The Altogether Appropriate NFL Draft Thread

[RoyHobbs]

I could see them going OG, but they tend to like smaller, quicker interior guys.

 
Yeah, 6'5" 340 would be a total outlier with the OGs on the roster. A guy this size would only make sense how...if BB was thinking of reverting to a power rushing attack in lieu of ever being able to count on a fully healthy Gronk?

 

[SMU_Sox]

Mock drafts before everyone declares and before the combine? That and how many people know the nuances of what player fits on what team given a GMs preferences? Hmm... the Pats need a guard and... oh ok yeah this is the highest ranked guard. That's their pick! Color me unimpressed purple. Same with many draft grades. Kiko Alonso is a good example. KFP and I talked about him last year pre draft as someone we liked. My former Duck friend thought he could be a consistent plus player in the NFL. Yet he was speculated pre draft as a round 3 or 4+ player. What happened? Bills took him in the 2nd round and he's been just that in his rookie year. Now I know that the exception doesn't disprove the rule and that a lot of times the draft grade is about right. But I hope no one here treats it like gospel because sometimes I think the draft media can artificially inflate a guy. See Williams, Jesse.

 

[Phragle]

Yeah, I think you're right. And if they're looking at going with a 3-4, he's probably shorter than they like their 3-4 ends (Warren and Seymour were both 6'6+). He is pretty similar to Vellano (6'1", 300) and Jones (6'2", 302) so it's possible they've changed their thinking about size needs. Then again, they got both those guys for nothing.

 
I think this is it. Plus Donald isn't even 6'2"300, he's listed everywhere at 6'0" 285. No chance.
 

I could see them going OG, but they tend to like smaller, quicker interior guys.

 
This is true, but the Pats did a lot of work on Richardson before he un-declared.
 

Mock drafts before everyone declares and before the combine? That and how many people know the nuances of what player fits on what team given a GMs preferences? Hmm... the Pats need a guard and... oh ok yeah this is the highest ranked guard. That's their pick! Color me unimpressed purple. Same with many draft grades. Kiko Alonso is a good example. KFP and I talked about him last year pre draft as someone we liked. My former Duck friend thought he could be a consistent plus player in the NFL. Yet he was speculated pre draft as a round 3 or 4+ player. What happened? Bills took him in the 2nd round and he's been just that in his rookie year. Now I know that the exception doesn't disprove the rule and that a lot of times the draft grade is about right. But I hope no one here treats it like gospel because sometimes I think the draft media can artificially inflate a guy. See Williams, Jesse.

 
Alonso is an character risk that has - so far - worked out. So did Hernandez in his rookie year. Let's not say they got the next Bruschi yet. And Williams was injured.
 
Mocks drafts aren't that useful, but they give you a quick summary of players and needs, and it's interesting to see who's available when your team picks.
 
Did you watch Amaro last night?

 

[SMU_Sox]

Uh... watched? Bro I salivated all over myself. He's the real deal.

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

Even if Talib resigns, wouldn't Darqueze Dennard worth a consideration if he slips in round 1?

http://www.freep.com/article/20131219/SPORTS06/312190190/2014-nfl-mock-draft-todd-mcshay

Dennard was named the Jim Thorpe Award winner as the nation’s top defensive back and was an All-America on nearly every list. McShay ranks him as the No. 3 corner in the draft and among his top 25 players overall.

“I was so impressed with that Ohio State game,” McShay said. “I watched that tape yesterday. He made so many smart decisions. That one time, late in the game, when he could have gone up and contested … he opted to get behind him. If he was going to make the catch, great, if the ball was thrown high, he stayed behind him, knowing the situation. You don’t see a lot of that on tape. Talk about split-second decision. Every instinct in your body tells you to go up and compete for the ball, but he had the presence of mind to realize they had the lead and the situation they were in and that he doesn’t want (the receiver) to make the catch, but if he does, he’s going to stop him somewhere at the 20 rather than making it a … (touchdown) or allowing him to tip it up.

5-11, only allowed 3 completions on 31 targets, gets to be united with his (third) cousin Alfonzo.

 

[mascho]

Bridgewater makes it official: He's coming out.

 

[SMU_Sox]

Abbrederis has 3 catches today. I really like the guy and I think he's undervalued because 1) he's the only good receiver on Wisconsin so often he is matching up against a safety and a corner on passing downs and 2) his QB sucks and he plays in a run first offense.
 
When he is in single coverage he gets open all the time - and that happens quite a bit too. I can't wait to see what will happen to him when he gets on a balanced or pass heavy NFL team. He's such a cerebral receiver and good route runner. 

