table as as noted, he's only sort of a big anyway. I could believe Bertans is available, but that contract isn't looking so great for what he is (a no-defense stretch 4). Aldridge has been bad this year and is hurt too.

What's the fit as a big?
You keep saying this BUT EVERYONE thinks they should add a wing by the trade deadline.

Having 3 separate TPE's, young players developing and all their picks opens up plenty of possibilities.

For the umpteenth time, I believe they should call Detroit and kick the tires on Ellington or Mykhailiuk
 

benhogan

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I'd do Adams/Ball for Kemba, Romeo and picks in a heart beat. Would make sense roster wise to include TT if they'd take him too. Not sure what the upside is for NO there though.
Yea in a heartbeat.

I'd even take JJ Redick, so make it JJ/Ball/Adams for Kemba/Romeo/TT/1st rounder

Did Kevin McHale take the Pelicans job while I wasn’t looking? You’d probably have to begin with Smart instead of Kemba to begin with and probably include TL as a 5 project to be part of their big rotation, then add a bunch of picks to not get hung up on.
the whole point of taking Adams is unloading Kemba's contract...

your not getting rid of Smart and keeping Walker
 

radsoxfan

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Seconded. Barnes, whom some posters here have essentially called the poster boy for mediocrity, had 28 points, 7 rebounds, 4 assists, 1 steal and no turnovers tonite in the Kings' win over the Nuggets. He was 5 for 7 from beyond the arc and 10 for 16 overall.

Whether he makes sense financially for the C's is a valid question, but the idea that he wouldn't help them on the court is ridiculous.
I don't think anyone said Barnes wouldn't help the team, certainly a decent NBA wing to soak up 20-30 minutes a night would improve the team. Especially given the huge drop-off after the Jays on this year's squad. But anyone who thinks Barnes is going to be a major factor hasn't followed his career. He looks the part, but he's just not very good. The advanced stats back this up.

If there is some reason to believe his 64% True shooting percentage in 23 games in year 10 is some new level (career 55%), then maybe he would be a bigger difference maker than I am giving him credit for. But he just doesnt bring that much to the table, and he makes a lot of money over the next 3 years.

He may be as good as we can reasonably expect out of the TPE, but Barnes has been underwhelming his entire career. I would expect more of the same if he comes to Boston.
 

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Tony C

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Yea in a heartbeat.

I'd even take JJ Redick, so make it JJ/Ball/Adams for Kemba/Romeo/TT/1st rounder


the whole point of taking Adams is unloading Kemba's contract...

your not getting rid of Smart and keeping Walker
You realize the Pelicans would have to agree to these deals too, though, right?

I think Ellington mentioned above is the class of player that could be helpful and for whom the price would in the range of what the Celtics could manage.
 

128

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I don't think anyone said Barnes wouldn't help the team, certainly a decent NBA wing to soak up 20-30 minutes a night would improve the team. Especially given the huge drop-off after the Jays on this year's squad. But anyone who thinks Barnes is going to be a major factor hasn't followed his career. He looks the part, but he's just not very good. The advanced stats back this up.

If there is some reason to believe his 64% True shooting percentage in 23 games in year 10 is some new level (career 55%), then maybe he would be a bigger difference maker than I am giving him credit for. But he just doesnt bring that much to the table, and he makes a lot of money over the next 3 years.

He may be as good as we can reasonably expect out of the TPE, but Barnes has been underwhelming his entire career. I would expect more of the same if he comes to Boston.
Barnes has been underwhelming in large part, I think, because he was the nation's No. 1 recruit coming out of high school and a top-7 pick in the NBA draft. He's been hyped for much of his career and was expected to be a difference-maker, which clearly he's not. But he'd be a great No. 3 or No. 4 option on an elite team, and that would be his role on the Celtics, who already have Tatum and Brown and, of course, Pritchard.
 

PedroKsBambino

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You keep saying this BUT EVERYONE thinks they should add a wing by the trade deadline.

Having 3 separate TPE's, young players developing and all their picks opens up plenty of possibilities.

For the umpteenth time, I believe they should call Detroit and kick the tires on Ellington or Mykhailiuk
You have said the opposite consistently from the pre-season on, arguing repeatedly that they should play the kids and develop them rather than add until next offseason. You have in fact specifically opposed all sorts of different types of additions to help on the wing, from draft picks to FA signings, to smaller trades, arguing that their wing depth is fine. I cannot really imagine you would try to dispute that, but if you really are---we can all go find your posts arguing there's plenty of wing depth.

Your interest in Ellington is no more than a couple weeks old---though i give you credit for recognizing that in fact they need more. And they need it now, not next year. I love your passion as a fan and a poster, but c'mon...you staked out "sufficient wing depth island" all year and you own that as much as you own your love of Baynes.
 
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