 

[Phragle]

Even if Talib resigns, wouldn't Darqueze Dennard worth a consideration if he slips in round 1?

http://www.freep.com/article/20131219/SPORTS06/312190190/2014-nfl-mock-draft-todd-mcshay


5-11, only allowed 3 completions on 31 targets, gets to be united with his (third) cousin Alfonzo.

 
Two Dennards? I'll have to find more pics of Nard Dog.

I've been a fan of Darqueze Dennard for a long time, but he's risen up boards and now looks like a top 15 pick.
 
 

Abbrederis has 3 catches today. I really like the guy and I think he's undervalued because 1) he's the only good receiver on Wisconsin so often he is matching up against a safety and a corner on passing downs and 2) his QB sucks and he plays in a run first offense.
 
When he is in single coverage he gets open all the time - and that happens quite a bit too. I can't wait to see what will happen to him when he gets on a balanced or pass heavy NFL team. He's such a cerebral receiver and good route runner.

Is he more Jordy Nelson or Wes Welker?

 

[mascho]

Simple. Darqueze needs to punch a cop.

 

[SMU_Sox]

Jordy Nelson for a few reasons. 1) he's taller than Wes. 2) His game is more route running and not explosiveness in quick short routes post snap. He's more of a Nelson type of game than Wes.

 

[Phragle]

Does Cyril Richardson always line up like this when he's going to pull? https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bc8SdwSIIAAFwnW.jpg It looks like he's trying to cheat to get to his man quicker than normal. That's won't fly in the NFL. Maybe he's not that athletic?
 
 
 

Simple. Darqueze needs to punch a cop.

 
And they say we need less lawyers.
 
 

Jordy Nelson for a few reasons. 1) he's taller than Wes. 2) His game is more route running and not explosiveness in quick short routes post snap. He's more of a Nelson type of game than Wes.

 
I was trying to be funny. The thing about WR is that when they re-sign Edelman they'll have 6 WRs under contract.

 

[mascho]

Does Cyril Richardson always line up like this when he's going to pull? https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bc8SdwSIIAAFwnW.jpg It looks like he's trying to cheat to get to his man quicker than normal. That's won't fly in the NFL. Maybe he's not that athletic?



That is a great catch. Now I know what I'll be watching the rest of this game.

 

[SMU_Sox]

I thought you might be, Phragle, but I figured it was worth sharing what a common comp is with him since casual followers might not even know of him. He's certainly not considered a slam dunk WR, you know? 
 
Quick edit: Re the 6 WR's... Who knows where we will be going into next year (Who gets cut, who gets injured, who gets arrested for killing multiple people while driving drunk while smoking crack while hiring a 16 year old prostitute). In the first four rounds we have bigger needs than WR. But what if he was somehow available in the 5th round? I guess what I am getting at it is if he falls - when does he become worth a draft pick? 

 

[Phragle]

who gets arrested for killing multiple people while driving drunk while smoking crack while hiring a 16 year old prostitute).

 
Thompkins. Maybe Edelman.
 

In the first four rounds we have bigger needs than WR. But what if he was somehow available in the 5th round? I guess what I am getting at it is if he falls - when does he become worth a draft pick?

 
The hell if I know. I said earlier that they should pick Allen Robinson in the first, and I still like that idea.
 

That is a great catch. Now I know what I'll be watching the rest of this game.

Is he still doing it?

 

[SMU_Sox]

Wait... of all our needs why would you want a WR in the first? It's an interesting idea. Robinson has, size, plays a physical game, and man does he have good vision. His open field runs are ridiculous. I don't think he has elite speed though (not that that matters). And he can catch anything too. 
 
My question for you is this: can he grasp the intricacies of the Pats system and is he a good enough route runner. The one criticism I've read is that he could tune that up. I guess that question is relevant for any receiver - can the more athletic guys also do what BB needs them to do?

 

[Phragle]

Wait... of all our needs why would you want a WR in the first? 

Our needs will change after free agency, and I think Robinson's is a rare blend of floor, upside, and fit.
 

My question for you is this: can he grasp the intricacies of the Pats system and is he a good enough route runner. The one criticism I've read is that he could tune that up. I guess that question is relevant for any receiver - can the more athletic guys also do what BB needs them to do?

 
Did you see my post? "Can he grasp the intricacies of the Pats system" is the main reason I want him. Under BO'B Penn State ran the same Erhardt-Perkins offensive system that the Pats run.
 
I literally think he's perfect. I think he's Keenan Allen, but with experience and a track record of success in an Erhardt-Perkins offense. Keenan Allen had 1048 yards and 8 TD this year.

 

[mascho]

Is he still doing it?


Yep. Every time he pulls he's cheating back off the LOS. That is a great catch.

 

[SMU_Sox]

My bad Phragle, I didn't and I was posting on my mobile. Wasn't trying to be lazy.

 

[Phragle]

‏Greg Pickel ‏@GregPickel
1h
Per #PennState, receiver Allen Robinson will forego his senior season and enter the NFL Draft.

Dane Brugler ‏@dpbrugler47m
Good to see #PennState WR Allen Robinson entering the Draft. He's been a regular in the late 1st round of my mocks. Big fan

Matt Waldman ‏@MattWaldman4
7m
@dpbrugler Nice player for sure.

Dane Brugler ‏@dpbrugler27m
Stats can be overrated for prospects, but WR Allen Robinson's production w/ inconsistent QB play the last two years is remarkable #NFLDraft

Dane Brugler ‏@dpbrugler
26m
Late 1st-mid 2nd range RT @adam_flango You thinking 2nd round for Robinson?

 
That's it. With Robinson declaring I'm all-in. #TeamRobinson #TeamPatriots
 
Edit: Unless Louis Nix is still available. Then it's #TeamGetBothAtAllCosts
 
Edit 2: The Falcons pick 6th? They're in perfect position to ruin their franchise with another high WR pick.

 

[soxhop411]

Adam Schefter ‏@AdamSchefter1m
Texans owner Bob McNair said Houston is willing to trade No. 1 overall pick so it can land another QB and a defensive player as well.

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

I heart the January to April phragle on draft related threads. 

 

[SMU_Sox]

If someone makes a Mallett joke here I will go on a tri state killing spree.

Interesting situation we have here. Part of me would love to see a dline with Clowney and Watt. That's about as close to football porn as you can get. So who else does Hou like at QB if not Bridgewater?

I think the strategy is to play the Browns, Jags, and Raiders against each other and get as many picks as possible out of it. My dark horse trade candidate is Tampa Bay. If the new regime doesn't like Glennon they are in prime position to trade up. TB is a lot more talented than their record. With a game changing QB I think they could challenge for a wild card spot next year.

 

[Phragle]

 
Adam Schefter ‏@AdamSchefter1m
Texans owner Bob McNair said Houston is willing to trade No. 1 overall pick so it can land another QB and a defensive player as well.
 

 
Smart, but maybe not smart to announce it. Not sure the first overall pick has the trade value it usually does, and they might be losing a little leverage with that tweet.
 
 

I heart the January to April phragle on draft related threads. 

 
So I was terrible in December? Thanks jerk.

 

[Super Nomario]

McCarron is rising and getting a lot of love lately, rates well in accuracy, game management and leadership, reading and changing plays. Knocks being arm is strong enough, but not elite and he is athletic but not mobile. I think he goes 20-40 and could end the 2nd best QB in this class.

Good article on McCarron struggling last night with Oklahoma's pressure, something he didn't really have to deal with much this year:
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000308530/article/aj-mccarron-folds-under-pressure-in-crushing-sugar-bowl-loss
 

 
He has a mechanical flaw that continually shows up on tape and it was an issue in Thursday night's game. He rarely digs his cleats into the ground and drives off of his back foot. He throws entirely with his upper body and the ball loses life on drive throws.

 
He made some really good throws last night, too. I think he's more of a playmaker than he generally gets credit for, but I have questions about how his "game management" skills are going to translate to the NFL. The more I observe the NFL, the more I think that it's almost a crapshoot projecting which college QBs are going to be good players in the NFL. Every QB needs work on his mechanics and footwork (and therefore accuracy), on his timing and antipating, on his ability to read defenses, and on his ability to set protection and avoid rushes. And these aren't secondary skills; this is most of a QB's job description! It's almost like QBs are like baseball players (who need time in the minors no matter how good they are as amateurs) while other positions are more like NBA players (who generally can contribute right away).
 
The interesting debate is what to do, knowing this. Do you take a guy like Tajh Boyd, reasoning that since you're going to have to work on all the knowledge and mechanics you should just worry about physical tools? Or do you take a McCarron, figuring that it's going to be easier to teach him this stuff since he's already partway there? Even though Brady is more of a McCarron-type, Belichick has tended to draft QBs more on their physical tools (Mallett, Kevin O'Connell, Rohan Davey).

 

[mascho]

Here is another write-uo on McCarron, written before last night.  Tons of tape.
 
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1878276-dont-buy-the-draft-hype-on-alabama-qb-aj-mccarron
 
I'll admit to being higher on AJ than most.  If he does fall I hope the Patriots give him a look.

 

[SeoulSoxFan]

 
That's it. With Robinson declaring I'm all-in. #TeamRobinson #TeamPatriots
 
Edit: Unless Louis Nix is still available. Then it's #TeamGetBothAtAllCosts
 
Edit 2: The Falcons pick 6th? They're in perfect position to ruin their franchise with another high WR pick.

 
Jets are in full Watkins (LOL), Lee (nice try), and Evans (maybe) mode. If none fall -- I think they go for Robinson. 

 

[Super Nomario]

Here is another write-uo on McCarron, written before last night.  Tons of tape.
 
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1878276-dont-buy-the-draft-hype-on-alabama-qb-aj-mccarron
 
I'll admit to being higher on AJ than most.  If he does fall I hope the Patriots give him a look.

Brady struggles with arm strength? Since when?

 

[SMU_Sox]

Aj's pocket presence last night had some very good and very bad moments. On the good side he showed an ability to execute a boot leg and throw on the run. But there were a few times he stood still and didn't step up in the pocket or start to get rid of the ball that resulted in sacks and or poor decisions.

 

[SMU_Sox]

He also had a few plays where he knew pressure was comming and got the ball off to his hot read. However there were two throws to his hot read that were very risky and in traffic. I don't always notice mechanics but I can say I have noticed his lack of using his legs and planting for some time. That reminds me what Counsins in Washington.

 

[Reardon's Beard]

The O and D Line need injections of youth in the worst way. I would be very surprised if one of the first two picks isn't for the trenches. FA are possibilities too I suppose but really need to give Brady better protection going into the last few years.

 

[Dgilpin]

Marquise Lee declares for the draft

 

[Phragle]

 
Jets are in full Watkins (LOL), Lee (nice try), and Evans (maybe) mode. If none fall -- I think they go for Robinson. 

 
That's really what they need the most? I feel like Smith-Sanchez are too shitty to make it worth picking a first round WR. On top of that I think Robinson offers a lot more value to a team that runs an Erhardt-Perkins. Jets are West Coast I believe.
 

Brady struggles with arm strength? Since when?

 
It's hard to say Brady struggles with anything, but he doesn't have the strongest arm. It's probably about average for starting QBs.

 

[Super Nomario]

It's hard to say Brady struggles with anything, but he doesn't have the strongest arm. It's probably about average for starting QBs.

I'd put it as above-average, but this guy's talking about Brady's "limited arm strength," which seems pretty silly. Moreover, he goes on to say Brady overcomes this with "truly exceptional touch as a downfield passer, especially on deep balls," which doesn't jibe with my assessment.
 
There should be some sort of rule that if you compare draft prospects to a guy with a huge body of work like Brady, you have to be specific. Is McCarron being compared to 2000 (Michigan / draft) Brady, 2001 (1st SB) Brady, '02-'06 Brady, Brady slinging bombs to Moss, etc.? There's kind of a big difference between a lot of those. There are probably a half-dozen guys who can be favorably compared to Brady coming out of college but that doesn't mean they're remotely capable of what he's achieved over the past decade. That statement in-and-of-itself should probably raise red flags about how confidently we can project QB prospects.

 

[Mugsy's Walk-Off Bunt]

I'd put it as above-average, but this guy's talking about Brady's "limited arm strength," which seems pretty silly. Moreover, he goes on to say Brady overcomes this with "truly exceptional touch as a downfield passer, especially on deep balls," which doesn't jibe with my assessment.

Yeah, I'd say that assessment is pretty far off. Brady is regarded as having a pretty strong arm, but one less accurate down the field. In terms of the short and intermediate throws he fires it in there harder than most.

 

[soxhop411]

-

 

[Eric Ampersand]

Instead of hoping AJ McCarron can develop properly why not draft Zach Mettenberger and "redshirt" him while he rehabs that ACL? He has a higher ceiling than any other late round QB.  

 

[soxhop411]

Adam Schefter ‏@AdamSchefter2h
UCLA QB Brett Hundley, viewed as a potential top-10 pick, plans to return to school for senior season, per sources. Announcement this week.

 

[Dogman]

 
Smart, but maybe not smart to announce it. Not sure the first overall pick has the trade value it usually does, and they might be losing a little leverage with that tweet.
 
 
 

 
How would they lose any leverage?  Set the cost of the pick internally and listen to all offers.  If a team doesn't meet your cost, use the pick for your own team. 
More, there are 3-4 guys who could be drafted in the first spot. Based on that alone I think, based on other team's needs, Houston will have a number of offers. 
 
Aside from that, there has been a recent top 3 pick swap that netted a ton of value for a team.  Why do you feel the top pick isn't as valuable now then, say, 2 years ago?  

 

[soxhop411]

IU's Cody Latimer declared for the draft. Would he be a good pick for us in the later rounds?

 

[sachmoney]

UCF's Blake Bortles declaring for the draft. 

 

[Dgilpin]

UCF's Blake Bortles declaring for the draft.


I think if Houston selects a QB my money is on Bortles

 

[Super Nomario]

I think if Houston selects a QB my money is on Bortles

PSU played UCF this year, so O'Brien has some direct experience with him.

 

[Saints Rest]

Can someone remind me, does the draft order for playoff teams get adjusted off base record by round or for the whole playoffs, with only the SUper Bowl teams being adjusted?  In other words, do we now know who is picking 21-24 or does nothing change until Feb 3?

 

[DJnVa]

Can someone remind me, does the draft order for playoff teams get adjusted off base record by round or for the whole playoffs, with only the SUper Bowl teams being adjusted?  In other words, do we now know who is picking 21-24 or does nothing change until Feb 3?

 
We know a few more.
 
Updated: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1911902-nfl-draft-order-2014-updated-selection-list-after-wild-card-round

 

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

 
That's really what they need the most? I feel like Smith-Sanchez are too shitty to make it worth picking a first round WR. On top of that I think Robinson offers a lot more value to a team that runs an Erhardt-Perkins. Jets are West Coast I believe.
 

 
Why do you feel that way?
 
I get that he runs the system now, so he should understand the "concept system" better than an average WR coming out of the draft. I can see the added benefit of a team using that system, but if he's a good athlete, the rest of the systems are generally dumbed down for WR's. If he can grasp a modified Erhardt-Perkins, he can certainly grasp a Coryell or West Coast.
 
Again, I agree that there's an added perk to the few teams running the Erhardt-Perkins to give him a long look. But if the kid is a good WR, I don't think he falls because he's an overachiever at understanding concepts.

 

[Shelterdog]

Can someone remind me, does the draft order for playoff teams get adjusted off base record by round or for the whole playoffs, with only the SUper Bowl teams being adjusted?  In other words, do we now know who is picking 21-24 or does nothing change until Feb 3?

 
Off base record by round--here it is through 24.
 
21. Green Bay Packers - 8-7-1
22. Philadelphia Eagles - 10-6
23. Kansas City Chiefs - 11-5
24. Cincinnati Bengals - 11-5

 

[bakahump]

Simple. Darqueze needs to punch a cop.

"It was Dennard who did it"
"Which one?"
"errr......"
 
I like this idea.

 

[Freddy Linn]

Ifo Ekpre-Olumu to stay at Oregon

 

[Super Nomario]

Cross-posting from the Gronk thread:
 

Phragle and I discussed this in the draft thread but there are two large tight ends who are excellent receivers in ASJ and Jace Amaro. If either is available when they pick in the late first you have to think both are on the table. You can get interior offensive and defensive line guys later on in the draft, even round two. But huge athletic receiving and potential blocking tight ends are a rare bunch and I think worthy of a high pick.

 
Right now there are a ton of DL guys projected on the 2014 roster. They've got veterans Wilfork, Kelly, and Sopoaga, youngsters Siliga, Chris Jones, and Vellano, Pork Chop Grissom and Armond Armstead, who spent the year on IR/NFI, and Forston on the practice squad. We don't know how healthy Wilfork or Kelly will be at the beginning of the season, Sopoaga figures to be a likely cut, and some of the young guys are no doubt fungible, but I'm not sure they need to add here. I think either they use a high pick on a potential star (a penetrator or long-term Wilfork replacement) or leave the position alone; using a fourth rounder on a depth guy seems pointless.
 
TE is a different situation. Hoomanawanui and Mulligan are JAGs and not even under contract next year, D.J. Williams is likely another JAG, and they can use a complementary Hernandez-type even if Gronk is 100% healthy next year.
 
OL is a question mark. Can Cannon take over at RG? How much do they like Kline? I also think it's fascinating that while Kline has been active over Barker, they've been willing to sneak Kline through waivers twice but have kept Barker on the active roster all season. Is Zusevics (IR) an option? What about one of the practice squad guys (Devey, Cave, Mattes)? And the big question mark is how much they like Wendell and whether they're able to re-sign him at a reasonable price.

 

[Super Nomario]

A friend of mine did a mock draft at his blog: http://zonereads.wordpress.com/2014/01/13/quick-mock-draft-113/
 
He has the Pats taking Austin Sefarian-Jenkins in the first and Michael Sam in the second.